What would you like to see in the Woodie refresh?

[TheKingofSquirrels]

As Woodie is currently broken, what would you guys think is the biggest thing you'd like to see changed?

For me, it's the sanity mechanic. Woodie should loose Sanity AFTER he transforms back into human form (like in Singleplayer). Sanity depletes so rapidly in Werebeaver form, that there's literally no joy in transforming into it. It's also just a horrible experience because the sanity effects plus the Werebeaver sound and video effects don't mix well at all: the sepia filter with the sanity discolouration makes the game look DISGUSTING and the banjo music + the sanity distortion sound effects are unbearable. 

Also, please, PLEASE get rid of the eating wood mechanic in human form. A human character eating logs is just dumb. 

I also would like him to be powerful again in Werebeaver form in some way. I know this needs to be balanced, so what if...during the full moon, the Werebeaver transformation becomes extremely powerful, with increased HP and attack damage. It fits with the lore of werewolves and full moons, and allows players the rare occasion of being the tanky Woodie we loved in Singleplayer.

Other ideas that are a bit out there:

- I'd like to see something creative with the curse. Maybe you can infect other characters. It be awesome to see Werebeaver forms of all the characters. 

- Gold axes, shovel and pickaxes do significant damage to Woody in PVP (the game's version of a Golden bullet).  (I forgot it's silver, not good, oops)

- Werebeaver can befriend Werepigs and form packs. 

[Jayfeather345]

8 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Gold axes, shovel and pickaxes do significant damage to Woody in PVP (the game's version of a Golden bullet).

think you mean silver bullet

8 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Also, please, PLEASE get rid of the eating wood mechanic in human form. A human character eating logs is just dumb. 

i wouldn't say to get rid of it ENTIRELY just nerf it somehow whether it going down through some other method or just having it go down MUCH more slowly. I mainly say this because if they buff the werebeaver like the way everyone wants it (same stats as normal DS or at least close) then turning into werebeaver form is going to suck ass and kind of nullify the buff.

[WolfYlch]

Personally I'd like to see Woodie in DST more close to Woodie in regular DS. I feel like it'd be pretty neat to go around as a werebeaver without a sanity penalty until after he's transformed back into a human. While I can see how having sanity drop as a werebeaver would make sense, it just doesn't give a very rewarding gameplay as he's not very powerful having no weapons.

I honestly really like having Woodie eat wood and such as a human, it's just a fun, albeit aggravating at times, quirk of his. It gives for a unique and challenging gameplay that requires a lot of thought and skill to really get the hang of. Besides, I feel that it fits him being a werebeaver; he has cravings!

I like the sepia overlay and the banjo music personally as it really makes gameplay seem a little more insane.

Back to Woodie not being very powerful as a beaver; I think it'd be cool if he were tanked up a bit like how he is in DS. It would really help in warding off shadow creatures and other enemies while also aiding in some good rock mining and wood gathering for other players.

[-Variant]

1 hour ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Also, please, PLEASE get rid of the eating wood mechanic in human form. A human character eating logs is just dumb.

But what about Wilson's hair that's legit shaped like a W? 

An old Lady with magical books.

Willow's horn shaped hair. 

Webber, a human child consumed by a spider. Spider man, but not.

Personally I like the eating wood thing, kind of makes sense in his case, cause you know. Beaver man.

[Well-met]

I've never experienced DS woodie but I hear that's what everyone wants so I imagine go for that I guess?

I suspect DST werebeaver was made crappy because of ancient PVP expectations too?

[Toros]

Anytime I see someone suggest that Woodie’s werebeaver form only not have pathetic combat stats during a full moon I struggle to take the rest of their ideas seriously.

The reason is that a full moon is a short duration and fairly rare event, and even if you made Werebeaver powerful it only would operate on the surface and only 5% of the time.  In terms of usability that is near useless if not useless.

Pretty much all of the “out there” ideas provided are also fundamentally flawed in obvious and massive ways.

Spreading the curse is going to open up a grief avenue and would require huge amounts of art and code refactor for something that people will not enjoy.

Werepig packs are generally only going to be during full moon anyway, because otherwise they’d still be hostile to his human form.  I already covered earlier how unhelpful a full moon only perk is.

@Hell-met that’s basically what the situation is.

@TheKingofSquirrels I’ve been reading your suggestion threads for years and I was hoping this one would demonstrate a stronger grasp of game mechanics and design.

Nothing you suggested would solve Woodie’s core issue of not having a niche or Werebeaver feeling weak and unsatisfying to play.

[Canis]

44 minutes ago, Toros said:

Anytime I see someone suggest that Woodie’s werebeaver form only not have pathetic combat stats during a full moon I struggle to take the rest of their ideas seriously.

The reason is that a full moon is a short duration and fairly rare event, and even if you made Werebeaver powerful it only would operate on the surface and only 5% of the time.  In terms of usability that is near useless if not useless.

Pretty much all of the “out there” ideas provided are also fundamentally flawed in obvious and massive ways.

Spreading the curse is going to open up a grief avenue and would require huge amounts of art and code refactor for something that people will not enjoy.

Werepig packs are generally only going to be during full moon anyway, because otherwise they’d still be hostile to his human form.  I already covered earlier how unhelpful a full moon only perk is.

@Hell-met that’s basically what the situation is.

@TheKingofSquirrels I’ve been reading your suggestion threads for years and I was hoping this one would demonstrate a stronger grasp of game mechanics and design.

Nothing you suggested would solve Woodie’s core issue of not having a niche or Werebeaver feeling weak and unsatisfying to play.

Hey, pro tip from one pro to another, sounding like an ******* tarnishes your points a tad. There's no need to single out the OP (KingofSquirrels) and call him out on something personally. In fact, that's against this forum's rules, so stop that.

Instead, how about you give non-back handed criticism, like so: (If you want to have an argument DM me so the thread doesn't lock)

 

Singleplayer Werebeaver, while fun, is extremely flawed from a multiplayer and balance standpoint. SP Woodie is borderline broken. There's nothing stopping him from becoming a Werebeaver day 1 and literally never turning human, ever again. This is a tad counter-acted by the Log Meter working differently in SP (Starting at 0, becoming a beaver if it hits 100, slowly going back down over time) which kinda acts like a timer of sorts, even though it's laughably easy to overcome and not "starve" without explicitly doing so to end go human again. If we wanted something closely resembling Singleplayer Werebeaver, there would have to be some sort of timer or constant threat to warrant the beaver being that tough.

Eating wood is a silly idea, don't get me wrong, but there are much sillier in this game so it's not exactly out of place.

Having other characters/mobs taking any kind of form resembling the Werebeaver would ruin the idea of it being a unique trait in the first place. It's Woodie's curse.

Also, Werepigs *could* work as a decent beaver mechanic if done extremely right. If a single thing is off, it'd just look borked.

I saw in another thread the idea that Maxwell is the "stay-at-base" gather and Woodie is the "Exploratory" gatherer and I really like that, so maybe Klei can push perks that would allow the Beaver to do just that, go off on it's own journey and rack up materials in it's destructive path.
(Edit: It was @S19TealPenguin that originally posted this)

Adding onto above, Klei should probably change how you turn back into a Human from a Beaver, because doing the thing that you're supposed to do in the first place (chop trees and break resources) will slowly turn you into a human again. Possibly, they can have DST's Log meter mimic Singleplayers, perhaps, with some minor changes.

 

 

 

 

[JoeW]

Please have the conversation without attacking each other. Keep it on topic and constructive. Thanks. 

[Toros]

33 minutes ago, Canis said:

Hey, pro tip from one pro to another, sounding like an ******* tarnishes your points a tad. There's no need to single out the OP (KingofSquirrels) and call him out on something personally. In fact, that's against this forum's rules, so stop that.

Instead, how about you give non-back handed criticism, like so: (If you want to have an argument DM me so the thread doesn't lock)

 

Singleplayer Werebeaver, while fun, is extremely flawed from a multiplayer and balance standpoint. SP Woodie is borderline broken. There's nothing stopping him from becoming a Werebeaver day 1 and literally never turning human, ever again. This is a tad counter-acted by the Log Meter working differently in SP (Starting at 0, becoming a beaver if it hits 100, slowly going back down over time) which kinda acts like a timer of sorts, even though it's laughably easy to overcome and not "starve" without explicitly doing so to end go human again. If we wanted something closely resembling Singleplayer Werebeaver, there would have to be some sort of timer or constant threat to warrant the beaver being that tough.

Eating wood is a silly idea, don't get me wrong, but there are much sillier in this game so it's not exactly out of place.

Having other characters/mobs taking any kind of form resembling the Werebeaver would ruin the idea of it being a unique trait in the first place. It's Woodie's curse.

Also, Werepigs *could* work as a decent beaver mechanic if done extremely right. If a single thing is off, it'd just look borked.

I saw in another thread the idea that Maxwell is the "stay-at-base" gather and Woodie is the "Exploratory" gatherer and I really like that, so maybe Klei can push perks that would allow the Beaver to do just that, go off on it's own journey and rack up materials in it's destructive path.
(Edit: It was @S19TealPenguin that originally posted this)

Adding onto above, Klei should probably change how you turn back into a Human from a Beaver, because doing the thing that you're supposed to do in the first place (chop trees and break resources) will slowly turn you into a human again. Possibly, they can have DST's Log meter mimic Singleplayers, perhaps, with some minor changes.

I always find it interesting and confusing how this forum seems to continually conflate being accurate and this need to act as if everyone's opinion and arguments hold water.  There's no need to be rude, but we also don't need to lie and pretend that an unworkable idea is workable.

Nothing I've said is an attack on KingofSquirrels, and one of his recent threads to add wilbur's running to wortox had actually disrespectful feedback because the vast majority of it was memes parodying his original post.  I explained item by item why each idea was flawed.  The ideas were criticized, and I recognized a trend that if we're being honest has existed for years and of which every forum regular is aware.  People have different strengths, and recognizing weaknesses is not an attack.

The argument that singleplayer Werebeaver is overpowered is not something I agree with.  It certainly has unique advantages, but combat-wise it is equivalent to a 100 health character with health degeneration, log armor, a tentacle spike, 10% speed boost, healing from eating wood, no sanity meter.

"There's nothing stopping him from becoming a Werebeaver day 1 and literally never turning human, ever again."

Ok, and what does this accomplish?  You aren't gathering resources, you aren't building structures, you need to go through a tremendous amount of wood in SP and you won't be making any meaningful progression.  It's simply not a helpful strategy, and if you run out of wood you'll be on day whatever with low stats, no blueprints unlocked, and an empty inventory.

" there would have to be some sort of timer or constant threat to warrant the beaver being that tough."

There's already a timer in SP, it's the log meter which needs to be refilled frequently to sustain the form.  There's regular threats in the form of seasonal bosses and again, the fact that you're not making any forward progression with a form that in general only has midgame combat capabilities and no inventory.

"I saw in another thread the idea that Maxwell is the "stay-at-base" gather and Woodie is the "Exploratory" gatherer"

There's nothing about Maxwell that emphasizes staying at base or rewards Woodie for exploring, and calling woodie and max both gatherers is rather disingenuous.  Woodie as he is now is not a gatherer.  He can produce large amounts of wood but is exactly the same as everyone else for gathering other materials.  Werebeaver gathering stone and gold is much slower than in human form, and because of the poor combat stats it's not going to gather meat efficiently either during early game hunting.  Lategame even in SP Werebeaver is outclassed in speed, combat, and utility by a well-equipped woodie.

"Also, Werepigs *could* work as a decent beaver mechanic if done extremely right. If a single thing is off, it'd just look borked."

I'm really curious as to how you think the implementation of this would work.  We don't have precise control over transforming to werebeaver, full moon is too situational to be useful, and manually triggering the transformation with monster meat isn't something that werebeaver can accomplish.

[ShadowDuelist]

Lately I feel werewilba should be the model to rework the werebeaver, but in a more harvester oriented way:

- Let the werebeaver be more efficient chopping trees, maybe as soon as he chops down a tree the stump is automatically dug out. Also digging out stumps  (left by woodie or something else) should cost him just 1 bite.

-Let beaver mine faster and gaining less beaverness with each bite, to prevent going back to woodie by nibbling just one boulder, as it stands now.

- Let the werebeaver run with cane speed (25% faster than normal speed). I think currently he has a 10% speed boost.

- Give the werebeaver bite a slightly stronger than spear damage, around 40ish could do. Currently the beaver deals axe damage. Paired with the fact that he will move like if he had a cane, I think its a fair deal of damage.

- Give the werebeaver a permanent life regen, just like werewilba. As long as you are not starving you should gain hp. For a character that is unarmored and permanently insane, you can still die if you don't kite well. But at least you have the means to stay alive for longer in the form if you have wood to eat and can remain long enough without being hit

- Make the beaver form 100% waterproof. Because its a beaver and makes sense. Late joiner in spring or spring caught you offguard? Dont worry, turn to beaver and dry out. Then go back to woodie, plant pinecones, and problem solved.

- Make the beaver form count as a monster for mobs that dislike that, like pigs, catcoons and bunnymen. Its a nerf, but I think it makes sense being actually a monster. Woodie in his human form should still befriend them as usual.

- Let the werebeaver eat logs, boards, living logs or twigs from his inventory. I'd keep that as his only interaction with the inventory. It will give more control over getting in and out of the beaver form.

- During full moons the beavers damage becomes around 60ish, his speed boost becomes 50%, instantly chops trees in one bite. Full moons drain your beaverness fast, dont last long and come every so often, so it will still be hard to abuse these short lived new powers. Maybe to kill werepigs, have a headstart in a boss fight, or get large amounts of wood in just one night.

And thats it. I'd keep the rest as it is.

The penalties of not having available the inventory, not being able to interact with anything or craft stuff, and being permanently insane and unarmored are more than enough, to compensate the perks of being a slightly stronger beaver: having nightvision, a free multitool, reduced hunger based on wood, a decent permanent speed boost, a decent damage to be able to fight back, and hp regen.

It still wont be combat oriented but it will have the means to survive or deal with combats should you choose to. Its like an alternative way to survive certain situations, stay as woodie, or take the risk as the beaver, with the pros and cons that has. Or a middle ground, like against toadstool: embracing being beaver for periods of the fight, using the regen and speed, while being able to keep a decent dps, then back to woodie.

[Canis]

18 minutes ago, Toros said:

snip

-I never said that being Werebeaver all game is an *optimal* strat, I just said that It was possible.

-I literally talked about the Log Meter sorta acting like a timer. External threats such as seasonal bosses can be solved with kiting.

-The original idea was in a thread talking about rework ideas. I should've clarified that.

-Again, emphasis on "if done extremely right". I don't have ideas on me because I myself am not really for that idea.

 

28 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

Lately I feel werewilba should be the model to rework the werebeaver, but in a more harvester oriented way:

snip

I agree on the fact that Werewilba could be considered for the mold of a new Werebeaver. I like the sound of the rest of your ideas, as nothing really sticks out like a sour thumb to me that strikes me as un-decent.

 

[ShadowDuelist]

Bonus perk: let the werebeaver be piggyback ridable by a Wendy player. The werebeaver is the one that commands moving around, but the wendy can use ranged weapons while piggybacking  there are a couple of quotes hinting this, so why not make it a thing.

[Brago-sama]

Honestly I just want them to introduce a way to control werebeaver better then just eating logs.

What use is Lucy if you either have to eat the materials she gathers or transform into werebeaver and not be able to use her at all. "I love lucy!"

[FreyaMaluk]

My suggestions for DST Woodie from previous posts: (back from April 22nd) 

 

- cold and wetness immunity as beaver (overheats a bit faster cuz fur and beard as normal Woodie) 

- higher dmg as Werebeaver (50 Dmg) 

- Armor as beaver:

some natural armor as beaver (60% minimum) OR

the ability to keep head gear and pick it up from the floor or inventory (maybe consider inventory use for second choice)

- more effective wood and rocks gathering mechanics as beaver (less gnawing to chop and mine).. 

- only one gnawing for tree stumps OR no transition from trees to stumps at all

- increased dmg against tree guardians as beaver and in human form (this already present against Poison Birchnut, 3 gnaws) 

- reducing a bit of the sanity drain (no removal to keep with the "curse" theme... just tunning) 

- remove sanity gain from pine cones if adjusting sanity drain

[4 Da LOLs]

add sap as a resource gained on occasion by chopping with Lucy

3-4 sap in crock pot = syrup acts a bit like a taffy and is imperishable but if a Woodie eats it it restores the log meter some

11 minutes ago, FreyaMaluk said:

remove sanity gain from pine cones if adjusting sanity drain

this could replace his gain sanity from pine cones

add all the QoLs you said on top giving for a fixing to his old attributes and some new ones

giving him a good sanity giver for the team

[Marthan]

from this thread

On 09/05/2019 at 6:06 PM, Marthan said:

Willow was just the "Girl that likes fire" and there was not much to expand on that, so Klei added Bernie as a way to expand the character in more ways than just fire.

Woodie's abilities don't need to be all centered around wood gathering and planting.(I suggested giving him some kind of carpenter skills in other thread)

Maxwell also should have more magic tricks than just the gathering clones(and the not so useful combat one).

[metallichydra]

10 hours ago, FreyaMaluk said:

the ability to keep head gear and pick it up from the floor or inventory (maybe consider inventory use for second choice)

let were beaver be able to have head armor (and hats) equipped, but were beaver can't put them on, another player have to give it to you.

[FreyaMaluk]

Just now, metallichydra said:

let were beaver be able to have head armor (and hats) equipped, but were beaver can't put them on, another player have to give it to you.

I don't think making Woodie dependent from other players for armor is a good idea

[TheKingofSquirrels]

23 hours ago, Toros said:

The reason is that a full moon is a short duration and fairly rare event, and even if you made Werebeaver powerful it only would operate on the surface and only 5% of the time.  In terms of usability that is near useless if not useless.

This is honestly a really valid argument. 

Just curious, do you agree with this though?

On 12/05/2019 at 11:19 PM, TheKingofSquirrels said:

For me, it's the sanity mechanic. Woodie should loose Sanity AFTER he transforms back into human form (like in Singleplayer). Sanity depletes so rapidly in Werebeaver form, that there's literally no joy in transforming into it. It's also just a horrible experience because the sanity effects plus the Werebeaver sound and video effects don't mix well at all: the sepia filter with the sanity discolouration makes the game look DISGUSTING and the banjo music + the sanity distortion sound effects are unbearable. 

Because that's really my main point, aside from lacking any real pros to becoming the were beaver, it's just painful to play cause the sanity effects are just unavoidable.

22 hours ago, Toros said:

Nothing I've said is an attack on KingofSquirrels, and one of his recent threads to add wilbur's running to wortox had actually disrespectful feedback because the vast majority of it was memes parodying his original post. 

I know I got totally wrecked by that, but...

I still think it's a total valid argument. Especially as Wilbur isn't in DST, it be nice to have a character to have his tail skills and it would fit with the animalist traits of his character (although I can agree that he's so powerful, that such an addition is a bit unnecessary).

[Mario384]

Most of my time not modding this game mainly revolves around playing the Werebeaver in vanilla.  I've gone on huge tangents and made huge forum posts on what's wrong with WB, but to recap why people dislike using the beaver:

- Nightmares swarm you after two minutes on full sanity (it's actually takes slightly less than 2 minutes to go from full sanity beaver to no sanity beaver, it's awful), and bar you from using the swiss-multitool aspect of the Beaver.  Once there's more than one terrorbeak, they're your SOLE FOCUS now, and instead of having fun romping around as an all-powerful beaver, harvesting things or simply trying to revert back from this terrible form, you're stuck fighting boring as all hell mobs which will never stop popping up on you.  Chances are you will be hit while eating a log to revert back.

- The beaver has 0 self-sustainability; if he gets hurt, he cannot heal himself without reverting.  The only healing item other players can use to heal him is Wortox's souls, which is frankly stupid.

- The beaver isn't useful to Woodie or his team as soon as you get out of early-game.  It's outclassed in every aspect of it's kit by much simpler alternatives (Maxwell, mostly).  Being the beaver is a waste of time and resources that the group could be using to accomplish other goals.

Personally, I think the beaver needs more mechanics and QoL updates.  Some of the following would work:

- Remove sanity or reduce the drain enough so killing the nightmares can keep them away for a while.

- Even more important than above, fix how the beaver overlay and sanity overlap, making some biomes at certain times impossible to see nightmares in.  It's awful, there's no defending it, and there's no way it should've been in the game this long.

- Some way to heal, probably from eating logs.  Only works while a Werebeaver, mind you.

- Damage and armor buffs, because werebeaver does axe damage with 25% resistance (grass is 60%), and that's frankly pathetic.

- Probably some way to better handle the extreme weather conditions better.  Experienced beavers can go to lava pools to heat up, and tree shade is enough to cool down, but it kinda kills the mojo beaver-mode used to give seeking these things out.

And as I mentioned above, more mechanics would be nice.  You can't craft, build, worry about hunger, or manipulate items, so some other things to do than harvesting (and maybe fighting...  Maybe.) would be appreciated.  Giving the beaver it's own unique goals it can work towards and being rewarded upon success would really help make the beaver less useless and more fun.

[Toros]

3 hours ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

This is honestly a really valid argument. 

Just curious, do you agree with this though?

Because that's really my main point, aside from lacking any real pros to becoming the were beaver, it's just painful to play cause the sanity effects are just unavoidable.

I know I got totally wrecked by that, but...

I still think it's a total valid argument. Especially as Wilbur isn't in DST, it be nice to have a character to have his tail skills and it would fit with the animalist traits of his character (although I can agree that he's so powerful, that such an addition is a bit unnecessary).

I strongly feel that Werebeaver isn’t satisfying to use in the current state, and the vast majority of suggestions are actually not buffing Werebeaver form enough.

The cost of using werebeaver is both direct costs (by default the sanity drain) and indirect costs (not being able to pick up anything or use items)

I made a mod of how I think he should be reworked, which I will link below.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=888197520

I won’t list the many changes I made, but it’s a fusion between singleplayer and DST werebeaver and makes woodie a hybrid fighter/gatherer as he is in DS.  He doesn’t gain all the advantages of DS werebeaver (still has a sanity meter, can die in werebeaver form) but can be a wood powered fighting/gathering machine.

I’ve tested him for maybe 40 hours as he is now, and would love more testing and feedback.

[Daxterr]

Give him a lightsaber 

[RETAKEREPLAY]

I personally love the current DST Woodie, I'd always pick Woodie even at his current state, he's generally a fun character for me to play, never tried Woodie on the singleplayer version so I couldn't relate to other ds/dst players. However, I'd think it would be an interesting mechanic that as a lumberjack, he should be able to benefit more on wood collecting, maybe have a different drop rate when chopping trees, since all the characters can only gather 4 logs with a full grown tree, give Woodie more power on the collecting part would make him a little more benefitial to a team without Maxwell.(since I could spend hours upon hours just chopping trees because I find gathering as Woodie relaxing lol)

 

Maybe giving a little more specialized tools would be interesting to see, being able to create better axes and shovels for others would be awesome (Albeit not very important, but still a thought) ,being able to last longer than golden tools? (Would that be too op or not fitting his character?)

Woodies beaver form and Lucy should still be the main attraction to his kit, after reading a couple of replies on here, it seems that everyone would like to see a tough beaver, I think it would be cool but since Woodie always struck me as a gatherer, retaining his current playstyle seems to be fine for me, (especially since not all characters must have a fighting attribute but being able to be useful in their respective way) but having his beaver form be able to gather more effieciently might be helpful, his sanity "problem" while in beaver form was always a little tough to get through, especially when no ones around to help you kill nightmares or tree guards, so giving him more tanky attributes while in beaver in this regard might be helpful, loosing sanity while in beaver form in general isn't really a bad thing, since his beaver form is supposedly a curse, it makes sense that Lucy and Woodie wouldn't be happy during his transformed state and I personally think being able to gather nightmare fuel early on would be helpful.

Lucy on the other hand, I think she's good as she is, she's a sentient unbreaking axe that cares about Woodie, what more could you want?

Woodies pine cone, twiggy tree cone and birchnut planting is pretty good in it's self, gaining 5 sanity per cone planted, so I think keeping this mechanic is fine (While everyone is out hunting and exploring, I'll be gathering and planting for god knows when, just assume there wouldn't be a chest un-filled with logs).

I do think that his befriending ability doesn't really make sense to me, having longer befriend time than others since I never really befriend pigs and such, but it depends with the other Woodie players out there.

Since Woodie seems to be very well versed in wood-ology, why not let him be able to craft wooden furnitures without a science machine / alchemy engine, let him be able to build chests(maybe even a better chest?), signs, minisigns, wardrobe, or give him some wood carving abilities, like carved wooden bear or deer statues. (It wouldn't really impact the gameplay but it would make me happy while I spend the next hour chopping and shoveling wood) Maybe giving him some personalised furnitures would be pretty neat, I just imagine him being able to craft wooden appliances.

Those are my thoughts on Woodies refresh, not really the best but I personally think Woodie is pretty good already.

Side note, can't wait to have new foods in DST! I want some poutine

Thanks for reading, loving the current updates and looking forward for the new ones to come! 

 

[Starphire]

Eating wood/twigs etc. is a mechanic that needs to stay from a practical standpoint. Being able to raise your log metre at whim allows you to stave off werebeaver form for as long as you wish unless full moon. I use it constantly playing Woodie. In fact I miss not being able to get rid of miscellaneous extra twigs by eating them when I play other characters afterward. It'd also be devastating if you couldn't use Living Logs to eat in certain situations such as human Woodie chopping sporecaps during the toad fight. If you can't replenish a large chunk of your log metre quickly you're going to be at a severe disadvantage/handicapped in your ability to contribute appropriately. He's got a curse. It's magical. I mean human beings have ate crazy things like broken glass or entire bicycles irl. *shrug*

Obtaining logs/boards is one of THE biggest grinds in game, especially as a builder. Woodie's whole premise is being a Were-BEAVER so i feel like the focus should remain on his being a top notch wood (and other resources such as boulders etc.) HARVESTER. His advantage over Maxwell is precision in harvesting (I get to choose which resources I'm going to harvest so I can only harvest fully mature trees and avoid harvesting the others). Ie. SELECTIVE harvesting over having minions with no control over what they target other than vicinity, and even then they fork targets strangely sometimes.

I see no flaws in human Woodie. When it comes to Lucy & Werebeaver it's an entirely other matter. Whoever decided to port Werebeaver and Lucy to DST SLASHED their stats to shreds. I want to be able to remain in Werebeaver mode indefinitely if skilled/experienced enough, with some sort of mechanics that allow werebeaver to replenish health & sanity on the run, with werebeaver equipped with enough insulation and armour to avoid being so squishy and constantly freezing/overheating, especially during long winter full moons, and enough damage (a flint axe worth is insulting; a tentacle spike AT LEAST please) to deal with twin terrorbeaks in a reasonable time frame. I still wanna see werebeaver get insane but perhaps not as quickly, or with ability to get regain sanity fast enough to maintain that rate of drain, and be able to be productive as a resource harvester throughout being werebeaver (so insanity creatures not too time-consuming). Lucy needs to be at least flint axe damage AND infinite. Again, having less damage than an infinite weapon willow's lighter is absurd.

The above are my mains concerns, and involve making Werebeaver/Lucy practical and good at their roles of #1 Wood harvesting #2 Resource harvesting, period. If KLEI are feeling generous and would like to add extra, please make Werebeaver viable and a bonus in boss fights, with cool abilities like being able to gnaw out of bone cage or a master at removing toad's spore caps (with enough survivability to reasonably resist boom shrooms or ground slams); or moba-like moves like a tail slap to stun (pan flute replacement for dragonfly) or a drill dash through attack like Wheeler dodge but with Werebeaver teeth gnaw damage. Attacks that would replace equipment that Werebeaver cannot equip that certain boss fights require, such as enraged dragonfly. Being able (possible, not saying easy) to solo every boss fight as werebeaver would be living the DREAM.

Also, I have such trouble finding my dropped items after I Werebeaver. So hard to find my cane, hat in winter/summer. Important stuff for survival. Some kind of compass back to my **** or some indication where I transformed would be such a luxury KLEI!

P.S. Please do not revert to DS Werebeaver mechanics. DST version is preferable.

Please keep the tree cone/nut planting +5 sanity perk.

One gnaw per stump would definitely be beneficial.

Some benefit with treeguards would be nice. I like to keep them alive but kiting them for long distances/time in werebeaver mode is challenging as you have to relocate them to continue to work at the chop site.

Please let me remain Werebeaver for long stretches and be able to harvest an entire forest of hundreds of trees IF I can maintain my health/sanity in combat. Please don't remove the twin terrorbeak challenge, but please give us tools to deal with them in a reasonable fashion as far as armour/damage is concerned, and with enough insulation value to last that long in cold/heat. Current state is Werebeaver can only chop 6-7 or maybe 11? fully mature (1 that is one stage lower) trees before filling log metre, and transforming back to human Woodie. A PITTANCE of logs. Do that process TWICE and Woodie's sanity is at 0 and you're going to want to replenish your sanity stat before you transform again. Werebeaver wants to gnaw ALL the trees. In a continuous flow/dance. ;P

Allow combat to either halt or regain log metre so long terrorbeak fights during full moon to do not result in 0 log metre and health loss so frequently. With as low damage as Werebeaver has it's what, almost 15 hits per terrorbeak, and with 2 that's a time-consuming process.

Maybe elaborate on that follower bonus? I get that it's a thing b/c Woodie is a polite Canadian but maybe make it more of a useful mechanic? Woodie chain gang crew, ohhh make it so that pig woodchoppers target ONLY the trees that woodie/werebeaver tags, for example. That'd be amazing and so useful! Let 'em go for a rip with his buds, eh (bonus points if all of Woodie's followers gain temporary plaid jackets while hired, lul). ;P

Having some cool carpenter crafting skills would be dope but DEFINITELY should take a back seat to making Werebeaver/Lucy viable.

Woodie is my fav character and I've played him many hundreds if not thousands of hours so I feel fairly well acquainted with his issues and what I'd like to see him be capable of. TY.

[maradyne]

I love Woodie as he is. That said...he's fallen on hard times. In the areas where he's supposed to shine, someone else does it better. Where he does have strength...it isn't enough to stand out. He's not in as bad of a spot as Willow was, but his is the same type of problem; he has some very light but neat usage cases, but he's ultimately a personality pick.

So as someone who likes him right now and who's been putting thought toward what sorts of things fit the 'new balance' standard...here's what I've got: some amalgamated/adjusted ideas, and some original.

 

Keep his follower friendliness perk, and boost its power further. Add oversized plaid shirts that you can give to Pigmen/Bunnymen to greatly extend loyalty, making them into long term wilderness camping buddies until the clothing deteriorates.
Also let Woodie befriend pacified Treeguards with a bunch of pinecones, causing them to nonviolently path toward him for a while, and tame Birchnutters into happy little pets with razor teeth and a bad attitude by giving them twigs. May result in hand nibbles.

Finally, return the werebeaver to glory.
He needs to keep his chopping crew and friends safe from harm. Armor the beaver up, give its bite attack the damage of a HUMONGOUS BEAVER DADDY.
He's braved the untamed wilds of Canadia, the finalest frontier; give the beaver plenty of insulation so he can traverse the harsh northern tundra. In exchange, it probably won't like summer. Tradeoffs, yo.
When he's beavering it up, he's given into the curse and he's in his element: chopping trees. The log meter ensures this. He should be having the time of his life. Don't drain the beaver's sanity; drain Woodie's when he wakes up and notices all the splinters in his mouth.

The loss of the sanity drain leaves his sanity management way too good, even for a woodsman at that sheer level of chill. He should be one of the most mentally stable survivors as long as he's keeping on task...but less so.
Lower the pinecone-planting sanity gain from 5 to 1. This changes it from INFINITE MAX SANITY to just a bit of extra security, so long as you keep chopping away.

This still leaves him a bit lackluster as a woodchopper on his own; boosting wood drops was a good idea. Let's go with that. 50% extra wood and pinecone drops per tree; this is a logger reformed by a life in the Constant, who coexists with the great wild and uses every part of the hunted tree.

Then there's the newly (re)introduced sea travel.
...wetness near-immunity.
Ability to swim.
IT'S A BEAVER.
Ples and danke.

 

Let the beaver build planked turf on water to emulate damming and that'd be kind of amazing.