chemie Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 13 hours ago, M.C. said: Absolutely. That's not the problem, however. There are -- or at least there have to be -- different levels of usefulness between "so OP that nobody in their right mind would use anything else" and "completely useless". The sum total of all the changes they've made is that the ethanol power plant went straight from the former to the latter. Ethanol is still useful for other things, but the power plant aspect of it has been all but eliminated. That's what I meant when I was talking about a new option that does not exist anymore. they decided that ethanol was for nosh plants and not power plants 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CannedSmeef Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 1 hour ago, Lilalaunekuh said: But having a +4 morale and +kcal buff for just grilling raw meat seems way off. => I would prefer if raw meat would be at least tier 0 (and maybe BBQ could be lowered to tier 2). No, it's only a +3. Meat isn't hard to get your hands on in the short term, but sustaining off of meat is much harder. +3 for a easily depleted source of food, again, is fair in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilalaunekuh Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, CannedSmeef said: 1 hour ago, Lilalaunekuh said: But having a +4 morale and +kcal buff for just grilling raw meat seems way off. => I would prefer if raw meat would be at least tier 0 (and maybe BBQ could be lowered to tier 2). No, it's only a +3. Meat isn't hard to get your hands on in the short term, but sustaining off of meat is much harder. +3 for a easily depleted source of food, again, is fair in my eyes. Ok, maybe I wasn´t clear about my point adn the "+4" is a bit misleading. I was not referring to the tier level of the processed item, but instead talking about the increase in food quality achieved through cooking it. => Raw meat (tier -1) will be turned into BBQ (tier 3) with just one "easy" processing step increasing the quality by 4 and adding calories. [Every other recipe with that kind of complexity will just add 1 to the total food quality: Cooking berries, mushrooms or pacu fillet] If we argue that meat is a "rare/valuable" resource, we should change the quality of raw meat to bring it more in line with pacu fillet(, berries and mushrooms). Edited July 19, 2019 by Lilalaunekuh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) I mean, it's raw meat vs cooked meat.. raw meat is revolting to most people except the Japanese. Grilling is so easy and useful that you will never eat them uncooked anyway. Raw meat being +2 would be identical for balance, but it would just feel a little off for what it is. Edited July 19, 2019 by nakomaru Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yunru Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 30 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said: A good steak with some salt and pepper seems like an awesome meal, but without any flavoring ... Blasphemy! A truly good steak needs no flavourings, as they're already present. Side note: High quality beef drippings also mhmmmm. 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lilalaunekuh Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 7 minutes ago, nakomaru said: I mean, it's raw meat vs cooked meat.. raw meat is revolting to most people except the Japanese. 1. Besides real life analogies: Why should the same process "cooking on a grill" increase the food quality for every other recipe of this type "processing a single ingredients" just by one ? 2. If pacu fillet should be "more valuable" than raw meat, I would argue that the same should apply to cooked fish vs (the current) BBQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sebastiangperez Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) Former Petroleum generator , must accept both liquids from the same pipe, now , you cann't , stops working when realizes that you put some peroleum instead of ethanol. Edited July 19, 2019 by Sebastiangperez 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonzaiferroni Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) My opinion is that ethanol power isn't/wasn't OP. I don't understand why "infinite power" is a concern when there is a hard limit imposed by how many acorns you have. You can get more from the printer but they won't come at a rate that puts it in danger of becoming unbalancing. In 1200 cycles I've gotten 8, and I selected them every time they came up. From that I could *almost* get a net 1000 W, which is still much less than the potential from natural gas, solar, and steam, even coal from hatches. In Arboria you'll start out with 15-20 acorns which makes ethanol a more interesting power strategy there, but you will still have that hard limit. Edited July 19, 2019 by bonzaiferroni 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nakomaru Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 I don't think it's deeper than real life analogies here. Raw fish and cooked fish is enjoyed by many. Raw meat is enjoyed by few. Because the uncooked stat is very unimportant - you will virtually never consume either raw when you have access to a grill - it allows them to add some atmosphere. "Raw meat, yuck!" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.C. Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 55 minutes ago, chemie said: they decided that ethanol was for nosh plants and not power plants In that case you'll have to explain why you can still feed ethanol into a a petroleum generator. If the real intention was to disallow power generation, you'd think they would simply break that first, no? 24 minutes ago, bonzaiferroni said: My opinion is that ethanol power isn't/wasn't OP. I don't understand why "infinite power" is a concern when there is a hard limit imposed by how many acorns you have. You can get more from the printer but they won't come at a rate that puts it in danger of becoming unbalancing. In 1200 cycles I've gotten 8, and I selected them every time they came up. From that I could *almost* get a net 1000 W, which is still much less than the potential from natural gas, solar, and steam, even coal from hatches. In Arboria you'll start out with 15-20 acorns which makes ethanol a more interesting power strategy there, but you will still have that hard limit. It wasn't just about infinite power. It was about infinite power and infinite pwater. We're talking cool slush geyser levels of output with a relatively simple setup, and scalable too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonzaiferroni Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, M.C. said: It wasn't just about infinite power. It was about infinite power and infinite pwater. We're talking cool slush geyser levels of output with a relatively simple setup, and scalable too. I also had a hard time seeing that one. We are literally getting water for free from geysers and vents, I didn't understand how it was gamebreaking to work for it. You said yourself that you'd get roughly the same level from a cool slush geyser, why isn't that a problem? I also wouldn't call it a simple setup, dealing with the CO2 and heat requires a decent amount of engineering for the average player. All of these are just my subjective opinion and I appreciate hearing yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitroturtle Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Sebastiangperez said: Former Petroleum generator , must accept both liquids from the same pipe, now , you cann't , stops working when realizes that you put some peroleum instead of ethanol. Just verified this in debug, it's definitely bugged now, though I never tested previously. You can feed the generator either petro OR ethanol when it's freshly built and it works fine. If you then feed it the opposite fuel, it will then stop accepting either input until it's rebuilt (or possibly on reload, didn't try that). Reloading doesn't work either, only destroying and rebuilding. It appears the generator is keeping a very small amount of whichever fuel in it's internal storage. When the other fuel is added, it also gets added to the storage but the generator refuses to run on either. Edited July 19, 2019 by Nitroturtle 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathmanican Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 47 minutes ago, Yunru said: Blasphemy! A truly good steak needs no flavourings, as they're already present. Says our local cannibal George Donner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chemie Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) 26 minutes ago, M.C. said: In that case you'll have to explain why you can still feed ethanol into a a petroleum generator. If the real intention was to disallow power generation, you'd think they would simply break that first, no? It wasn't just about infinite power. It was about infinite power and infinite pwater. We're talking cool slush geyser levels of output with a relatively simple setup, and scalable too. My point was not they they banned it; just nerfed it so it no longer makes sense from wood-ethanol loop Edited July 19, 2019 by chemie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yunru Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 45 minutes ago, nakomaru said: I don't think it's deeper than real life analogies here. Raw fish and cooked fish is enjoyed by many. Raw meat is enjoyed by few. Because the uncooked stat is very unimportant - you will virtually never consume either raw when you have access to a grill - it allows them to add some atmosphere. "Raw meat, yuck!" We need steak tartare, we have all the ingredients (Plus tartare sounds great with a little cooking.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamprunner7 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Performance is very bad in this snapshot, it's freezes for minutes if to select Harvest plants tool too and just in mid game. Previous version was smooth. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGCat Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 13 minutes ago, swamprunner7 said: Performance is very bad in this snapshot, it's freezes for minutes if to select Harvest plants tool too and just in mid game. Previous version was smooth. I noticed the same. Not minutes, but a couple of seconds to open the harvest screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamprunner7 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Stopped playing, mid game freezes became more freequent, something not right, waiting for fix If game save needed, i could upload np. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluefoxfire Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) 52 minutes ago, swamprunner7 said: Stopped playing, mid game freezes became more freequent, something not right For me, the game window refuses to even load up and it's stuck in a loop until I end it's process. Basically, it won't go past the "update checking" window. Edited July 19, 2019 by Bluefoxfire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamprunner7 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Is there any way to load previous snapshot? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardCrusher Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 19 hours ago, Ipsquiggle said: Ethanol lakes have been added to the Rust biome (worldgen required) Seems like this isn't happening correctly on Rime. Ethanol lakes aren't generated in Rust biomes, and there's some tiles of snow spawning for some reason. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamprunner7 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 (edited) I've got ethanol lake in the rust biom spawned Edited July 19, 2019 by swamprunner7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maleus M Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Arbor trees are just useless now. Why put new stuff in game and nerf it so hard to make it useless? It's nonsense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasza22 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, Maleus M said: Arbor trees are just useless now. Why put new stuff in game and nerf it so hard to make it useless? It's nonsense! How are they useless? Turned into ethanol and fed to nosh beans is now more water efficient than sleet wheat. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.C. Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 2 hours ago, swamprunner7 said: Stopped playing, mid game freezes became more freequent, something not right, waiting for fix If game save needed, i could upload np. I am getting around 20 FPS after cycle 80 or so. 6 dupes, very little map explored, no computationally expensive infrastructure like liquid or gas pipes. It's not unplayable per se, but it's pretty damn close to "I don't really want to play right now". 3 hours ago, chemie said: My point was not they they banned it; just nerfed it so it no longer makes sense from wood-ethanol loop It actually still makes sense. You'll get a decent chunk of power without tune-up, and lots of power with tune-up. Take a look at my post further down, I have a summary of a possible post-nerf setup. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now