M.C.

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About M.C.

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  1. That one is, like... literally in this announcement.
  2. My only problem with this is that it increases endgame tedium even more by greatly reducing hydrogen production efficiency, which in turn slows down the already painfully slow space exploration. By the time I am sending dupes to space, I am no longer racing against time and the game becomes about waiting, waiting and more waiting. What I'd really like to see is an alternative to electrolysis for hydrogen production. In the real world, about half of all industrial hydrogen is produced by processing natural gas (a high temperature reaction that requires steam plus a low temperature reaction that requires water), and you can also produce it from coal and oil. All of the required substances are already in the game. Throw in a space-only material to make sure you still have to generate hydrogen via electrolysis to bootstrap your space program, and maybe introduce syngas to model the real world better, and you'll kill off some tedium and expand the endgame a little bit.
  3. [Game Update] - 353289

    I am getting around 20 FPS after cycle 80 or so. 6 dupes, very little map explored, no computationally expensive infrastructure like liquid or gas pipes. It's not unplayable per se, but it's pretty damn close to "I don't really want to play right now". It actually still makes sense. You'll get a decent chunk of power without tune-up, and lots of power with tune-up. Take a look at my post further down, I have a summary of a possible post-nerf setup.
  4. [Game Update] - 353289

    In that case you'll have to explain why you can still feed ethanol into a a petroleum generator. If the real intention was to disallow power generation, you'd think they would simply break that first, no? It wasn't just about infinite power. It was about infinite power and infinite pwater. We're talking cool slush geyser levels of output with a relatively simple setup, and scalable too.
  5. [Game Update] - 353289

    The lumber intake hasn't doubled. It's been increased from 750 g/s of lumber to 1000 (non-ethanol outputs have doubled but they don't factor into these calculations). I think you are missing the actual math: 1 generator requires 4 distillers; that hasn't changed. These 4 distillers require 4000 g/s of lumber. Each tree produces 5 branches * 300 kg lumber/branch = 1500 kg lumber per 4.5 cycles, or 556 g of lumber per second. 4000 / 556 = 7.2 trees per distiller.
  6. [Game Update] - 353289

    You need 7.2 trees per generator.
  7. [Game Update] - 353289

    Ok, so I've added skimmers to my spreadsheet and here's the setup I am looking at: 8 trees 4 distillers running full time 1 generator running full time 2 compost piles running full time 1 carbon skimmer idling most of the time 1 liquid pump idling some of the time Some sort of gas containment structure to capture CO2 Dirt: neutral or somewhat positive via compost piles, heavily positive if you add more compost piles Pdirt: lots and lots of it left over and available for conversion to PO2 if you don't send it all to compost piles Water: 183 g/s minimum input, more if you want more pwater Pwater: neutral via carbon skimmer, or as much of it as you want if you use more water and more carbon skimmers Power: around 1000W, give or take Dupe labor: harvesting 8 trees and flipping 2 compost piles So. This is... an interesting setup. It sort of does a lot of things at once, compared to most current designs that do one thing and do it well. It's a monstrosity that can be configured to produce dirt, pdirt, pwater, CO2 and power in various quantities depending on your colony's needs. It can also be scaled up if necessary. I think it boils down to whether you want to commit your colony to using it. If you do, it can take you all the way to the endgame, providing your dupes with food, water and oxygen. I suppose it's not quite as bad as it seemed at the first glance, but the complexity involved is, well... intimidating.
  8. [Game Update] - 353289

    Trees require dirt. Distillers produce pdirt. This means you need compost piles, lots of them, which means lots of dupe labor. Pwater geysers are not guaranteed. Water geysers are, but converting water to pwater requires skimmers, which means more complexity and less power produced. Each tree consumes 70 kg of pwater per cycle, or 117 g/s. Your hypothetical 20-tree farm will require 2333 g/s of pwater, which is a non-trivial amount no matter how you turn it. Can I make this work? Sure. It will have lots and lots of moving parts and will require dupe labor. Does it make sense to build this setup? I would argue that it does not. It's way too complicated for what it actually does, and there are far simpler and far more effective options competing with it.
  9. [Game Update] - 353289

    I am sorry, but what does storing gas have to do with what we're discussing here?
  10. [Game Update] - 353289

    You missed the part where (a) it requires massive amounts of dirt, which is a resource that's abundant during early game only and that doesn't become renewable until much later, (b) your power plant consumes pwater instead of producing it, (c) you won't have any sources of pwater until much later in the game, and (d) by the time those sources become available, you'll have many other ways to generate power, making your ethanol setup pointless -- or, if you prefer, something you do for the sake of doing something new, not because it's actually a good idea.
  11. [Game Update] - 353289

    Absolutely. That's not the problem, however. There are -- or at least there have to be -- different levels of usefulness between "so OP that nobody in their right mind would use anything else" and "completely useless". The sum total of all the changes they've made is that the ethanol power plant went straight from the former to the latter. Ethanol is still useful for other things, but the power plant aspect of it has been all but eliminated. That's what I meant when I was talking about a new option that does not exist anymore.
  12. [Game Update] - 353289

    Ok, well... RIP ethanol power plant. That's a damn shame. I was looking forward to more options, the old tricks have grown stale long ago, and now it looks like these new options are nerfed into uselessness. Oh well. Maybe the DLC will have enough new stuff to play with...
  13. [Game Update] - 353289

    Doing quick napkin math on pdirt-to-PO2 conversion, the minimum number of containers to evaporate one distiller's worth of pdirt (333 g/s) is 12. That's not horrible per se, but it's also going to take ages before you fill these containers with enough pdirt to achieve that evaporation rate. You can use more containers, but at that point it just becomes a hassle I'd rather not deal with.
  14. [Game Update] - 353289

    From wiki: The emission rate (in g/s) is proportional to the exposed perimeter, or the square root of the mass (in kg): rate = 0.2*sqrt(mass). It's also kind of a moot point if the setup is pwater-negative. The forest asteroid does not have a guaranteed way to get enough pwater to fuel the ethanol loop early in the game, and by the time I get to better technologies and resources, I will no longer need ethanol-derived power. Have you verified whether this changes lumber yield per cycle?
  15. [Game Update] - 353289

    That depends on how you read the five-branch change. If you read it as "5 branches per cycle [instead of 7]", then yes, it is pwater-negative and thus useless. If you read it as "it stops growing once it reaches 5 branches but still grows 7 branches per cycle", then it's still positive. I am not sure which reflects the new reality, actually.