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JoeW

Willow Refresh Info and Roadmap Schedule Update

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-Variant    4,414

I hate to be a bandwagoner, but Fire Immunity would be neat.

Everything else seems okay, though. 

I'd love for some more Willow based content or ideas, rather than her sidekick, Bernie. 

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Well-met    1,197
2 minutes ago, Marco BR said:

@JoeW

I know dozens of friends who are waiting for the update to create a world, since we do not see more sense in investing in a world that will not receive the new content .... we should wait until when in the consoles for this?

character updates apply to any world.

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ADM    1,737

LOVE THE NEW PERKS !

 

Here's my opinion about the update, consider it as you like

 

  • Willow no longer gets cold from low sanity.

Good change, I feel like Willow should be more eazy-to-play cause she's the character next to Wilson and most of the new player start with her and this down-side is kinda bad for player who don't even reach winter

 

  • Willow takes more damage and loses sanity from freezing.

Sounds logic... but it looks kinda weak to me, I don't have the percent of damages but sanity effect on freezing better be masive to be considered, players just want to get fire as fast a possible when getting cold, finding a tree to burn or placing a fire takes ~5-10 seconds

 

  • Willow takes less damage from overheating.

Lots of players asked for immuntiy to overheating but this is way to strong in my opinion, unlike WX and freezing, she have no special statue to trigger to have this bonus, as the summer is harder than winter, it's a welcomed addition to her perks

 

  • Willow gets fire immunity for the first several seconds and then reduced damage thereafter.

Well... I have a very unpopular opinion about fire immunity in this game : Fire is the least impacting enemy of the game, almost all the time, fire is cast by a player, to make charcoal or ashes, if you find a wild fire, well, you probably just lost a flower/sapling or maybe your entire base

cause fek i forgot to feed the damn fingo but you don't take damage from that, to extinct a fire, we use ranged items, why should you die in fire ?

So the immunity to fire is pointless and have no important impact, you can still get it from an item that you almost never use (scale armor)

Unless the upcoming changes to the game make fire very difficult to manage and escape from, like in the center of a forest, I just feel like you just need this decent perk in early game, nothing more :)

 

  • Willow takes no burn damage while extinguishing fires and does it faster than others.

This sounds like the Winona speed crafting perk ^^ I like that but I wanna suggest a sanity loss to that action, how do you feel about that?

 

  • Adding fuel to fires is more effective for Willow.

I'm wondering what happens if you place a very efficient fuel into fire, like glommer goop, do the fire last longer or this should be only effective for logs and similar item ? Anyway this is something good, it makes Willow more cooperative in early game, so she have more priorities in base roles

 

  • Bernie can now be equipped by Willow for sanity and warmth at the cost of durability.

I never used Bernie, as I never died into fire, but this is a change that will make a good use for Bern'. I like the fact that it's not only for sanity gain but also a heat-related perk, the only thing I'm wonderng is if it's good enough to handle it and not keeping the walking cane that we get during winter, you know, player are idle only next to fire most of the time... so... :?

 

  • Bernie grows big and will taunt and fight most hostile creatures when Willow is nearby and insane.

Oh, that's good ! This perk requise low sanity to be used against more ennemis like hound waves so you have to trade something for getting the adventage

 

  • Bernie will still taunt Shadow Creatures when any other player is nearby and insane.

Still better in game that removed, I guess Bernie is getting very helpfull right now, well re-balanced Klei

 

  • In addition, Willow still gains sanity near fire and can still cook with her Lighter.

As I noticed that lot of players didn't know about the last perk, it's a good thing to keep it, making her as usefull for lone survival time and multiplayer with new content

 

Well that's pretty much it, very exited about the changes and I'll finally consider playing Willow more, it's hard to stop playing Maxi when you have no others choise than high tier characters and the "Meh-lson" kind tier, GOOD JOB !

 

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reverentsatyr    2,266

Why's everybody being so loud and angry about Willow not having 100% fire damage? She already sounds super powerful, and she only has one downside(extra damage and sanity loss to freezing) which will probably be super easy to control considering all the fire-related buffs she got. 6-seconds of fire immunity is a lot, and after that she only takes half damage.

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-Variant    4,414
1 hour ago, Hell-met said:

character updates apply to any world.

I think they're talking about the new content, not Willow.

The new content cannot be transferred to old worlds as said by a Dev.
The biomes, at least.

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FreyaMaluk    4,952
4 minutes ago, Canis said:

Right now, in-game, Willow doesn't take damage from fire until 3 seconds pass.

Ik but the scenario was pretty much set a lot of logs on fire and Willow standing in the middle fighting doggos

That's why I mentioned we don't know how many other seconds she got from the update.. 

I'm aware of the 3 seconds fire immunity 

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Canis    7,971
2 minutes ago, reverentsatyr said:

Why's everybody being so loud and angry about Willow not having 100% fire damage? She already sounds super powerful, and she only has one downside(extra damage and sanity loss to freezing) which will probably be super easy to control considering all the fire-related buffs she got. 6-seconds of fire immunity is a lot, and after that she only takes half damage.

Because having 100% immunity would open the door to plenty of fun and interesting ways to play the character.

The downside is also really, really underwhelming.

 

1 minute ago, FreyaMaluk said:

Ik but the scenario was pretty much set a lot of logs on fire and Willow standing in the middle fighting them

That's why I mentioned we don't know how many other seconds she got from the update.. 

I'm aware of the 3 seconds fire immunity 

I literally gave you the answer.

Here it is again:

40 minutes ago, JoeW said:

 CURRENTLY it's set at Immunity for 6 second and 50% reduced damage. 

 

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FreyaMaluk    4,952
1 minute ago, Canis said:

Because having 100% immunity would open the door to plenty of fun and interesting ways to play the character.

The downside is also really, really underwhelming.

 

I literally gave you the answer.

Here it is again:

Ahhh sorry didn't get that part.. Hmm 6 seconds is not that much tbh... I hoped they go a bit higher 

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Chris1448    12,946
7 minutes ago, jantonio said:

everyone complaining about fire immunity, go make scaled armor.

Characters having perks that already do the job that items do is not a new concept.
Look at Wortox's Soul Hop, just make a Lazy Explorer.
Look at Winona's Trusty Tape, just make a Sewing Kit.
The Scaled Armor argument falls flat.

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Bluegeist    1,148

I assume that to utilize the fire resistance fully, you would have to step into the fire for 6 seconds, then step out, then step in again and so on. Is that how it would work?

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Marco BR    1,626
6 minutes ago, Hell-met said:

character updates apply to any world.

yes, I mean the game update, bioms and mobs, not the characters ....

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Shpee    489
1 minute ago, reverentsatyr said:

Why's everybody being so loud and angry about Willow not having 100% fire damage? She already sounds super powerful, and she only has one downside(extra damage and sanity loss to freezing) which will probably be super easy to control considering all the fire-related buffs she got. 6-seconds of fire immunity is a lot, and after that she only takes half damage.

still trying to not bandwagon on the fire immunity thing, but  super powerful? did you read the same rework as we did? everything, except the bernie fighting back thing can all be taken quite easily at face value, boring, not very useful, the bernie buff is debatable, however i do not expect bernie to suddenly become hulk hogan and pummel a beefalo into goo, if anything he will be about as strong as a spider warrior, or abigail if yer lucky, probably not gonna get a AOE attack, so we can safely say that bernie is gonna be negligable, and overshadowed by abigail/spider allies, not seein this "super powerful" buff here.

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Papa Zach    19
3 minutes ago, Chris1448 said:

Characters having perks that already do the job that items do is not a new concept.
Look at Wortox's Soul Hop, just make a Lazy Explorer.
Look at Winona's Trusty Tape, just make a Sewing Kit.
The Scaled Armor argument falls flat.

To follow up on this, scaled armor is statistically worse in dst, making the crazy demand of a Dfly scale makes this basically worthless to craft. (but seriously, go craft some chests or somethin useful)

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reverentsatyr    2,266
4 minutes ago, Canis said:

The downside is also really, really underwhelming.

Exactly. All this complaining just looks like it could lead to another OP character, like what happened with Winona. She got a super powerful buff(catapults) paired with a big downside(hunger while speed crafting). But then everybody complained about her downside, and now she's a super powerful character that only takes hunger once every minute or something. that's nothing.

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RatherAzure    26

>Willow takes no burn damage while extinguishing fires and does it faster than others.
Willow never could extinguish any fires and neither could anybody else. Either it's "extinguishing smoldering fires" or "Willow can now extinguish fires." and one of them is much cooler than the other.

>Willow takes more damage and loses sanity from freezing.
>Willow takes less damage from overheating.
Honestly, I feel like nobody would notice a difference. With the crackling of the freezing fx or hissing of summer, everybody is most likely going to either panic or put down a fire. Nobody is going to stay freezing or overheating for an extended amount of time because the game is warning them: "Hey, you're dying. You need to get out of here."
I suggest modifying Willow's insulation factor. Have her freeze faster in Winter and make Winter clothing less effective. Have her overheat slower in Summer.

>In addition, Willow still gains sanity near fire and can still cook with her Lighter.
I never really understood why Willow and only Willow could cook with her lighter. It's Don't Starve Together after all.

>The Rest
I like it.

All in all, though. I'd say Willow is better, but still not where she is supposed to be. It's still missing something. What's the new mindblowing thing that makes everybody go "woah I wish I was Willow so I could do that"? Willow's lighter having an ability causing the fire to suddenly flare up, deaggroing all monsters and sending them into panic? Refuellable lighters? Whatever man. Point is: Something is missing here.

My two cents on the matter.

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Obviousclone    45

I just wish the rework made her more like singleplayer willow

it was cool how you could translate whatever cool strategies and skills you learned from single-player to multiplayer environments.

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ADM    1,737
2 minutes ago, Canis said:

Because having 100% immunity would open the door to plenty of fun and interesting ways to play the character.

The downside is also really, really underwhelming.

I've mentioned that in my post, just a minute ago, immunity in early-game sounds not necessary for Willow as fire is not so dangerous and common in wild, and before making big stuff with fire (who will requise to stand still into fire... kinda rare) you may have the time to build a scale armor to benefit for a real fire immunity, no offense but fire need a rework to be more impacting for player behavior to consider a fire immunity as a perk :)

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Canis    7,971
Just now, reverentsatyr said:

Exactly. All this complaining just looks like it could lead to another OP character, like what happened with Winona. She got a super powerful buff(catapults) paired with a big downside(hunger while speed crafting). But then everybody complained about her downside, and now she's a super powerful character that only takes hunger once every minute or something. that's nothing.

This gave me an idea.

Big upside: Fire Immunity, yup.

Big downside: Willow remembers the last time she was near fire. The longer she's away from fire, the more sanity she loses.

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ADM    1,737

Also, I'm pretty sure that getting like a damage every 0.5 sec or something like that is not a big deal for Willow

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Chris1448    12,946
Just now, FreyaMaluk said:

could she warm up with burning logs in her inventory like in ds? If she had fire immunity she could in theory

Nope. Inventory burning isn't a thing in DST, only DS. 

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minespatch    58,327
1 minute ago, Canis said:

Big downside: Willow remembers the last time she was near fire. The longer she's away from fire, the more sanity she loses.

She'd need to make a torch during the day and a firepit during the night if that were the case.

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Stonetribe    471

I feel really bad saying that seeing how hard at work Klei is with these updates, but to be entirely honestly, these changes seem pretty underwhelming to me. We don't know the what refresh will fully entail though, so to everyone who feels disappointed, let's stay positive!!

 

I already mentioned this in another thread, but here are three things that I think Willow could really benefit from.

1. Full on Fire immunity: This is the one thing that everyone on forums seems to agree on. Removing it didn't stop griefers and it wasn't an especially powerful perk to begin with, so putting it back in would be a step in the right direction. Additionally, I think that giving Willow full on immunity to overheating would be a great extension of this. I'm not in a position to say if this would be entirely ballenced or not, but it's very thematically appropriate and would give her a special niche that no other character has.

2. Buffed Lighter: l think that having an infinite light source might have been the real reason folks, or at least beginners, would pick Willow. So why not expand on that? Let's not just revert it back to being infinite, let's take it a step further and turn it into a very good portable light source that can even compete with the lantern. Increasing the light radius to at least that of a torch would be a good start. I'd really love it if you could use it as a hands free light source like the lantern.

3. Control over how her fire spreads: Willow's biggest obstacle when starting fires for her benefit is keeping them from spreading to other resources you don't want to destroy. On paper that sounds like a fun thing to play around, but in practice the only practical way of doing that is setting aside a designated"burn" area, which ends up being kind of boring. This extends to using fire as a way to fight mobs as the risks of a panicking mob spreading the fire and losing out on the loot are too great to justify the extra damage. I know it might seem contradictory to her character, but giving Willow the ability to somehow light fires without the risk of devastating collateral damage would still end up with more beautiful arson overall compared to before! :wilson_evil:

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Canis    7,971
1 minute ago, ADM said:

I've mentioned that in my post, just a minute ago, immunity in early-game sounds not necessary for Willow as fire is not so dangerous and common in wild, and before making big stuff with fire (who will requise to stand still into fire... kinda rare) you may have the time to build a scale armor to benefit for a real fire immunity, no offense but fire need a rework to be more impacting for player behavior to consider a fire immunity as a perk :)

The idea of fire immunity as a perk isn't for the sole reason of "to protect willow from taking damage" but more along the lines of "giving the ability to use fire for her benefit."

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Well I'm not a pro in DST, but I believe that characters here should be balanced I na way to make them cooperate. Wicker has books that allow her to make food, Max gives wood and Wortox heals. Now I like the idea of some characters being made for lone wolfs, but Willow does not need to be one, especially when light and heat is a minimum to survive a night/winter..

My additions are:

Lighter:

•Keeps the durability, but instead of breaking down needs to be refilled Nightmare fuel

•As a light source - infinite

•To burn things down - 1% each time

•"Lucky Star" - a dwarf star-like orb that lasts 1.5 day, warms, cooks and keeps away Charlie, for a cost of 10%, will scare off enemies at night 

 

Willow:

•Fire immunity, with the exception being lava pools

•"Fire meter" that needs to be filled with burning creatures/items/structures

•Can extinguish fire

 

 

 

 

 

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