Memetan Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 I tried to take care of smallbirds, and It feels wrong, Smallbirds can't jump in to a boat, can't hatch on a boat, they have very low health, low hunger, tried to kill you... Can they even despawn with his owner? It feels outdated. I think the easy fix will be turning smallbirds in to critters, even if this mean that they will never grow, or maybe a QOL. What do you think guys? Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALCRD Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 Yea if a rework for them isn't going to happen. Making small Tallbirds a critter den "adoptable" would be much better than what we currently have. Hatching and caring for a Tallbird at its current broken and tedious state just so it can try to kill you for no reason what so ever is not worth it. It's completely nonsensical why is it like this.. what's the point? Almost feels like a cruel prank Klei has pulled on people who like to have pets. And for people who think they are decent for combat ... No ..just no. I hate to admit it but Beefalos are leagues better for that purpose and much more ...and a lot less tedious to manage too. It's indeed a very outdated and punishing mechanic that isn't worth the effort at all and should be changed. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572408 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spino43 Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 No, they deserve to die. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572413 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caochu Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 For me, the tallbirds are one of the most emblematic monsters of Don't Starve. They are featured on most of the promotional posters and have that disturbing feel of the original Don't Starve. However, I don't know any experienced player who uses them in game to build strategies (not talking about tallbirds fortress tho). They are nice to get meat easily, nothing more. I really would like to have a non-killable smallbird as a pet, yes 5 hours ago, ALCRD said: Hatching and caring for a Tallbird at its current broken and tedious state just so it can try to kill you for no reason what so ever is not worth it. It's completely nonsensical why is it like this.. what's the point? Almost feels like a cruel prank Klei has pulled on people who like to have pets. And for people who think they are decent for combat ... No ..just no. I hate to admit it but Beefalos are leagues better for that purpose and much more ...and a lot less tedious to manage too. It's indeed a very outdated and punishing mechanic that isn't worth the effort at all and should be changed. Indeed, the whole hatching mechanic is not worth the effort. I wish tallbirds without nests could build their own, which would allow cool midgame and lategame strategies: butterfly farm, pigs, rabbits, bees etc. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572440 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaZoul Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 that would strip me of the sudden surge of joy I get every time I see a morsel next to a Tallbird nest Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572443 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baark0 Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 i survive mostly off smallbirds, this change would literally make the game unplayable for me Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572450 Share on other sites More sharing options...
planetearth Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 No. I love the weirdness and grimness of the smallbirds. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572458 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike23Ua Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 I believe it is this way because in real life a momma bird will kick its children out her nest to try to teach them to fly, if they learn good.. but if they don’t- they splat the ground and the mother considers them to be too stupid to survive. Is it harsh? Yes- but news flash: Life is harsh, extra especially WILD LIFE.. I believe this is the intent behind the small bird/Tallbird mechanics.. you hatch a baby bird, it grows into a teen and then it resents your entire existence, it’s not exactly like wild birds in reality but just pretend your that momma bird, kick the baby out the nest.. before it decides it wants to betray all the love you gave to it growing up. (also as a side note I would love for the mechanic to remain exactly the way it is in the game now.. but having a Craftable pet den critter variant would be nice too.) Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornete Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 Nah, it's one of those last few remnants from classic Don't Starve that I really enjoy. Their whole purpose is just to be mean! and I love it. Though I'll take some changes to tallbirds in general, the renewability of their nests could take a look. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572470 Share on other sites More sharing options...
EighteenXVIII Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 There doesn't have to be another reward. The whole point is the satisfaction of raising a baby bird to adulthood, being careful not to let it get too cold or overheat before it hatches, feeding it regularly... Like the great philosopher Miley Cyrus once said: it's not about what's waiting on the other side. Besides, raising a smallbird is like the most OG Don't Starve mechanic. The wiki page for it was created in December 2012, most of y'all weren't even born yet at that point. So don't touch it. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Variant Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 Hot Mildly Lukewarm take here... I kinda want the opposite. It's a mean jab, a classic one even, from old DS. And I adore it. I honestly wanted Critters to interact with the world and not be cosmetic only. They have unused death and hurt animations too, it feels like they were gonna be like smallbirds. I'd greatly want them to be killable and have more risk/reward! I'd love to feel acomplished being able to raise them into adults. Maybe unlike smallbirds, critter adults would stick around and fill certain niches/have their own abilities. They always brought me out of my immersion since they're kinda just there to look cute and make loud noises. Immortal mobs in this harsh survival world is weird to me. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALCRD Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 5 hours ago, EighteenXVIII said: Besides, raising a smallbird is like the most OG Don't Starve mechanic. And OG DS has quite few mechanics that are outdated and trash and have no place in DST without a proper rework. This is one of them. There is more than one thing wrong with Tallbird hatching and raising mechanic.. 5 hours ago, EighteenXVIII said: The wiki page for it was created in December 2012, most of y'all weren't even born yet at that point. So don't touch it. Factually wrong statement that serves no purpose in this argument. I bet my left kidney that majority here who defend this poopy stinky mechanic never actually use said mechanic in their playthroughs and yet still want it kept "outdated" and in a borderline "unfinished" state for no other valid reason but "hur hur DS nostalgia". Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572501 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenomeSquirrel Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 4 hours ago, Mike23Ua said: I believe it is this way because in real life a momma bird will kick its children out her nest to try to teach them to fly, if they learn good.. but if they don’t- they splat the ground and the mother considers them to be too stupid to survive. Is it harsh? Yes- but news flash: Life is harsh, extra especially WILD LIFE.. I believe this is the intent behind the small bird/Tallbird mechanics.. you hatch a baby bird, it grows into a teen and then it resents your entire existence, it’s not exactly like wild birds in reality but just pretend your that momma bird, kick the baby out the nest.. before it decides it wants to betray all the love you gave to it growing up. This is false, birds generally don’t push their children out of their nest on purpose. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572504 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALCRD Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 9 hours ago, Caochu said: Indeed, the whole hatching mechanic is not worth the effort. I wish tallbirds without nests could build their own, which would allow cool midgame and lategame strategies: butterfly farm, pigs, rabbits, bees etc. That would actually be somewhat worthwile and justify the tremedeous amount of effort you have to put in to keep that wretched thing alive cause of course you can't make it stay put or pen it like you can with Beefalos and miscellaneous mortal "pets" (and some immortal ones too) .. nooo this thing while young warps through walls and follows you constantly and attacks everything that attacks you - one late game hound wave and say bye bye to all your baby tallbirds cause there is no possible way to safely dispose of hounds with this berserking birb with tiny amount of health following you around and "attacking" everything that looks at you funny. Oh and traps kill it too so forget about using traps against Hound waves while you have one of those things as a pet. (So it's hopeless in typical scenario unless maybe if its early game or you play as Wendy then you might have a chance to keep them alive long enough.) Not to mention the sheer amount of food that you need to supply so this thing doesn't die.. I am baffled why people want this out of place borderline broken relic of a mechanic kept how it is now lmao. (Again i have my doubts that people who defend this mechanic ever actually use it in their playthroughs. It's really disingenuous.) Famous AVGN words come to mind. Addendum: Not sure if still the case but logging out and logging back in (or changing shards) did pernamently break the bond with young Tallbirds (essentially undoing all my work) when last i tried to raise them. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faintly Macabre Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 51 minutes ago, ALCRD said: i have my doubts that people who defend this mechanic ever actually use it in their playthroughs. Hate to be a smart aleck but I mean, of course they don't. As you and others have pointed out, they're dumb, made of paper, and your reward after 28 days of feeding the stupid things is having to turn them into less food than would have fed them for a day. I think you're correct that all they are is a prank pulled on players. Or it's possible that there was a time in the development cycle when the 18 days they're half-decent combatants was actually decently valuable? I dunno. I don't have a huge problem with the way they work now mostly because at this point it's not something that happens on accident or anything; everybody who knows it can be done knows what's waiting for them at the end of the process. Plus, I don't really know how you could reasonably balance them remaining followers as adults. I suspect any attempts to do so would be incredibly messy. But if people want smallbird critters, maybe what they could do is repurpose the raising process: when a smallbird becomes an adult, they leave, but leave behind an item needed to recruit a smallbird critter, like a more troublesome and less gruesome variation of the Broodling adoption process. Alternatively, maybe as Caochu suggested, make it so homeless Tallbirds will make their own nests. Adult tallbirds still want to kill you because they're awful, but after chasing you for a while they settle down and make a nest, so nests are renewable so long as they're not all destroyed. What I do have a problem with, though, is the way the whole spring breeding situation works. The way smallbirds starve to death and teenbirds start fights with their parents, inevitably either killing or being killed by them, just seems incredibly lazy. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572519 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GelatinousCube Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 I like many others just want renewable tall bird nests. I have one in my main long term world and it sucks. Make them like volt goat renewability and make it have very specific requirements and a specific season to do so, I don't care. Just make them renewable/a mechanic to make new ones. A small bird skin for the already existing bird critter would solve the pet issue btw. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572527 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nino123 Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 yes, but with a challenge before, like, if you success to keep it alive enough, or something like that, to not break the actual way to have it witch is cool. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572529 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FourthLess Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 Nah, I like it being absolutely worthless and not worth your time, their whole life cycle is just a very cruel and funny joke, I love it. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheggf Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 If by "Outdated" you mean "a Don't Starve mechanic instead of a pandering power fantasy". Small birds are perfect as they are right now. Not every single thing that you can possibly do needs to reward you. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572532 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jan Mele Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 3 hours ago, ALCRD said: "hur hur DS nostalgia". I didn't even play vanilla/rog ds, I just think the tallbird life cycle is funny. And like to be able to kill them. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572535 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantispidae Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 I love the fact that raising the baby smallbird is largely a useless thing you can kinda just... do. Even if it turns out that it will be an evil little blight on your the whole time before you have to put it down. Its fine little quirk of the constant, and its reflected just fine in the comical parent-child murder that goes on at the actual nests. The constant is supposed to be a brutal world and the idea that you could put effort into something only to have it turn out bunk is a fine quirk to hold onto for at least some mechanics, provided they say little flavor things like the smallbird That said, a lot of the constant's beasts are endearing little things- and I'd love to see them be added at least in spirit to the critters. Things like a smallbird giblet or a baby spiderling would be cute options I'd love to see. But not as replacements Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572536 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameoAppearance Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 I have a weird fondness for the brutal and unrewarding process of raising smallbirds and I feel like it'd be missing the point of them to make them easier to keep alive or useful allies when they grow up. However, given that raising a smallbird is an almost entirely pointless endeavour beyond having a cute little creature around for a while and tallbird nests are both nonrenewable and flammable, I have to agree that it'd be a nice change if player-raised tallbirds (or wild smallbirds that survive offscreen long enough to become teenbirds and win the fight to the death with their parents) could make new nests. Normal tallbird nests that make normal hostile tallbirds, just... harder to drive extinct in a long-running world. I wouldn't say no to a smallbird skin for the giblet as well though. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheggf Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 Perhaps they could make it so that it you recreate the fountain from Mario 64, hatch 8 smallbirds in a circle around it, then do 64 counter clockwise laps around the fountain Luigi could jump out and hands you the blueprint for crafting a smallbird critter at the rock den. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572554 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faintly Macabre Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Cheggf said: Perhaps they could make it so that it you recreate the fountain from Mario 64, hatch 8 smallbirds in a circle around it, then do 64 counter clockwise laps around the fountain Luigi could jump out and hands you the blueprint for crafting a smallbird critter at the rock den. I'm down Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572565 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lakhnish Posted May 23, 2022 Share Posted May 23, 2022 On 5/22/2022 at 2:58 PM, Caochu said: However, I don't know any experienced player who uses them in game to build strategies I once saw a player pen a tallbird in the middle of their Berry farm. The bait was under the Tallbird, Gobblers would go to it and get auto-killed. They would then use a sleep dart to put the Tallbird to sleep and safely collect the loot. It was the most silliest yet most ingenius thing I ever saw, I wish I remember whose stream I saw it on. I just know they never streamed again. Link to comment https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/140414-should-the-smallbirds-be-critters/#findComment-1572663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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