Character Rebalance Discussion thread

[karnikins]

I've had ideas bouncing around in my head since this whole re-balance thing was first announced, so I'm making a forum account just to post them! I apologize in advance if some of what I'm writing has been suggested before, I'm untangling these thoughts in my head and I'll be reading through the thread afterward.

Wilson: I like where he's at, too. He feels like a good beginner character and has enough benefits that even long-time players have a reason to favor him.

Willow: What you've put in the opening post looks good, but I could see people being very annoyed at random fires during low sanity. Considering that she has to enter low sanity to get things like beard hair, it would restrict a player from their base/berry farm/many things for an extended period and I could see that detracting from the fun of the game a lot. She might even light the beard hair or nightmare fuel that she needs on fire!

Wolfgang: Right now he's definitely the most newbie-friendly character, and I'd definitely call him the "easy mode" to Wes' "hard mode". I think he fills a niche that certain people need (I have a friend who plays exclusively as him because she has trouble with the game) and that making him anything but the "easy" character could drive some people away. Alternately someone else could become said character, but it may be simpler to just leave him mostly as is.

A few suggestions for Wolfgang:

* Maybe allow him to break certain things without a hammer? Things in his inventory, for instance, and that action would increase his sanity while giving you half the resources you put into whatever you just snapped in twain.

* Playing off his bumbling and sort-of stupid nature could also be a good idea. Maybe he requires extra ingredients for more advanced science machines/magic devices, as a downside?

* Combat is sort of what this guy specializes in, and in keeping with that theme perhaps the weapons and armor he makes could be more durable? Maybe a 1.25x or 1.5x modifier.

Wendy: She's my favorite character, so I may have some bias here, but I'd like to see more done with Abigail. Right now she's very helpful when she does spawn, but that's all that there really is to Wendy -- An occasional night-time helper.

A few suggestions for Wendy:

* She's haunted by her deceased sister and clearly disturbed, I think a lower maximum sanity would be a good place to start as far as downsides are concerned.

* Wendy seems to take joy and sometimes comfort in destruction, maybe she could gain a dose of sanity when you hand-kill a critter, or her nature allows you to murder more small animals before Krampus shows up.

* Abigail being a less random boon would definitely help her feel more powerful, in my opinion. She's a bit too strong to have every evening and night, but some sort of advance warning so you know that you should take on that pesky spider nest during the evening could be helpful. Something like, in the middle of the day, she might say "Brr, I feel a chill..." and that means her sister will be visiting that night.

* Wendy looks adorable in the winter hat. That is a boon, as far as I'm concerned.

WX-78: I confess that I don't play as the robot much because he isn't all that interesting to me. Being able to eat rotten food is a good thing, but my playstyle revolves less around hoarding food and more around making sure I am fed for the next 3-4 days and nothing more at most times.

A few suggestions for WX-78:

* Something a little more powerful than the ability to eat rotten food is definitely in order, I think. Maybe something like more inventory space? Not too much, but maybe there's a compartment in his chest cavity for storing 2-4 extra items without needing a backpack.

* A robot should have the strength of iron and steel behind him -- Maybe not a melee damage boost, but something like "Does Spear damage with the Axe and Pick, a tool is a tool" could be neat. Some extra defense even while not wearing any kind of armor could also be sweet.

* Damage in rain sounds like a good idea, but early rain (and ESPECIALLY the adventure mode map that has insane weather) would be an absolute crap chute for this guy in that case. Finding reliable healing items early isn't exactly easy.

Wickerbottom: I don't play much as Wickerbottom either, mostly because of something I actually did see touched on in this thread -- She's unbelievably strong early-game, but once you reach the Nightmare Fuel step of research she becomes a less beardly Wilson, basically.

A few suggestions for Wickerbottom:

* The tech level thing is nice and I like it! I'd keep it in, because it's a nice boost in the early game like I mentioned before.

* A woman who enjoys learning and reading could maybe get double the normal sanity boost when she prototypes an item.

* Maybe, tying in with her tech level thing, she could get certain recipes that the others don't. Like... Replace the straw roll with a book that requires some papyrus or less materials in general. She'd spend the night reading instead of sleeping, and maybe suffer less of a loss than the straw roll use as a result.

* I picture her as fragile but smart, so a small health drop and small sanity increase could definitely do well for her.

Wes: I've never, ever played as Wes... I don't think I'm in a position to try and flesh him out. Sorry!

That One Secret Character: He's already pretty strong. I don't think he needs anything!

So there that was. Sorry for the length, but here's hoping it's useful to someone or another.

[flipsied]

Quoted from a reddit post I made a while back."Personally I absolutely love Wendy. Her macabre outlook really feels fitting for don't starve. My post is more about her ability. Don't get me wrong Abigail fits Wendy perfectly but it seems rather lack luster compared to the others. I was trying to think of something that would be balanced and fit her character.I have two Ideas1)"Wendy is not afraid of the dark" - Pretty simple really, she just doesn't lose sanity from night time. It really fits her. She just seems like the type of person who would enjoy the dark. Everything else would still affect her sanity because making it impossible for her to lose it would be totally game breaking but this would give a small edge similar to that of other characters.2)"I ain't 'fraid of no ghosts" - The name needs work but the idea is that wendy doesn't take sanity damage from ghosts. This one would also make sense because she is around a ghost rather frequently so one would assume they wouldn't really scare her anymore.Any opinions or suggestions? Like I said I really like Wendy's personality but having her sister show up once every night or so really feels lack luster."

[MycoLogical]

Here is what I think for Wickerbottom:Pro'sDue to her intelligence she gets her tier bonus (as the same now)All or most items have a reduction in item cost (to a minimum of 1)Sanity increases faster than other characters, and gets higher sanity through prototypingCons:Less damage per hit (what would take 3 hits, now takes 4)Get's more hungryA little bit slower

[jbeetle]

You're gonna use even more food to fill a bigger stomach, you know, like it's now. There's a lot of people with OCD out there, including me, that fill him always up. Anyway, it's 3 am here and i'm not going to put my brain cells to work anymore. At least people seem to like the poop thing [ATTACH=CONFIG]9037[/ATTACH]

(I'm not saying it doesn't make sense as far as what you would expect in real life. I think that's why so many are inclined to latch on to the idea. but that is thrown out the window when it conflicts with gameplay)Filling him up more but making him lose hunger faster does nothing, though. I'm trying to think of an hypothetical example that's just as useless, but exchanging food for food as about is good of an example as you can get.If Wes is hard mode, Wolfgang is easy mode. If Klei is going to change Wolfgang, they had better change Wes too. and it better not be 2 offsetting direct food alterations in one character. There are so many good suggestions on here that have nothing to do with that and still fit his character.Finally, don't offense to what I say because I don't fill it with smilies. I now feel the need to occassionally say that. :)--Speaking of Wes, I do think he should remain the hardmode character, but I feel there should be some sort of perk that allows for a payoff for playing such a brutal character. Edited June 13, 2013 by jbeetle

[Cozyhut3]

Question: Do you plan on keeping Wolfgang and *** (spoilers!) as easy and hard mode, or fleshing them out into normal, balanced characters?

[OOO]

Wilson?! Come on!Please make Wilson take more fire damage when he has a long beard! He needs to have at least one downside!

[TheHomeChicken]

A few suggestions for WX-78:

* Something a little more powerful than the ability to eat rotten food is definitely in order, I think. Maybe something like more inventory space? Not too much, but maybe there's a compartment in his chest cavity for storing 2-4 extra items without needing a backpack.

* A robot should have the strength of iron and steel behind him -- Maybe not a melee damage boost, but something like "Does Spear damage with the Axe and Pick, a tool is a tool" could be neat. Some extra defense even while not wearing any kind of armor could also be sweet.

* Damage in rain sounds like a good idea, but early rain (and ESPECIALLY the adventure mode map that has insane weather) would be an absolute crap chute for this guy in that case. Finding reliable healing items early isn't exactly easy.

I agree with this. WX78 seems still like a terrible character with the stats mentioned in the thread.

[oCrapaCreeper]

Wilson?! Come on!Please make Wilson take more fire damage when he has a long beard! He needs to have at least one downside!

People seriously want the default, base character nerfed?

[OOO]

People seriously want the default, base character nerfed?

It encourages you to shave your beard hair off, most people just run around with their long beards in the middle of winter.When does a scientist get in contact with fire anyway? This is a balance thread. Don't be shocked at nerf/buff suggestions.

[jbeetle]

I like the way Wilson works as is. He rounded out enough to be balanced and juuuust boring enough to get you to try other characters (after the rebalance) and no im not actually saying he's a boring character

[Turkey62]

I am content with the lighter for Willow, exactly what I wanted, the negative effects aren't that bad.

[Shadow_Of_Awesome]

Wait, does this mean Willow has infinite fire? if so... F*CK YEAH! IVE ALWAYS WANTED THIS! thanks kevin! PLZ MAKE THIS HAPPEN WILLOW IS AWESOME! I CAN'T EVEN DESCRIBE HOW AWESOME SHE IS! BUT NOW SHE IS EVEN MORE AWESOME!

[MyrnaTheFae]

I agree, I love Wendy and all, but she should have some perk to do with her ghoulish personality. Graves, or less sanity at night (maybe only lose the normal amount at dusk?) And it would be cool if she ...i dunno, talked to herself in the middle of the night?

Edited June 13, 2013 by MyrnaTheFae

[MycoLogical]

I agree, I love Wendy and all, but she should have some perk to do with her ghoulish personality. Graves, or less sanity at night (maybe only lose the normal amount at dusk?) And it would be cool if she ...i dunno, talked to herself in the middle of the night?Plus, I wonder who Ophelia is...

Ophelia is a character from Hamlet, she was on a branch on a willow tree that snapped and she drowned in a brook. It's a reference; not a new character

[MyrnaTheFae]

I knew it wasn't a new character, I was just asking....then I looked it up on the dont starve wiki, and you replied to this before I edited my post xD

[Penny Thoughts]

Pretty new, but Wendy is definitely my favourite character! I had an idea for her new ability. She's sort of a melancholy sort so maybe some sanity loss/gain are reversed. Like maybe rain increases her sanity and sun decreases, picking flowers decreases it, picking evil flowers increases it. Maybe she has Abigail more often but she can't sleep when she's around so it could be a pain.

[Palpetinus]

Wx takes damage in rain now? How are you supposed to survive then?

[spiritcrusher77]

An UMBRELLA of course. How else?

[brummbar7]

Wx takes damage in rain now? How are you supposed to survive then?

Ya, some playtesting of WX in Cold Reception is definitely going to be in order. Especially as the first world.

[sack1hacim]

I think Abigail should be summoned via blood magic. That is my suggestion.

[Creepado]

I hope WX doesn't loose too much health from the rain, If he looses like one health per second it would be like starving to death. plus, it usually takes at least half a year for something to rust.Otherwise, its cool.Plus, It would be great to be able to make gears out of gold or something.

[Palpetinus]

I hope WX doesn't loose too much health from the rain, If he looses like one health per second it would be like starving to death. plus, it usually takes at least half a year for something to rust.Otherwise, its cool.Plus, It would be great to be able to make gears out of gold or something.

The idea isn't rusting, it's more like him not being water-proof.

[Creepado]

Oops, My mind passed right past that. :culpability:I would make it so that he can't die from the rain. He could just stop getting rain damage below 30 health or something.

[Gangstamonkey214]

This re balances look awesome! Can't wait to see how the other characters will change

[Aeris]

I could see the rain thing working out if it was measured like sanity drain. Say; 10 health per minute. The issue with balancing this is it wouldn't do much in a regular sandbox scenario, but if they make it too drastic, he'll be worthless in a Cold Reception.Mm, as for ideas for the others. I'd definitely like to see some thing with Wendy, she's probably my favourite personality wise as well as voice wise (Fluuute!) My suggestion for her would probably be something to do revolving around death, and her sister. Right now Abigail is essentially a randomly spawning chester who will bite back. WENDY: -Decrease her sister's spawn rate, but increase her light radius, making it kinda a 'free firepit' replacement on occasional nights, similar to a Lightning Rod. Down side to this idea is that it's similar to Willow's advantage.-No sanity loss from gravedigging. It's a small touch and won't really affect anything, but it does make sense for the character.-Since she's so focused on death, maybe give her the opportunity to bring things back from the dead. No I don't mean undead minions! I mean, she could come with a 'miracle grow' item that turns Charred Trees into the withered ones, restoring them slightly. (Reverse your forest fires today!) Or perhaps grows trees back from stumps. Or something that gives food back a bit of it's freshness.-Her sister definitely needs to be more.. useful perhaps she's automatically hostile to everything (Including allies / Wendy herself) and will just go damage things randomly, but of course she'd die (again) after taking a few hits and respawn another night. As to not be OP and solo Killer Bee nests like a freak.I'm not a creative genius, but damn it I want a reason to play Wendy! She's the only character who freaked me because of the noises that her sister makes at night. Wolfgang: Leave him as is, he's easy mode!Wickerbottom: -Perhaps a sanity increase when there are no other entities nearby? (Pigs, Birds, Spiders etc) She likes it quiet!-Have a usage for building a shadow manipulator. Maybe, a max sanity increase or it passively gives off an aura of sanity increase for her, due to her proud accomplishment that wasn't needed at all.-Able to write on signs since she's literate! (I just want to write on signs... You should just do this for everyone actually *Cough*... Cept Wes, secret is, he never learned how to talk. )-Spawns with Papyrus?WES: Keep him as he is! He's a hardmode. In fact make him harder! Make all armor except a grass suit too heavy for his body! HAH.Maxwell: He's pretty good as he is. Though maybe something to increase his health once you hit the later stuff? After your initial Night Armor breaks, he's so squishy until you get another one or a marble suit.-Can eat Dark Petals which give positives!

Edited June 13, 2013 by Aeris