Ancient Fuelweaver: Bone Cage

[KoreanWaffles]

With the Return of Them beta, Klei added new ocean tiles and changed the way world boundary detection worked. These changes also affected the caves which means you can no longer dodge Fuelweaver's bone cage by running to the edge of the arena because of how the new boundary detection works.

This basically makes the Lazy Explorer mandatory for the fight. Personally, I'm opposed to this change because it takes away a layer from the fight, making it much more linear. You're no longer rewarded for good positioning. Simply bring an extra Lazy Explorer and extra sanity restoration to telepoof out of every bone cage.

Some might say that dodging the bone cage is cheesy/exploitative, but I would argue that it's good game design because it adds meaningful counter play to the fight.

I would like to see this mechanic restored to make the Fuelweaver a more interesting boss battle.

What does everyone else think?
 

Main Branch:

Spoiler

Beta Branch:

Spoiler

 

[-Variant]

Ech... I dunno, felt more cheesy than it did a second option.

Feels more like they fixed an exploit here, I'm all for this staying and having it keep the player stuck.

Teleporting ain't all that required, but it just means you'll want to prepare more, have a Wortox on your team, or maybe have Warly cook you up some foods.

Plus with Warly you can still do the whole "Let's kill FW in under 2 minutes!" thing with Wolfgang...

[Flash.Jonathan]

It seems more like an unintentional fix to an exploit that allows you to cheese Fuelweaver than a removal of an "intended feature". But normally you're with others friends when fighting the Fuelweaver so I'm fine with the new change. Since Fuelweaver can only target one player[as in hit them with his skull], people in the team can take hits for each other so the other could recover which helps motivate more coordination between players. 

[reddocc]

a exploit fixed is fine i wish they fixed the multiple dragonfly exploits

[ADM]

Now let's see if they'll fix the lureplant exploit :]

[0rutyna0]

"Bring back the bug to the game!"

No, thanks.

[Quyzbuk]

There are ways to avoid or slow the Fuelweaver besides teleporting out of the cage. I am in the crowd that welcome this, it's supposed to be a final boss of sorts, let it act like one.

[Bird Up]

They should change it back for all the reasons you said. It took good timing and understanding of his attack patterns to know when he was going to use his cage attack, and you were rewarded every time you were able to predict it. Now it's just flat out inescapable and you have to either 1. have a lazy explorer 2. be wortox to teleport, or 3. brainlessly sit in the cage and tank hits. Obviously 3 is no fun in terms of fighting style and the other 2 options are lame requirements just to make the fight a hell of a lot easier. Option 3 stops working as soon as he spawns his unseen hands and woven shadows. You simply cannot afford to sit in the cage for the full duration when the boss fight is all about movement and destroying the hands and woven shadows. And it being a linear fight now is very important too. Your positioning matters far less in this fight now, because you're just going to get caged every couple seconds so don't even bother running on the outside.

If they keep in how the bone cage works on beta, then I hope they at least make the bone cage breakable in 1-3 hits. This would make the explorer useful but not mandatory. 

[lakhnish]

On 7/26/2019 at 10:40 AM, KoreanWaffles said:

I would like to see this mechanic restored to make the Fuelweaver a more interesting boss battle.

What does everyone else think?

Through the superior knowledge of knowing that the edge negates the Bone Cage, and that certain corners of the arena completely negates the Bone Cage, I present to you the most interesting way of fighting FW: hugging the edge the whole time and running around in a circle -_-.

With the use of only a single Lazy Explorer telepoof, a Bee Queen Crown + a Thulecite Suit, some healing food and very little (and unneeded) sanity food, I was able to kill FW in a rather reasonable amount of time. Had I been more aggressive and did a better job at kiting in this example, he would have probably gone down a little faster with me using less of my armor's durability.

Spoiler

 

Now you could say, "Oh, you know the fight so well already, hence why you were able to do this". To which I say, here are my first two solo FW fights where I learned from others of the Bone Cage nullification as Wigfrid (one and two). It's rather evident that I used the edge to my advantage to kill FW, even as a newer player to FW's mechanics.

When the edge mechanics changed, the biggest difference in the I noticed between the two was that Lazy Explorers, Weather Pains, and more sanity food was needed for the fight. Much of the combat is now in the center of the arena rather than the edge as it's not really in your favor to hug the edge anymore, making it a much more close combat fight as well as a more sanity-intensive fight due to the telepoofing. 

If people really want it back, it ain't going to make much difference to me. I just don't agree with the notion that nullifying the bone cage made for a more interesting fight from what I've seen and done ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

The only biggest concern for the fight that I can see now is worrying if you have enough Walrus Tusks/Orange Gems for Lazy Explorers (in One Tusk Worlds, though you can recycle your previous LEs via decon staves), alongside some Sanity Food. 

Side Note on Explaining FW's Bone Cage Mechanics For Those That Don't Know It:

Spoiler

The Bone Cage occurs about every 10 seconds and there are two ways to take note of this. During phase 1, after every third attack, FW will immediately do his Bone Cage attack. If you instead get a Bone Spiral attack, he will do a Bone Cage attack two swipes later.

When things start to get more hectic during phase two (or you're having trouble in phase 1), the other way to know when FW is going to do his next Bone Cage is when the previous Bone Cage starts to dissipate into dust. I only noticed this during the current iteration of the FW cause the Bone Cages in the previous iteration would either be out of view cause it was at the edge, or wouldn't spawn at all when you nullified it.

 

[Ezaroth]

There're two types of player in DST, one who wants the game to be harder, and another who wants it to be easier.

[watermelen671]

8 hours ago, Ezaroth said:

There're two types of player in DST, one who wants the game to be harder, and another who wants it to be easier.

And those who faff about in God mode.

[Spep]

i dunno, seems like this is a issue with combat in general instead of a problem with the fuelweaver, hit, run, hit, run, occasionally use a particular item/some cheese, not very intresting.

[Ohan]

On 29/7/2019 at 2:45 AM, Shpee said:

i dunno, seems like this is a issue with combat in general instead of a problem with the fuelweaver, hit, run, hit, run, occasionally use a particular item/some cheese, not very intresting.

i agree sadly  makes me wonder why we cant have Forge combat in the regular game 

[daBulgarian]

Well I was able to kind of find a way to not have to have a bunch of lazy explorers by dodging the cage using the corner pillars, but it's really inconsistent. See the attached pictures for starting position and example results. This works well for the first phase of the fight, but in the second phase, you need to really work your timing to make use of this corner technique otherwise you'll get caught in the middle. with my three lazy explorers (1 of them is at 75% starting), I run out of uses. Give this a go and let me know if you guys find a better way to do it.

 

 

 

[Majestix]

I just went into this fight as Wolfgang, not aware of the change. Admittedly, I had prepared well, had changed into Warly beforehand and cooked myself a Volt Goat Chaud-Froid and chilli-spiced food, but the upshot was: instead of teleporting out of the cage: one can tank him while in the cage. The only worry for me would be the BQ crown. With Wolfgang, it was still at 23% at the end. With other characters I would always temporarily take it off while being hit.

[Renatriuxtrix8000]

I aggressively hardly agree, I never knew about this garbage until now.

I was going to expend summer killing FW and look what I founded!, I can't dodge this thing, forced to bring multiple lazy explorers with me in order to defeat this thing...not worth it for a second time. I was so frustrated that I tried to learn how to dodge him that now I CAN'T and all that study went to the trash turning this fight from the best one in the game to the most boring eating icecream and cacti and teleport behind you fight ever, I got pissed from this and just used Too many items mod to one-shot the abomination.

The only reason they did this was cause they want to force people to play together to beat him, sadly for them, most of us solo the game, cause the multiplayer is a joke that only lasts one or two days before the main world is deleted; also adding that multiplay boss kill is boring and just hitting the big monster all together at the same time tanking all the damage without a real strategy besides OOGA BOOGA LET'S FIG BIG BAD BAD.

Klei is making lots of mistakes on this new expansion, no hopes on turning this into something good btw, first the boring boat mechanic now this...

 

[Well-met]

8 hours ago, Renatriuxtrix8000 said:

sadly for them, most of us solo the game

sadly for you*

I hope they fix all the walls and ancient fossil blocking nonsense soon aswell.

[Woodie To Remem]

Does anyone know how many hits it takes to kill the ancient Fuelweaver with a dark sword? (Without the Fuelweaver being able to heal)

I'm pretty much ready to fight it but I get a feeling ts gonna be hard due to poor targeting on DST console

[Electroely]

4 hours ago, Woodie To Remem said:

Does anyone know how many hits it takes to kill the ancient Fuelweaver with a dark sword? (Without the Fuelweaver being able to heal)

I'm pretty much ready to fight it but I get a feeling ts gonna be hard due to poor targeting on DST console

The Ancient Fuelweaver has 16,000 health and the dark sword does 68 damage, so you'll need 236 hits to kill it.

[NSAiswatchingus]

11 hours ago, Woodie To Remem said:

I'm pretty much ready to fight it but I get a feeling ts gonna be hard due to poor targeting on DST console

Targeting those shadows hands can be a nightmare (pun intended), but it's totally doable. Utilize the weather pain to offset the poor targeting and just carpet bomb the entire area. 

[Woodie To Remem]

13 hours ago, NSAiswatchingus said:

Targeting those shadows hands can be a nightmare (pun intended), but it's totally doable. Utilize the weather pain to offset the poor targeting and just carpet bomb the entire area. 

Yeah Its gonna be a long time, I tried doing the speed amulet and football helmets but that did not work but I am doing the bee quee  crown with armor method soo... I hope luck is on my side this time

 

20 hours ago, Electroely said:

The Ancient Fuelweaver has 16,000 health and the dark sword does 68 damage, so you'll need 236 hits to kill it.

Thank you kind sir

[-Nick-]

After defeating the fuel weaver for the first time, you can drop the shadow thurable on the ground when you fight him again. Any players in the radius of the thurable will not get bonecaged. Make sure to fuel it though.