Geyser Salt Water

[akrabat14]

Why was this geyser made so hot? Why from 30 the temperature was raised to 95? First with water siete, then wheezewort, now also a geyser, how is it all cool?

[nakomaru]

It was probably made hot so that you have to put some effort in to use it because it's guaranteed in an ocean biome.

You cool it with an aquatuner, and you cool the aquatuner with a steam turbine.

[akrabat14]

5 minutes ago, nakomaru said:

It was probably made hot so that you have to put some effort in to use it because it's guaranteed

You cool it with an aquatuner, and you cool the aquatuner with a steam turbine.

all this can be obtained only in the middle or in the game

[nivodeus]

46 minutes ago, akrabat14 said:

Why was this geyser made so hot? Why from 30 the temperature was raised to 95? First with water siete, then wheezewort, now also a geyser, how is it all cool?

I was thinking just boil it and get salt and steam out of it, prob get a nice hot water or use it as energy source rather than using Aquatuner to cool it down. You can also use it with desalinator and use the water for oil extraction which output oil at 90 degree anyway.

I dont know really as I never really bother playing with it all this while. I have only begun to get used tot the new forest biome with all its limitation but I can see potential use in mid game, and since most of it found usually near hot biome or lava, at least one of the tide biome in every map I have played in. 

But if you really want to see early game implementation I would say used it for research and watering anything that is not heat sensitive like algae terrarium. Ive been using hot water on my algae and it seems to produce an average of nice temperate oxygen for me.Of course you need desalinator for it first. 

Or you can exchange its heat with another substance such as pWater to bring it to boiling point. 

Sorry if all the suggestion seems to point to mid to late game. Personally i dont like to touch anything hotter than 40 degree in early game and usually deal with it much later, especially after I secure a stable food and oxygen plus energy. But it does looks like something you want to deal with around mid game, prob use it to farm lettuce at around 60 degree maybe, of course after exchange its heat with another substance to a nice temp suitable for lettuce farming. 

[OxCD]

44 minutes ago, akrabat14 said:

all this can be obtained only in the middle or in the game

For the early game, you should have enough wild salt water to survive for a long time. And it is not 95°.

If you drain all your free salt water before moving to mid-game, then maybe consider you have been dragging to much.

Salt geyser are for perpetual instance, so mid-game or late-game. When you should be able to deal the t° with AT & turbine.

[nakomaru]

If you care about salt:

• Salt water desalinates to 7% salt.
• Salt water freezes to brine (10%) and boils to salt (36%) for a total of 3.6% salt.
• Salt water freezes to brine (10%) and desalinates to salt (30%) for a total of 3% salt.
• Salt water boils to 2% salt.

[abud]

1 hour ago, akrabat14 said:

Why from 30 the temperature was raised to 95

I like this temperature change, it was too easy to get infinite water early game with it being 30C. Geyser should not be an early game solution, IMO. Encourage people to explore and exploit other areas of the asteroid and to stop cool steam geyser protest, "new guy just push me aside". All geyser should pose some kind of challenge to tackle. It can be temperature, germs, usability, or any other kind of challenge. Yeah, many people already complained about slush geyser being too OP, and they tone it down.

10 minutes ago, nakomaru said:

If you care about salt

Brine yield 1800 g per 5kg boiled, so it is 36 percent? In terms of salt gain, desalinator better for saltwater, boiling better for brine. Almost looks like an oversight to me or error on my experiment.

There is no brine geyser though.

[nakomaru]

Your experiment results match.

I would have hoped for balance reasons that freezing salt water to brine and then boiling it would be the most lucrative, but instead just piping it straight to a building is.

[Cairath]

1 hour ago, akrabat14 said:

Why was this geyser made so hot? Why from 30 the temperature was raised to 95? First with water siete, then wheezewort, now also a geyser, how is it all cool?

It was just a 1:1 copy paste of polluted water geyser, so placeholder values. Don't get too attached to values that are clearly temporary in a preview build. It doesn't even have its own art yet.

[Lurve]

7 hours ago, akrabat14 said:

Why was this geyser made so hot? Why from 30 the temperature was raised to 95? First with water siete, then wheezewort, now also a geyser, how is it all cool?

I had just built a waterweed farm using salt water straight from a geyser, is why.  It was a very simple design and we can't have those.

As for how to cool it, what do you want to do with it?  Geysers make a LOT of water.  If you're using it for O2, it's much cheaper to cool the O2.  Run the ~95C water behind a set of gold thermoregs before electrolyzing it.  Easy heat deletion.  If you want to farm with it, yeah you'll need to cool it, but you'll only need to cool down that water.  Geyser -> aquatuner <-> tank -> bristle blossom.  Leave some room above the aquatuner and you can shove a turbine in there eventually to make it heat-negative in the late game.

[natanstarke]

Its because everything now needs to have a steam turbine basically, so to make that even more clear lets drop in another very hot geyser ! Its totally livable etc and the salt water geyser was necessary for various reasons just this hot is a little strange indeed.

[Soulwind]

Geez, I am rapidly getting sick of hearing "just use a steam turbine" as the answer to all the cooling questions.

[OxCD]

15 minutes ago, Soulwind said:

Geez, I am rapidly getting sick of hearing "just use a steam turbine" as the answer to all the cooling questions.

That's an open debate, highly discussed in the thread below. By the way, and even I love playing with the turbine, I do agree with you, there's not that much choice when it comes to cooling. And that's the prevailing theme into the following topic.

 

[Junksteel]

37 minutes ago, Soulwind said:

Geez, I am rapidly getting sick of hearing "just use a steam turbine" as the answer to all the cooling questions.

Cooling stuff down is currently boring. No challenge, just tedious. I played all the asteroids with at least 100 cycles each. Played 1200 cycles in Arboria too. I never cooled through sieving before the change.

But the worts were a huge punch on my stomach.

Never got tired of the game before with even over 1000 hours but I think now I'm done. I'll wait for some changes or DLC. I honestly think people glad with this change didn't build enough steam turbines yet. Gets old really fast.

(Not trying to start this debate again)***

 

[Farlin]

Water is major issue right now or rather the lack of it. The last three arboria maps I have tried have all failed just because I can't find water, or if I do manage to find some it's maybe the salt water geyser or the steam geyser. The later it being so hot there is nothing I can do with it till later in the game, and the salt water geysers have all been so far away from the base I can't get to them in time. If I do get to them I run out of time trying to set them up, that the base is dead. The game used to be fun now it is just getting so tedious and boring, it's just a fight to find some water and hope that it is in reach of the base. All I find now on the map is ethanol but no water.

[Kangaax]

2 hours ago, Junksteel said:

Cooling stuff down is currently boring. No challenge, just tedious. I played all the asteroids with at least 100 cycles each. Played 1200 cycles in Arboria too. I never cooled through sieving before the change.

But the worts were a huge punch on my stomach.

Never got tired of the game before with even over 1000 hours but I think now I'm done. I'll wait for some changes or DLC. I honestly think people glad with this change didn't build enough steam turbines yet. Gets old really fast.

(Not trying to start this debate again)***

 

TBH they just need to make worts a bit better (eg. not depend on high hydrogen pressure) and we can all go back to using them in midgame like they're intended, and keep the steam turbine/space venting for the late game.

[Lilalaunekuh]

6 hours ago, Kangaax said:

TBH they just need to make worts a bit better

For me it´s mostly about the lack of reason to explore more of the map after the first struggles for food (call it mid game^^).

=> I loved to hunt for wheezeworts and the trade-off to maybe destroy a wild sleet wheat farm (or call it ice biome^^).

 

 

If you have no problem with hatch cruelty, here is a cooling solution I am (ab)using:

Spoiler

• A hatchling spwans at 20°C and can be considered 100kg genetic ooze (SHC 3,47).
• A hatchling will reset it´s temperature back to 20°C when it becomes a hatch. (After 5 cycles).
• And even the eggs can delete some heat (2kg genetic ooze spawned at 20°C).

=> Build a hatchery for surplus eggs which is heated by an aquatuner, the critters will delete some heat when the hatch,mature and die.

 

Right now I am tinkering with the perfect temperature (and stable setup for that temperature ^^) to kill my (adult) hatches after ~6cycles.

So the hatchlings have not enough time to die before reaching maturity.

 

 

 

 

[mathmanican]

7 minutes ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

If you have no problem with hatch cruelty, here is a cooling solution I am (ab)using:

So this is a slightly less efficient "Chill Pill". Temp resetting, at a more reasonable scale, as both vitamin pills and hatches are both "genetic ooze".  If only we could get those hatches to sit on rails.   

[Lilalaunekuh]

1 hatchling egg can remove ~ 35.000.000DTU of heat.

 

To provide some scale for the above heat value:

1 hatchling egg can provide the cooling for an auquatuner using (polluted) water for 60s.

Or you would need 10 eggs each cycle to cool a full time running aquatuner using (polluted) water.

(~20 eggs each cycle for one full time running auquatuner using super coolant.)

[nakomaru]

You can try pacu too: 200kg of ooze and quick lifecycles. A big pacu pool with a radiator can regulate your main base pretty well.

[abud]

I just realized that I accidentally regulating temp of my main water reservoir by placing killing door inside. ONI Biology thread already gone, where I can see critter base body temperature?

It contains various eggs, including slickster. Probably I should put these in another pool.

[mathmanican]

1 minute ago, abud said:

ONI Biology thread already gone

Dark times. We do not speak of this thread.

[Lilalaunekuh]

24 minutes ago, nakomaru said:

You can try pacu too: 200kg of ooze and quick lifecycles. A big pacu pool with a radiator can regulate your main base pretty well.

Ok I have not messed with pacus in my current colony, but isn´t the temperature they reset to 55°C ?

 

[The last nail in the coffin for using pacus was to produce a stable supply of eggs. Yes, I could build everything different and go for a slower heat death till my pacus all lay eggs inside the cooling chamber. Which leaves me with a couple options:

1. Increase the size of my cooling chamber to sastify the space contraints, to keep the number of eggs stable. But now most eggs will be tropical pacu eggs which result in less heat deletion, or I would be forced to use different pools for the 3 kinds of pacu. And I would be forced to relocate "random/unlikely" glup fish spawns in my cooling chamber.
2. Use a pool of pacu, which I honestly feed to supply just surplus eggs to my cooling chamber. (Like I do it with my hatches. Who can/want to really feed pacu with their enormous hunger?)
3. Use an other less temperature sensitive critter.]

[nakomaru]

Yes as a pure heat sink pacus will be more picky in those ways you mentioned. I believe pacu base temp is 25C - passive radiation will cool/heat to around here. Not sure about tropical.

Voles are only 25kg, but they can survive extreme heats with a base of 20C. Hatch are probably easier to work with than those.

[Lilalaunekuh]

2 minutes ago, nakomaru said:

Yes as a pure heat sink pacus will be more picky in those ways you mentioned. I believe pacu base temp is 25C - passive radiation will cool/heat to around here. Not sure about tropical.

Voles are only 25kg, but they can survive extreme heats with a base of 20C. Hatch are probably easier to work with than those.

 

I looked it up: The comfortable range of pacu changed a bit over time, so right now they spawn at 30°C.

My thought about my critter options, when starting my cruel cooling:

(I hope it is still true, but at least I asumed that each critter spawns at the arithmetic mean of the extremes for it´s comfortable temperature range. All DTU calculations asume you heat the eggs just to the same temperature as the critters, but you could exploit this to delete even more heat. Each egg has 3 masses you can heat: 1. the egg 2. the baby critter 3. the adult critter.)

• Shine bugs: 5kg and just 35K heating range.           
  • =>      1,2M DTU per egg
• Puft: 50kg and 50K heating range.
  • =>    17,5M DTU per egg
• Slickster: 50kg and 95K heating range.
  • =>   33    M DTU per egg
• Hatch/Pip/Pokeshell: 100kg and 50K heating range.
  • =>    35   M DTU per egg
• Pacu: 200kg and 50K heating range. (But you need to manage the 3 kinds of eggs, in one of a few possible ways. Pacu spawns have different sized comfortable temperature ranges. So pacu can be heated by 50K, tropical pacu by 45K and gulp fish just by 37,5K)
  • =>    70   M DTU per egg (Asuming just pacu eggs)
• Drecko: 200kg and 62,5K heating range. (Random glossy drecko spawns will die in this build to early, so you need to invest some additional effort to make this work. Maybe 2 cooling chambers, one for dreckos and one for glossy dreckos.)
  • =>     87  M DTU per egg (Asuming just drecko eggs)

I have no numbers for gassy moos or shove voles, I didn´t really consider them at that point in time. But voles should be one of the best critter considering the liveable temperature range.