What we're the Devs thinking?

[EpicAlex]

idk what the people over at Klei were thinking... But here's a meme to which I thought was being said.

Anyone agree with this or have other ideas?

[PhailRaptor]

While I don't disagree that we have arrived at the same end destination, this is probably the worst way possible to give criticism about their decision making, goals, or competence.

[Halberdier]

Wait... Klei has Lego people working for them?

[JoeW]

37 minutes ago, Halberdier said:

Wait... Klei has Lego people working for them?

Yes. 

[Whispershade]

I mean. The added complexity of managing dupe expectations has interesting elements. And the desire for dupes to have personality and interact with each other are things people have wanted for quite a while. I also really like the schedule system. So if the meeting did go like that, I'd actually be really onboard with what that last girl said.
 

Edit: And, I will say, that given the history of the updates. They have done everything but the spaceship preceding the release of the expression update. From the oil and cosmic biomes, set pieces and Gravitas facilites, slush, hot water, chlorine, and volcanos, to critter variants and whole new species like Dreko and Pacu, everything on that list is checked off as a priority before expression.

[LZ96]

put up some decors and you gonna be fine =/

[QuQuasar]

1 hour ago, JoeW said:

Yes. 

It explains so much!

By the way OP, I'm not accusing you of anything, but I think you should be aware if you aren't already: this meme template was designed by online white supremacists. The hand symbol in panel 3 is a dogwhistle.
 

[Argelle]

Away during the testing of the update, catching up 2 weeks later, and I can testify of this:

* restarting my old 250 cycles colony with expression update was fun and refreshing!

* reading a lot of hysteric posts here in the aftermath is quite baffeling.

It may be that the update cause problems, but reactions are not measured, nor fair.

[Promethien]

1 hour ago, QuQuasar said:

It explains so much!

By the way OP, I'm not accusing you of anything, but I think you should be aware if you aren't already: this meme template was designed by online white supremacists. The hand symbol in panel 3 is a dogwhistle.
 

Do you know what 4chan is? Dunno why I asked I'll have to explain anyways. 4chan is an anonymous message board where not only is rudeness the rule, but if you aren't constantly seeking new levels of rudeness you will be declared weak and unworthy. The OK sign being a white power symbol originates from 4chan. They did it literally to be rude to as many people as possible. You have fallen for their trick. Congratulations.

[Yoma_Nosme]

On 16.6.2018 at 1:52 PM, Yoma_Nosme said:

 I got that idea from this thread.

https://forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/91987-priority-bugs/

Long story short. The cook did the power engineer's job and the researcher was making food.

I know about the jobs tab, so yeah, it was obviously not set up right. Although it can happen anyway. But what the TO mentioned I found very cool...

Let the "Job owner" send the dilettante off his job. 

Like. "Hey buddy, you call this research? Since when is dirt+water=pi?"

Or. "You're mushing it wrong!""let me, le chef, show you how it's done"

Further I would suggest the rebuke to increase stress by 5-10%(edit. too high 2-3% is better) to the "trespasser" 

This way players would have to keep a keen eye on who's doing what and where are deficits and micromanage plus it would be funny and add a cool new layer of dupe to dupe interaction!

Edit. Smuch brought it to my attention that this could be too "one-wayish". There should be a chance that they give a compliment instead of a complaint. high five for instance or a friendly twinkle or such. 

So full disclosure, I wrote this some while ago. Also i am totally for the interactions, I was even aiming for even more negative interactions when i wrote this so I think we were all well treated. Imagine your base going ballistic because you made a mistake micromanaging the jobs 

Ps. On the off chance klei hangs on every word I write (obviously they do...smart minds think alike)and the pretty girl is my harbinger give her a raise, she did good, and make kitchen a room and check out my suggestion "table manners"

I have to go now. My sarcasto-mobile is ready. It drives on overconfidence and vanity.

Cheers

 

[thewreckedangle]

nice that you blame a wahmen for this /:

[Alfons100]

Okay, so

 

Build a Great Hall

Give people just a little bit of leisure time, not that much is needed, actually. You get more work due to the clever schedule system, despite the need for Leisure. 

Avoid low-decor areas like the plague. That means that Shinebugs are useful for making good looking areas. 

and boom, now so is Morale not as painful as people make it up to be. Seriously. Git gud, even if I sound rude.

[Whispershade]

4 hours ago, Promethien said:

Do you know what 4chan is? Dunno why I asked I'll have to explain anyways. 4chan is an anonymous message board where not only is rudeness the rule, but if you aren't constantly seeking new levels of rudeness you will be declared weak and unworthy. The OK sign being a white power symbol originates from 4chan. They did it literally to be rude to as many people as possible. You have fallen for their trick. Congratulations.

None of this changes the fact that the hand sign has become a dog whistle for white national 'identitarians'. And the original meme almost certainly used the hand sign for that deliberate purpose. The plausible deniability is precisely why they're called dog whistles and you rebuking someone for pointing it out is doing their work.
Congratulations.

To be clear, I've not reason to suspect any malicious intent from anyone in this thread regarding that sort of politic. Exploiting the uninformed is sort of their whole schtick.

[TheGCat]

 

8 hours ago, Whispershade said:

And the desire for dupes to have personality and interact with each other are things people have wanted for quite a while. I also really like the schedule system. So if the meeting did go like that, I'd actually be really onboard with what that last girl said.

When know the user, what they want ? Are all of the customers now game designer's ?  The Dev's must know, what the goals are and should be, not the customers. A great problem of Early Access. To many people give suggestions to a game, that they don't understand. Factorio is a good example, that not all of the mostly dumb suggestions will be accepted! GOOD! It must fit with the game.

The expression update doesn't fit with the game. Surviving is the main topic of the game. Add stuff for surviving, not socializing. Play Rimworld for your social crap. Who needs this ? The Facebook Folks ? Add dangers to the game (Yeah, u know it. It is a survival part!!!) All the stuff that has nothing to do with surviving is not important and not a feature , that must be in the game.

What's the title of the game ?

I am a Factorio player too, but after the automation release at ONI, I ask myself: "Why?" This part is not a part for ONI. U have it, okay, but it is not necessary. The most of ONI has get new content, cool, yes, but the most of it is just unimportant and "decor". Other People would say, useless.

The Dev's don't know it yourself, what the game should be. The most suggestions from the customers are Factorio based suggestions. Why the hell ? Play Factorio instead, they do it 1000 times better than ONI could be.

I don't want to play a Factorio clone. NO. ONI were a bad one by the way.

The feelings from the start of my ONI career was beautiful ( agricultural ). It was not too easy and not too difficult. The Planting System was nice!

U make over the time an micromanagement game with many of unfitted things and a social note. U play ONI for a long time ? If u play one hour ONI, how much time u play it really ? 10 Minutes ? I am serious, the other 50 Minutes u wait till the god damned dupes do their job. Build the things, that i have ordered an hour before. And within the 50 Minutes u see dupes that chitchat with each other. I don't want a Screen Saver loved DEV'S!

A man who don't like the direction of ONI.

And by the way. The god damned Steam turbine is still broken since a couple of updates. Thanks for that loved DEV's.

[Gurgel]

I actually find it much easier to manage stress now. Maybe some people are just having trouble to adjust to changed circumstances? Maybe, if so, you should not play a game in early access?

[Yoma_Nosme]

4 minutes ago, DustFireSky said:

And by the way. The god damned Steam turbine is still broken since a couple of updates. Thanks for that loved DEV's.

Hahhahhaa. Says the guy with the grumpy cat profile picture. I just started laughing while drinking soda water....flooded my sinuses, wish I was dead...

[Whispershade]

9 minutes ago, DustFireSky said:

When know the user, what they want ? Are all of the customers now game designer's ?  The Dev's must know, what the goals are and should be, not the customers.

The suggestion forum exists for a reason. And you alone are not the arbiter of what the game should look like.

12 minutes ago, DustFireSky said:

The expression update doesn't fit with the game. Surviving is the main topic of the game.

Stress and mental health of Duplicants has been a mechanic of the game's survival loop since inception. Acting like they don't belong seems to be deliberately attempting to miscast the style of game this is in favor of what you hoped it to be.

15 minutes ago, DustFireSky said:

A man who don't like the direction of ONI.

Indeed. This issue can be summed up with another quote from your post.

15 minutes ago, DustFireSky said:

A great problem of Early Access.

But I will repeat. You alone are not the arbiter of what this game should be. Other people enjoy these changes. Certainly, offer your feedback. But don't expect your opinion to be raised above others. If you say you don't like something, it is perfectly legitimate for others to say they do as a counter argument.

I am quite pleased with the expression changes, personally. I still think a more diversity in decor would be nice. I like the idea that I'm providing not just minimal survival, but a good quality of life for the duplicants under my care and even the animals that they raise. I would even like to see ranching animal enrichment items to add variety to the animal habitats. They come across a little too factory farm cages. And I'd like to create good habitats for them.

But if the game becomes something I don't like, well then, I got my fun out of it. The money I spent on early access was good value.

[TheGCat]

I said my opinion. U don't must share it. But it has a reason, that micromanagement games are hated! Read the reviews at steam. Maybe u will find the clearness.

[Whispershade]

1 minute ago, DustFireSky said:

I said my opinion. U don't must share it. But it has a reason, that micromanagement games are hated! Read the reviews at steam. Maybe u will find the clearness.

What is your specific complaint about the micromanagement?

[_Q_]

Morale removed stress mechanic from the game, it needs to be balanced, to be real thing to manage as opposed to slap few portraits here and there, make a great hall and forget about stress whatsoever.

[TheGCat]

53 minutes ago, Whispershade said:

What is your specific complaint about the micromanagement?

I am not a person with a pink glasses on my nose. I am Grumpy cat. hehehe. Joking aside. I see the problems of the game, because I play it for a long time now. I knew the difference between the agricultural update and the actual one. And the path ONI is going now is no one that I love. U know, it is just me, my person. But for who is the game ? The casuals, that play the game for 2 hours a months or the enthusiasts ? If u are more waiting in a game, than playing, the game has a problem. If u say the opposite, I don't believe u and u lying yourself.

The bad AI do the rest. The bad performance too. The messed up UI.  Have u ever build a huge base ? If not, try it and then share your experience. Play it on fast forward, than dupes struggle with path finding, eating and other important stuff. Don't forget to observe your dupes at building buildings. They run and build one tile, go back to the next path finding choice and then, oh wonder, they run back to build the second tile. Baddest AI i have ever seen. The interesting fact is, if u set the priority to level 9, they build it without to break the job. The game has so much bugs and curios dev's choices, i don't understand it. The nicest fact is, the more you have in the game, the more it got dreadful. U must get more to have more to get more ? If u build late game stuff u need automatically more dupes to serve the machines. But, oh wonder, more dupes, more problems. What is the way to go ? Don't build the stuff, that must be served by a dupe manually. No Oil refinery, no farm stations and all the other stuff that takes time from the day and hampered your progress.

If u want more examples, read the reviews. They are not lying, they are telling the truth.

[EpicAlex]

11 hours ago, PhailRaptor said:

While I don't disagree that we have arrived at the same end destination, this is probably the worst way possible to give criticism about their decision making, goals, or competence.

PhailRaptor, I just made it for a laugh and meant no harm in the making of this

5 hours ago, thewreckedangle said:

nice that you blame a wahmen for this /:

thewreckedangle, I wasn't trying to blame a woman, or anyone, in that decision. I just didn't think that the whole staff that is developing ONI or any other game is just a bunch of guys

[Whispershade]

1 hour ago, DustFireSky said:

Have u ever build a huge base ? If not, try it and then share your experience. Play it on fast forward, than dupes struggle with path finding, eating and other important stuff. Don't forget to observe your dupes at building buildings.

I started playing probably a month into the agricultural update. I built a base that nearly excavated the entire map. I've had bases that lasted over 2000 cycles. I've learned how to setup priorities and access restrictions in order to maximize dupe productivity. The tools to so do now have only expanded.

 

1 hour ago, DustFireSky said:

The nicest fact is, the more you have in the game, the more it got dreadful. U must get more to have more to get more ? If u build late game stuff u need automatically more dupes to serve the machines. But, oh wonder, more dupes, more problems. What is the way to go ?

Well, the automation you complained about before helps address a lot of this. Using it to improve the efficiency of certain tasks as well as completely removing the need for dupes from others, so that they can do the work of expansion. I haven't honestly found these to be issues I couldn't solve myself. Nearly all the issues I have with dupe AI are resolved by proper planning. On the instances where the issues are clearly bugs like they forget their needs. Well... Early Access is Early Access. I've watch them successfully and diligently tackle bug after bug.

 

1 hour ago, DustFireSky said:

If u want more examples, read the reviews. They are not lying, they are telling the truth.

Why do I care about negative reviews if I am having fun? I don't need to reinforce my perspective with groupthink.

[CherryHavoc]

I actually like the expressive upgrade. Formerly you had to have a duplicant stop their work and use a massage table to get their stress down, that was the only way.

While that's still an option, I've found that once you start getting the entertainment bits right this isn't necessary, I can keep their stress low without any effort on my part.

[TheGCat]

7 minutes ago, Whispershade said:

Why do I care about negative reviews if I am having fun? I don't need to reinforce my perspective with groupthink

Why should I care what u are thinking ? Is it not the same thing ? I don't care too. So why we discuss ? And I have fun too, but I am realistic. The game has problems. U say, all is fine. I accept that, but for me the game needs much improvements. And now ? U tell me now, that's not true or what ? U want me to change my mind ? The discuss is something like the game itself. Sometimes, just ****ty. Your opinion doesn't change my opinion.

Early Access is not an apologize for everything. Get u paid for this statement ?