Maxwell Refresh Beta Open!

[KCDA]

36 minutes ago, RatherRabbit said:

The Codex should not be a spellbook. This is a horrible idea

Woah, careful there, you could get an abusive behavior warning for saying something like that, even when you spend a few paragraphs explaining the mildly inflammatory hook.

[Gabovisk]

Time servant shadows need to be increased...

[Wonz]

Gonna make shadow chester to steal all maxwell player's stash

[Destiny Dude]

Man, I was so excited for my boy finally getting some love, The minions feel way worse to use than before though. I'm a big fan of the new traps/storage chest however. I'd like the minions alot more if you had the option to have them follow you OR stay in one place and work. You could either roam around and just do stuff while also getting logs/rocks on the way like before or you could also set up your minions to clear out your tree farm while you're away. As for the duelists, they're still super wimpy and their AI doesn't seem to have really changed. If klei insists on keeping them at 75 HP at least do something like: The minions last for a limited time but will keep respawning near maxwell when they die for the duration of the spell. That way you'd always get value out of the fuel you spend no matter what.

PS, get rid of the time limit on minions I'm begging you klei, every other character with a summon gets to just keep them around at their leisure for no cost

Edited November 3, 2022 by Destiny Dude
forgot something

[KCDA]

10 minutes ago, maradyne said:

If there were an option for them to follow like before, the hammerspace hat would be quite a lot more useful for transferring gathering trip stuff back to people at base.
I'd like to see both, though. Maybe a magic command for active shadows to stick to a certain location, or a page from the Codex that does similar?

Being able to choose between old DST style Shadow Puppets and current style would be super nice.

[MrMango24]

Spoiler

here it is. the final character rework.

 

[-Nick-]

A new spell should be added that allows you to make your shadows follow you, or stay in one location.

It could work in a radius when you cast it, so you can make some follow and have the rest stay.

This could also allow you to move your shadows around to different areas.

Edited November 3, 2022 by Nickolai

[Milordo]

23 minutes ago, KCDA said:

Woah, careful there, you could get an abusive behavior warning for saying something like that, even when you spend a few paragraphs explaining the mildly inflammatory hook.

He just said it's an horrible idea..... he didn't insulted Klei devs 

9 minutes ago, MrMango24 said:

  Hide contents

here it is. the final character rework.

 

Wilson still missing. I thought he would have been with Maxwell. 

[PuffinBy]

Played a little bit, here's my find: Duelists regenerates health now, making them great for hounds and stuff. They can be used to easily farm butterflies too.

Codex Umbra can be fueled with nightmare fuel and will not perish on 0%

Shadow storage will make stuff spoil faster just like Shadow Chester.

Something to improve is that we need an command to make Max's shadow minion to follow him or stay at will. Also, it'd be great if he can quickly despawn a minion.

And a bug: Shadow pillar trap works on shadow creatures, but they will teleport the second they were cast the spell. Resulting the shadow creature being outside of the trap and still unable to move.

[Hormiga89]

It would be better if you could turn the shadows on and off instead, like Abigail's agro. I usually keep my shadows for a while when I use Maxwell. I'm guessing this will also make it use up more nightmare fuel, and the fact that Maxwell doesn't stay low sanity for long will probably make it harder to get unless you go to the ancient ruins.

I don't think I will be using Maxwell at all after this change, and if I do it probably won't be early game because he is to weak and now not as good as gathering resources. When I usually use Maxwell is in the beginning when I play with my brother and his girlfriend. I would keep the shadows for a few days (all while collecting nightmare fuel), kill them myself to get some of the fuel back. Then switch to the other workers. Also the fact that now they're stationary makes them more vulnerable to tree guards.

The other things seem cool like me gathering things and transporting them to base, but the shadows seem worse now.

[alanzoid]

2 hours ago, V2C said:

You can learn how to opt into the beta branch here.

Changes

• Codex Umbra is now a spell book that feeds off of Sanity and Nightmare Fuel only.
• Added a spell wheel UI for reading the Codex Umbra in your inventory.
• Maxwell now summons the following shadow minions:
  • Shadow Servant
  • Shadow Duelist
• Minions automatically aggro or work within their summoned radius for a set duration before expiring.
• Maxwell now controls up to six minions at a time.
• Maxwell now summons the following shadow traps:
  • Shadow Sneak
  • Shadow Pillars
• All shadows can be summoned on the ocean.
• Maxwell can imbue shadow magic into a Top Hat to create Magician's Top Hat.
• Maxwell can craft the Magician's Box.
• Magician's Top Hat, Magician's Box, and Shadow Chester are all connected to one shadow dimensional storage.

Bug Fixes

• Fixed bug with action destination point on rotated boats.
• Fixed bug with player save position on rotated boats.
• An AMD-specific issue for card series RX 5500 XT, RX 5600 XT, RX 5700 XT, and RX 6700 XT has an attempt made to address a minimap rendering issue causing a large band of darkness to appear at the center of the map when the map was explored a large amount.
• Please report feedback if this does or does not fix it for your setup.

Notes for modders

• The old Maxwell Shadows (Workers/Duelists) are deprecated but all of their TUNING, brains, stategraphs, etc are retained.
• Mod Release ID will be out in the next hotfix.

 

View full update

 

Why did you guys remove the animation of the Codex flying on the ground?

Edited November 3, 2022 by alanzoid

[Bearger Enjoyer]

1 hour ago, RatherRabbit said:

Logging into this account for the first time ever JUST because I have to say this:

The Codex should not be a spellbook. This is a horrible idea. Especially if you keep the health requirement the way it is. The Codex is and will always be Maxwell's ''thing''. It works for characters like Wickerbottom because the books as a whole are her's, but to have Maxwell's Codex have durability just. It's the one way he accesses his main power. No. Abigail's flower doesn't have durability.

Buddy, I don't know if you remember this, but the original DS codex was a spellbook with an active fuel cost. This just reverts it to that while simply making it roughly ten times more efficient at least for workers, and also without the health penalty from DS. I for one am glad the real codex is back after so long, and with all the benefits of the DST maxwell pre-rework included.

 

I've heard many people agree with me that they missed the old book, so... lol.

[YouKnowWho]

I don’t mind how the shadow servants work now considering how cheaper they are to make now. It incentivizes spawning a lot more at once to speed up gathering rather than having to wait around for one or two to get the work done.

Plus shadow duelists are a lot better if you actively help them out with snares and traps and such. If an animal gets caught by a snare it’ll be unable to retaliate for a short while, which means that the duelists less than optimal kiting strategy gets solved pretty easily.

All in all, I think the community will see this update in a much more positive light once they’ve learned they have to utilize the new shadows differently than the old ones

[minespatch]

1 hour ago, Instant-Noodles said:

Spoiler

 

1 hour ago, abominacja said:

I know its a small thing but i feel sad about it that codex umbra is no longer flying when maxwell is near :\ it was a cool detail

Hope it gets brought back.

 

 

[Mike23Ua]

Wait, so the final rework is going to be Wilson.. and that rework will happen ironically enough: around the 10 year anniversary of the Dont Starve Franchise?  
 

I kinda thought Maxwell would have been the last rework because he would have (in my opinion anyway..) had the most lore to reveal. I’m curious what his animated short will reveal at least. 

Also loving the new shadowy power stuff, but.. disappointed there wasn’t a On/Off toggle like how Abigail works.

[ChocoFishie]

This rework is great, however I would buff the duelists. They are far too useless for proper use, Wickerbottom easily surpasses them with her bees. My idea would be to make them invincible while keeping the one minute duelist duration. Of course, it would likely be overpowered, so duelists would not be targeted by enemies and the number of them active at once would be reduced. 2-4 sounds good, it would yield either 40 or 80 DPS. It would also add to the new caster persona of Maxwell, while making the cage way more useful. Having to cast the cage while re-casting the duelists.

Edited November 3, 2022 by ChocoFishie

[minespatch]

Question: When do you guys think that Curio Collector animation with the party hat will be in the game? 

[RatherRabbit]

9 minutes ago, Siegmund said:

Buddy, I don't know if you remember this, but the original DS codex was a spellbook with an active fuel cost. This just reverts it to that while simply making it roughly ten times more efficient at least for workers, and also without the health penalty from DS. I for one am glad the real codex is back after so long, and with all the benefits of the DST maxwell pre-rework included.

 

I've heard many people agree with me that they missed the old book, so... lol.

The Codex as it is now has an active fuel cost as well, when summoning clones. It's not the fuel cost that I don't like, it's that the Codex can no longer help fuel itself. The inability to cap sanity makes farming fuel harder and resource intensive. And if you mess up with kiting, either due to lag or just lack of skill, it still has the same health deduction. Original DS had the same sanity cap, presumably to help keep the Codex fueled as well as Maxwell's inclination towards using weapons like the dark sword and dark armor.

[Parusoid]

1 hour ago, RatherRabbit said:

getting more nightmare fuel

lazy deserter

[RatherRabbit]

6 minutes ago, Parusoid said:

they also pick stuff up from the ground and put it in max's inventory

I don't really feel like they do it much faster than I can do it myself, honestly. It's not much of a benefit. They pick up one at a time and have to run back and forth, not that much faster than just holding down spacebar. They also tend to get distracted in my experience, picking up seeds and things I just dropped when all I want is the logs. I do think it's a good function, I just wish I could tell them to fill up a chest rather than chasing me about with a handful of stale seeds.

(Edit) And as for the lazy deserter, that still is more of a resource investment than summoning four resource gatherers. Both for killing the boss and for building the thing. It's also not portable and has to be reapplied. A lot less suitable for solo players.

Edited November 3, 2022 by RatherRabbit

[Bearger Enjoyer]

Wait, wait. Hold on a moment.

So the gatherers are unspecialized, and do tasks according to whatever they're close to... But they also pick items up and deliver them to you, when unoccupied.
That's... actually very potent-sounding on paper. "You can't finish gathering without picking up everything" is why Woodie's always struggled to compete with Max. Or Wurt. Or anyone with meat and pigs. Multitasking beats monotasking.
I'll have to experiment if they're satisfactorily efficient. I was pretty unimpressed at first, but the rework's fascinating me more and more bit by bit.

The duelists also initially seemed awkward, but the spammability is so much better than DS, their numbers overwhelm anything that can't one-shot them or has AoE. Very good for bullying day-to-day mobs, /bishops/, so on. It effectively costs nothing to keep the fuel flowing. And being stationary/only working within the area they're summoned, alongside dying after inactivity, is a good way to keep them from being cracked. 

The top hat is linked ONLY to shadow chester. This is actually splendid. Why?
Because Maxwell can have 46/48 inventory slots. That's more than Walter. Snow/chester + top hat. And it costs 6 silk and one-fifth of a fuel to set up his specific bit. You can either use it to teleport stuff or you can have more inventory. The choices are there.

Shadow sneak seems to do everything poop pellets/wigfrid's panic song do combined, better. I can name a million good applications off the top of my head for causing a mob to panic without getting close to burn them up. (don't bring up fire staff, this is way better)

The prison does surprisingly good. Will mostly have similar uses to panic in day-to-day life, with a few additional applications. There's one way to seperate bee queen from her minions.

Even just sitting there and spamming duelists has some pretty nifty damage. One dies, is replaced instantly. Use and dispose. As it always should've been.

Ended this beta test with one of the most fun bee queen fights I've had in a while. 

It may not be 'flashy', but this is turning into my favorite rework yet. No meaningless downside, can do almost everything he already excelled at but only better. Except...

HAH!

Edit: Never mind, the gatherers just last too short to be good at their job. Their work radius, the number of items in one stack they can hold before handing to max, should be greatly increased alongside lifetime.

Edited November 3, 2022 by Siegmund

[Gabovisk]

Servants for rowing and plowing sounds very interesting too

Edited November 3, 2022 by Gabovisk

[Bearger Enjoyer]

24 minutes ago, RatherRabbit said:

And if you mess up with kiting, either due to lag or just lack of skill, it still has the same health deduction.

...This is a very general rule and isn't specific to Maxwell whatsoever? What's that got to do to compare to the direct, flat health cost?

26 minutes ago, RatherRabbit said:

The inability to cap sanity makes farming fuel harder and resource intensive. And if you mess up with kiting, either due to lag or just lack of skill, it still has the same health deduction. Original DS had the same sanity cap, presumably to help keep the Codex fueled as well as Maxwell's inclination towards using weapons like the dark sword and dark armor.

Okay, yeah, this is a fair complaint. You're forced to multitask with workers either working or duelists fighting to have your sanity capped. That's some terrible QoL compared to the old fuel farming tactics. I agree there. But hey, five shadows for one fuel is pretty low-cost, at least.

[alanzoid]

1 hour ago, abominacja said:

I know its a small thing but i feel sad about it that codex umbra is no longer flying when maxwell is near :\ it was a cool detail

I thought I was the only one sad about this

[Starling]

Hello, Maxwell has been always my favorite character and it is safe to say that he is my "main" character. I've been waiting for this refresh for very, very long time. I don't mean to be so negative but so far this doesn't look like what I hoped for:(
-I usually play as my team's gatherer by using Maxwell, summoning miners to clear entire rock biome, same with loggers to clean forests. With this refresh Maxwell servants only clear a small circle of area and if I were to clean a rock biome for example I will have to summon so many servants to do so this isn't practical nor cheap, I would even prefer to use old shadows to gather.
-As a Maxwell player I always thought that shadow duelists are very useless because they die so quickly. And that hasn't really changed. I was really looking forward for them to get better. I saw some people had great ideas on the forum's suggestions page such as making players able to give them armor, weapons etc. I think new duelist won't please other Maxwell players as well.
-I'm not sure how useful the shadow sneak and shadow pillars, perhaps I didn't get how to best use them yet.
-I was hoping Maxwell to feel like real magician. The hat seems similar to the pirate hat we recently received and wasn't very impressive to me, I wish he knew how to craft magic tier 1 items similar to Wickerbottom's starter knowledge of science.
I'm not very happy with this changes but there are some things I like too: I really like the shadow chest but also I really like that shadows are finally getting same skin as the player. So much dapperness!
I hope developers reading the feedbacks and alter the servants to fit to gatherers, and find a way to make duelists useful.