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When will they add more weapons?


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We have 99999 ocean fishes nobody even bothers to fish, and if they do, they all look the same after you kill them.

We have 99999 crock pot dishes nobody even bothers to make because "haha le funny meat + 3 ice".

We have 99999 types of walls nobody makes, 999999 beefalo costumes nobody even touched, 999999 Wendy skins nobody bought because Wendy players are poor, etc.

But just 3 or 4 weapons? And not even that. People either make a spear or a hambat and that's it, nothing else exists to the average player. if I see someone using a dark sword it's a miracle and nobody seems to even bother getting thulucite stuff unless they are playing solo.

The game is called Don't Starve but all the mechanics and gameplay revolves around fighting things, yet we've got nothing to fight them with but a stick with a stone or a literal ham.

They even keep adding more monsters, bosses, etc but, for what? so we all build a hambat and "1, 2, 3, RUN" "1,2, 3, RUN". They update farming but not the feature everyone actually uses, fighting.

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that'd be nice, something i'd like to see is some more damage stimuli (basically, damage types, but the game calls them "stimuli" in the code). As of now the only stimuli we have is.... electric, provided from morning star and volt goat jelly. I think it'd be very interesting to see some more stimuli.

I really don't wanna see DST be too focused on combat though, I always disliked how the community just cares about combat so much more than other aspects of the game, I'll be happy to see some more types of weapons but honestly I don't want some epic combat overhaul with forge mechanics and what not. That just doesn't fit vanilla DS/T in my opinion.

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1 minute ago, Hornete said:

That just doesn't fit vanilla DS/T in my opinion.

Heh, considering you have Wormwood as your profile picture i'm sure you didn't complain when they added the farming update that turned a grim survival game with deppressed characters trying not to die into Stardew Valley.

But you're right, i've seen players who just join servers to spam in chat "When are we killing Dragonfly" and if something goes wrong they rage quit or just leave after killing some boss.

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Some brand new combat assortments wouldn't hurt. Though i hope they don't make a bloating amount of DoT (damage over time) weapons and decide to create something entirely new or refine some already existing combat gimmicks like the stun from Forge that could be accessible in high tier weaponry. There's also the ranged combat which is pretty bad so it would certainly be interesting to see it revamped in the future.

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Yes for more types of weapons. No regarding some theoretical combat reworked into complex mechanics. Forge did well for its intent and purpose: 8-10 minutes Combat Arena matches. Bringing that to regular DST would probably be pretty chaotic and quite destructive with environment. "Hit-back off-hit again" with different numbers for those hit intervals is simple enough to pick up and diversify in relation to each type of enemy and its attack periods. And we already get, albeit Ocean/Moon-related, new such types of enemies/mobs via "Return of Them". Hope main Constant landmass will also have in future new mobs plus biomes, weather, "biotope" and "biocoenosis" progression etc - new weapons likewise.

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17 minutes ago, RenTheCat said:

Heh, considering you have Wormwood as your profile picture i'm sure you didn't complain when they added the farming update that turned a grim survival game with deppressed characters trying not to die into Stardew Valley.

But you're right, i've seen players who just join servers to spam in chat "When are we killing Dragonfly" and if something goes wrong they rage quit or just leave after killing some boss.

Reap what you sow didnt just solve hunger issues, hunger wasnt and hasnt been a huge drawback for quite a while, what reap what you sow did was make an old mechanic more immersive

Combat already is quite interesting, as long as you dont tank. I always find it enjoyable to learn the kiting pattern to a boss or a strat to fight them (recently learned maze strat for bee queen despite having 2000+ hours), while farming was just a leave it doing while you do something else.

I do think more alternatives to the 3 weapons everyone uses after year 1 is something needed though

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There are 5 top tier melee weapons, 6 decent melee weapons, 16 bad melee weapons, 2 top tier ranged weapons, 6 more ranged weapons, some traps, and some explosives. In total that's about 15 viable weapons.

But I'm not quite sure why you ask for more weapons and use "Nobody ever actually does anything" as a reason they should be added. Shouldn't you be saying "We have 999999 weapons nobody uses because hohoho le 1 flint & 1 rope"?

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2 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

There are 5 top tier melee weapons, 6 decent melee weapons, 16 bad melee weapons, 2 top tier ranged weapons, 6 more ranged weapons, some traps, and some explosives. In total that's about 15 viable weapons.

But I'm not quite sure why you ask for more weapons and use "Nobody ever actually does anything" as a reason they should be added. Shouldn't you be saying "We have 999999 weapons nobody uses because hohoho le 1 flint & 1 rope"?

dude, the only weapons widely used are Ham Bat, Dark Sword and Thulecite Bat. Glass cutter is only used when fighting the fuelweaver or when rushing the moon island (I used to do this) after that, it doesnt last long enough despite the normal damage. The morning star is only worth it during spring and the tentacle spike is usually an early game only weapon

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3 minutes ago, Wardin25 said:

dude, the only weapons widely used are Ham Bat, Dark Sword and Thulecite Bat. Glass cutter is only used when fighting the fuelweaver or when rushing the moon island (I used to do this) after that, it doesnt last long enough despite the normal damage. The morning star is only worth it during spring and the tentacle spike is usually an early game only weapon

You seriously think thulecite clubs are more used than tentacle spikes? And what even is the point of that comment? That certain weapons have certain uses? Because if they were to add any more weapons to the game they'd definitely be more weapons that have uses so I guess they'd suck too and shouldn't be added for some reason.

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5 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

You seriously think thulecite clubs are more used than tentacle spikes? And what even is the point of that comment? That certain weapons have certain uses? 

I dont know if it is that I've played too long, but I dont see myself using tentacle spikes a lot after getting a good source of ham bats and dark swords, and when I said the Thulecite Club thing I meant used by people rushing the ruins

And also the comment was meant to explain my opinion on the change the meta thing

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6 minutes ago, Wardin25 said:

I dont know if it is that I've played too long, but I dont see myself using tentacle spikes a lot after getting a good source of ham bats and dark swords, and when I said the Thulecite Club thing I meant used by people rushing the ruins

I don't use tentacle spikes nearly as much as I do dark swords and ham bats either, but I definitely use them more than thulecite clubs. While the club is a good weapon, unless the target is practically stationary it doesn't really offer much more damage over the tentacle spike yet requires you to not only go to the ruins to craft it but spend thulecite on it. I'd say that proper use of the thulecite club is situational like the weapons you complain about existing: glass cutter for shadows, thulecite club for fatties, and morning star for wets.

But seriously, what do you want? You say you want more weapons added to the game and cite the weapons having specific uses as therefore being bad for some reason and "not real weapons" or whatever. If they added more weapons they would also have specific use cases because we already have general all-purpose weapons in the dark sword, ham bat, spike, and to a lesser extent club and cutter. What do you want them to add for new weapons? It sounds like you don't actually want new weapons and you just want a different sprite in your hand, which is more like a request for weapon skins than a request for weapons.

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25 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

There are 5 top tier melee weapons, 6 decent melee weapons, 16 bad melee weapons, 2 top tier ranged weapons, 6 more ranged weapons, some traps, and some explosives. In total that's about 15 viable weapons.

But I'm not quite sure why you ask for more weapons and use "Nobody ever actually does anything" as a reason they should be added. Shouldn't you be saying "We have 999999 weapons nobody uses because hohoho le 1 flint & 1 rope"?

There is 1 top tier melee weapon, Hambat. Second thing people go for is Spear, Maybe Wigfrid's spear but only if you have a wigfrid and she spends time crafting for everyone.

Played Don't Starve together for years and I can't think of a single time someone used a Thulucite Club and only person I saw using a Dark Sword is me. Everything else doesn't even exist, ever seen anyone craft the last 3? Or craft them yourself?  Morning Star and Bat bat is basically a joke weapon nobody uses.

And this whole "viability" thing shouldn't even exist. Even in games in which some character or thing is crappy people can still have fun with it. Try having fun in Don't Starve killing bosses with a whip. Specially since this is a game where making a mistake during combat means you die and this ain't like minecraft in which you immediatly respawn.

Weapons.png

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2 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

But seriously, what do you want? You say you want more weapons added to the game and cite the weapons having specific uses as therefore being bad for some reason and "not real weapons" or whatever. If they added more weapons they would also have specific use cases because we already have general all-purpose weapons in the dark sword, ham bat, spike, and to a lesser extent club and cutter. What do you want them to add for new weapons? It sounds like you don't actually want new weapons and you just want a different sprite in your hand, which is more like a request for weapon skins than a request for weapons.

maybe weapons could have more characteristics so that they can adapt to a players playstyle instead of to a specific situation

You do are right about the no need for more weapons though, the old things have to work fine to add more

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I was with you on the first half, but weapons is your main beef? Adding 3-4 new great weapons, paradoxically creates even more useless weapons. Every weapon can be used depending where you are at the game(except for whips, they suck really bad).

Spoiler

Sounds like a bait thread

 

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52 minutes ago, RenTheCat said:

We have 99999 ocean fishes nobody even bothers to fish, and if they do, they all look the same after you kill them.

There's 19 fish total, with 2 of those being event exclusive, 6 dropping unique items, 7 dropping a variant of a fish morsel, and the 6 dropping fish meat.
 

54 minutes ago, RenTheCat said:

We have 99999 crock pot dishes nobody even bothers to make because "haha le funny meat + 3 ice".

Ice argument: thanks Jazzy!

Dish argument: Even if we consider "meta dishes", there are still 7-8 many people would pick. If you want to try similar restoring dishes with different ingredients it would jump to around 20 dishes. Multiple dishes exist for a reason, and even if you don't choose to use some of them, other people will. There's only around like 8-9 dishes in the 60+ that are not worth the effort or take extremely specific combos to actually gain a profit.
 

57 minutes ago, RenTheCat said:

We have 99999 types of walls nobody makes

8 total if you count fences and fence gates each being separate walls, 2 are uncraftable/archive exclusive (and if you are including skins with this, which is fair, you still get 27 "walls" total, and 4 of those skins only relate to the 4 main walls [rest are fence/gate skins])
 

1 hour ago, RenTheCat said:

999999 beefalo costumes nobody even touched

10 if you count default as a separate costume, and all of which are free. I know a lot of people who actively tame beefalo like the changes as well, as it's neat to distinguish your beefalo from someone else's.
 

1 hour ago, RenTheCat said:

But just 3 or 4 weapons? And not even that.

There's certainty weapons that will outdo any others in many situations (see: hambat and dark sword) but that doesn't mean every other weapon is awful. Some weapons easily excel at doing specific tasks, and don't really get much spotlight. Take the morning star, for instance. It's one of the best weapons to fight off worm waves since they are always wet, and you can easily find worms in large amounts if you reset the ruins often. Combined with the fact it only loses durability while held, and it will last you around 12-13 worm waves, with a single star.

However I won't lie and say there are some gripes I have with the combat system, either. In particular, Klei really doesn't want a melee weapon to breach past the 68 damage cap in any normal case circumstance. The dark sword, glass cutter, and the trident (and only if the player is on a boat, by the way) all do 68 damage. The club/a 100% hambat deal 59.5 damage, and the spike is the only one that deals 51. 

If you want another issue on why most weapons are obsolete, you could also indirectly blame DST's HP changes. In DS you could easily get by with 1-2 dark swords for almost any combat scenario without any real worry. In DST, you likely need several to tackle a raid boss, especially if you do lower then 1X damage. Weapons like the hambat really climbed in popularity here, as the lower damage + slow damage dropoff is usually far more tempting then just making 3-9 swords to tackle a raid boss (and 15 if you want to challenge misery). It's been a reason why I wish the thulecite club had 375 uses (Same as SW's obsidian spear) or a way to repair it with thulecite, since 200 uses really doesn't last a long time against most bosses, combined with the fact it's a weapon you are forced to make at a pseudo station every time you want another one.

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I think there's a small gap between hambat and darksword/thulecite club/glass cuter. A weapon stronger than a spear, not quite as strong as a fresh hambat, is easy to produce, but doesn't rot. Tentacle spike fits the bill but its too rng. A hound teeth weapon? A gold weapon? A silk weapon? Idk.

As for more weapons... Im very unsure how this could be implemented. Other than a straight damage increase the game doesn't led itself well to a range of weapon variety. They all pretty much do the same go up to a mob and slash. Adding any range to a weapon puts 90% of the mobs at a disadvantage.  

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1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

I think there's a small gap between hambat and darksword/thulecite club/glass cuter. A weapon stronger than a spear, not quite as strong as a fresh hambat, is easy to produce, but doesn't rot. Tentacle spike fits the bill but its too rng. A hound teeth weapon? A gold weapon? A silk weapon? Idk.

As for more weapons... Im very unsure how this could be implemented. Other than a straight damage increase the game doesn't led itself well to a range of weapon variety. They all pretty much do the same go up to a boss and slash. Adding any range to a weapon puts 90% of the mobs at a disadvantage.  

 

They could have the same damage but some extra thing like +10 damage to winter mobs/summer mobs/bugs/frogs, etc or stuff like that, we have several crock pot dishes that fill the same hunger with barely any variation in the health and sanity, and that's because of ingredient variation, it could be the same for weapons, there is a mod out there to add a fish bat, it's literally a ham bat but wih fish, or add different types of spears with different materials

Crockpot.png

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1 hour ago, RenTheCat said:

 

 

Most mobs arent really worth having their own dedicated weapon. It would be a lot of unnecessary fluff. The cutlass invalidated every other weapon in shipwrecked because it had no drawbacks and tied for highest damage.

You keep bring up food but you're comparing apples to oranges. The many factors I would have to  compare between the two and amongst themselves will just muddle the conversation. But I will say you are only scratching the surface with food. There are more things to consider: Availability, accessibility, location, spoil rate, production rate, cooking time, restrictions, cost vs time, meat vs veggy, monster meat vs fillers, emergency food, etc. 

 

3 hours ago, RenTheCat said:

Morning Star and Bat bat is basically a joke weapon nobody uses.

I use them. A LOT. The bat bat is the absolute best early to mid game healing item at Wormwoods disposal. Bat bat means I don't need to rely on pierogies and not fall behind the other characters healing methods. For 2 living logs (40 hp) gain a net healing of 470 hp. That's 470hp almost every 2-3 night on auto with 2 fenced in bunnymen (provided i got purple gems in the ruins). The sanity loss is circumvented easily with a few seeds.

Volt goats are easily auto farmed too. Anenemies (spelling?) are a god send for this. I cant imagine not using a Morning star if I were to fight toadstool. Well, legitimately anyways. Personally, everyone should be using this weapon more and lose the rng stigma it currently has. Weather pains may compete for the horns early though.

Edit: In case anyone wonders, no, I don't use the bat bat as a weapon. Its only switched to when I need healing then I switch back to my main weapon.

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It's hard to make new weapons that don't just make the current ones redundant.

Klei's been really good at avoiding power creep (where the latest updates have the next most powerful thing that raises the bar and makes older content more useless), with the only obvious exception being Volt Goat Jelly, which is a multiplier. I don't want any weapon that does more damage, because then it'll either feel mandatory if the new mobs get extra health to compensate, or previous fights will become too easy with the extra damage. 

Before asking why there aren't enough weapons, try thinking of some interesting concepts that won't bring problems with them. It's not easy and will answer the question for you. If you do come up with something, then suggest it! That'll help others build ideas off it and a place to suggest similar things.

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Personally I think that interesting combat is better added on what you're attacking's end rather than the player's end. Not only does it make the feel of player versus enemy interactions more interesting, but it doesn't break too much of the classic feel to combat.

For instance here are a lot of things which make combat interesting AND are already present in the game:

Secondary attack changeups, examples being klaus chomp.

Leap attacks and deerclop's laser making you dodge to the side rather than directly away from the creature.

Area denial affects like klaus deer auras.

Wildcard affects like sporecaps, unseen hands, killing woven shadows.

If done the right way, hoard spawning can make a fight more interesting. Spider queens come to mind since they don't spawn the enemies in such a large quantity that it's overbearing.

Enemy's having an aversion or immunity to a specific type of damage, whether it be fire, ice, electric. Good examples are lavae having an aversion to ice attacks and tentacles/worms/merms always taking more damage from electric attacks.

Lobbed projectile attacks and antlion sand pillars make the player not only remember when an attack happen, but watch where the attack will land too.

 

Another thing that I think helps out combat is (quick) reactionary elements. It's quite simple. You see an enemy do a thing; you then react with this thing. It's slightly different than the typical kiting strategies because it relies on you watching the enemy rather than counting in your head. A good example of this in vanilla is laserclop's laser attack and the player reacting while dodging to move slightly to the side. Otherwise an uncommon combat trait.

 

 

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I wouldn’t generalize, I play mostly Woodie and my weapons are almost always either the moose punching/charging, or dark sword/bat-bat combo when in the human form, from very early in the game.
I rarely use hambats.

New players are what you will mostly see on servers and most new players still suck at the game, that’s why you will exclusively see them using spears, axes and maybe, a tentacle spike or a hambat. It all boils down to what they know and what’s at their reach given their limited knowledge of the game.

But in contrast, on public servers I’ve seen:

- Wormwoods making thul clubs very early into the game

- Wendys beefalo fighting since day 4 or 5. Even before her rework.

- Wickerbottoms and Webber’s farming yellow feathers since very early into the game, and having darts to fend off any hound waves or giants fight.

That said I’d love to see new weapon types and new weapons effects, even endgame good weapons.

Also some of the existing weapons could get a QOL revision at some point: The strident trident was a terribly missing opportunity to make a good endgame weapon which works well both in land and in the water (maybe even charging it with gems for different effects, since it comes from the crab king n all).
 I also think that Walter’s slingshot, specially his crowd control pellets, was a big miss to give Walter something unique and useful for the late game. Instead the slingshot is a weapon nobody really uses beyond early or maybe a few cheesy strats in mid game. A small AOE upon impact for freezing pellets and slow pellets, would be game changers, and probably re-define the character: Using the slingshot for crowd controlling groups of enemies while dealing damage with darts, dark swords or beefalo.

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, RenTheCat said:

We have 99999 ocean fishes

We have 99999 crock pot dishes

We have 99999 types of walls 

..but a (female dog) ain't one!  Wait...

5 hours ago, RenTheCat said:

They update farming but not the feature everyone actually uses, fighting.

Um.

That is a GIGANTIC generalization!  Fighting is "the feature EVERYONE actually uses"?!  Well, bye guys.  It's been nice knowin' ya. But since apparently I, as a part of "everyone" whose favourite part of the game ISN'T combat, don't exist, I have to fade away now...

Anyway yeah, this is an aggressive-ass thread, which...I guess makes sense considering its subject matter, but MAN someone is angry!  "turn it into Stardew Valley" dude it ALWAYS had a domestic farming/building aspect.  (My own personal nickname for it is "H.P. Lovecraft's 'Harvest Moon'".) It's just that, _while_ you're doing that, you might have to worry about being attacked by the dark corners of your own mind!  :)  And that's still true--in fact, now those "dark corners" are way better at keeping up with you.

As for weapons...and other stuff:  There's just ALWAYS going to be things in any larger, older, frequently-updated game that a lot of players don't use, because either they don't want to, don't know how/that it exists, or care.  Chill.  Me, I use tentacle spikes more than hambats.  Why?  Because I'd rather save the pigskins for football helmets (armor you can wear _all the time_ without taking your backpack off!) and umbrellas, and use the meat for meals that require big non-monster meat.  (But I get that not everybody has to be ready for any weather at almost any time the way I do, Ms. Crazy Random-Seasons-Pants over here.  So not everyone wanders around with an umbrella in their inventory all the time, so, other people have more spare pigskins. Other people also care more about killing bosses than I do.)

If the noobs are bugging you that much...make a friends' only server and play with people you already know are cool.  If they don't already know how to play well but seem smart and willing to learn, teach them!  But if you're mad about the fact that people who don't play the game the same way as you _exist_...deal.

...Notorious

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Honestly if Klei were to make more weapons, there could be more variation other than just higher damage, like taking significantly longer to break, or better range.

But either way, adding more weapons can potentially make less weapons useful, so that's also worth keeping in mind.

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