I Think New Characters Would Help DST

[minespatch]

1 hour ago, FreyaMaluk said:

Up and Away was a pretty cool mod.. I hope they can port it and mantain it for DST. That can be really fun

shopkeeper is from the original files though.

[dameJuno]

i would love for wilton to be in the game, im sure his official stats could be something cool and unique

[. . .]

2 hours ago, FreyaMaluk said:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=468856987

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=469134741

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=463554075

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=453114504

Mods are awesome & all, but these characters would be better if Klei implemented them into the game. If I remember correctly all these characters are already finished, so it wouldn't be hard to add them into DST.

Like even though these characters where planned characters for Don't Starve but got scrapped for unknown reasons they could still have a chance to comeback, I mean I thought Don't Starve was never going to get anything new yet Hamlet DLC is coming for it soon so I think anything's possible!

[minespatch]

25 minutes ago, Moabjk said:

i would love for wilton to be in the game, im sure his official stats could be something cool and unique

My theory is that he has similar abilities to Fuelweaver. Not as OP but probably connected to either nightmare fuel and green gems? Just throwing some brainstorming balls out there based on mechanics and lore.

I'd also love Fuelweavers babies be brought back from concept to finals.

[VexTheHex]

 Egh, I'm not digging these Pro-Mod people trying to say just use mods in this thread like it's the cure all.

 I mean let's just tell Klei to not do any more updates cause we can use mods. We didn't need new bosses like the Bee Queen... just use mods. We didn't need Winona... just use mods. We don't need any balance updates... just use mods. We don't need new skins... just use mods. We don't need events... just use mods. We don't need nothing... just use mods.

This thread has been derailed into pure v mod even though that shouldn't be the topic. The topic is about wanting new characters added into the official game and the general negative view at Winona being a very flat character for being the only character added in quite some time. Whether you use or don't use mods has no importance in this. And both sides should respect the other's choices in not using or using mods. But in no way does "there's mods" really have any influence on the size of the official cast of the game.

[FreyaMaluk]

1 hour ago, SuperDavid said:

Mods are awesome & all, but these characters would be better if Klei implemented them into the game. If I remember correctly all these characters are already finished, so it wouldn't be hard to add them into DST.

Like even though these characters where planned characters for Don't Starve but got scrapped for unknown reasons they could still have a chance to comeback, I mean I thought Don't Starve was never going to get anything new yet Hamlet DLC is coming for it soon so I think anything's possible!

ofc that'd be nice.

but i think it's more important to fix the characters we have now, instead of creating ones.

56 minutes ago, VexTheHex said:

 Egh, I'm not digging these Pro-Mod people trying to say just use mods in this thread like it's the cure all.

 I mean let's just tell Klei to not do any more updates cause we can use mods. We didn't need new bosses like the Bee Queen... just use mods. We didn't need Winona... just use mods. We don't need any balance updates... just use mods. We don't need new skins... just use mods. We don't need events... just use mods. We don't need nothing... just use mods.

This thread has been derailed into pure v mod even though that shouldn't be the topic. The topic is about wanting new characters added into the official game and the general negative view at Winona being a very flat character for being the only character added in quite some time. Whether you use or don't use mods has no importance in this. And both sides should respect the other's choices in not using or using mods. But in no way does "there's mods" really have any influence on the size of the official cast of the game.

hmm ... this is not what I was implying.

OP mentions he has abandoned the game cuz no new characters, someone suggested characters mods, then all the mods discussion began.

and as I mentioned before, it's more important a character rebalance rn IMO.

I'm not againgst new characters ofc, but some revisit to the current characters is overdue and takes priority IMO.

1 hour ago, SuperDavid said:

Mods are awesome & all, but these characters would be better if Klei implemented them into the game. If I remember correctly all these characters are already finished, so it wouldn't be hard to add them into DST.

Like even though these characters where planned characters for Don't Starve but got scrapped for unknown reasons they could still have a chance to comeback, I mean I thought Don't Starve was never going to get anything new yet Hamlet DLC is coming for it soon so I think anything's possible!

let's hope the devs add them in the near future after changing some of the issues with the current ones.

[. . .]

54 minutes ago, FreyaMaluk said:

ofc that'd be nice.

but i think it's more important to fix the characters we have now, instead of creating ones.

well the topic is about adding new characters not reworking existing ones which is why I say what I say in the first place , for reworking the only characters I feel need that is Willow & Woodie since they are a bit weak imo they could use some buffs

[spideswine]

2 hours ago, VexTheHex said:

 We didn't need Winona...

Well...

[TheKingofSquirrels]

18 hours ago, Lumina said:

Please, stop with this myth. One of the last time an update made mods useless was a change with worldgen with an entire topic to explain the changes and help for Klei when mods stopped working. And it was in April 2016. Maybe other stuff happened here and here, but in a scale very minor.

You don't know how to mod, don't have artistic skill and/or don't want to mod ? Fine.

But mods can stay a long time without any problems usually, and it would be very unlucky for a mod to stop working after a month.

 

So it's not a reason to not mod. Thanks.

One of my favourite mods, Krampusnacht, which I used on every world, was taken off from DST. 

So no. It's not myth.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't mod. I'm just saying that you shouldn't be shocked when people reply to your "just use mods" responses by saying that it's not the same. 

That's all. 

7 hours ago, Moabjk said:

i would love for wilton to be in the game, im sure his official stats could be something cool and unique

I feel like Wilton is too OP. The fact that he doesn't starve is too much. It breaks the game. 

On 30/11/2017 at 10:36 PM, Tumalu said:

The problem with this idea; "Oh, the new character was boring, the solution is MORE NEW CHARACTERS!". See how this might not go so well? Quality >> Quantity, in any case.

I'd rather get buffs to existing character than another new character, right now. Especially Winona, who's newness makes it feel more likely to maybe happen.

 

5 hours ago, FreyaMaluk said:

and as I mentioned before, it's more important a character rebalance rn IMO.

I'm not againgst new characters ofc, but some revisit to the current characters is overdue and takes priority IMO.

 

4 hours ago, SuperDavid said:

well the topic is about adding new characters not reworking existing ones which is why I say what I say in the first place , for reworking the only characters I feel need that is Willow & Woodie since they are a bit weak imo they could use some buffs

Guys...IT'S BEEN 3 YEARS. There's been countless threads on how Winona and Woody need fixing and nothing has been changed. It's not gonna happen.

So that's why, I say let's move on, and ask for new characters.

18 hours ago, Residays said:

Before we get a new character, we should get direct contact with the developers to give feedback so a semi-useless character like Winona doesn't happen again.

In theory, this is what this is right?

The problem is, Klei doesn't really acknowledge the forums anymore.

18 hours ago, spideswine said:

I'm going to guess that they were fully aware her design was ****, and didn't need feedback to confirm that.

Do you really think that's what happened? I honestly don't understand Winona. If they knew she was crap, why release her at all, and why make such a big announcement for it.

[spideswine]

18 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Do you really think that's what happened?

Yes. A developer can generally assess the quality of his work.

I mean most people realized she was garbage based on her perks, and didn't react well to her theme either, then some decided to test her in game anyway, and returned with "Well you know what you've all thought on her based on reading her abilities? That's exactly the case here."

I mean sure sometimes it's hard tell but that's not the case here, so I'm fairly sure they knew she was crap.

18 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

I honestly don't understand Winona. If they knew she was crap, why release her at all, and why make such a big announcement for it.

I think it was to make people more interested in the PS release, also I'm not sure if she was a big announcement, I think the PS release was.

[TheKingofSquirrels]

8 minutes ago, spideswine said:

Yes. A developer can generally assess the quality of his work.

So if they know she's crap, then why not re-work her. Do they really not care?

[spideswine]

2 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

So if they know she's crap, then why not re-work her.

Why not rework woodie?

Why not rework willow?

Why not make beefalo taming not god awful?

It takes time, and they have things they consider to be of higher priority.

2 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Do they really not care?

Of course they care, they just care about other things more.

[Lumina]

46 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

One of my favourite mods, Krampusnacht, which I used on every world, was taken off from DST. 

So no. It's not myth.

I'm sorry you don't understand what the problem is here. The problem is not saying that you got one bad experience with one mod removed from workshop but pretending that mods stop working after a month. Which isn't true, a lot of mod i have got no problem, even during ANR beta, and some aren't updated in years and still work, and as far as i can see in the workshop it's a case for a lot of mods (no complain in comment about incompatibility for a lot of them).

I don't know why your Krampusnacht was removed from the workshop. Maybe it was compatibility issues (but you don't seems to be sure of it), but yes, back in time, during the early access of DST, things were a little more instable. Now, even the ANR beta was mostly stable for modding, and Klei try to prevent any problem (we got a short problem when a line used in DS was removed in DST, they quickly fixed it so mods will still work even with this).

46 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

 

I'm not saying that people shouldn't mod. I'm just saying that you shouldn't be shocked when people reply to your "just use mods" responses by saying that it's not the same. 

And it's not the same, it's true. However, mods well done will not become not-compatible after a month, especially now, when Klei try to prevent this kind of issue, so don't discourage people to make (or use) mod by saying that.

Again, you don't want to code mod, ok. You want some things into the base game, ok. But don't tell things that aren't true.

 

 

About the main topic, i would like to see a rebalance of character. But the addition of a new character could be the perfect moment for this. Because a new character could help to accept the change, or distract from them. "Ok, Wicker is a little less powerful, maybe i could test this new char to see if i like they more", for example. I must admit i have habits and habits are hard to change, a balance of character could help to break the habit.

[Toros]

2 hours ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

One of my favourite mods, Krampusnacht, which I used on every world, was taken off from DST. 

So no. It's not myth.

I'm not saying that people shouldn't mod. I'm just saying that you shouldn't be shocked when people reply to your "just use mods" responses by saying that it's not the same. 

That's all. 

I feel like Wilton is too OP. The fact that he doesn't starve is too much. It breaks the game. 

 

 

Guys...IT'S BEEN 3 YEARS. There's been countless threads on how Winona and Woody need fixing and nothing has been changed. It's not gonna happen.

So that's why, I say let's move on, and ask for new characters.

In theory, this is what this is right?

The problem is, Klei doesn't really acknowledge the forums anymore.

Do you really think that's what happened? I honestly don't understand Winona. If they knew she was crap, why release her at all, and why make such a big announcement for it.

I think you might be an actual squirrel behind the keyboard.  Your problem-solving skills certainly aren’t any better than the creature that forced me to hit the brakes by running in front of my car on friday.

Firstly, this mod still exists and took about 2 minutes to google.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=858404263

Secondly, why would anyone use this mod when klaus exists?  It’s just an easier version that gives lesser rewards.  Also, the DS version hasn’t been updated since 2013, which kind of throws out the whole “mods stop working after a month” idea.

Thirdly, Wilton is not remotely OP because while he doesn’t starve he also can’t eat or use medicine.  His healing is very expensive and requires hound teeth or bone shards.  This makes him basically a nightmare to fight any of the more difficult bosses with.

Hunger is also a trivial challenge at every stage of the game, so being immune to it is a really weak upside.

Also, Winona is no more crap than Wilson is, so while I find her disappointing she’s within the rest of the group in terms of mechanical power and how boring her perks are.

[TheKingofSquirrels]

5 hours ago, Toros said:

I think you might be an actual squirrel behind the keyboard.  Your problem-solving skills certainly aren’t any better than the creature that forced me to hit the brakes by running in front of my car on friday.

Firstly, this mod still exists and took about 2 minutes to google.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=858404263

Are you like unavailable to have a conversation with someone without insulting them?  

Secondly, this was A LONG TIME AGO. So yeah, the mod disappeared back then and was gone for like a year. Glad to see it's back.

And I'm guessing you are gonna use this to criticise my argument. My point still stands. There was another mod called Temperate Caves that used to be on DST and it's now gone. So it happens, perhaps not that often, but it happens. 

5 hours ago, Toros said:

Secondly, why would anyone use this mod when klaus exists?  It’s just an easier version that gives lesser rewards.  Also, the DS version hasn’t been updated since 2013, which kind of throws out the whole “mods stop working after a month” idea.

Like I said...LONG TIME AGO. It was way before Klaus or ANR was even announced. It was just a fun event that would happen on my server that people enjoyed.

5 hours ago, Toros said:

Thirdly, Wilton is not remotely OP because while he doesn’t starve he also can’t eat or use medicine.  His healing is very expensive and requires hound teeth or bone shards.  This makes him basically a nightmare to fight any of the more difficult bosses with.

Maybe. It's true that that is a pretty heavy downside, but at the same time, not having too worry about food is a bit unbalanced. Just my opinion. 

5 hours ago, Toros said:

Also, Winona is no more crap than Wilson is, so while I find her disappointing she’s within the rest of the group in terms of mechanical power and how boring her perks are.

Wilson is the Vanilla character. He is the first character you play in Don't Starve, that's why he doesn't have any real perks. He's the starter character. 

Winona is the 12th character to be introduced...There's no excuse for her to be at the same level as Wilson.

Also, personally, I prefer Wilson's beard over her duck tapes or any of her perks. 

[Cass_]

I'd rather have them improve upon characters like Winona and Willow than add in more.  Leave the character implementation to the modding community, they seem to be pretty good at it (unless it's some anime character that runs faster and deals less damage because that's unoriginal)

[Toros]

8 minutes ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Are you like unavailable to have a conversation with someone without insulting them?  

Secondly, this was A LONG TIME AGO. So yeah, the mod disappeared back then and was gone for like a year. Glad to see it's back.

And I'm guessing you are gonna use this to criticise my argument. My point still stands. There was another mod called Temperate Caves that used to be on DST and it's now gone. So it happens, perhaps not that often, but it happens. 

Like I said...LONG TIME AGO. It was way before Klaus or ANR was even announced. It was just a fun event that would happen on my server that people enjoyed.

Maybe. It's true that that is a pretty heavy downside, but at the same time, not having too worry about food is a bit unbalanced. Just my opinion. 

Wilson is the Vanilla character. He is the first character you play in Don't Starve, that's why he doesn't have any real perks. He's the starter character. 

Winona is the 12th character to be introduced...There's no excuse for her to be at the same level as Wilson.

Also, personally, I prefer Wilson's beard over her duck tapes or any of her perks. 

Do you think your opinion on gravity has anything to do with how quickly you fall?

Because your "opinion" on the relative strength of not eating is exactly as relevant.  Food is super abundant in don't starve, and the primary way people heal as well.  Not *having* to eat is very weak (because Wolfgang can stay mighty at 3x drain without significant effort) not being *able* to eat is rather significant since it denies the health and sanity restoration from food.  Not being *able* to eat or use healing items or sleep means the only way at all to restore health is through Wilton's 10 hp bone shard requiring item.

When we're comparing a perk that would actually not help most of the rest of the characters much to a pretty significant downside that makes it more difficult to heal damage that when fighting certain bosses is either unavoidable (firefly) or very difficult to avoid (shadow pieces) we have a minor and forgettable perk and a significant to the point of being crippling downside.  There's things Wilton effectively can't do.  There's not things that other players could do without *having* to eat they couldn't already do.

[Remps]

cmon guys why blame winona . i guess winona come for other console because dst hard to play and you cant make fire quickly so winona can dodge any attack from darkness again i said winona awesome char for xbox or ps4 vb. and i agreed your buff texts willow and woodie should get buff 

[TheKingofSquirrels]

4 hours ago, Cass_ said:

I'd rather have them improve upon characters like Winona and Willow than add in more.  Leave the character implementation to the modding community, they seem to be pretty good at it (unless it's some anime character that runs faster and deals less damage because that's unoriginal)

4 hours ago, Toros said:

Do you think your opinion on gravity has anything to do with how quickly you fall?

Because your "opinion" on the relative strength of not eating is exactly as relevant.  Food is super abundant in don't starve, and the primary way people heal as well.  Not *having* to eat is very weak (because Wolfgang can stay mighty at 3x drain without significant effort) not being *able* to eat is rather significant since it denies the health and sanity restoration from food.  Not being *able* to eat or use healing items or sleep means the only way at all to restore health is through Wilton's 10 hp bone shard requiring item.

When we're comparing a perk that would actually not help most of the rest of the characters much to a pretty significant downside that makes it more difficult to heal damage that when fighting certain bosses is either unavoidable (firefly) or very difficult to avoid (shadow pieces) we have a minor and forgettable perk and a significant to the point of being crippling downside.  There's things Wilton effectively can't do.  There's not things that other players could do without *having* to eat they couldn't already do.

I understand your point, not being able to heal is a big downside, I got that. Actually, I take that back, hound teeth are really easy to farm and, especially in DST, bone shards are everywhere; but that's not really my main problem anyway.

I think the main issue is that Wilton will break the game for noob players. Remember that this isn't classic DS, where characters need to be unlocked via experience, this is DST, where all characters are unlocked off the bat.

Meaning that most noob players will see a character who doesn't starve and go "Oh, that's a character I should pick"  and it will break the game for them, and here's why:

Remember when you first started the game? What was your first goal? It was probably "I need to get food or I'll die". However, as you became more experienced and food no longer became an issue, you could move on to other more complex goals. 

The problem is...That that 'noob' period is essential for learning how the game works. It offers a learning curve, but that's gone with Wilton. I think Wilton offers too much power too quickly. And before you say "Well he can't heal", how much do you think this affects the noob player? The noob player who doesn't fight bosses, or anything for that matter, and probably dies on the first hound attack? I mean when I first started playing, I didn't discover healing or crockpots until like after my third death. 

Essentially what I'm trying to say is, when the 'noob' player picks Wilton, they'll get bored because they won't have any goals. Those first 7 days, they will be bored out of their minds, because without hunger to motivate them to do stuff...What the hell else are they going to do? A more experienced player would use Wilton's powers to their advantage and focus on goals such as fighting bosses or mega base building, but a noob player...A noob player is not gonna know anything about that and is just gonna end up hanging around base until he gets bored and disconnects.   

That's my problem with Wilton. 

[minespatch]

2 hours ago, TheKingofSquirrels said:

Essentially what I'm trying to say is, when the 'noob' player picks Wilton, they'll get bored because they won't have any goals. Those first 7 days, they will be bored out of their minds, because without hunger to motivate them to do stuff...What the hell else are they going to do? A more experienced player would use Wilton's powers to their advantage and focus on goals such as fighting bosses or mega base building, but a noob player...A noob player is not gonna know anything about that and is just gonna end up hanging around base until he gets bored and disconnects.   

We'll never know what Wilton is like until the devs release him.

[Tylordian]

If we don't want that loss of the learning curve with Wilton, why not make you able to change into him with a special item? Hear me out-

Let's say very later in the game, perhaps from FW, you get a small, mini version of the atrium heart, (It doesn't have to be that, it can be any item) and if you kill yourself with maybe some other special item or ritual, you can ressurect with that atrium heart as Wilton, he would become a late game character. You would lose any perks of your character before that however. Just an idea.

[minespatch]

17 minutes ago, Tylordian said:

, mini version of the atrium heart, (It doesn't have to be that, it can be any item) and if you kill yourself with maybe some other special item or ritual, you can ressurect with that atrium heart as Wilton, he would become a late game character.

That and they can bring back Forge's Webber's baby system so that Wilton can use those unused henchmen from concepts.

[VexTheHex]

17 hours ago, Lumina said:

About the main topic, i would like to see a rebalance of character. But the addition of a new character could be the perfect moment for this. Because a new character could help to accept the change, or distract from them. "Ok, Wicker is a little less powerful, maybe i could test this new char to see if i like they more", for example. I must admit i have habits and habits are hard to change, a balance of character could help to break the habit.

 

 I don't really think Wickerbottom or Woflgang should be priority and may not even need nerfed for say. I'd say buffing Wes should even be above nerfing those two.

 

 Why? Cause at least Wickerbottom feels like her own character that does feel like the "Mage" class of the game. Some of her books feel strong and useful, something only she can accomplish. (End is Nigh is useless though without WX. I like the skin for it. Would love the other... more useful books to get matching skins) The thing is, Wickerbottom and her books feel good. 

 Wolfgang also does a pretty good job of filling the shoes as the meaty guy that can dish out the damage and take a beating. The food aspect is obviously to help balance him out some, but overall you feel like this muscular god at times, and it feels good.

 

 I feel the characters playing fun and filling their unique role is actually more important than the balance. There's tons of videos on cheesing things. And many people want Wes to remain terrible and not improve him. So I really don't think someone being a bit strong or weak is as important as the character filling out the fantasy. Winona came in as a character with little to her and little room for the fantasy to her. So I'd like to see another character that helps deliver a new fantasy to the cast, but I also don't object to some others get reworks like Winona or Willow. I feel Woodie offers his fantasy pretty well, it just needs polished to be a bit funner. 

[Raspberry Shake]

Just buff / nerf everyone till they're all equal. That way everyone's happy! Plus, adding too many new characters kinda takes away from the entire "were trapped in this nightmarish world with a close band of friends" vibe.

[Quoth143]

I'd first love it if Willow got some re-balancing first. Having her immunity to fire back would be nice.