Were the forums always like this?

[Retepeter]

I've only been on the forums for a few months but I'd like to ask older users if they were always like this? with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

I've seen some other game forums and they're usually more positive and people discussing game strats, fan creations and such

[Creatorofswamps]

[Yuuko]

Typically people get vocal about things they don't agree with.  That's just how it works.  I doubt the forums you're usually visiting are all positive unless its also heavily moderated to remove negative comments.  Most forums I visit for games are a healthy mix of positive and negative.  imo its important for negative comments to be given their space to be properly balanced against positive comments.  It lets us hash things out to find out where we really are.  Deleting negative posts (as some moderation teams do) only negatively impacts development.

[Retepeter]

29 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Typically people get vocal about things they don't agree with.  That's just how it works.  I doubt the forums you're usually visiting are all positive unless its also heavily moderated to remove negative comments.  Most forums I visit for games are a healthy mix of positive and negative.  imo its important for negative comments to be given their space to be properly balanced against positive comments.  It lets us hash things out to find out where we really are.  Deleting negative posts (as some moderation teams do) only negatively impacts development.

I'm not saying there's no negativity it's just that here there's more negativity then positivity and I agree some negativity is necessary but the amount here is very above average

[_zwb]

1 hour ago, Retepeter said:

with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

Is demanding changes a complaint then? If so it's good to have "complaints", at least the developers can get some feedback about what players need.

[Fufuji]

This isn't a bad thing. People know that Klei can see and consider accepting their suggestions so they make feedback.

Methods of submitting a suggestion isn't the most important part. A lot of offensive emails are sent to Klei too, you just don't see these.

Their standpoint, wishing DST become better, is what matters most. If negative ideas are not allowed, the positive will be meaningless. And to Klei, reasonable suggestions are positive instead of negative, no matter how it sounds like.

[chirsg]

59 minutes ago, Retepeter said:

I'm not saying there's no negativity it's just that here there's more negativity then positivity and I agree some negativity is necessary but the amount here is very above average

I'm not sure how to judge other games, but this is the only one where I actually feel like I'm listened to by the developers. For how much of a brat I tend to be, I never feel like my voice doesn't count. 

I actually quit terraria because of the way I was dismissed by one of the developers and on principal, that disgusted me so much that I said nothing else. I didn't flail my arms, I didn't post how bad things were, I didn't try to appeal to anyone, I simply stopped. I felt so betrayed, it was unreal. I'm waiting for the day a terraria-killer emerges because I love building in 2D, but that's a bridge I never look back on burning and I pray every day that re-logic goes under.

Klei on the other hand I feel will always make efforts to do right by it's playerbase. That's not something that will always be reflected on the forums. This isn't the type of game that is forgiving to players and causes immense frustration. When the dust settles, it's only a few people that keep playing, but that few is a huge amount.

 

This isn't a game where you can really turn your brain off and relax. You do that and you die. You do that and you starve. You do that and you freeze. This isn't the type of game where the "Fake positivity" crowd can huddle around and say how they've done nothing but roast a marshmallow in game or watch 2 npcs have speech bubbles and love heart emotes above their heads to post on reddit for free karma. This game is actively trying to kill you. It doesn't necessarily have those "Wholesome-baiting" elements. 

The type of player this attracts for better or worse are the kind that probably want to be killed. Other times you get the builders or the megabasers and as a result of the game's innate hostility against the players, things might get tuned a little to much for their liking where it kills you and everything you've built.

 

It's a weird ecosystem. Furthermore, I'll admit that gameplay elements will be harder to implement in this game than literally any other. Other games, especially indies, you generally accept that graphics will not be the cornerstone of their design, so riff raff will be allowed for in return for more deeper gameplay experiences. I think dst has to sacrifice on that a little bit because the animations, sprites, models and all the art in general really do stand alone in terms of how good they look. You could go forward in time 100 years and the artstyle is different enough to not be dated by that point. Therefore, I can't imagine it would be easier to animate or add new bosses when taking into consideration the art. Not sure if that makes much sense, but I'll stick by it.

 

 

Anyway, my overall point is that how these forums are do not reflect much on how people appreciate this game. Notice that no one really quits? They ask for additional things and ask questions. 

[JustAFlower]

13 minutes ago, chirsg said:

I'm not sure how to judge other games, but this is the only one where I actually feel like I'm listened to by the developers. For how much of a brat I tend to be, I never feel like my voice doesn't count. 

I actually quit terraria because of the way I was dismissed by one of the developers and on principal, that disgusted me so much that I said nothing else. I didn't flail my arms, I didn't post how bad things were, I didn't try to appeal to anyone, I simply stopped. I felt so betrayed, it was unreal. I'm waiting for the day a terraria-killer emerges because I love building in 2D, but that's a bridge I never look back on burning and I pray every day that re-logic goes under.

Klei on the other hand I feel will always make efforts to do right by it's playerbase. That's not something that will always be reflected on the forums. This isn't the type of game that is forgiving to players and causes immense frustration. When the dust settles, it's only a few people that keep playing, but that few is a huge amount.

 

This isn't a game where you can really turn your brain off and relax. You do that and you die. You do that and you starve. You do that and you freeze. This isn't the type of game where the "Fake positivity" crowd can huddle around and say how they've done nothing but roast a marshmallow in game or watch 2 npcs have speech bubbles and love heart emotes above their heads to post on reddit for free karma. This game is actively trying to kill you. It doesn't necessarily have those "Wholesome-baiting" elements. 

The type of player this attracts for better or worse are the kind that probably want to be killed. Other times you get the builders or the megabasers and as a result of the game's innate hostility against the players, things might get tuned a little to much for their liking where it kills you and everything you've built.

 

It's a weird ecosystem. Furthermore, I'll admit that gameplay elements will be harder to implement in this game than literally any other. Other games, especially indies, you generally accept that graphics will not be the cornerstone of their design, so riff raff will be allowed for in return for more deeper gameplay experiences. I think dst has to sacrifice on that a little bit because the animations, sprites, models and all the art in general really do stand alone in terms of how good they look. You could go forward in time 100 years and the artstyle is different enough to not be dated by that point. Therefore, I can't imagine it would be easier to animate or add new bosses when taking into consideration the art. Not sure if that makes much sense, but I'll stick by it.

 

 

Anyway, my overall point is that how these forums are do not reflect much on how people appreciate this game. Notice that no one really quits? They ask for additional things and ask questions. 

I totally agree, in short of what I think : even if I started playing this game late 2022, this community and developers are the best gems I've seen, everyone is looking for more ;( YOU'RE GONNA MAKE ME CRY BUFF-EAGLE DUDE.

[Antynomity]

This is one of, if not only places like these where the Devs actually read and apply feedback in most places where it's required.

Most companies would never listen to their community to this extent, like, ever.

[Paxtonnnn]

Criticism is important but I do feel like sometimes people start fear mongering that the game is going to be RUINED and NEVER THE SAME AGAIN too often

[Cheggf]

This is a mindset issue with you, not the forums. Look at the front page right now:

Thread for helping people

Your post complaining for no reason

Appreciating Klei for no reason

Asking about a character's best skills

Criticizing a boss

Pondering a hypothetical change

Engagement bait

Bragging about how good he thinks he is (disguised as a thread wondering about difficulty)

Sharing their ideas on new skill trees

Asking about inventory management

Suggesting Wormwood gets a bloom meter

Criticizing the content arcs

Wondering about an economy system

Advertising a speedrun tournament

Asking about a skin

Asking about a weapon

Tech support

Sharing their ideas on new skill trees

[Captain_Rage]

Many suggestions on the forums would turn the game pretty awful. Opinions vary what constitutes a good game / makes DST a good game, sure, but there are plenty of ideas whose reasoning makes very little sense and are being pushed despite not being well thought through. It's easy to get defensive over that. That is my point of view.

The forums had a different feel to it when the game was new and people were still discovering everything in it. Events had a sensation of novelty. I enjoy the seasonal events repeating however. Even if they are not as new they definitely have their charm.

[Horsheen]

6 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

This is a mindset issue with you, not the forums.

Going to have to disagree, I've witnessed the most harmless of threads turn to toxic dumpster-fires VERY often. This community dogpiles on people a lot, and hardly any threads ever hit a nice conclusion because they crash and burn so fast.

[GetNerfedOn]

5 minutes ago, Horsheen said:

Going to have to disagree, I've witnessed the most harmless of threads turn to toxic dumpster-fires VERY often. This community dogpiles on people a lot, and hardly any threads ever hit a nice conclusion because they crash and burn so fast.

As a case in point, here's an old one but a good one:
 

A harmless poll thread trying to celebrate new year, eventually locked after people started to argue hotly in it

 

[-Variant]

The forums are very interesting.

It also really depends on what you mean.
If you mean the sheer amount of knee-jerk reactions to almost anything Klei does, then yes, I'd have to personally say this has always been a thing. I remember when both Wormholes and Krampus were first added to DS, ahah, people loathed those additions. Now I rarely see anyone batting an eye. I think this trend will be a Constant.

Now, if you more-so mean how people treat each other? I'd also say its stayed relatively consistent relative to the community's size. I'd personally wager that its gotten worse over the years, but I have to confess, that's just something to expect with how large communities grow. Not everyone will get along, despite my personal wishes otherwise, hah.

Something very damn important I want to note is that Klei is very different to many other companies that even run forums like these. Klei listens. And they listen a lot.
This alone in of itself is going to be a doubled edged sword! It's wonderful in the sense that many people can almost directly influence the direction of the game! But also may potentially cause turmoil in the fact that not everyone is going to share the same vision as each other, or the people directing things.
Some folks may just want to express their opinion, or have a say in things. Others are going to potentially take it a step further. Unfortunate, but very natural.

This is most likely going to be the reason you see other forums less hostile in appearance, there's simply just less things to be torn apart over!

When you're in the middle of a growing community, there's going to be some growing pains. Breaks are important, even if saying so can be seen as cheesy.

[BalkanCockroach]

19 minutes ago, GetNerfedOn said:

As a case in point, here's an old one but a good one:
 

A harmless poll thread trying to celebrate new year, eventually locked after people started to argue hotly in it

 

It's not even that bad just a lil heated. My experience so far has been nice, people are chill. Sometimes a lil mad but its understandable, every arc changes the game drastically some people just need to get used to it. And while they do they will whine, i will too.

1 minute ago, -Variant said:

Constant

Cyclum of forums

[Hungry French]

5 hours ago, Retepeter said:

I've only been on the forums for a few months but I'd like to ask older users if they were always like this? with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

I've seen some other game forums and they're usually more positive and people discussing game strats, fan creations and such

The discontent of DS fans is justified.

And complaining when your DST has been updated for 7(10) years is a sin

I was happy with only 1 update. Mega Update 2023 for DS.

And DST updates... Cool update... I will definitely play it when it is transferred for DS.  (Continues to run DST for daily gifts only )

[Dextops]

Ask any dst related discord and they’ll you a lot about what they think of the forums

[Gashzer]

Anyone who complains about Walter saying hes bad or f tier gets about 1000 posts from me proving the opposite. 

Plus i think a few people (or just me ) love a good heated debate. The forums is a good place to have moderated discussions about the game that can get abit heated but if people start being petty and use personal insults they get shut down.

Edit: most importantly this is the best place to have your ideas posted and Klei have in the past used ideas that myself and others have suggested. Klei have been good at filtering through bad ideas or pointless criticisms and taking on board the good ideas and constructive criticisms.

[lakhnish]

6 hours ago, Retepeter said:

with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

You have to keep in mind that we all perceive negative things much more harshly than we do postive things.

Yes, things can get heated on the forums, but it's also a large community with different viewpoints so it's only inevitable. I'm in another discord for a much smaller, chiller game and its the same even there.

The thing to remember with the Klei forums, and I can't stress it enough, is that the devs are incredibly receptive to feedback. And I cannot tell you how many times community based feedback has made their way back into the game; it's simply too numerous to count. 

So even if things seem bad on the forums, always keep in mind that the devs do listen and more importantly, when you see others behave in a way you don't agree with or isn't productive, you do have the option of not engaging with them and/or to instead make your own post to positively contribute to the community rather than getting into an arguement with someone else.

I personally see people get into arguements far too many times when they are obviously frustrated when they should have instead taken a break. Rage bait can be very addicting and people can't help themselves sometimes.

[Russian_Philin]

Spoiler

7 hours ago, Retepeter said:

I've only been on the forums for a few months but I'd like to ask older users if they were always like this? with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

I've seen some other game forums and they're usually more positive and people discussing game strats, fan creations and such

 

I mostly didn't participate briskly in suggestions or looking for bugs in the game, but before the community on the forums was more tolerant and easier. But I can also understand those who complain. Still, the game has undergone great changes over all this time, which can cause rejection and irritation, especially among old players. I don't want to justify anyone with these words. In this situation, everyone is right, but at the same time they are wrong.
Time goes by, this cannot be changed, people come and go, the priorities of the team change, the team members themselves change, because the world does not stand still. Criticism allows developers to go in a more familiar direction for the atmosphere of the game, but recently too many negative events have been caused because of trifles, which does not play in favor of the community. First of all, this is a game that the developers have made, and they always have the last word. These are my thoughts on this.

[HowlVoid]

It's not that bad, I think it's overblowing the situation. 

Now if you want to see toxic positivity just go to the ff14 reddit. You criticize the game at all and you'll be witch hunted. So having some criticism is good, and painting it as negativity is a disservice imo.

However, I think we sometimes forget there is a right way to voice that criticism and that we don't have full control of the game. After all, feedback is a privilege not a right. We don't get to backseat drive the devs.

As far as debates go, this forum has some of the best I've seen. It's just we get a little passionate lol.

 

[Gashzer]

11 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

We don't get to backseat drive the devs.

Excuse me, i will do all the backseat driving to ensure klei does Walter justice with his skill tree! 

[Cr4zyFl4mes]

 

[Mike23Ua]

8 hours ago, Retepeter said:

I've only been on the forums for a few months but I'd like to ask older users if they were always like this? with every post complaining about something, nobody being happy with new updates and demanding that Klei add what they want

I've seen some other game forums and they're usually more positive and people discussing game strats, fan creations and such

Okay let me put it this way- Last month I paid 70$ for the newest Sonic the Hedgehog game Sonic Superstars, It’s a decent-ish game BUT.. it isn’t without its Flaws, The campaign is kinda short, Multiplayer doesn’t work as good as it Should (as in if your lagging behind you fall off screen then tap a button to teleport to the person who’s in front rather then the game split-screening and letting you go your separated paths) there’s No online Multiplayer, only living room Coop. Then there’s also the fact that collecting 100 coins or jumping into special bonus stages only grants you a new currency token which is ONLY used to buy robot customization parts for the games highly forgettable & clearly tacked on- Battle Mode.

To top all of that off- there’s a new mobile sonic game coming out next month that has more playable characters and will probably be free or at least very cheap, compared to the game I just paid 70$ for.

Are you telling me that I as a consumer have no right to complain about it??

DST is the same way- If people bought DST expecting it to stick to its roots that were DS.. then it’ll feel like the game has steered colossally away from that- With literal in game pop up windows, way point & navigation systems, recipe cards, Reworks, Re-Re-Works, Skill Trees- More powerful characters right out the starting gate on Day 1 where the game world isn’t being buffed to match them & their new found powers. Content that’s being added is either too late into the game to be the challenge Klei intended it to be (Brightshades infesting crops and resources won’t really be a challenge to anyone who has done pearls entire quest line, killed crab king & defeated Celestial champion) Or… OR- Content that SHOULD be early game is tied to late game tasks (such as obtaining furniture BP for the SawHorse through Ruins & Pearls Island)

As much as I love DS & DST- there’s a ton of things I’d “Like” to see be done with the game- For example what I still fail to understand is that how come in a game that literally has a world Gen toggle for just about every single feature or world hazard- Why can’t we get world Gen toggles that make the game react or play in a completely different way??

Such as & this is just a few examples:

A harder difficulty option where perhaps the player can’t build permanent solutions to all the games weather hazards.

A new way of exploring the world by having the biomes separated when generating a new game world into Archipelago Islands requiring more boat use, or even mountains slopes and hill sides so you’ll need to navigate up, over, or around the map..

Less focus on raid bosses, more focus on world exploration & adding an actual Adventures Mode campaign.

My point is that just like that Sonic game I paid 70$ for, no game is without its flaws… in general a game forum can’t ever be all positive.

Unless those forums are heavily moderated and any negative comments get removed so it only appears to be sunshine & rainbows.

Believe it or not something CAN be your favorite thing- And you can still find things to complain about it because maybe you can suggest things to “hopefully” make it more enjoyable for you.

Thats the thing though- You wouldn’t be on these forums at all if you didn’t care about the game or franchise, and you don’t have to praise every update Klei puts out for it either…

Some people will love X update, while others hate it. Those same people who loved X update May hate Y update while the ones who hated X end up loving Y.

Realistically speaking there’s a famous saying- you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can’t ever please all of the people all of the time.