Ocean Content Concepts

[HumanBean150]

A discussion for all the ocean or ocean- related concepts you may have. 

[Captain_Rage]

What an amazing thread. Here is an image to really help facilitate the discussion:

 

[HumanBean150]

1 minute ago, Captain_Rage said:

What an amazing thread. Here is an image to really help facilitate the discussion:

 

ocean

[MondayNight]

4 hours ago, HumanBean150 said:

ocean

Content. Almost "Wow". Barely almost.

[Mike23Ua]

I can’t find the thread I made about ocean content sometime back ago anywhere in my post history, it must have been removed for being inactive too long-

but the TL:DR of that: I choose a bunch of SW/Ham/Forge/ Unimplemented mobs & features & suggested those things be added in to the game as Ocean Content. Such as, Jellyfish, Ballphin, Spoonbill, Kelpy & Snake/Otter. Along with unimplemented hazards such as Whirlpools & high seas.

Now, if you started the game out on Pearls Island or Lunar Island- and you built a BOAT to Sail back to the main cluster of Biomes, that entire Area is considered an Island & what made Shipwrecked so great: Was that you sailed between different islands of resources/content. So in my mind: More Ocean content would ALSO include new land biomes- Anything that requires building a boat to sail towards… that’s Ocean Content.

And I really wish Klei would make something the same size & scope of Lunar instead of these tiny biomes that require us to interact with things while still on the boat (Water-Logged, Seaweed Barnacles etc..)

That’s what I personally want out of Ocean content, a few mobs to round out the games emptyish waters but, mostly new land biomes you need to sail to.

Some examples would be: Dont Starve Hamlet has Frogs that can Swim.. so it really baffles the heck out of me why Klei only programmed HOUNDS in DST to Swim but did not give frogs the same treatment.. my guess is because “Frog Rain” But.. Still it’s sad to see them have swimming animations in Hamlet but won’t swim DSTs large empty ocean..

[Capybara007]

I wouldnt like islands

[Cr4zyFl4mes]

10 hours ago, Captain_Rage said:

What an amazing thread. Here is an image to really help facilitate the discussion:

 

What does this image even mean? Is it supposed to be making no sense on purpose or am I just stupid and not getting it?

[maradyne]

I'd really just like to see the ocean become less isolated from the land gameplay loop. More small interactions between it and the world we already have.

More mobs capable of swimming smoothly as part of their pathing... definitely Merms, and I liked the Frog suggestion.

Also Wurt.

...I'd actually like if most characters had a brief grace period when entering the water, in part for smoothing exploration out, but also to solve that old, still-present bug where jumping onto a boat with a structure near either edge can result in just...instantly drowning.

In that case, stuff like the balloon vest or playing a fish person can extend the grace period.

 

I'd still say let Wes insta-drown though.

Actually, remove all collisons that stop Wes from walking off of world borders and just let him trip and fall and die any time he touches 2 drops of liquid/void.

I need this.

[Cr4zyFl4mes]

As for the topic:

1) I always imagined being able to ride gnarwails, but since we've got the new grass gators, riding them would somewhat suffice. I know, it's only limited to shallow water, but at least boats would be still better choice for most of the content.

2) Rebuildable sea stacks - for building mazes/race tracks.

[ShadowDuelist]

1 hour ago, Capybara007 said:

I wouldnt like islands

Why?

The thrill of finding new lands, exotic inhabitants, new traders, new treasures and new enemies exploring lands is what makes sailing attractive for the most part, at least to me. 

Currently there are very few islands and just sailing for sailing’s sake feels boring to me. I know DST’s world has a limit in size but I mean if there were at least 4-5 new islands with different stuff to do and different enemies on each it could be more interesting.
 

I’d also like a new world generation mode where the world’s biomes are split across the ocean in a random way (optional, not default, stop yelling at the screen)  so to find pig king, or beefalos you have to sail (or find the cave connections. Or the wormholes) I don’t know maybe it would be boring but it would be neat to try something like that.

[Mike23Ua]

1 hour ago, Capybara007 said:

I wouldnt like islands

Why? You don’t like Lunar Island or the main starting area of the game? They are both Islands. Full of biomes, mobs, resources and content. Lunar even has its very own Weather effect.

So the possibility of having new islands each with its own set of mobs, resources, biomes & weather patterns is a very very REAL possibility.

I would prefer Klei remove 90% of the sea-stacks I smash my boat into and to instead add new interesting islands in their place.

one of the highly requested ones seems to be for a frozen fridged place with extreme cold temperatures, icebergs, ice sheets, a new gameplay mechanic of sliding across a slippery surface, frequent snow/blizzards Webber’s Snowfallen head? Yeah those actual spider types would probably fit in well there.

Webbers Magmatic head? Well for that we would need a shipwrecked like volcanic/magma biome a hot place with extreme heat.. you get the idea..

As far as actually “At SEA” Ocean content, I would want something similar to ATLAS the pirate game I’m playing where Whirlpools, Water Sprouts, rough seas, Enemy boats & Aquatic Mobs attack.

ATLAS actually IS a game structured like how I want DST to be- while yes atlas is a pirate game.. it also has many different islands, and each island has its own unique resources and inhabitants upon it.

Despite being a “pirate game” most the actual time you will play is spent on Land.

Now Atlas also “cheats” by having the same type of resource used in the same crafting recipes just merely look different on another island instead of being an actual new resource used in exclusive crafts requiring it.

DST already HAS this to a limited Degree.. there are already 3 different types of Berry Bushes which serve the exact same identical purpose.. they just look different.

Same can be said about how saplings look on main land/lunar/pearls island.

So Klei is ALREADY doing something similar to what ATLAS did…

I just wish they would do things on a much larger scale then these tiny little areas we sail to and interact with while still on the boat.

[Capybara007]

Islands have no inmersion in the boats experience whatsoever, yes you have to use a boat to get to them but after that its just another land biome where you just walk like always, creative biomes that adapt to the sea like waterlogged's are much more fun

[Mike23Ua]

4 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

Islands have no inmersion in the boats experience whatsoever, yes you have to use a boat to get to them but after that its just another land biome where you just walk like always, creative biomes that adapt to the sea like waterlogged's are much more fun

Have you played atlas though? It’s an actual pirate game, pirate games are generally about boating entirely, but Atlas has land biomes with resources, tameable creatures etc.. If atlas was only about the at sea ship content- it would be boring fast.. but it’s not.

And I’m starting to realize that if Klei would actually USE Shipwrecked/Hamlet: Maybe not every feature of SW/Ham but a good bit of its Flora/Fauna there are a lot more “different looking but still serves the same purpose” resources then I ever possibly accounted for.

For example- Shipwrecked and Hamlet have their own types of Grass, which still does the same thing as current grass but they only look different and unique to the Biome they’re in.

Didn’t the gorge have its own Bush/tree designs too?

Klei: please play atlas I’m begging you guys, just everyone drop what your doing and spend a few hours playing Atlas.. 

I truly do feel like playing Atlas would be a good starting point for discussing future Ocean Content.

[Capybara007]

Why cant dst be special from itself instead of "with a little inspiration from"

You always have the attitude of "if this cool thing from this different game/dlc would be in the main branch the game would be so cool" but thats not how dst works

[Mike23Ua]

2 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

Why cant dst be special from itself instead of "with a little inspiration from"

You always have the attitude of "if this cool thing from this different game/dlc would be in the main branch the game would be so cool" but thats not how dst works

Before there was Atlas, there was Don’t Starve Shipwrecked.

Im pretty sure whoever created atlas took ideas from Shipwrecked. And whoever created Shipwrecked also got inspiration from somewhere else.

I reference these other games because that’s how video games have been made for decades, a company see’s something they like and they use it “in their own creative way of course”

Take the fighting formula from Arkham Asylum as an example- while great- it then went on to be copy and pasted into every other game from Mad Max, to Assassins Creed, to Most recently.. Marvels Avengers.

But you borrow what works for your vision- and you scrap what doesn’t. You modify it.. you make it your own thing.

Throughout all of human history we have drawn inspiration to do something from something else.. and this should be no different.

Im not saying DST should play identical to atlas, but borrowing what fits Klei’s vision for what they want their game to be while leaving behind what doesn’t- is a good foundation.

If DST played identical to atlas we would be able to hand build our ships part by part by the way with our own designs, this isn’t your pre-built ready to sail ships of Sea of Thieves, you much like DST.. have to build the thing from scratch and add onto it as you go.

Atlas also has wall climbing pickaxes, mythological creatures and Batman like glider suits.. but we’re not aiming to turn DST into Atlas, we’re only aiming to borrow from Atlas what fits Klei’s vision: While leaving behind what doesn’t.

I have no doubt in my mind that Don’t Starve wouldn’t exist at all if it wasn’t for some movie, tv series, or other game that inspired its creators along the way.

Shipwrecked existed before Atlas and shipwrecked had you sail in between island biomes gathering resources all while combating against hostile at sea dangers/mobs. 

Water Logged could’ve just as easily been a patch of marshy turf you could get off the boat and walk through, which is what the concept art for it showed off: before Klei decided to make it a strictly at sea stay on the boat to interact biome.

Thats because the shallow water marshy walkable turf while fully drawn out in concept art, didn’t fit this particular area of the games vision.

If I can actually find those Dev stream concept arts I will paste them here, but someone else would probably be able to find them much faster then I ever could.

[HowlVoid]

If you're adding more islands are you adding more ocean content or are you adding more land content to the ocean?

[Erineyes7]

I'm just throwing ideas in the ring and seeing what you guys think

I like the idea ot adding a kind of large shoal biome full of unique sea stack structures, some monsters and plenty of shoals of fish to catch would be plenty fun, the water would be a much cleaner blue, the rocks would have washed up seaweed on them, just something to make it feel alive yknow?

I think there should be one more island out there, it doesn't need to be big, just some kind of mactusk resort maybe? You'd be able to come here all year (Expect winter) and get a walrus tusk for a cane. It's simple, has gameplay purpose and is something to explore for. 

On another Note, I actually really like the tiger shark, and wish there was a more territorial mini boss, one that guard a certain area, maybe coffee even?

And last but definitely not least, FIX CRAB KING. This boss is so horrible, its nearly impossible to solo without abusing freezing staffs, and the reward isn't even worth it. He needs some kind of Nerf, and I would much rather have it so he's originally stronger, but the gems Nerf certain aspects of him, literally any nerfs would appreciated, I hate him.

[Mike23Ua]

8 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

If you're adding more islands are you adding more ocean content or are you adding more land content to the ocean?

Ultimately it would depend on what you consider to be “Ocean Content” would the Unimplemented Lilypad Shadow monsters being placed into tiny pond like areas like the water areas of the Hamlet DLC been considered as Ocean Content?

Spoiler

 Fingers crossed they still add this to the game at some point.

Or would being able to “walk” through a biome fully submerged in water but the “land” wasn’t under the water deep enough to NOT stand on would that not count as Ocean Content??

[HowlVoid]

I want more random encounters.

Preferably monkeys on boats wearing funny hats. You may have to get rid of a rockjaw that's trying to eat them, feed them, or build something on their boat. 

The encounters can chain together too, maybe that monkey you helped is now a merchant with stuff you can buy or he's a pirate with a monkey crew and they want to steal your boat.

Some rewards include the funky monkey hats, like a banana hat that lets you do the macarena when you stand still for a bit.

[Kelloggs Dogfry]

19 minutes ago, Erineyes7 said:

And last but definitely not least, FIX CRAB KING. This boss is so horrible, its nearly impossible to solo without abusing freezing staffs…

I don’t want this to derail into a crab king discussion but I will point out that you can solo him without ice staves or various cheese methods (in a quite exciting manner might I add) but unfortunately you need to have Wolfgang damage to be able to pull it off. I wouldn’t want him to be nerfed in anyway as he’s quite well balanced for multiplayer, but perhaps there needs to be a better tool to help deal with him by yourself (namely the biggest crunch I’ve found is having the damage to take out the claws before you get overwhelmed by other mechanics). Perhaps the moon sword could offer a unique benefit in his fight as well to help with that (idk ¯\_(ツ)_/¯). I think it’s fair to say that more useful farmable rewards would be nice from him. I feel like he’s probably snapped at a passing gnarwail or two while sitting around just out of spite, so why doesn’t he drop some of their horns for starters?

[Hornete]

3 minutes ago, Kelloggs Dogfry said:

but perhaps there needs to be a better tool to help deal with him by yourself

Absolutely, Crab King is genuinely my favorite boss fight in a multiplayer setting, I've always had a soft spot for games that have you and others coordinate together on a ship or vehicle of sorts to avoid danger, working together as a team to row your boat and fight Crab King feels so awesome.

But solo? Hoo boy! Hes my least favorite boss in the game solo. I think it could help to have some better ways to combat his claws and his healing. Gnarwails could be a cool way to help with that, but unfortunately they suck since theyll just end up pushing your boat away from the fight (They stink in general.. but that's a topic for another day) I've always personally really wanted to see mobs like pigmen or perhaps a new kind of mob that helps you with boat actions like heaving masts, raising anchors, and rowing.

[Ohan]

not a new suggestion but id really like buildable static wooden platforms for the ocean. they could be the size of pitchfork tiles and snap to that grid when ur placing them and that way they would seamlessly connect to each other.

Would be sooo awesome i think. like can u imagine building small fishing outposts near malbatross shoals etc; the ocean would look so much cooler and less empty if we could build in it without resorting to ugly clusters of anchored boats. 

Also buoys like we had in shipwrecked. and ocean walls. 

 

[Maxposting]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Lunar even has its very own Weather effect.

What?

[Mike23Ua]

11 minutes ago, Ohan said:

not a new suggestion but id really like buildable static wooden platforms for the ocean. they could be the size of pitchfork tiles and snap to that grid when ur placing them and that way they would seamlessly connect to each other.

Would be sooo awesome i think. like can u imagine building small fishing outposts near malbatross shoals etc; the ocean would look so much cooler and less empty if we could build in it without resorting to ugly clusters of anchored boats. 

Also buoys like we had in shipwrecked. and ocean walls. 

 

I can see where this would allow people like Me to build gigantic circular wood platforms around crab king, and then fight him without needing a boat. Would probably make this fight feel a little more fair when playing solo if I could just build “land platforms” but while out at sea.. but also you run into the same problem of taking content that was designed to be interacted with while still on a boat and turning it into another land biome.

albeit a hand-made one.. but still.

I personally feel like boats already have ENOUGH things you can do with them, fishing in shoals, mining away at salt formations and fighting off cookie cutters, gathering spittle fish and seaweed barnacles, fighting off RockJaw & Gnarwail attacks, All Water-Logged content, collecting Jam and fighting off hordes of spiders that flood the tiny platform you have no room to move about on, Fishing up sunken treasures to create moon totem with a pinching winch, collecting message in a bottles.

Its starting to feel like Batman Arkham Knight shoving the Batmobile into areas of the game it just doesn’t really need to be in.. which in turn- the more it’s over-used, the more it ends up hated.

As someone who plays completely alone most the time, fighting off hordes of gliding water spiders all while standing on a tiny platform I have no room to move around on just isn’t fun… NOR is it as fair as it WOULD HAD BEEN if there was a patch of land I could run around on to dodge & kite.

While yes DST is designed with multiplayer in mind, not everyone cares to play Multiplayer- and content shouldn’t feel completely unfair when doing so.

[MikoFanboy]

The sad thing is, ocean is boring and every ocean content (although it looks nice and pretty) is boring 

and it's because of the cookie boat 

1) the boat ruining the ocean exploring experience 

let compare DST to SW,

if we ignore the waves, the ocean of SW is as empty as DST (Or even worse)

but here's the thing, with how fast you can go with the boat and you always need to control the boat to move, you will hardly have time to notice how empty the ocean is

with the waves, it's even better because you can interact with it for a speed boost or seeing as a challenge to avoid, it's fun

but in DST, the cookie boat is slow, plus you don't have to always control it to move and the control of it is kinda annoying. It make you not want to drive it at all, but just want to go to the lunar island or the new biome quickly. The long time traveling plus the not fun to drive make you start to focus your view to the surrounding, making the emptiness of the ocean pop up more. 

2) the boat ruining the boss and the bost fight

What's the different between SW ocean boss and DST ocean boss?

SW boss attack doesn't being designed around the cookie boat

combat on DST boat is suck, not only your arena is being limited by the boat, you have to alway check the boat health because the boss are designed to attack the boat, not you.

Basically

if it attack you, you feel like you're being cheated by the small space to attack

if it attack the boat, you feel like you're being cheated by the pathetic heal of the cookie boat and the annoying leaking water

 you don't feel like it's your fault to die or heck, you don't feel like you have a choice 

meanwhile in SW, want t fight a boss but doesn't confidant to be able to avoid every attack? Use a tank boat

fighting arena? It's the whole ocean boi, heck, we can go on land to continue fighting if you want

boat on low heath? One simple click and it's back to go 

since you are fully in control of the boat, it's your fault to not avoid that attack, it's your fault that the boat got hit, ... and you can feel it

3) the boat make you get more frustrated when it got destroyed 

The cookie boat is designed to have stuff build on it, you will lose more when it got destroyed compared to the SW boat