Any chance we can revert the marble tree nerf?

[Rhovious Aran]

Hey, 

For those of you who don't know. When marble trees were initially introduced in the A New Reign updates a couple years ago. They would initially always drop 3 marble and 1 marble bean when mined at their fully grown stage. While I do agree that that was excessive at the time, I felt the nerf was always a bit over the top going from 3 marble + 1 bean to either 1 marble & 1 bean or 2 marble. 

Now, a couple months back the cost for marble suits was changed from 12 marble to only 6 marble. I feel like it would have been a smarter choice to maybe add another piece of marble to the marble tree loot table instead of reducing the cost of the marble suit, as the marble suit appears to be the only truly functional thing you make out of marble, whereas statues and checkered flooring are purely decorational. (I personally don't use marble statues to block things for farms or defensive areas, as I prefer the imo highly superior looking moon glass for that purpose)

Farming marble feels quite unrewarding imo. It takes like 15 days to grow them and you basically only double your input. The mining process itself is incredibly slow and requires lots of pickaxes, so often find myself using bearger, rooks or the forest stalker to knock them down for me. 

I feel like increasing the marble tree loot from an effective 2 to 3 pieces while reverting the marble suit cost could make farming marble less tedious and feel more rewarding to basebuilders like me, while at the same time making sure it does not become too easy to obtain the very powerful marble suits.

Any thoughts on this? It's not something I feel out of this world passionate about, but I wanted to get my thoughts on this topic out, as I always felt the change to marble suit cost was a very weird approach to balance the power of marble.

 

[Aheguro]

Walter also uses marble to make one of the highest damage ammo for his slingshot.

[Echsrick]

i mean it does make sense that you sould get at least 1 more marble i mean if you look at a fully grown marble tree it realy looks like you sould get more then 2 i mean look at this

realy sould get 3 pices but you only get 2

[Well-met]

Agree with armor needing 12 but making grown trees drop more.

[MondayNight]

From my pov Marble Shrub mechanic is ok how it's now. Even on dedicated Endless servers as Walter I get more than enough Marble for all my needs (Marble Suit and Pellets) over acceptable time - starting from 2-3 Marble Beans. (Also helps if camping in Caves, since Marble literally falls from ceiling in your proverbial lap.) Now depends what are those needs for everyone else. Regarding Marble armor, 12 pieces were excessive, but half (the usual half/double game-balance "rule") seems a pretty big buff; perhaps 8-10 was more appropriate. Personally would be ok with a +2 Marble pieces buff per completely-grown Marble Shrub (+3 in total or 2x Marble + 1x Bean/1x Marble + 2x Bean). Hard "NO!" for reverting Marble Suit cost to 12 pieces.

[Maybe a dog]

I dont particularly mind how long it takes to get a decent amount of marble out of the shrubs. It just means making a bigger farm. Though I am certainly not against readjusting the amount dropped.

I would however like them to address how long it takes to harvest from them so it doesnt feel as much of a drag. Just small QoL changes. I wish they would reduce the hits required to mine them and that they changed the drop table from "extra marble piece or Marble Bean" to just marble bean just so you dont have manually convert marble into beans when replanting them.

[Aheguro]

25 minutes ago, Dr.Medic said:

i mean it does make sense that you sould get at least 1 more marble i mean if you look at a fully grown marble tree it realy looks like you sould get more then 2

Uh, actually 
The mass from the smallest piece is added to the second, and magically replicates the same as the biggest one which has the standar marble piece size... blabla... bla.

[lakhnish]

I'd like if the Marble Suit cost stayed the same since it's a good piece of armor, but they could also increase the marble shrub drops too for making lots of Marble Turf.

I use the Marble Suits all the time now with the new cost via the marble the world supplies but I also remember how tedious farming that marble for base building can be.

[Cheggf]

Great idea. I always find it really annoying trying to get enough marble flooring.

[Notecja]

For base building yes. I like marble floors and marble ambient sounds. 

[Friendly Grass]

Making the shrubs drop more and/or just making them only require 6 hits to mine instead of 10. Although it’s true there are alternatives like bearger or gunpowder.

[JWalker1311]

Use gunpowder to mine marble trees.

[Flusap]

I just forget about them cause they take so long and then when I finally remember to mine them like half of them have reverted back to stage one and I cry irl

[ArubaroBeefalo]

31 minutes ago, JWalker1311 said:

Use gunpowder to mine marble trees.

then you have to grind the other materials  Zzzzzz

i only bother farming marble if i can use the reanimated skeleton, warly spices or wurt slaves friends

[Mike23Ua]

Getting ridiculous amounts of marble for one of the best armors in the game would be pretty op, I mean it’s ALREADY Op.. but what your asking is to push it into extremely OP.

I don’t think we need all that now that we also have other OP things to aid with combat like a literal Day One Beefalo mount.

[Rhovious Aran]

 

29 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Getting ridiculous amounts of marble for one of the best armors in the game would be pretty op, I mean it’s ALREADY Op.. but what your asking is to push it into extremely OP.

I don’t think we need all that now that we also have other OP things to aid with combat like a literal Day One Beefalo mount.

Lol, did you even read my post?

[QuartzBeam]

35 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Getting ridiculous amounts of marble for one of the best armors in the game would be pretty op, I mean it’s ALREADY Op.. but what your asking is to push it into extremely OP.

I don’t think we need all that now that we also have other OP things to aid with combat like a literal Day One Beefalo mount.

Last time I checked, you didn't even know what a green gem was. I really doubt you have any idea what the "best armors in the game" are.

[HowlVoid]

From my point of view Ill have to say I disagree with this change. I try to take one marble suit to the ruins if its not to out of my way as Wormwood (bishops). If it was reverted to 12 marble it would be way out of my way.

Same for killing bee queen on year 1 using 1-2 lureplants. Getting the necessary 4 marble suits without having to invest in any shrubs is great, just from what I can reliably scavenge in the world. 

How about introducing a more powerful marble shrub? A new seed with marble + thelucite for late game builders? I like my early game marble suits...

9 minutes ago, QuartzBeam said:

Last time I checked, you didn't even know what a green gem was. I really doubt you have any idea what the "best armors in the game" are.

Is pointing things out this way really necessary, quartzbeam? Lets not turn this thread into drama, please.

[Maxil20]

6 hours ago, Rhovious Aran said:

Any thoughts on this? It's not something I feel out of this world passionate about, but I wanted to get my thoughts on this topic out, as I always felt the change to marble suit cost was a very weird approach to balance the power of marble.

Admittedly while I never had issues with marble shrubs getting nerfed, I’m not opposed to them getting buffed either.

My main issue with marble beans was never how it took awhile for them to grow and harvest (since once you do ~4-5 doubles you really start making serious gains, and megabasing is already pretty reliant on patience), but it has always been crafting the beans. I wish I could joke about how I’ve unsarcastically spent literally ingame days just sitting by a scaled furnace and crafting the marble beans as Winona. Other then that, I never really had issue for using marble for whatever I needed. I could definitely see the buff being appreciated though, especially if it made tier 3 marble shrubs guarantee you get the bean.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

From my point of view Ill have to say I disagree with this change. I try to take one marble suit to the ruins if its not to out of my way as Wormwood (bishops). If it was reverted to 12 marble it would be way out of my way.

Same for killing bee queen on year 1 using 1-2 lureplants. Getting the necessary 4 marble suits without having to invest in any shrubs is great, just from what I can reliably scavenge in the world. 

How about introducing a more powerful marble shrub? A new seed with marble + thelucite for late game builders? I like my early game marble suits...

Is pointing things out this way really necessary, quartzbeam? Lets not turn this thread into drama, please.

it doesnt need to be 12 again. 6 is so cheap even with the drop that we already have

it can be 8 but buff a little the drop

[HowlVoid]

16 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

it doesnt need to be 12 again. 6 is so cheap even with the drop that we already have

it can be 8 but buff a little the drop

6 is very cheap, but thats what I love about it. And how maxil said, it becomes very easy to get tons of them later on in the late game. The only issue is that you have to craft tons of seeds. 

What if they had a very small chance to drop marble when growing kinda the way twiggy trees drop twigs occasionally? I'd really hate marble armor to take a hit when Wormwood isnt good at mining. Characters without damage perks (more marble suits per boss/more mining) and mining perks (more marble per suit) will be at a disadvantage. Plus, Wormwood benefits so much from them in the early game when taking damage is very dangerous. 

And it makes sense. Marble being a mineral and all, it shouldn't just shrink up along with the plant.

[Mike23Ua]

Friendly reminder: I used about 14 marble armors to just walk in and tank Dragonfly without any healing items or kiting.. Marble Armor is OP as heck now..... and ridiculously easy to get.

6 marble for one suit? You can basically get that from just mining one or two statue set pieces found on the map, and the fact it only takes a single marble to craft beans to plant marble trees to reproduce said armor- just means I CAN amass 14 marble armors to take to face tank Dfly with.

Ive had no problems playing as “Nerfed Wes” thanks to things like cheapened costs of marble armor and easy tame beefalo

If Armor costs were reverted back to needing 12 instead of 6... I would not have 14 marble armors to take into a healing item-less fight with Dragonfly.

In fact: Wooden Armor seems pretty useless due to how easy it is to get and reproduce the superior marble ones.

Maybe if your playing in Klei server worlds (which Xbox one does not and has never had) things are different: but when playing completely alone, or with one or two friends there’s plenty of marble to go around.. and waste on things like face-tanking Dfly.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

17 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Friendly reminder: I used about 14 marble armors to just walk in and tank Dragonfly without any healing items or kiting.. Marble Armor is OP as heck now..... and ridiculously easy to get.

you only need arround 2 or 4 fully tanking her depending of the character. With 14 you have for the entire boss repertory of the DS franchise

23 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

OP as heck now

not at all

17 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

If Armor costs were reverted back to needing 12 instead of 6... I would not have 14 marble armors to take into a healing item-less fight with Dragonfly.

you cant tank for an infinity amount of time, doesnt matter if you have 10 or 100 marble armors, at the end you will need healing

18 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

In fact: Wooden Armor seems pretty useless due to how easy it is to get and reproduce the superior marble ones.

wooden armor is superior due to the fact that is an armor to prevent high damage in case you make a mistake kiting meanwhile with marble armor you mostly need to tank which waste the armor and reduce your health

the cost was changed because 12 was too grindy for such situational item (howlvoid said a good scenario were it is worth to be used), with 6 marble for crafting cost you can think about using it more often since early game (when it is more useful than in late)

[Maxil20]

44 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

In fact: Wooden Armor seems pretty useless due to how easy it is to get and reproduce the superior marble ones.

You need to consider the reliability of both armors though. Early on when you don’t have a lot of marble, you certainly wouldn’t want to use all of your armor making marble suits, and will likely rely on log ones. 80% protection is still far more then 0% at the end of the day, and the speed down from marble suits makes a significant difference if you plan to kite the enemy (which you probably won’t with marble suits anyways, but is an option with log suits).

And don’t forget, healing items exist to help make up the lost protection! It certainly is another preparation cost, but it certainly is worth the effort to make sure you stay alive.

46 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

If Armor costs were reverted back to needing 12 instead of 6... I would not have 14 marble armors to take into a healing item-less fight with Dragonfly.

I mean you could, it would just take twice the amount of time : P. At the end of the day, unless they add a new item to the recipe, the marble suit will always serve its use: to specifically be an armor intended to tank any enemy in the game. Even if the cost is higher, it doesn’t take away from that niche. It just would take more time and effort to craft, which isn’t exactly fun.

 

[Echsrick]

and in the end we all just use football helms anyway because packback is too OP and everyone forgets that the durability of armor actualy stacks but that is a lie some say and say its only single player then i will tell you go to together use just a helm take a hit from a spider then take a new helm and wear a wood armor and see how much % it is for both helms so yes armor does stack even if its not the protection