Why I believe the new character may be Charlie and its significance

[HowlVoid]

As always take everything with a grain of salt.

 I have always taken a great interest with the opening animation in DST. The way Charlie is having an inner struggle with "something" embedded inside her. There are a great many valid arguments that can be made as to what that something is; Her inner dark desires, the influence of the Constant, nightmare fueled revenge towards Maxwell, etc. 

 There is a new found similar struggle we find in the Constant. A fight for dominance between the influences of the moon and the dark corruption of all that is nightmare. These two forces counter each other as would the same polar sides of a magnet. 

Warning: Headcannons ahead

  I don't believe these forces to be opposites of each other as you would think of Ying and yang. The "transformation" we see in a star caller staff isn't a transformation at all but rather a cleansing. Sanity meters are converted to enlightenment ones to further convey the concept of an inverted reality. Like oil and water, they go as far as being unable to occupy the same "space". So, why is this important?

  The last Forgotten Knowledge short may have given us a "hint" on how Maxwell, Winnona, and Wilson will save Charlie. They will subject her to lunar forces that will root out the inner darkness within her. However there may be dire consequences for doing this.

Gameplay and story factors

  If Charlie becomes playable then what of the dangers of darkness? 

  I believe the darkness within Charlie has grown strong enough to sustain itself. It may even rob something of Charlie as a way to maintain a corporeal form; possibly her memories. This could be truly dangerous, as we face nightmare incarnate; true evil like never before.

How can we be sure the story will take this turn?

  I am speculating, of course, but I highly doubt they wont try to save Charlie. We saw those 3 characters for a reason. They hold a strong relation to Charlie that is (possibly) not shared by any others. Wilson's is a bit of a mystery, but why was he so relieved to see her? How was he so sure she was not an enemy?

Wont this all take place in the background?

  I think that would be a mistake. A lunar powered Charlie may be the only beacon of hope to stand against the ultimate darkness. As the players, we should be allowed first hand to see the change she (we) make. A perspective that is incredibly important story wise and have only followed in fragments since charlies debut. We have also made background ( in relation to the story; in-game) contributions before, such as getting Wilson on the nightmare throne.

Wont she be too op?

  I think a brand new detriment that enforces a change of playstyle  would be in order to allow her grand powers: An ultimate aversion to darkness. Having a deep trauma or negative "feed back" to the abyss would not be out of place. Having been (by forced?) attuned to the darkness it would make sense for her to have a lesser resistance to it, despite moon powers. How many times do we take the few seconds of immunity to darkness for granted? Leaving and entering out of the range of a morning/polar star? Gathering/fighting on the very edges of any given light radius? It would be fitting for Charlie to be instantly defeated if she would to ever expose herself, irregardless of armor. Possibly experiencing "episodes" of Nightmare cycles above ground as she struggles to grasp the reality of who she is. Taking more damage from nightmare creatures and/or occasionally being target by them as the power of the moon shifts between its stages. A constant beckoning from both inner and outer forces compelling her to return to the throne.

 

 

Tl;DR: Wilson, Maxwell and Winona use Lunar magic to save Charlie consequently unleashing dark forces on the world (replacing her with an evil "version"). It would be very disappointing not to experience the resulting chaos first hand from Charlie's perspective.

[Rylanor]

I think that Charlie MIGHT become playable at the end of RoT like Maxwell in original Dont Starve, but i doubt it. Someone should be at Nightmare throne always, and we didnt seen anyone taking that place from her, so i think new character will be Wagstaff (since his history is moody after Winona Short) or brand new dlc character (almost sure in this)

[LinknAllie]

She probably will be a playable character or NPC eventually but I doubt they would kick her off the throne yet.   I personally think that Wagstaff will be added next because of the machine from roadmap 2021.  Only he could build something like that and he is the biggest plot hole in the series right now.  He and Winona were pulled into the portal only minutes apart and he isn't in DST yet.

[DarkPulse91]

She has been getting a lot of focus in the trailers lately. And they didn't say when the next character was coming out, so it may be after all the RoT updates come out. So yeah I too think it could be Charlie.
And I hope that it is, It will help the lore, and it will be a NEW character, not a reused one.

[Chesmu]

Charlie joining in with the characters would be nice, if we were playing a story-based game that literally ends, like an adventure RPG game; Charlie join in and helps the characters, and also herself, to fight off or realize whoever the others are and stuff like that.

BUT, the game is a sandbox multiplayer and it needs to be a sandbox, to be multiplayer, with an antagonist to keep it interesting; If we move to the next episode, removing Charlie as the dark one, a new player starting the game will miss on the previous episode, which is why you don't progress this kind of games like that.

[VouMorrer]

i was thinking about this too, mostly becouse the change from the main villian to a playable character already happened with maxwell.

if an ending eventually gets added, i believe is possible for charlie to become playable, and maybe They take control over everything. it would be interesting to see what They would do.

[HowlVoid]

1 minute ago, Chesmu said:

Charlie joining in with the characters would be nice, if we were playing a story-based game that literally ends, like an adventure RPG game; Charlie join in and helps the characters, and also herself, to fight off or realize whoever the others are and stuff like that.

BUT, the game is a sandbox multiplayer and it needs to a sandbox multiplayer, with an antagonist to keep it interesting; If we move to the next episode, removing Charlie as the dark one, a new player starting the game will miss on the previous episode, which is why you don't progress this kind of games like that.

Maxwell was at one point the main antagonist only to be made playable later. Charlie would still hold a presence on the throne if she where to be fractured in the way I described.

[Chesmu]

8 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Maxwell was at one point the main antagonist only to be made playable later. Charlie would still hold a presence on the throne if she where to be fractured in the way I described.

Yes, and that was a one time event, and actually the ending of main story-line at the singleplayer game DS; that means Klei had it planned for Charlie to remain the antagonist and Maxwell to lose the position.

I'm not sure how much fun it would be to repeat that loop; we need something unique, and also something old, dark and familiar to be always there, like Charlie, to keep the originality and history of it all.

Edit: There must be a trick here tho,

Spoiler

Charlie doesn't seem to be herself, it's like something is possessing it, which means we could see her being released of that somehow and find out that cure/whatever , was actually the "Others".

If that is the case, we may see another old enemy become friend.

[HowlVoid]

8 minutes ago, Chesmu said:

Yes, and that was a one time event, and actually the ending of main story-line at the singleplayer game DS; that means Klei had it planned for Charlie to remain the antagonist and Maxwell to lose the position.

I'm not sure how much fun it would be to repeat that loop; we need something unique, and also something old, dark and familiar to be always there, like Charlie, to keep the originality and history of it all.

I think repetition is an important theme in the game actually! The ancients used dark magics only to find themselves corrupted. Our survivers have all tempted themselves with similar pursuits for power. 

How many times has this game been played out by "them" and how many people have assumed the role of conduit? Maxwell surely has not been the only one; we have enough lore to know there was a before. Chess pieces are a repeating theme thought the game, it is established we are the pawns. 

Repetition does not have to equal boring or played out.

[1bubbainpa]

I’m not sure, it just doesn’t feel “right”.

[Souper]

This might sound weird, but if they do add Charlie, I hope she will have to be earned. Not just with spools, but like something epic must be done. (Whether that be fuelweaver or whatever). I know people can just cheat it with mods and everything, but I feel like she has a lot of hype behind her and it would be kinda lame to release this awesome character that we just unlock automatically or with spools.

[minespatch]

I think Mourier would be the best next throne sitter, being a antithesis to Maxwell. A fraud who uses spiritualism, has a connection to Wendy, might give ptsd to Abigail. I think they can make something of that relatively obscure character.

[Alements]

I am not sure, this would be interesting, but this would make an advancement that would be more appropriate for a sequel, as it is a major development, story wise and gameplay wise

[Mike23Ua]

21 minutes ago, Souper said:

This might sound weird, but if they do add Charlie, I hope she will have to be earned. Not just with spools, but like something epic must be done. (Whether that be fuelweaver or whatever). I know people can just cheat it with mods and everything, but I feel like she has a lot of hype behind her and it would be kinda lame to release this awesome character that we just unlock automatically or with spools.

If Charlie ends up being as powerful as I pray they make her (being able to switch mobs and things in the environment and herself between a Light and a Dark Stance...) Then She would have to be something you earn and not just buy directly.

A small example: In human form she can turn Beardling back into Rabbit.. and In Dark Form, she can turn Rabbit into Beardling.

How It Works: Remember that Glass Canon mechanic that was once on Wendy? (Of course you do..) Well Exactly like that: Shes Human and basically an even more boring Winona at full health, but let her health start to drop below 40/30/20/5% etc... And her Dark side takes over and the shadows protect her from death (and also unlocks some pretty darn cool shadow powers)

This Game in its entirety has A LOT of items that have both Light.. and Dark versions (Flowers, Evil Flowers, Pigmen, Werepig, Chester, Shadow Chester the list goes on and on and on...)

Imagine being able to manipulate those light and dark stances between objects and mobs at your own will.

I think as a character that has to be EARNED to play as... the Glass Canon Mechanic would work extremely well on her: Because in order to even unlock her you’d have to be decently skilled enough.

And.... As Maxwell has shown: Anyone who has once sit upon the throne has some lingering side effects.

For Charlie in Particular: I don’t think she’ll ever be 100% Just Human again..

[Toros]

Title is “why I think the next character will be Charlie” and the OP provides no actual reasoning or points to any evidence as to why that would be the case.

If anything having Charlie split would be against what we’ve seen from Charlie in the ANR trailer.  After taking the throne she merged her light amd dark sides into a new form.

Why would she split now?

[HowlVoid]

24 minutes ago, Toros said:

Title is “why I think the next character will be Charlie” and the OP provides no actual reasoning or points to any evidence as to why that would be the case.

If anything having Charlie split would be against what we’ve seen from Charlie in the ANR trailer.  After taking the throne she merged her light amd dark sides into a new form.

Why would she split now?

Yeah I did, based on the way the story is progressing so far. Based on how we see the moon influencing the constant. It was mostly implied. My take is that it is foreshadowing future events where Charlie could develop a similar "change". Despite all my disclaimers that it was simply a theory based on headcannons you want me to provide concrete proof? 

I am also taking her merging as further foreshadowing that she can change forms. She has gone a change and I believe she may undergo another one to further the plot.

Mind clarifying what you mean by "despite what we have seen"?

There is literally a part where I explain why think the story will progress this way. That saving Charlie may lead to her becoming unlockable.

[Toros]

35 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

Yeah I did, based on the way the story is progressing so far. Based on how we see the moon influencing the constant. It was mostly implied. My take is that it is foreshadowing future events where Charlie could develop a similar "change". Despite all my disclaimers that it was simply a theory based on headcannons you want me to provide concrete proof? 

I am also taking her merging as further foreshadowing that she can change forms. She has gone a change and I believe she may undergo another one to further the plot.

Mind clarifying what you mean by "despite what we have seen"?

There is literally a part where I explain why think the story will progress this way. That saving Charlie may lead to her becoming unlockable.

Except her merging is the opposite of switching forms.  It’s not black or white, but grey.  The ANR short already showed form switching back and forth as Charlie had an internal struggle but the result was fusion and the aesthetic was a blend of both and Charlie’s body language was calm and confident after the merger.

You’re suggesting that would be reversed entirely based on some fanfiction.  I rewatched the Forgotten Knowledge trailer and it looked like Charlie was happy the survivors sparked a conflict between gestalt and shadow, and she herself took out Fuelweaver.

Charlie has a plan and it’s unfolding as she planned things.

[HowlVoid]

30 minutes ago, Toros said:

Except her merging is the opposite of switching forms.  It’s not black or white, but grey.  The ANR short already showed form switching back and forth as Charlie had an internal struggle but the result was fusion and the aesthetic was a blend of both and Charlie’s body language was calm and confident after the merger.

She certainly was, I still don't doubt they could try to save her. We still don't know what exactly she is fusing with. You can tell its a manic Charlie that wants to inflict pain. When she reverts she is confused as if she doesnt know what had just happened. She may have been suffering from dual personality, something had fragmented her mind before. The morf could be reversed. 

Quote

You’re suggesting that would be reversed entirely based on some fanfiction.  

Its a theory and its in the disclaimer. A theory as to why I think shes a probable contender to becoming a character. Many characters in other works of fiction have had their transformation undone despite the new personality appearing seamless.

Quote

I rewatched the Forgotten Knowledge trailer and it looked like Charlie was happy the survivors sparked a conflict between gestalt and shadow, and she herself took out Fuelweaver.

Charlie has a plan and it’s unfolding as she planned things.

It was a simple grin. There's a lot conjecture that can be drawn from that. It sounds to me like you're coming up with a "fanfiction" of your own :P.

I simply took it as "Oh, you saw me did you?" 

[LinknAllie]

11 minutes ago, Toros said:

Except her merging is the opposite of switching forms.  It’s not black or white, but grey.  The ANR short already showed form switching back and forth as Charlie had an internal struggle but the result was fusion and the aesthetic was a blend of both and Charlie’s body language was calm and confident after the merger.

You’re suggesting that would be reversed entirely based on some fanfiction.  I rewatched the Forgotten Knowledge trailer and it looked like Charlie was happy the survivors sparked a conflict between gestalt and shadow, and she herself took out Fuelweaver.

Charlie has a plan and it’s unfolding as she planned things.

Not only that, in the forge trailer she was seen absorbing energy from the ancient portal.  Nothing was ever said about that afterwards. 

3 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

She certainly was, I still don't doubt they could try to save her. We still don't know what exactly she is fusing with. You can tell its a manic Charlie that wants to inflict pain. When she reverts she is confused as if she doesn't know what had just happened. She may have been suffering from dual personality, something had fragmented her mind before.

It's the night creature.  When she was sucked into the constant with Maxwell/William she fused with the night creature while Maxwell was placed on the nightmare throne.

[HowlVoid]

6 minutes ago, LinknAllie said:

Not only that, in the forge trailer she was seen absorbing energy from the ancient portal.  Nothing was ever said about that afterwards. 

Oh good catch! I didn't notice that... I wonder if the portal will become relevant again in the future...

Quote

It's the night creature.  When she was sucked into the constant with Maxwell/William she fused with the night creature while Maxwell was placed on the nightmare throne.

So it is an outside entity? Isn't that more of a reason to try and split them? I still believe moon energy could do that. Maybe Wagstaff could build it? He knows more about the constant than the other survivors. Maybe he can free Charlie? Or bind the night creature to himself and be the next antagonist. Like when Wilson and Maxwell swapped.

[Well-met]

I would like this only because I'm curious how Klei would design her player graphics.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

I dont know if i like the idea. Isnt original since will be the same that happen with maxwell (saving him and later be trapped in the constant too) and we will need a new night monster+a new throne owner

[Cheggf]

In addition to what everyone else has said, Charlie has always been what harms you when you're in the dark. Even back when Maxwell was on the nightmare throne she was the evil hiding in the shadows. Maxwell leaving the nightmare throne was simple since he was just the one sitting on the throne and pulling people in the constant. Charlie is the one on the throne, Charlie is the one in the dark, Charlie is the one plotting schemes. She would have to lose her 8 year long role as the darkness danger and be replaced with someone else who would no doubt be much less interesting and I bet if it happened all they'd do is change Maxwell's quote from the magnificent "Charlie? It's me! Maxwell!" to something generic like everyone else has. 

[TemporarySolutn]

On 2/6/2021 at 6:02 PM, HowlVoid said:

As always take everything with a grain of salt.

 I have always taken a great interest with the opening animation in DST. The way Charlie is having an inner struggle with "something" embedded inside her. There are a great many valid arguments that can be made as to what that something is; Her inner dark desires, the influence of the Constant, nightmare fueled revenge towards Maxwell, etc. 

 There is a new found similar struggle we find in the Constant. A fight for dominance between the influences of the moon and the dark corruption of all that is nightmare. These two forces counter each other as would the same polar sides of a magnet. 

Warning: Headcannons ahead

  I don't believe these forces to be opposites of each other as you would think of Ying and yang. The "transformation" we see in a star caller staff isn't a transformation at all but rather a cleansing. Sanity meters are converted to enlightenment ones to further convey the concept of an inverted reality. Like oil and water, they go as far as being unable to occupy the same "space". So, why is this important?

  The last Forgotten Knowledge short may have given us a "hint" on how Maxwell, Winnona, and Wilson will save Charlie. They will subject her to lunar forces that will root out the inner darkness within her. However there may be dire consequences for doing this.

Gameplay and story factors

  If Charlie becomes playable then what of the dangers of darkness? 

  I believe the darkness within Charlie has grown strong enough to sustain itself. It may even rob something of Charlie as a way to maintain a corporeal form; possibly her memories. This could be truly dangerous, as we face nightmare incarnate; true evil like never before.

How can we be sure the story will take this turn?

  I am speculating, of course, but I highly doubt they wont try to save Charlie. We saw those 3 characters for a reason. They hold a strong relation to Charlie that is (possibly) not shared by any others. Wilson's is a bit of a mystery, but why was he so relieved to see her? How was he so sure she was not an enemy?

Wont this all take place in the background?

  I think that would be a mistake. A lunar powered Charlie may be the only beacon of hope to stand against the ultimate darkness. As the players, we should be allowed first hand to see the change she (we) make. A perspective that is incredibly important story wise and have only followed in fragments since charlies debut. We have also made background ( in relation to the story; in-game) contributions before, such as getting Wilson on the nightmare throne.

Wont she be too op?

  I think a brand new detriment that enforces a change of playstyle  would be in order to allow her grand powers: An ultimate aversion to darkness. Having a deep trauma or negative "feed back" to the abyss would not be out of place. Having been (by forced?) attuned to the darkness it would make sense for her to have a lesser resistance to it, despite moon powers. How many times do we take the few seconds of immunity to darkness for granted? Leaving and entering out of the range of a morning/polar star? Gathering/fighting on the very edges of any given light radius? It would be fitting for Charlie to be instantly defeated if she would to ever expose herself, irregardless of armor. Possibly experiencing "episodes" of Nightmare cycles above ground as she struggles to grasp the reality of who she is. Taking more damage from nightmare creatures and/or occasionally being target by them as the power of the moon shifts between its stages. A constant beckoning from both inner and outer forces compelling her to return to the throne.

 

 

Tl;DR: Wilson, Maxwell and Winona use Lunar magic to save Charlie consequently unleashing dark forces on the world (replacing her with an evil "version"). It would be very disappointing not to experience the resulting chaos first hand from Charlie's perspective.

quit asking what silhouette I confused myself but im still like very% sure its gonna be wagstaff

[TheGoldenDonut_]

I'm all for it if she is unlockable. This game is missing unlockable characters.