warbucks is gone

[. . .]

20 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

I could have sworn that people weren't this fond of Warbucks while he was playable. He was there, he was comically sunburnt, whatever. Did his deletion stir up latent passion for sunburnt old explorers within your souls?

warbucks is gone

[Retty]

I think this has been a very interesting argument to watch.

I know I don't have a lot of posts, but that's just because I'm a lurker. I've enjoyed Don't Starve for many years. I lurked the forum without an account for awhile, then made an account a few years ago and then just lurked mostly. That's just a clarification. I'm not like a newbie or something.

Anyway I like Warbucks, I'm not entirely happy he's removed, but... The problem is easy solved with a mod. The mod is good, it works and is easy to use. I've been observing and it's so strange to me to watch people paint this picture of people who are happy with Warbucks being gone as being "easily offended". When I look at what's been going on in the forums, I see many posts and topics about how mad people are Warbucks is gone. In contrast, the people who disliked Warbucks never rallied to have him removed. Maybe they did? It's not like I'm on the forums constantly, ha ha. But I've never seen them constantly make tons of posts and topics about this. I've never seen people who dislike Warbucks making a huge fuss. A few comments is all I've ever seen. They never made a huge mob to swarm Klei. The True Warbucks Outrage didn't start until he was removed. How are the people who dislike Warbucks considered easily offended when they just sort of... quietly tolerated him for so long? People say "if you don't like Warbucks just ignore him" and that's what they did. And now that he's gone, the people who want to play Warbucks have an easy solution. We just use the mod. It's not like you can't continue to easily play him. I think the people who are mad at Warbucks being removed seem more offended and outraged personally.

People can claim Klei has been "censored" or whatever, but when you have been a fan of this game for a long time you can remember the game has gone through many, many changes. Character ideas never implemented, gameplay designs altered and changed... Klei playing around with an idea, deciding they don't like it and removing or changing it... That's not new. It's true we've never had a character removed before, but plenty of other stuff has been added, removed, changed.... The people who dislike Warbucks didn't force Klei to do anything. Klei choose to make this change for their own reasons. And I respect that. I respect Klei. This is their game, they can choose the characters that are in it. Klei does a lot of great stuff for the community at a fair price and it always sort of bothers me how often people complain about the stuff Klei does. I think we can be more grateful. So many other gaming companies are not so nice and don't care about their userbase so much. It's admittedly part of why I don't post here too much, it bothers me when people tank on Klei's choices too much.

I agree with the idea that the game already has a lot of dark and immoral elements. And Warbucks had his distasteful lines removed already. I think the character fits in, personally. But like....

It's Klei's choice. Which they made freely. They weren't censored? Changing the game is very normal especially when the game is in early access. Warbucks fans can use the mod. With the mod it's like he never left. It's fine and it may be a good idea to try to calm down and not get upset over such a tiny thing.

As a side note it's interesting how people didn't really seem to care for Warbucks before but now suddenly we have all these people saying he's the best. I almost think that to some people this isn't really about Warbucks as much as is that people think they're fighting censorship, which I don't think is the case. I really don't think this was Klei being forced to censor themselves.

Anyway as I said earlier in another post I don't have any interest in arguing, I just thought maybe there was a chance I should throw all these words out there hoping that maybe some people chill out. But I also know plenty of people will choose to be outraged no mater what anyone says.

[SkylordElberich]

5 minutes ago, Retty said:

I think this has been a very interesting argument to watch.

I know I don't have a lot of posts, but that's just because I'm a lurker. I've enjoyed Don't Starve for many years. I lurked the forum without an account for awhile, then made an account a few years ago and then just lurked mostly. That's just a clarification. I'm not like a newbie or something.

Anyway I like Warbucks, I'm not entirely happy he's removed, but... The problem is easy solved with a mod. The mod is good, it works and is easy to use. I've been observing and it's so strange to me to watch people paint this picture of people who are happy with Warbucks being gone as being "easily offended". When I look at what's been going on in the forums, I see many posts and topics about how mad people are Warbucks is gone. In contrast, the people who disliked Warbucks never rallied to have him removed. Maybe they did? It's not like I'm on the forums constantly, ha ha. But I've never seen them constantly make tons of posts and topics about this. I've never seen people who dislike Warbucks making a huge fuss. A few comments is all I've ever seen. They never made a huge mob to swarm Klei. The True Warbucks Outrage didn't start until he was removed. How are the people who dislike Warbucks considered easily offended when they just sort of... quietly tolerated him for so long? People say "if you don't like Warbucks just ignore him" and that's what they did. And now that he's gone, the people who want to play Warbucks have an easy solution. We just use the mod. It's not like you can't continue to easily play him. I think the people who are mad at Warbucks being removed seem more offended and outraged personally.

People can claim Klei has been "censored" or whatever, but when you have been a fan of this game for a long time you can remember the game has gone through many, many changes. Character ideas never implemented, gameplay designs altered and changed... Klei playing around with an idea, deciding they don't like it and removing or changing it... That's not new. It's true we've never had a character removed before, but plenty of other stuff has been added, removed, changed.... The people who dislike Warbucks didn't force Klei to do anything. Klei choose to make this change for their own reasons. And I respect that. I respect Klei. This is their game, they can choose the characters that are in it. Klei does a lot of great stuff for the community at a fair price and it always sort of bothers me how often people complain about the stuff Klei does. I think we can be more grateful. So many other gaming companies are not so nice and don't care about their userbase so much. It's admittedly part of why I don't post here too much, it bothers me when people tank on Klei's choices too much.

I agree with the idea that the game already has a lot of dark and immoral elements. And Warbucks had his distasteful lines removed already. (I wouldn't like him so much if he kept those lines...) I think the character fits in, personally. But like....

It's Klei's choice. Which they made freely. They weren't censored? Changing the game is very normal especially when the game is in early access. Warbucks fans can use the mod. With the mod it's like he never left. It's fine and it may be a good idea to try to calm down and not get upset over such a tiny thing.

As a side note it's interesting how people didn't really seem to care for Warbucks before but now suddenly we have all these people saying he's the best. I almost think that to some people this isn't really about Warbucks as much as is that people think they're fighting censorship, which I don't think is the case. I really don't think this was Klei being forced to censor themselves.

Anyway as I said earlier in another post I don't have any interest in arguing, I just thought maybe there was a chance I should throw all these words out there hoping that maybe some people chill out. But I also know plenty of people will choose to be outraged no mater what anyone says.

I gonna be completely honest here. I couldn't give a flying one if they removed him for reasons of sensitivity, or because they just couldn't get his perks right. The fact they removed him in the first place just rubbed me the wrong way. As SuperDavid said above:

15 minutes ago, SuperDavid said:

People don't realize how precious something truly was until they lose it.

I will still campaign for his return, and always will... but, hey, guess I'll just have to get used to the mod for now.

God, this whole argument's tiring me out.

[. . .]

20 hours ago, Retty said:

Anyway I like Warbucks, I'm not entirely happy he's removed, but... The problem is easy solved with a mod. The mod is good, it works and is easy to use.

warbucks is gone

[Retty]

2 minutes ago, SkylordElberich said:

I gonna be completely honest here. I couldn't give a flying one if they removed him for reasons of sensitivity, or because they just couldn't get his perks right. The fact they removed him in the first place just rubbed me the wrong way.

I will still campaign for his return, and always will... but, hey, guess I'll just have to get used to the mod for now.

God, this whole argument's tiring me out.

I can honestly definitely sympathize with you, dude. Like most of my favorite characters in the game are characters that a lot of people like to hate on. Characters with "bad" perks. (I'm a huge Walani and Wes lover. I also like Wionna a lot!) And like, it would be heart-breaking if for some reason one of my favs was just. Gone. After appearing in trailers even. It is an odd choice to axe Warbucks after he appeared in a trailer, definitely. Fictional characters can mean a lot to people! You can make a deep personal connection with the character in a video game! Video games are art and art resonates with people.

But ultimately human people are more important than fake video game characters. No one should be insulting or angry at anyone because of a fake video game character.

People who are upset about a character they like being removed don't deserve to be insulted and neither do people who were hurt by the character. I kind of don't think anyone is wrong for being upset and no one deserves to be made to feel like their feelings don't matter. What's bad is lashing out at other people and trying to hurt them in defense of a video game. That's not a cool thing to do, hurting real people.

But... Yeah. It's very normal for Klei to make big changes during early access and it's a bad idea to get too attached to stuff in early access... There's a lot of changes made with Shipwrecked I wasn't happy about, ha ha. I try not to play early access anymore because it's frustrating for stuff you love to change. I get that. But it's a risk of early access. This kind of thing has happened before....

That's about all I have to say about it, I guess. I hope everyone feels better eventually. Making a fuss and going to war at each other in the forums doesn't help, but understanding your fellow human beings is super cool to do if possible. If people are really upset and really tired with this argument, it's always a good idea to step away and do something you like to chill.

[4 Da LOLs]

11 minutes ago, SuperDavid said:

Modding should never be the answer to fix something which wasn't broken.

 

Now there may not be many topics on how "offensive" Warbucks was, but trust me that he was removed because of even the few posts which people said they were offended.

I've seen many game companies go down this road of censoring their own content when even 1 person complains. This is because they don't want it to become a big deal, all it takes is a couple of these "social justice warriors" to go and spread hate and misinformation about your company on every social media to exist about how everythingphobic you are for including ____ or not including ____  in their products and they will throw fits until they get what they want unless the company has enough backbone to stand up for them self and their creations, like Rockstar Games.

I assume Klei did not want any drama to spread on the twitter and every single social media to exist about how they included a character which is "racist" to pigs and took the easy way out by removing Warbucks, but what they didn't take into account is that the people who want and liked Warbucks would get angry instead as we people who have our games censored usually don't speak out and we let the vocal minorities make all our decisions for us.

Though, now did Warbucks was removed I just couldn't take it anymore. I have played many games which have had content removed because of these people which complain how much they took offense to something and I thoroughly enjoy Don't Starve and seeing Klei as potentially becoming one of those companies which bend the knee to the "social justice warriors" and will remove any content that they find offense to it worries me because I really don't want that to happen...

I just can't sit back and watch this unfold without trying to do something to prevent it, if Klei really removed Warbucks because he was boring then there is no problem adding him back him back because people don't want content removed, especially something as important as a character.

I know and its not like Klei just didn't like them just don't touch the character but no they removed him that truly shows the true motive behind his removal i hate S.J.W. 's  they are nothing but entitled and go out and intentionally get offended because they know that's the were they get there political power like inquisitors who then get the doxxers to remove all opposition to there goals

[. . .]

19 hours ago, Retty said:

Making a fuss and going to war at each other in the forums doesn't help, but understanding your fellow human beings is super cool to do if possible. If people are really upset and really tired with this argument, it's always a good idea to step away and do something you like to chill.

warbucks is gone

[4 Da LOLs]

Just now, SuperDavid said:

This thread is all about getting people and hopefully Klei to realize that Warbucks should not have been removed and that he should be brought back as soon as possible! Thankfully everyone who replied in this thread has been nothing, but respectful and positive and I am truly glad for that it gives me hope that with such a good community we can get Warbucks back very soon if we stand united together.

im backing you up, brother!

[SkylordElberich]

3 minutes ago, SuperDavid said:

This thread is all about getting people and hopefully Klei to realize that Warbucks should not have been removed and that he should be brought back as soon as possible! Thankfully everyone who replied in this thread has been nothing, but respectful and positive and I am truly glad for that it gives me hope that with such a good community we can get Warbucks back very soon if we stand united together.

One can only hope.

[. . .]

warbucks is gone

[SkylordElberich]

Just now, SuperDavid said:

Well, my friends it seems Warbucks is gone for good with official confirmation by Klei.

I was probably too optimistic to think we had a chance to get him back as now that I think about it I don't recall there ever being a time where people where able to ever get good things back into a game, only have them removed.

It annoys me that the world over the years has become such a touchy place, but oh well..

All we can do now is wait for a mod that adds the real Warbucks back into the game, so all hope it not lost!

I thank you all for fighting alongside me, my friends! We may lost Warbucks, but the true soul of the character before it was censored will live within us all and will never be forgotten, thank you.

I think there already is a mod for that.

[Atsumame]

I was gonna say that now the poll is way better now and that I did make my vote. But....yeah recent events happened.

[Izuku_Midoriya]

I don’t get why they’d go through with this decision when the poll shows most people want it back

[Maslak]

Earth. Year 23XX. 40 years ago human resistance force finally managed to win terrible, bloody war against machines that took tons of lives. 
Someone found old stash of video games and picked one called Don't Starve. After playing for a while they unlocked new character, WX-78.
Oh no it's a robot that wants to kill everyone this is terrible and beyond any good taste!

[. . .]

18 hours ago, Izuku_Midoriya said:

I don’t get why they’d go through with this decision when the poll shows most people want it back

warbucks is gone

[ucw]

1 hour ago, Retty said:

People who are upset about a character they like being removed don't deserve to be insulted and neither do people who were hurt by the character.

Well, you just summed up the most important part of the debate, perhaps, oh wise one!

[Maslak]

Jokes aside, I don't like the way David presents his opinions here, but I mostly agree with everything said. What I can't understand the most is the artstyle argument. How did Warbucks not fit? I would gladly see some sprite rework, sure, but to make his hair look more like an actual hair or generally making him resemble his portrait more. But that's it. The orange (tan) skin + white hair thing looked really nice.

[minespatch]

5 minutes ago, Maslak said:

but to make his hair look more like an actual hair or generally making him resemble his portrait more.

Yeah, focus on what they showed in the promo art and trailers, and I think l Warbucks could return.-

[Atsumame]

For you people who have still a Warbucks save file still available, here's something you can do to be able to play forever as warbucks.

Make a skyworthy and send him into Rog. Do adventure mode and clear it so he sit on the nightmare throne. 

You can now swap to him whenever you please and play him on as many saves as you want while still not using mods or cheats. It takes longer to set up than every character but it's possible.

[Monkey Cups]

Just now, Atsumame said:

For you people who have still a Warbucks save file still available, here's something you can do to be able to play forever as warbucks.

Make a skyworthy and send him into Rog. Do adventure mode and clear it so he sit on the nightmare throne. 

You can now swap to him whenever you please and play him on as many saves as you want while still not using mods or cheats. It takes longer to set up than every character but it's possible.

An alternative to that would be using console commands.

[Atsumame]

2 hours ago, Xehanightmare said:

An alternative to that would be using console commands.

This is why I said "no mods or cheats", cheats being console commands in this case.

This is a solution only for people that wish to keep him while being purist.

[watermelen671]

17 hours ago, __IvoCZE__ said:

Are you sure about that?

East India Company? any ring a ding dings?

He mentions the Honorable East India Company, not that he worked for it.

It was a symbol of British pride in the era...

Ya wanna know what else the Honorable East India Company did? Smuggle Opium into China and kick off two wars because of it, and molding China into what it is today because of the Century of Shame it brought, which has become indistinguishably interwoven into the Chinese culture.

But I don't see y'all complaining about THAT.

Spoiler

Also Warbucks is the only one that's offensive? We got:

• An Ethically Compromised "Scientist" (Animal Abuser)
• An Arsonist WHO KILLED HER PARENTS AND EVERYBODY AT HER ORPHANAGE
• A Walking Suicidal Emo Stereotype (And a Necromaniac)
• Terminators
• Realistic depictions of Psychosis
• Split Personality Disorder
• Freaking Vore
• Don Quixote level of LARPing gone too far
• Casual References to self-harm
• False Imprisonment
• We got bastardization of Aztec-esque rituals to delay a world ending events
• PC Shakespeare, even though the dude was extremely racist and didn't hide that in his writing
• Casual sexism (not one of the original female Starving cast wears pants)
• Gender Inequality (7 females to 10 males, and only 1 NB)
• Casual stereotyping (Warly is a chef and OF COURSE IS ALSO FRENCH!)
• Non-Inclusivity 

Only two (maybe 3 because I'm unsure about Woodlegs) characters are actually characters of color, all the rest of them are pasty whities.

• Casual Skin Darkening

But you see what I mean? If you look hard at anything you're bound to find so many things to be offended at! But I don't hear anybody caterwauling about these things!

Also, I don't know what y'all are moaning about in terms of Warbuck's coloring scheme...I mean it kinda fits with the bright color palettes of all of the other Hamlet characters.

I mean...if you were to whiten his skin to match all of the other characters you'd get something horrifying.

Spoiler

Which I now want to make.

 

[Maslak]

7 hours ago, watermelen671 said:

Don Quixote level of LARPing gone too far

God I'm dying

[axxel]

I didn't read all posts but I could tell that Warbucks' removal was unnecessary. Culturally, he represented a colonialist - I am fine with that. Enough people pointed out that we can play the life-hating robot and the first evil mastermind. I don't mind his perks, I am playing Willow in DST for years and I can tell what it's like to play a rather bland and a hated character, however Willow was (gladly) not removed. I dunno why people argue about his design, it's ok. DS hadn't a criteria list what art style does fit or not. There are several artists working on DS, everyone with their personal art style. I mean I don't mutter about how Wolgangs chin is changing in every skin artwork. 

[TurtleKitty]

This poll is biased and inaccurate. The only options which go against the opinions  validated by the pollmaker are slated in an insulting manner to portray anyone voting against Warbucks in some form as uncaring or malicious. Therefore making someone vote inaccurately to their viewpoint or not be able to vote due to a lack of representation. 

An inverse of this would be to make a poll showing all the points of Warbucks being removed and painting the pro-Warbucks options as something along the lines of "I don't care that Warbucks is racist"  "I don't want fixed gameplay I just want my Caucasian male character"  "Warbucks should replace Wormwood whom I hate immensely". You see how unfair that is? That would mean any pro-Warbucks voter would need to put themselves in a category they don't fit or be silenced from voting entirely. 

Personally I wouldn't mind Warbucks returning either in Hamlet, DST, or some future expansion, reworked to have an interesting playstyle and perhaps show a repentant colonialist dedicated to exploration and preservation.