56933043043 Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 2 hours ago, Masked_Misery said: I would welcome a 25-50% damage nerf for either Wendy or Abigail during the day to encourage teamwork between them. Abigail's damage actually varies depending on the time of day. If I remember correctly, she does 10 damage at day, 20 at dusk, 40 at night. This has been a perk of Abigail since she was introduced in the original Don't Starve. 2 hours ago, Masked_Misery said: Wendy has always been my main character because of her personality and age, and I have generally found that Abigail is simply the bomb. She can slaughter hordes of most basic mobs, even in broad daylight, and at night she has saved me from herds of entire Beefalo I accidentally provoked. I actually resent it since, Abigail also removes an aspect of the game; singular combat. You end up depending on her, and while it makes it interesting when she gets banished and you have to wait for awhile; in general, it seems like Wendy's damage reduction is seriously not enough to justify Abigail. Wendy is meant for support, but other then her mild sanity resistance she really isn't support. She's just the living sister of the mega hyper tank character that happens to be dead. I would welcome a 25-50% damage nerf for either Wendy or Abigail during the day to encourage teamwork between them. The characters weren't designed with multiplayer roles in mind. They all came from an uncompromising single-player experience, and most of them (bar Maxwell and Willow) haven't changed much from that game. 1 hour ago, Masked_Misery said: Wendy really is not either of these things. Abigail actively plays the game for her, and there is no real sacrifice for this that is meaningful. It is an uncompromising wilderness survival game, easy mode is a mod. On every level, the existence of a character that is meant to be a crutch is a contradiction of what the developers encourage. Not balanced. What are your thoughts on Maxwell? The character that can create shadow puppets to chop down/mine/dig up items for him and last until they die? Is he unbalanced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanAzej Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Stop suggesting character nerfs, we don't need any more of those. Willow/Warly are the main examples of characters who got overnerfed (and now are boring/useless) because of dumb suggestions. Abigail is for swarms of weaker mobs, anything else will kill her sooner or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starlogy Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 inb4 last anr patch nerfs wendy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroely Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 inb4 this becomes the new "Wigfrid is considered OP? Why...?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochilo Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Wendy should be able to summon four abigails and make them able to cook for you and equip them axes to chop trees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minespatch Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 1 hour ago, PanAzej said: Stop suggesting character nerfs, we don't need any more of those. I'd prefer balances instead of nerfs to be honest. Wilson is a good character to start with, so a shame that characters like Willow and Wes haven't gotten their tweaks yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starlogy Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 17 minutes ago, minespatch said: wes got tweak Wes? Tweaks?? You smokin somethin minespatch???? Wes is the literal best character in the game, and no one can stop him. His appetite for honor and glory reaches out to all of us, and a man brave enough to tame the mighty Wes should be saluted, in the battlefield, and in the game. If any tweaks need to be done, it should be that characters who stand idle by Wes should bow down like he's wearing a Bee Queen hat, but he won't have to wear the Bee Queen hat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroely Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 3 hours ago, mochilo said: Wendy should be able to summon four abigails and make them able to cook for you and equip them axes to chop trees. AoE chopping power? I'll stop making meaningless posts now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeruul Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Will this be another "[Character] is OP! Why....?" - Episode 3? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electroely Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 14 minutes ago, Zeruul said: Will this be another "[Character] is OP! Why....?" - Episode 3? Spoiler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsPizzaTime Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Funny thing is, Wolfgang when fully buffed probably outputs more damage than a wendy and an abigail on a single target entity. Does that mean he needs to be nerfed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masked_Misery Posted February 24, 2017 Author Share Posted February 24, 2017 Well, ignoring the children who just scream at people who talk about nerfs; instead of acknowledging my points like a developed organism; the premise of this thread has already been resolved. I typed up a continuation thread to discuss the outcome of this one, but of course nobody has posted on it. They all came here because they can whine, because that is such a valuable social contribution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochilo Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 47 minutes ago, Zeruul said: Will this be another "[Character] is OP! Why....?" - Episode 3? It already is!! Wolfgang peoples arrived!! 15 minutes ago, ItsPizzaTime said: Funny thing is, Wolfgang when fully buffed probably outputs more damage than a wendy and an abigail on a single target entity. Does that mean he needs to be nerfed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowDuelist Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 9 hours ago, Arlesienne said: The thing is, if you're a player beyond the wide-eyed newcomer stage, Abigail becomes more of a nuisance. To me this is the one and only answer needed to this thread. Wendy has something going for her that is decent, very specific and limited to some uses; and a big penalty to damage against enemies Abigail is useless with, which are the ones that count the most in long term games (bosses, treeguards, spider queens, etc). Even smaller mobs like hounds or depth worms eventually swarm you in numbers and require traps, others mobs, or powerful fighting characters (Wig, Wolf, WX) to be dealt with. In very long term games, her sanity resistance is probably the most useful thing she'll take advantage of. 9 hours ago, Sinister_Fang said: At least Abigail is useful. Unlike a certain someone's shadow duelists. This too. Abigail is the only reliable permanent summoned fighter/tank you can have. At least until (and If) duelists are fixed. It's still okay given that she has a big penalty to compensate. I really hope the multiple flowers thing does not get patched, as it's the only way I've found Abigail to prove useful in lategame: Summon Abigail, use her for whatever she's needed, then despawn her, and instead of having to wait 3 days for that flower to become active, always have another ready-to-summon flower with you for her next use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masked_Misery Posted February 24, 2017 Author Share Posted February 24, 2017 1 minute ago, ShadowDuelist said: I really hope the multiple flowers thing does not get patched, as it's the only way I've found Abigail to prove useful in lategame: Summon Abigail, use her for whatever she's needed, then despawn her, and instead of having to wait 3 days for that flower to become active, always have another ready-to-summon flower with you for her next use. You should check out my topic A Better Abigail then for sure, as it proposes the idea of Abigail being redesigned to be more of an on-demand companion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsPizzaTime Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Masked_Misery said: Well, ignoring the children who just scream at people who talk about nerfs; instead of acknowledging my points like a developed organism; the premise of this thread has already been resolved. I typed up a continuation thread to discuss the outcome of this one, but of course nobody has posted on it. They all came here because they can whine, because that is such a valuable social contribution. At this point I would be surprised if anyone really wanted to have a "civil" discussion with you because of how passive-aggressive you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeadatrix Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 I'm gonna have to go with Masked on this one. We have Wigfrid and Wolf, both living warriors but the girl who seems to kill the most things on the server is usually Wendy. It doesn't matter how one uses her, I feel that they need to lower Abigail's damage a notch. Just a thought. This is coming from a Wilson main BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeklo Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 2 minutes ago, Mikeadatrix said: I'm gonna have to go with Masked on this one. We have Wigfrid and Wolf, both living warriors but the girl who seems to kill the most things on the server is usually Wendy. It doesn't matter how one uses her, I feel that they need to lower Abigail's damage a notch. Just a thought. Quality over quantity though. They're good with swarms yes, but that's like bees, spiders, and smaller groups of frogs and hounds. When it comes to big bad enemies. They come short. Disclaimer- As a Wendy player bias may exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeadatrix Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Just now, Zeklo said: Quality over quantity though. They're good with swarms yes, but that's like bees, spiders, and smaller groups of frogs and hounds. When it comes to big bad enemies. They come short. Disclaimer- As a Wendy player bias may exist. 3 Yeah. I understand. Since I basically never play Wendy and have only seen experienced players use her, maybe I'm biased as well! Honestly, unneeded nerfs kill good characters. I say leave her the way she is, yeah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamBatter Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 12 hours ago, Masked_Misery said: Wilson is meant to be the easiest character, no downsides; which is why he is the start. Every other character after is supposed to be unlocked by playing, meaning they are not designed to be easier because by now the player is already experienced. And thus, the characters fundamentally are meant to provide variety and or challenge. Wilson appears to be more of an introduction to the harshness of the world, as his perks are barely noticeable. Newer players likely won't know about or be capable of making a reliable supply of Meat Effigies, and will still probably die to freezing even with the insulation. I also don't agree with the proposed smaller sacrifice and special cooldowns. For the previous, it looks like the original intention of the sanity drop is to have you combat Shadow Creatures with 25% damage output reduction. For the latter, it looks like unnecessary micromanagement that almost makes Abigail not worth summoning (and also indirectly buffs Wilson). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamBatter Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Also Abigail was indirectly nerfed when things got HPx2. And given that you're dealing with single targets, the combination of Dark Sword Wendy (51=68-17) and Abigail (10|20|40) should roughly average x1.00 damage for the normal player. AoE and tanking are bonuses offset by Abigail's downtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochilo Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 I love how Abigail kamikaze on every tentacle she ever spots. They should add quotes like the pigmen ones, but like "ABIGAIL LOVES TENTACLE!!" and "Hey Wendy I'll stay here with the dudes come later to pick my flower up". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pruinae Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 I just want Abigail dancing when Wendy starts to dance, like Maxwell and his shadow minions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leonseye Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 Babysitting Abigail 24/7 is a pretty huge drawback, imo. Also, if you want something like this, I think it would better fit into a mod, as most people like Wendy the way she is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanAzej Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 4 hours ago, Masked_Misery said: Well, ignoring the children who just scream at people who talk about nerfs; instead of acknowledging my points like a developed organism; the premise of this thread has already been resolved. I typed up a continuation thread to discuss the outcome of this one, but of course nobody has posted on it. They all came here because they can whine, because that is such a valuable social contribution. Uhh, okay. I see I gotta explain myself, eh? I'm kinda bored with ideas like these. Nerfing or changing character's purpose will only cause problems. Abigail isn't even that good. She isn't bad either. Wendy is not overpowered nor underpowered. She's a balanced character. Her weakness is her sister dying and having to face high hp opponents head-on. Her x0.75 damage is a huge drawback. Abigail is a good character for taking out Spiders and Bees... And that's about it. Big swarms of enemies that can be stunlocked is where she excels. Wendy herself is a character with no good perks. That % less sanity drain doesn't change much. Is DST a PvP-centered game? I wouldn't say so, but even there Wendy isn't a good pick. Is Wendy so overpowered that nobody picks anything else? Hell no, you can see everybody picks who they like. Why nerf her, even if some small imbalance exists, if there is a point to the character, there are people enjoying the mechanics and nobody is having less fun "because somebody picked Wendy". Wendy's niche in multiplayer is farming Spiders, and even that Webber can do better. Wendy is, like, the last character I'd pick for rebalance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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