With the current release, are there still ways to destroy heat?

[SchlauFuchs]

Hi,

I had seen that they changed the game behavior in building output temperatures, what are your current strategies to handle excess heat now?

[SamuraiJones]

Wheezeworts, AETNs, and the mother of all anti-entropy devices, the steam turbine, all violate the laws of thermodynamics to stave off an inevitable heat death for you. It does take more attention though, and requires a higher tech level. You might need cooling loops earlier, and heat dump locations longer, but it's not a huge problem if you pay attention.

[mathmanican]

Trap critters or hundreds of tons of materials in doors, and then transfer the heat to those. Magically delete heat by putting it into food and then sending the food into a fridge. There are lots of ways.  Cook your water to 99C, transform it to oxygen, and then cool the oxygen (so abuse SHC in any way you can). 

[Timych]

10 minutes ago, mathmanican said:

There are lots of ways.

Yeah, sadly none of which intuitive or understandable for new players. There are building categories for food and oxygen, but not for heat, only crazy contraptions.

[tseitsei]

1 minute ago, Timych said:

Yeah, sadly none of which intuitive or understandable for new players. There are building categories for food and oxygen, but not for heat, only crazy contraptions.

Wheezeworts and aetns are quite easy to understand. And steam turbine isnt that hard either.

[Timych]

3 minutes ago, tseitsei said:

Wheezeworts and aetns are quite easy to understand. And steam turbine isnt that hard either.

I agree on wheezeworts and AETNs, though these are not buildings. Steam turbines are not intuitive for cooling, they are listed in power buildings. Intuitively, one might want to use a thermoregulator, which is not very good at it.

[N00bieMeap]

heat up hydrogen and send it to generator

[Oozinator]

47 minutes ago, tseitsei said:

 And steam turbine isnt that hard either.

How more complicated could it be?
It would take ages to test that out on your own and in survival it's no way practical, to test/opt it..

 

[abud]

10 minutes ago, Timych said:

Intuitively, one might want to use a thermoregulator

I did that too when I started ONI. Most we can do is moving the heat or transform it into another form of energy, that what I thought. So I move all heat into cold biome, mainly using thermoregulator (because I use similar concept in real world) and rarely using aquatuner. Moving heat alone should be sufficient for few hundreds of cycles on terra (new player supposed to play here first). Steam turbine at that time is very hard to use and there is no space to permanently move our heat. Both possibilities are open now for new player to take advantage of it.

Sometimes I jealous at that pure thinking of energy. I already tainted with @mathmanican ways of thinking deleting energy. Save yourself before it's too late. If you ever think about heating your dupes then killing them, it means it is too late for you.

 

2 minutes ago, Timych said:

Steam turbines are not intuitive for cooling, they are listed in power buildings.

They are intuitive enough for me because new player still upholds: energy can neither be created nor destroyed; rather, it can only be transformed or transferred from one form to another. What can we transform heat energy into? Probably the highest answer will be electricity.

Although they will be betrayed with the reality of ONI world later... using vitamin or critters.

[Oozinator]

1 minute ago, abud said:

They are intuitive enough for me

Can you explain why SE is in any way intuitive? You watched the vid from my last post, to run that thing efficient?
Even a very experienced ONI buddy could not figure it out, without watching videos and we had to try it out together, to get it working, both in survival.
Was a real pain / no fun and took long time. Included reloading game(more then once), after 50 cycles of dupe labor, when something went wrong.
Those videos are most times obsolete, because Wheezie changes, for example in my vid case..

 

[tseitsei]

16 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

How more complicated could it be?
It would take ages to test that out on your own and in survival it's no way practical, to test/opt it..

 

You dont need anything close to this complicated to make it work. Of course a highly automated and optimized build will be complicated. All you actually need is a steam chamber, some heat source and loop the output water back to self cool the turbines and get back in to the steam chamber. 

Later you can start making it more efficient by actually storing the electricity provided, adding thermosensors, blocking inputs, adding better cooling for the turbine, etc etc. But the simplest working design is relatively simple.

[Oozinator]

Just now, tseitsei said:

 But the simplest working design is relatively simple.

Everything is, even inventing a fusion reactor..
 

[PickPay]

I'm curious as well, I started a new game on Verdante and underestimated the challenge : with very little water and no Algae in the starting biome I'm lacking options. I'm growing all the Oxyfern I could find but after 30 cycles I know trouble will come sooner than I can deal with. I found a geyser early but it took time to skill up to dig it out to find out its water (yay) but at 95°C. There's no way I'm getting a Steam turbine setup this early in the game, so moving heat elsewhere and dealing with it later isn't a happy situation, thinking of giving up

[mathmanican]

1 hour ago, Timych said:

There are building categories for food and oxygen, but not for heat, only crazy contraptions.

One very simple way to manage heat is to build ice tempshift plates where you need to control the temp. Use the ice maker - a building (it does delete a small amount of heat), and then build the tempshift plate where you want it.  There is no need to cool everything down. Let some parts of your map get really hot on purpose, while you let other parts cool way off. A few nicely placed tempshift plates, coupled with good insulation, can keep your farms where they need to be temp-wise, till you have more permanent plans. Oddly, one super efficient way to cool things down is to actually melt regolith into magma to run LOTS of steam turbines, cooling down the entire asteroid without it costing a dime of resources (SHC abuse at it's finest). You get tons of useable rock from it as well, which produces gobs of resources through the hatch circuit.

In the end, ONI becomes a game about temperature management, not a game about oxygen creation. However "Oxygen Not Included" sounds much cooler than "Avoiding Heat Death On a Space Rock" or "Unrealistic Thermodynamics Simulator." So "crazy" contraptions that deal with the rules of the ONI universe (it's a game, so we play the game), aimed at helping with heat, are precisely what I love about the game. Yeah, some of them are just downright ridiculous and stupid (and hopefully will get patched out). Others are quite fun. 

@SchlauFuchs asked the golden question, how do you manage heat.  It's been really fun over the last month watching tons of different new mechanics appear (that have been in the game for quite a long time) because they got rid of the water sieve, and some people want to avoid the turbine.

In my most recent base, I try to sink as much heat as I can into regular water before zapping it into the electrolyzer.  The SHC abuse deletes way more heat than an aquatuner can transfer. As long as the game continues to transform elements into new ones with different SHC, this will be a key to efficient temp management.  

[Ellilea]

Without getting into complex builds (don't want to know so I don't feel tempted to copy stuff) - what is it about the turbine that's so amazing at heat deletion? I haven't built one yet, but from what I've read in its description it takes 120C+ steam and turns it to 90C water. That is still a very hot water?

[abud]

10 minutes ago, Ellilea said:

it takes 120C+ steam and turns it to 90C water. That is still a very hot water?

It is, most people use that hot water to replace consumed steam.

Unless we make steam turbine for some boiler, usually we didn't take water from steam turbine itself. My first (new version of) steam turbine is PW boiler. My recent one is saltwater/brine boiler. Just because it is boring to make something exactly same build in one colony over and over again.

If you need cooling some water, you can use aquatuner. Aquatuner will produce heat, which can be used to maintain steam temperature hot enough.

[Xuhybrid]

25 minutes ago, Ellilea said:

Without getting into complex builds (don't want to know so I don't feel tempted to copy stuff) - what is it about the turbine that's so amazing at heat deletion? I haven't built one yet, but from what I've read in its description it takes 120C+ steam and turns it to 90C water. That is still a very hot water?

Use the 95C water to cool down the chamber where the steam was taken from. No matter how hot the Steam is, say 300C, it'll still come down to 95C water, until the temperature in the room drops to 125C. If you want to cool something below 125C, you have the aquatuner.

51 minutes ago, mathmanican said:

One very simple way to manage heat is to build ice tempshift plates where you need to control the temp. Use the ice maker - a building (it does delete a small amount of heat), and then build the tempshift plate where you want it. 

Ice maker generates heat in it's surroundings also so it becomes another method for transferring heat and NOT converting it. Granted it has a net cooling effect, but one that requires constant dupe maintenance in the form of building a tempshift plate or an Ice Fan.

[QuQuasar]

39 minutes ago, Ellilea said:

Without getting into complex builds (don't want to know so I don't feel tempted to copy stuff) - what is it about the turbine that's so amazing at heat deletion? I haven't built one yet, but from what I've read in its description it takes 120C+ steam and turns it to 90C water. That is still a very hot water?

Here's why they're so powerful in picture format.

The steam in the chamber will be cooled as soon as it exceeds 125 C, but the aquatuner's overheat temperature is 175 C. The aquatuner can run forever and never overheat, allowing you to cool the liquid in the cooling loop down to near-freezing and run it through your base.

[Darkin Coaled]

1 hour ago, mathmanican said:

"Avoiding Heat Death On a Space Rock"

Are you kidding me? I would totally play that!

[Mutineer]

People forgot one more way for early hit deletion available, Icemakers. They were greatly nerfed before realize, but I think they still work to a degree.

They destroy 20% of heat in the water you put into them, so put in 90C water. Run cooling loop around it to absorb heat warming water to 90C.
You can use Ice to cool area you need to cool, but I admit, it is dupe time intensive. But can be used to as minimum transfer heat from one area to another.

[PatentPending]

3 hours ago, Oozinator said:

Everything is, even inventing a fusion reactor..
 

Do you mean a shine bug reactor?

[tseitsei]

3 hours ago, Oozinator said:

Everything is, even inventing a fusion reactor..
 

Okay then lets say simple enough.

 

It really only needs 3 things:

Some kind of a heat source

An enclosed steam chamber where you put the heat

And finally the turbine itself

 

Heat source can simply be a steam vent or output of a metal refinery.

Turbine itself is really simple. Only needs a water output pipe.

Steam chamber requires you to make a vacuum but that is the most complex requirement for this build and can be done with a single pump and gas vent.

There is no need to know about automation or advanced cooling methods for the turbine or blocking some of the inputs or storing the electric energy efficiently. They all make the design more efficient but are not needed to make it work in the first place. You only need to know how to do simple piping, how to make a vacuum and how to move heat from your heat source to your steam (in a simple case this is also just basic piping).

[Lurve]

Icy fans are terrible don't use them, but the ice from the ice maker works just fine for early game spot cooling.  Put the ice in a storage container under whatever you need to cool.

[bobucles]

1 hour ago, Mutineer said:

They were greatly nerfed before realize, but I think they still work to a degree.

Pre-nerf, ice makers cooled around 80kDTUs. They now cool 4kDTUs, if anything at all.

Don't use ice makers for heat deletion. They're a poor man's aqua tuner.

[Timych]

3 hours ago, mathmanican said:

 So "crazy" contraptions that deal with the rules of the ONI universe

Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy that the game makes it possible. Some solutions, you and some other people invent are pure amazement. 

I joined the alpha around the time they introduced ice biomes Feb 2017.  Only recently, from your posts, I learned about gas conversion bug. Before I just assumed that that's the way things works
Really, I was only dissatisfied with 2 things: heat deletion (as everything's creating it) and airlocks (don't like the looks of waterlocks)