QoL Upgrade Mk 1 Now Open For Testing! - 295825

[Serpher]

5 hours ago, Xadhoom said:

i rather want an output similar to smart battery. so i can use the signal to turn off like petrol refinery, or NG generators etc.

I was thinking in terms of: IN-OUT / NOt gate where it would give of a 1 or 0 by itself. For example, if empty IN would be green, OUT red and reverse situation. Of course you could get by with just one output and logic gates. The end goal stays the same: to be able to control them via automation.

[Sasza22]

1 hour ago, Ixenzo said:

LH2 and LOX are completely different substances that require very different conditions for storing in a tank. The thing with LH2 is that it simply leaks through the walls of a tank since the particles are so tiny, and as such requires different lining and structure of the tank.

Besides, LH2 uses the same fuel tank unlocked along with the petro engine. This makes even less sense.

Well let me just say that it makes sense for somebody that has no idea about rocket science, like me. It`s cold so belngs in the cryo section. I guess it`s still better than if they moved LOX to a separate "liquid oxydizers" research.

[impyre]

1 hour ago, Serpher said:

I was thinking in terms of: IN-OUT / NOt gate where it would give of a 1 or 0 by itself. For example, if empty IN would be green, OUT red and reverse situation. Of course you could get by with just one output and logic gates. The end goal stays the same: to be able to control them via automation.

@Serpher I don't think it works that way. It's either an input or an output. You *could* have both, but they would have to be separate ports. Input enables/disables tank, and output tells fill state. Enabling/disabling tanks seems kindof useless... because you generally use them because you want a buffer that's *always* available... why would you ever want to turn it off. Even if you did want to turn it off, using shutoff valves accomplishes this. You could also use a shutoff to automate the inputs and have the tank completely controlled by automation.

The big deal here is having some way to easily check the fill levels of tanks.

@Xadhoom It would be really nice to have a built-in sensor like the hydro and atmo sensors. Something we can change settings for so that it changes from red to green once a certain fill level is reached. It's nice to know when tanks are full because some systems don't handle being overfilled very well. It's nice to know when tanks are low because we can choose to activate secondary systems to help supplement our supply. (Like pulling nat gas from geyser storage if the gas from fertilizer, petrol, and oil production begins to run low... we want to use what we make first so it doesn't back up) Having configurable sensors make this easier. You *can* do it with vent-based sensors *sortof*, but it doesn't work great. Right now the most accurate way is to use a storage area combined with vent and mini pump, control the flow rate in and out, and monitor the fluid/gas levels, as that will represent the level in the tanks... but this sortof defeats the purpose of the tanks imo.

edit: I tend to stay away from the pumps and sensors though, I use multiple tanks and pipe element sensors connected to filter gates, I get a signal when I'm down to one full tank left, and I have a full signal.

Edited November 24, 2018 by impyre

[Lilalaunekuh]

1 hour ago, Serpher said:

7 hours ago, Xadhoom said:

i rather want an output similar to smart battery. so i can use the signal to turn off like petrol refinery, or NG generators etc.

I was thinking in terms of: IN-OUT / NOt gate where it would give of a 1 or 0 by itself. For example, if empty IN would be green, OUT red and reverse situation. Of course you could get by with just one output and logic gates. The end goal stays the same: to be able to control them via automation.

I think that would be overkill.

(Just adding an output based if the reservoir is full or not, is easy to achieve with some in-pipe sensors.)

But a smart battery like automation would allow to shrink some builds that used 2 reservoir to have a buffer in both directions to use just one tank.

2 minutes ago, impyre said:

The big deal here is having some way to easily check the fill levels of tanks.

=> Sounds fun, but I would prefer a more primitive automation output: "true if above ... kg"

(Smart battery without the latch^^)

 

 

39 minutes ago, Sasza22 said:

1 hour ago, Ixenzo said:

LH2 and LOX are completely different substances that require very different conditions for storing in a tank. The thing with LH2 is that it simply leaks through the walls of a tank since the particles are so tiny, and as such requires different lining and structure of the tank.

Besides, LH2 uses the same fuel tank unlocked along with the petro engine. This makes even less sense.

Well let me just say that it makes sense for somebody that has no idea about rocket science, like me. It`s cold so belngs in the cryo section. I guess it`s still better than if they moved LOX to a separate "liquid oxydizers" research.

I think a new research "liquid oxydizer" would be a good idea.

Adding the liquid oxydizer to our normal petroleum rocket research makes it really tempting to just skip "solid oxydizers", but it would fit the kind of fuel tank used here.

=> Gameplay-wise I prefer to allow access to liquid oxydizers later and I think seperating it from the "hydrogen tank" would allow a more smooth progression

(And I would prefer if the LH2 tanks would be more "costly" to build, maybe make them a bit heavier so we have to fill them with a metallhydrid to "store" the hydrogen)

 

 

PS: Need something that could eat my data banks ... (Maybe even literally eat them)

Edited November 24, 2018 by Lilalaunekuh
new post^^

[saaadel]

I have created a new game, living at 55 cycle - The Dupe with highest priority for tidy, supply and storage jobs, just walks in idle state and DOES NOT sweep anything. The navigation is ok - it see debris and storage.  Save-and-Load didn't help.
Can upload the save if it's needed

Edited November 25, 2018 by saaadel

[ChickenMadness]

On 22/11/2018 at 6:29 PM, Ipsquiggle said:

 

• New Pedestal Building: Use it to display various objects for your Duplicants and increase their decor
• New Artifact Objects: Bring them back from outer space for decorative display in the colony
• New Decor Items: Corner Decorations, Carpeted Tile, Crown Moulding, new Painting and Statue variations
• Increased Automation: Critter Sensor outputs a signal based on the number of critters and eggs in a room
• New Sight Seeing Module: Send Duplicants to space for a morale and productivity bonus
   

Does that mean we will be able to make a colony that looks pretty and still gives dupes +12 decor morale without resorting to spamming statues?

At the moment it's always a difficult choice between making a colony that looks nice, and spamming statues like this to meet the decor requirements for +12 morale. 


It would also be realllllllllly nice if you could give 'dry wall' tiles a decor bonus. +1 atleast, or varying decor dependant on the material you use for them.

It takes a huge amount of resources to cover your base in drywall tiles so I think it would be balanced. As well as make up for the problem I mentioned previously, being forced to spam statues to get enough decor.

I currently spam drywalls in my bases because it looks pretty. 

In this next screenshot. This base is objectively way prettier than my first screenshot. But the dupes in the first screenshot with statue spamming get +12 morale, but the dupes in the second screenshot vary quite a bit. ( I did end up spamming slicksters on each floor to make up the decor I needed for +12 morale though ).




Also another point about critters that give decor. I think tropical pacus should have their decor range buffed because if you build an aquarium for hem inside your base, the decor range barely reaches outside the aquarium. It reaches the first 'comfortable bed' if the wall is vertical. And if beds are underneath the aquarium with a 2 tile gap for the bedroom height requirement, quite often the fish are too far away.

(screenshot is example of aquarium)



Also, if you want to have a hot water aquarium that doesn't leak heat into your base the only way to do it is with a vacuum surrounding it. I tried building everything surrounding the aquarium  ceramic dry wall, painting, statues etc. as those are the only options you're given and it makes it manageable. But then the pay off you get from it is still meh. because of the low decor range of pacus and low decor they give. Just unbalanced imo. But I do it anyway because I like the idea of having an aquarium. I usually value making the base look nice more than getting enough decor because statue spamming looks so ugly lol.

Just want to bring attention to these problems as they limit player creativity, you have probably thought about it already with the changes you mentioned but just letting it be known lol. I like being able to create 'pretty' designs from a roleplaying perspective that my dupes would like to live in. But currently having to accommodate statue spamming into the designs is very limiting.

Giving drywalls a decor bonus would help massively with giving players some freedom for creativity imo. Maybe give the option to have gold or diamond used as a material that gives decor in dry walls, for balance.
It would also be great if drywalls hid wiring and pipes behind them. would give another reason for building it. For aesthetics.
 

Edited November 25, 2018 by ChickenMadness

[LeftyRighty]

re the new ui for the grill and other work stations, is there a way to reorder the list that I'm missing?

For example, you have a solid supply of bristle berrys from the farms, but you've only got a small intermittent supply of wild peppernuts; you'd want to make stuffed berrys as a priority, then fall back to gristle berrys. At the moment if you set those jobs to continuous the gristle always takes the "current order" slot (so use up all the bristle berrys until there is none left then... oh, there's none left for the stuffed berrys either)... maybe just a "swap" button next to the "next" and "current" order?

[PhailRaptor]

5 hours ago, Lilalaunekuh said:

5 hours ago, Sasza22 said:

7 hours ago, Ixenzo said:

LH2 and LOX are completely different substances that require very different conditions for storing in a tank. The thing with LH2 is that it simply leaks through the walls of a tank since the particles are so tiny, and as such requires different lining and structure of the tank.

Besides, LH2 uses the same fuel tank unlocked along with the petro engine. This makes even less sense.

Well let me just say that it makes sense for somebody that has no idea about rocket science, like me. It`s cold so belngs in the cryo section. I guess it`s still better than if they moved LOX to a separate "liquid oxydizers" research.

I think a new research "liquid oxydizer" would be a good idea.

Adding the liquid oxydizer to our normal petroleum rocket research makes it really tempting to just skip "solid oxydizers", but it would fit the kind of fuel tank used here.

I haven't built a colony to Space yet, but wouldn't that start causing issues with orange (space) research points?  There are only so many planets to get orange research points from.  Once you run out your collection rate for orange points becomes near zero.

[Jasperism]

On reload (on this patch) the Steam Engine keeps spitting out its contents into a Gas Canister that I can't use on an Emptier. I never had this problem before. Any way to avoid this?

[Pandemonium135]

Wow awesome. Thanks devs. I hope nuclear power, invasions and robotics are also on the way

[Ipsquiggle]

On 11/25/2018 at 12:15 AM, Jasperism said:

On reload (on this patch) the Steam Engine keeps spitting out its contents into a Gas Canister that I can't use on an Emptier. I never had this problem before. Any way to avoid this?

Is the canister unclickable? We've had a problem where sometimes the elements inside buildings become visible, that may be the case here. I'll look in to it.

[Jasperism]

5 hours ago, Ipsquiggle said:

Is the canister unclickable? We've had a problem where sometimes the elements inside buildings become visible, that may be the case here. I'll look in to it.

I can select the canister for sweeping, but the Emptier doesn't have Steam on its output list. I can only empty it in place. On further testing it seems to happen when I save with the Steam Engine set to less than max capacity and full, with the input pipe full of steam.

Edited November 27, 2018 by Jasperism

[Ipsquiggle]

2 minutes ago, Jasperism said:

I can select the canister for sweeping, but the Emptier doesn't have Steam on its output list. I can only empty it in place. On further testing it seems to happen when I save with the Steam Engine set to less than max capacity and full, with the input pipe full of steam.

Hmm, this sounds like something new then. Would you mind making a bug for it and uploading the save file for us to take a look at? Thanks!

[Jasperism]

5 hours ago, Ipsquiggle said:

Hmm, this sounds like something new then. Would you mind making a bug for it and uploading the save file for us to take a look at? Thanks!

Thanks for the support. I'll recreate the setup when I get home and upload a save where the canister gets spit out.

edit: bug info uploaded here

Edited November 27, 2018 by Jasperism
updated for link to bug tracker

[Jainee]

Is there really a single human being that ever used non-infinite recipe queue for cooking? I hoped so much we will be able to just queue multiple infinite recipes with the old ui, but this change made it so much worse... BTW what about leftover resources inside the grill? I mean if you have shinebugs you can have 900 out of 1000 sitting inside it for a long, long time. How big is its internal storage? And can we make it so that the grill is only loaded when there is enough resources for at least one full portion?

On the unrelated note, are incubators now loadable with a sweeper?

And is there any fix for build priorities not going back to default of 5?

Edited November 27, 2018 by Jainee

[Lali-Lop]

19 minutes ago, Jainee said:

Is there really a single human being that ever used non-infinite recipe queue for cooking?

I do... I like being able to make a specific amount of something.  For example, I don't want to use up all my sleet wheat making pepper bread for only my most needy dupes and not have any grain left over for other meals.  And because I just like managing my food production manually.

[Jainee]

Good to know... still, I would like to know what Klei wanted to achieve with a new UI what was unavailable in the old one.

In the old UI you would still be able to queue 5 single recipes and then queue a multiple.

Oh, and can we drop the leftovers to the ground if there is not enough for current recipe when we move to the next recipe? It would solve the food rotting inside the stove at least. 

[Copy3ms]

Maybe now i can play for longer than 400 cycles without eating up all of my ram! Should i wait for the complete update to play or is it safe to start now?

 

 

[Sasza22]

51 minutes ago, Copy3ms said:

Maybe now i can play for longer than 400 cycles without eating up all of my ram! Should i wait for the complete update to play or is it safe to start now?

 

 

I`d wait. Preview has some debug tol running in the background that slow down the game. They also keep adding some stuff like the new plants that reqire a fresh start to get.

Edited November 28, 2018 by Sasza22

[Parusoid]

On 22.11.2018 at 7:29 PM, Ipsquiggle said:

New Decor Items: Corner Decorations,

i cant find this

[Rebrait]

 

I think it would be nice if the decorations gave the bonus per room, having a limitation of the same forniture per room. a statue would give decoration bonus to the whole room, but each room would only receive that bonus from a limit of (for example, can be more than one) a statue, a picture, one of each plant, and the floor would only give the bonus if the whole room was covered with the same type of floor.

 

Another nice thing would be to slow down the dups when walking in the dark, it would force the bases to have light.

[PhailRaptor]

1 minute ago, Rebrait said:

Another nice thing would be to slow down the dups when walking in the dark, it would force the bases to have light.

This would slow down the early and mid game to a pretty drastic degree.

[Rebrait]

23 minutes ago, PhailRaptor said:

This would slow down the early and mid game to a pretty drastic degree.

 

maybe then make the dups walk faster in bright places

[tzionut]

Quote

Maybe now i can play for longer than 400 cycles without eating up all of my ram! Should i wait for the complete update to play or is it safe to start now?

I suggest the opposite. Why. If you find new bugs there are more chances to be solved now. If not you will be forced to start a new game instead to continue the old one. My example. Because of the bug whit the command module, i can't load my save game in the development version. If i didn't make a bug report, it will not be solved (or kley said sow, any way i will upgrade when i am at home and test it), and when the released version is out, no continued game for me...

Post edit:

I upgraded on my laptop and i can confirm that the bug whit the command module is solved. Thanks klay. I can play on my laptop again yes

Edited November 29, 2018 by tzionut

[JeP2k3]

Regarding the food queues :

I don't know what is the intended or expected behaviour, but besides the bugs that are happening for now (production stopping at some point), the goal seems to give us the ability to set different foods to unlimited, I don't really understand in which order the dupes will follow the queue (maybe just in the order it was inputed ?) but they'll cook meal A until they don't have the means to (ingredient or skill), then they'll cook meal B until they don't have the means to OR they can cook meal A again, then meal C etc.

Exactly the same behavior as I think we all thought it would work when we discovered the cooking queue for the first time... except befor this patch the queue would freeze if meal A could not be cooked.

 

Now, I see 2 issues with the way queues are presented right now : with the recipes presented vertically like they are, we don't really know what will be cooked at first, and if we want to cook an infinity of DIFFERENT meals, we don't seem to have a way to easily make that.

I don't think there is an elegant and unique solution, but what I want to submit, is like instead of (or even better, in addition of) behing able to order infinite meal A, infinite B, etc... maybe have a way to order the queued elements TIMES INFINITY ! You then could adjust the proportion of meal A in regards to B, and if you need a backup meal C, put it in a different musher/grill with a lower priority.

 

 

... well, it's not THAT BIG of an idea, but hey, could be handy. My next idea would be to be able to "code" the queue, with parenthesis and an infinity multiplicator... but I fell it would be waaaayy too complicated.

 

 

Edited November 29, 2018 by JeP2k3