Drawings and Drivel

[gallusvarius]

10 hours ago, Raspberry Milk said:

How much do you bet the rock lobster is going to fall to its death when the rope gives out?

That does lead to question how on earth it is that they emerge from the caves when lead out... Maybe they're lighter-weight than we think, or very very fast rope climbers? Who knows, they never let us witness it. It must be a secret somehow. 

[ResettePlayer]

Figured I'd share my crackpot Wagstaff theory that I came up with several weeks ago.

I've decided to basically ctrl+c the same ranty train of thought that I subjected my first victim to. There are a few edits for clarity and a TL;DR in the second spoiler.

Spoiler

(as response to hearing a theory that WX was created by the ancients)

It's cool to imagine WX as some ancient automaton, crawling up from the deep recesses of the planet after hundreds of years just to make snarky comments at people, but that strikes me as pretty unlikely. You have good points with the clockwork stuff found in the ancient civilisation, and there is a way to still incorporate that while saying that WX was created by Wagstaff.

The Voxola radio factory burned down. WX looks at a fire and says "THIS REMINDS ME OF SOMETHING." Honestly, that is my main reason for my own ideas on WX's origin, but there's more I can add.

Since the radios are undeniably tied to Maxwell in some way, some people like to think that Maxwell gave Wagstaff the information on how to make such unusual machines. Who knows, maybe he was trying hard to make his own thing, like Wilson, and was partially successful. Thus, Maxwell was allowed to reach him, but the radios could be improved.

These radios had to be unusual, meaning the manufacturing process likely involved some dark magic. Look at Wilson't origin story video: he uses his own blood at some point. Now, if blood is part of any process like that, it can probably be filed under "dark magic" since blood doesn't really make sense to add to a machine. Maxwell could have given Wagstaff the information, and that probably included how to make nightmare fuel or something similar. He probably made it himself, and then let the factory workers assemble the more normal, mechanical parts of the radio.

Where I was going with this: Wagstaff probably already had a lot of mechanical knowledge even before Maxwell stepped in, but now he has magical knowledge.

WX is not a normal robot. Neither are the chess pieces, but WX is far more "human". In fact, it seems like Wagstaff was trying to make the perfect automaton, a metal human, basically. He could have been working on this project for years, for all we know, and now he has the final piece. Magic.

As for WX's soul? Gameplay reasons, first and foremost, but in my slightly morbid mind I like to think that maybe a little human sacrifice was involved. Wilson, in his backstory, is seen to be using rats for some reason, even though the portal is mainly mechanical. If he was basically just following instructions from Maxwell, he wouldn't need rats to check for any mistakes or anything. Why were they necessary? Perhaps souls are their own kind of energy or somethin', I dunno. Look at living wood: necessary for a lot of magic stuff. Still alive when you chop it, unlike a regular plant, but it doesn't survive the magic process. So maybe some rando's soul was used to get that human aspect in WX, to make him more than just a piece of clockwork.

Similarly, maybe the ancients used animals or something to make their machines. Things with less "complex" souls, thus making each machine essentially a one-trick pony.

With this idea, the soul used to create WX most likely lost it's identity in the process. Which is sorta-kinda-not really supported by that one Wendy vignette: "Wendy clings fiercely to the grief over her sister's death, for fear that moving on would cause Abigail's memory to fade." Perhaps the soul used in WX was eventually "overwritten" to become the soul of a salty robot who hates organics, a soul more fitting for the body it inhabits. This is getting really far fetched, I know.

Oh, and the ancients can be tied into this better by pointing out that Maxwell has no business knowing anything about mechanical stuff. He was a magician, fer cryin' out loud. He was in the Constant for however long, 13 years at Wagstaff's point, and had probably analysed and copied the stuff that the ancients did. They had spent a whole lot of time messing around with magic and figuring out how it worked, and most of Maxwell's knowledge was built on what he found there and in the Codex Umbra (where THAT came from, I have no idea. Probably one of the kinds of things thrown around by Them in an attempt to reel in some prey). So yeah, according to this theory, the radios, Wilson's portal, and WX are all based off of the technology of the ancients.

Now, with WX's naivete, this could be because he's just a few years old, yet doesn't have a child's mind, if that makes any sense. He has some familiarity with humans, as he mentions them a lot in his quotes even when he was in the wilderness alone, so it's likely he spent a little time on Earth. Things like becoming attached to Hal and having a sanity meter at all could be a bit of his "humanity" leaking through. He has emotions and stuff. His family references when looking at machinery is probably just for humour's sake, especially since he probably has more in common with the other survivors than an immobile, silent alchemy engine. I guess he is a bit childish.

Wait... do ya think, do ya think that maybe Wagstaff used his OWN soul to create WX? Was this a result of Wagstaff trying to achieve immortality? Intriguing... man, I'd gladly write essays of lore for Klei for peanuts, maybe even nothing. I love lore.

TL;DR:

Spoiler

WX-78 is the product of Wagstaff's failed attempt to cheat death. WX's soul as seen in-game is whats left over from Wagstaff, but no memories or personality survived the trip from human body to robotic body.

 

[gallusvarius]

1 hour ago, ResettePlayer said:

Figured I'd share my crackpot Wagstaff theory that I came up with several weeks ago.

Interesting, I see a name, 'Darleen' also on the grave. Is WX familiar with both?

Also, I still don't know who Wagstaff is. Maybe Minespatch can tell me, it seems like they know everything or something like that. 

[Auspice]

2 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

Wagstaff

Great pose! I haven't thought about it too much, but I do think that WX might be powered by Wagstaff's remnants of a soul. You make a lot of interesting points - Wagstaff discovering black magic through Maxwell, and him using some of it for the Voxola radios, and WX.

Sacrifice. I like that. Perhaps he even killed himself (stabbing himself in the heart or something) in a ritual to transfer his soul, and WX woke to the corpse of his creator, with only fragmented memories and knowledge. 

24 minutes ago, gallusvarius said:

Also, I still don't know who Wagstaff is.

I believe he is the inventor of the Voxola radio that we see in Wilson's origin story.

[gallusvarius]

6 minutes ago, Auspice said:

I believe he is the inventor of the Voxola radio that we see in Wilson's origin story.

But where does it say this? I was sent something to the wiki but it didn't really say anything verified. 

[ResettePlayer]

44 minutes ago, gallusvarius said:

Interesting, I see a name, 'Darleen' also on the grave. Is WX familiar with both?

I kinda just made Darleen up on the spot, since a lot of married couples share tombstones. I don't think WX knows either... this is just a meaningless drawing.

13 minutes ago, gallusvarius said:

But where does it say this? I was sent something to the wiki but it didn't really say anything verified. 

https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/14816-rp-all-the-way-rp-product-suggestions/?do=findComment&comment=138649

Word of God. shrugs

20 minutes ago, Auspice said:

Great pose! I haven't thought about it too much, but I do think that WX might be powered by Wagstaff's remnants of a soul. You make a lot of interesting points - Wagstaff discovering black magic through Maxwell, and him using some of it for the Voxola radios, and WX.

Sacrifice. I like that. Perhaps he even killed himself (stabbing himself in the heart or something) in a ritual to transfer his soul, and WX woke to the corpse of his creator, with only fragmented memories and knowledge. 

Bless you people for reading that whole thing. As for the sacrifice thing, though stabbing oneself in the heart is dramatic and all, you know it's got to be more science-y.

Spoiler

 

[Auspice]

4 minutes ago, ResettePlayer said:

Bless you people for reading that whole thing.

Lore is life.

5 minutes ago, ResettePlayer said:

you know it's got to be more science-y.

>:O

You are right

5 minutes ago, ResettePlayer said:

Word of God. shrugs

I guess that's how it works. I forgot about how his body went missing, though... Perhaps he was either taken to the Constant, or his body was consumed in whatever ritual he did, or WX took it? Since WX seems to recall the fire, he was probably initialized during it... Maybe Wagstaff died before WX was actually finished, so his soul was consumed but that is why the transfer was flawed.

[ResettePlayer]

2 minutes ago, Auspice said:

Maybe Wagstaff died before WX was actually finished, so his soul was consumed but that is why the transfer was flawed

That's a good one. Generally a better reason for the failure rather than "it just didn't work".

[gallusvarius]

2 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

shrugs

Ahh, I see now, thank you.
Where on earth was that thing buried? I had seriously never even heard the name 'Wagstaff' until I met you.

These ideas definitely make more sense now.

[minespatch]

On 7/25/2018 at 11:11 AM, ResettePlayer said:

 I find Jesse's laugh to be pretty contagious.

He's like Rich Evans of Red LEtter MEdia. '

On 7/29/2018 at 3:20 PM, ResettePlayer said:

1. 
2. Wait... do ya think, do ya think that maybe Wagstaff used his OWN soul to create WX? Was this a result of Wagstaff trying to achieve immortality? Intriguing... man, I'd gladly write essays of lore for Klei for peanuts, maybe even nothing. I love lore.

1. The return of Bob Fosse WX:
2. So... Wagstaff did a scientist from 9???

 

[ResettePlayer]

22 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

Where on earth was that thing buried?

There was a link under "References" on the wiki page. If not for that, I would never had known.

 

1 hour ago, minespatch said:

He's like Rich Evans of Red LEtter MEdia

Yeah, he kinda does sound like him. Wonderful sound.

1 hour ago, minespatch said:

The return of Bob Fosse WX:

Hmm, yeah, I remember that one. There's something oddly natural about it.

WX is a paragon of style, everyone. You know in your hearts that it's true.

 

[DragonMage156]

On 7/30/2018 at 9:45 AM, gallusvarius said:

But where does it say this? I was sent something to the wiki but it didn't really say anything verified. 

I think he's mentioned in the William Carter puzzles. Correct me if I'm wrong.

That theory was quite a read but I made it to the end ^_^ quite an interesting theory.

[ResettePlayer]

Picking through a sketchbook, and found something mildly amusing.

Spoiler

Cut out one Wilson...

...And find another.

That's all for today, folks.

[Raspberry Shake]

... Midnight sketches.

[Szczuku]

Haha. Nice

Btw have you ever thought about making Wilson's hair a bit bigger?

[ResettePlayer]

3 hours ago, Szczuku said:

Btw have you ever thought about making Wilson's hair a bit bigger?

Short answer: Sort of not really. I think I tried it once and it looked weird so I stopped.

Long answer: [puts on art analysis hat]

Spoiler

One time I was listening to an art podcast (Bobby Chiu's stuff on Youtube is good listening; I've learned a lot), and one of the guests (may have been Jonathan Hardesty) mentioned how he could tell a little bit about someone's personality just by looking at their art. Now, there are some glaringly obvious examples of this I've seen in my life (the edgy kid in art class drawing edgy dark stuff), but it never occurred to me to turn that analysis upon myself.

The artist was actually talking about painting specifically, since that's his thing. I was doing an oil painting at the time, and you know how oil paintings often look good in spite of how messy they are? In fact, the messier ones often look better than the neater ones, especially since you know they didn't take four years to paint. Anyway, I looked at my own painting, and what did I see?

Painstakingly sharp edges. I was holding my breath while doing most of the brush strokes. I'd have to remind myself to take a step back just to frickin' breathe.

I've said many times before that I'm a perfectionist, and that it's most likely super visible to any stranger looking at my art. Perfectionism is a form of obsessiveness, and most definitely a weakness.

I haven't used pencils for sketching in a long time because of this. Allowing myself to erase adds so much time to everything. Digital art takes me forever because I'm allowed to hit Undo, and erase everything so cleanly and sharply. Late last year I gave myself neck problems because I was so hunched over my desk, face a dozen centimetres from the paper, making sure every line was "right."

I have issues, man. I know that my perfectionism is wrong, but it's so hard to let go.

What does this have to do with Wilson's hair? Well, look at it. Super clean, hard edges, geometric shapes. No fluff. Frankly, it doesn't look natural. I excuse myself for this by saying "Wilson spends time specifically styling his hair". Does that justify it? Does that justify morphing Wilson into something that fits my horrible, obsessive comfort zone? Look at the way I draw his nose. So straight, clearly visible planes, looks like some sort of prism.

Maybe all of this means nothing, and it all boils down to the fact that I like to elongate things vertically and have a hard time stretching things out horizontally.

You want to know why I draw Woodie so much? Well, not a lot lately, but it's because he's dramatically different from Wilson visually. He's scruffy. His face is squashed. He's out of my comfort zone. I'm trying to overcome my weaknesses, people. But it's difficult, because it's closely related to my personality.

Read this far? Thanks for your patience. While you're here, consider looking at your fellow forum artists' art and think about what you see. Of course, you know a little of their personalities already, but ask yourself a few more questions. Why do they draw their lines like that? Did they spend eons trying to achieve that effect? What were they trying to accomplish with x? 

Feel free to discuss this concept further here, if you want.

Uh, yeah, that "long answer" is really long and mostly irrelevant. So maybe don't bother reading it if you don't want to waste your time.

[gallusvarius]

42 minutes ago, ResettePlayer said:

Read this far?

Read the whole thing. That was very interesting. 

I have mixed feelings on perfectionism myself. It depends on the definition/connotation. For what I know of it, I don't think it's harmful if it's under control. My mother is a really big perfectionist, and an amazing artist. Really amazing... Me, I was never born a perfectionist. I don't actually know what people can see from my art, but if things can be determined, maybe this is one of them.  I had to kind of grow some perfectionist-ness for myself, like a plant. That and patience. 
In the far past I would never notice the flaws of my work, like I was blind to them. But perfectionists notice flaws. This is what I mean by having to grow it. I notice them much more now. I still don't always notice all of them. 

To be without perfectionism isn't entirely good either, not for art anyway. Or for a clean house, at that matter. Compare my room to my mother's. XP 
It definitely affects your life, though not every aspect. 

[SDragonhead]

As an animation major, drawing messy is fine, you need to get messy. When I'm coloring digitally I would wanna get all the colors 100% in there, but really no one is gonna see those stray pixels. In traditional art I can't seem to do smooth lines perhaps due to how I hold my pens, but it still looks fine, the best thing to do is just get the idea across cuz in the end folks aren't gonna look at those gesture marks or slightly wobbled line. In painting that's when things get tough, but again you gotta lean back on it. Yeeha take it easy

[ResettePlayer]

2 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

To be without perfectionism isn't entirely good either, not for art anyway. Or for a clean house, at that matter.

Yes, it does depend how you define perfectionism. Knowing that there is room for improvement in your life/skills/whatever is a bit different, I think. At any rate, perfectionism is more a flaw when it's in the extremes. 

2 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

In the far past I would never notice the flaws of my work, like I was blind to them. But perfectionists notice flaws. This is what I mean by having to grow it.

See, I can't even imagine not being super critical of my work. Occasionally I'll look at something I did and say "that's pretty okay, actually", but even then there's something about it I don't like. I have no idea even what ballpark of skill level I'm in because all I see is amateur garbage.

Being self-critical is important for improvement, but it can take a toll on your self esteem sometimes. Especially when the criticism moves beyond art...

2 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

I don't actually know what people can see from my art,

One thing I've noticed is that you're super apologetic most of the time. Generally, though, the impression is that you just want to get the idea across most of the time, and presentation isn't your primary concern.

 

2 hours ago, SDragonhead said:

really no one is gonna see those stray pixels

I know this on an intellectual level. No one is going to be looking that closely at my drawings, and if they do for whatever strange reason, are they going to fixate on that flaw? Are they going to care the tiniest bit? No. I have to continuously remind myself that no one cares as much as I do, and what matters is finishing the project and moving on to the next.

Someone else put it this way once: you're going to end up hating your old art anyway, so there's no need to put in THAT much effort and polishing. There is a balance between quality and quantity that must be attained for the best time management and technical improvement.

2 hours ago, SDragonhead said:

n traditional art I can't seem to do smooth lines perhaps due to how I hold my pens, but it still looks fine, the best thing to do is just get the idea across cuz in the end folks aren't gonna look at those gesture marks or slightly wobbled line.

It sucks when you look at someone like Scott Robertson, who just has maximum arm control apparently, then your own lines are super wobbly and just go off course. Again, though, how many people are going to notice?

 

I've been trying to be conscious of this issue of mine, as I head off to college in September (where there's going to be DEADLINES and I can't take as long as I like), as well as the fact that I want to make comics or game art or something... where there's also deadlines. I can't let this continue. However, it requires action and not whining on a forum.

Thanks, guys.

[gallusvarius]

I put my block of thoughts here. 

Spoiler

 

9 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

es, it does depend how you define perfectionism. Knowing that there is room for improvement in your life/skills/whatever is a bit different, I think. At any rate, perfectionism is more a flaw when it's in the extremes. 

Oh, it's not about knowing whether we need room for improvement... I mean, maybe with a messy room it is, but usually it's a lack of understanding for where.
In a technical sense, though, I do get perfectionistic about specific things. Namely cooking. 
 

9 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

See, I can't even imagine not being super critical of my work. Occasionally I'll look at something I did and say "that's pretty okay, actually", but even then there's something about it I don't like. I have no idea even what ballpark of skill level I'm in because all I see is amateur garbage.

Being self-critical is important for improvement, but it can take a toll on your self esteem sometimes. Especially when the criticism moves beyond art...

When it moves beyond art, and into a criticism of yourself - Even I know that feeling. In a past time I was pretty entrenched in self-hate actually. No human can completely escape it so it's probably still there, just less in this current time. I was much younger when it existed at it's level. And not as well along in 'teaching myself perfectionism.'  Self-hate and self-esteem, and self-criticism or any such related thing probably shouldn't be connected with perfectionism, depending on the definition. The thing that makes us keep a room sparkling or try to perfect art isn't actually the same as what gives us esteem or promotes positive self-image. 
 

9 hours ago, ResettePlayer said:

One thing I've noticed is that you're super apologetic most of the time. Generally, though, the impression is that you just want to get the idea across most of the time, and presentation isn't your primary concern.

Ah, yes. Apologetic, because I know I'm not giving my best presentation. I am working on something I am doing my best on, but I spend copious amounts of time doing these.  It's still not finished... 

But yeah, I'm apologizing and recognizing those flaws in my work, too. But I can't say I'm disturbed by my messy presentation beyond anything else. What DragonHead said about 'no one will notice those stray pixels' comes to mind, but it's different for me because it's doodles on lined paper vs. non-lined paper... 
Sometimes it comes as lack of ability to see issue. And sometimes it just comes as tolerance of issue.  Extremity of either Perfectionism or lack of therein could be bad. I say 'Could' because I don't know what everyone's definition for it all is. 
To be perfectionist to the point that we stress out when a little mess is made in the house or descend into self-hate because of a personal flaw is of course, not ideal. To lack perfectionism to the point where your home is unsanitary and where you do nothing to improve as a person and continue in personal flaw (Think Lying or any other form of malicious selfishness that is constantly present in all humans and in need of constant improvement.)  is also not ideal. 

I can't say I lack being perfectionist on all things. Honestly, the self-hate I mentioned probably came from perfectionism in that area.

 

[Raspberry Shake]

2 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

Namely cooking.

You would hate me.

Spoiler

The recipe says half a teaspoon of vanilla.

3 teaspoons it is then.

 

[ResettePlayer]

8 hours ago, Raspberry Milk said:

3 teaspoons it is then.

dude are you feckin insane

 

10 hours ago, gallusvarius said:

Sometimes it comes as lack of ability to see issue. And sometimes it just comes as tolerance of issue.  Extremity of either

This reminds me that much of my problem is rooted in comparing myself to others, often older and more experienced artists. I don't see the flaws in their work, so when I hold myself up to that standard, it's basically the standard of flawlessness. An issue indeed.

[DragonMage156]

On 8/1/2018 at 6:05 AM, ResettePlayer said:

Is that a hidden draft of that smexy one?

[minespatch]

On 7/31/2018 at 2:05 PM, ResettePlayer said:

.

We all know the characters to most likely marry themselves in this game are Wilson and Maxwell. Maxwell's just lucky that he has the power to do it.

[ResettePlayer]

17 minutes ago, DragonMage156 said:

Is that a hidden draft of that smexy one?

It's the draft of this one, if that's what you mean.

Spoiler

 

10 minutes ago, minespatch said:

We all know the characters to most likely marry themselves in this game are Wilson and Maxwell. Maxwell's just lucky that he has the power to do it.

Spoiler

You have... a point, I suppose.

We could also add Wolfgang to that list of narcissists.