Is food all about eggs now?

[PhailRaptor]

I've been struggling with this for a bit now.  And I have to say, the conclusion I've reached kinda bugs me.

Looking at how the numbers work out between plant requirements and Geyser outputs versus Ranch Egg production for Omelettes, it seems like farming is a rather pointless task now.  It seems to always consume a much greater amount of resources of a higher quality to farm food rather than ranch it.  Berries, for example, require a lot of water, and need a certain amount of cooling to continue growth.  A couple of Stables filled with Hatches, on the other hand, costs very little in the way of resources, and you can choose to use the "useless" resources like Sedimentary Rock and Clay for them, in exchange for enough Eggs for Omelettes to keep 8ish Dupes fed.

Such comparisons only get worse when you start thinking about Pacu meat farms.  Simply drop a large glob of Algae into the pond they are occupying to get your initial egg quantities up, set enough Auto-Sweepers to reach the entire pond, and completely forget about Food after that.  And lets not forget infinite Phosphorite from Dreckos eating Balm Lillys, literally creating something from nothing.  Which you can feed directly to Shine Bugs for a huge Egg source for even more Omelettes.

It just seems like the whole food production aspect of the game is really off kilter compared to the other systems that must be managed.

[MidnightSteam]

I've been wondering about that. Next play through I'm not going to bother with plants and as soon as I can, start a butchery. ranch. As small as possible yet maximizing meat and eggs.

[0xFADE]

I get a lot of food from mushrooms, and pufts help keep that going.

This is the best mushroom farm i've come up with so far.  Each set of mushrooms can be fed by the sweeper if some dupe doesn't snipe the job.

I've cleaned up the chance of leaving slime lung on them in my current map but I don't have enough metal to put the sweepers in yet.

Plants are more of a passive thing(except for farmers touch) and ranching is much more active.  I've noticed I am not near as far along base wise with all this ranching.  A lot more of my dupes time is being spent there.

[Carnis]

You are correct sir. Eggs are broken.

[TheExceed]

2 hours ago, PhailRaptor said:

I've been struggling with this for a bit now.  And I have to say, the conclusion I've reached kinda bugs me.

Looking at how the numbers work out between plant requirements and Geyser outputs versus Ranch Egg production for Omelettes, it seems like farming is a rather pointless task now.  It seems to always consume a much greater amount of resources of a higher quality to farm food rather than ranch it.  Berries, for example, require a lot of water, and need a certain amount of cooling to continue growth.  A couple of Stables filled with Hatches, on the other hand, costs very little in the way of resources, and you can choose to use the "useless" resources like Sedimentary Rock and Clay for them, in exchange for enough Eggs for Omelettes to keep 8ish Dupes fed.

Such comparisons only get worse when you start thinking about Pacu meat farms.  Simply drop a large glob of Algae into the pond they are occupying to get your initial egg quantities up, set enough Auto-Sweepers to reach the entire pond, and completely forget about Food after that.  And lets not forget infinite Phosphorite from Dreckos eating Balm Lillys, literally creating something from nothing.  Which you can feed directly to Shine Bugs for a huge Egg source for even more Omelettes.

It just seems like the whole food production aspect of the game is really off kilter compared to the other systems that must be managed.

I have been having a tough time balancing ranching and other things lately. Cycle 320ish but I also suck at the game lol, I forget about the age thing and come back to everything being dead and cooked. rip.

[blash365]

I am not using eggs at all. Too much hassle to make sure that the right eggs are being used.

Only mushrooms and meat.

[chemie]

eggs are too much work.

I just go berries and wheat.  around 18 berries and 7 or 8 wheat is enough for 16 dups.  Easy-peesy

[Olimar]

Here is a related question on a grand scale perspective.  Can you ignore ranching and creatures entirely?

The game turned quite difficult for me since the occupational update.  I'd assume that ignoring creatures would make it more difficult with how the game's systems have changed.  I've only been reading about the two Ranching updates and have not played for a few months.

 

[Oozinator]

8 minutes ago, chemie said:

eggs are too much work.

I just go berries and wheat.  around 18 berries and 7 or 8 wheat is enough for 16 dups.  Easy-peesy

Food chain feels now completely broken for me.
Since we have no more to grow stuff in optimal conditions, to get seeds, it feels that way.
Maelwood meta - Bristle meta - Omelette meta
With every new stuff Klei is adding, things change and the others rot in a dark corner.
When you put pacu eggs in a pool and give it some time, you get meatexplosion, without taming.
I run  a base with <10 dupes and they are experts in anything, most times six of them are idle, but game feels boring now.
Jobs / rotations suck. It's only micro, to rotate them through every job, to get the benefit of it.
Some rancher/farmer and game gets completely unbalanced.
Water is no problem with the "old" fertilizer NG plant, but we got a steam engine..
^^

[Coolthulhu]

5 hours ago, Olimar said:

Can you ignore ranching and creatures entirely?

Only if you have enough water geyser output for berries/wheat at your preferred dupe count. Or short enough time scale that it doesn't matter.

Plants are less work-intensive than critters, but consume much more limited resources. In ONI, it's animals that are the sustainable option - opposite to real life.

[clickrush]

5 hours ago, Olimar said:

Here is a related question on a grand scale perspective.  Can you ignore ranching and creatures entirely?

The game turned quite difficult for me since the occupational update.  I'd assume that ignoring creatures would make it more difficult with how the game's systems have changed.  I've only been reading about the two Ranching updates and have not played for a few months.

 

Absolutely. Ranching is a nice bonus but you are not forced to do it. You just get more conversions which opens up new base styles. Ranching makes quite a few materials scalable and sustainable that were not before. Just note that you are still converting *something* when feeding critters, even if you free up water when cooking meat/eggs etc.

The new geysers and volcanos etc. are a huge improvement in my book. Sure it is a little bit more complex now, but the worldgen feels more unique and you are incentivised to adapt to what you get.

Some things are actually kind of easier/smoother now with some of the building rebalance.

My conclusion so far is that this update gave us more options and made the game more dynamic, less cookie cutter,

[PhailRaptor]

1 hour ago, clickrush said:

Just note that you are still converting *something* when feeding critters, even if you free up water when cooking meat/eggs etc.

This is true for everything except Woolly Dreckos.  Because they can eat Balm Lilies, they create Phosphorite from nothing.  This is because Balm Lilies do not require anything to grow beyond a Chlorine atmosphere.  There is no resource consumed for the plant to grow.  As long as the plant grows, the Dreckos will eat the plant when they are hungry, and produce Phosphorite in proportion to how much they eat.

[TehPlayer14]

I now struggle with food on new bases

[Greep]

I think people are obsessed because it's new, and thus fun (why we play games :D).  When you work it out, automized mushrooms is an extremely small footprint and it's the least labor intense food process in the game aside from pacu eggs, which are not really viable long term from what I've seen.  It's even slightly less resources than BBQ, when you consider each peppernut is about ~9KG/cycle polluted water.

Omelettes is interesting just because with certain setups, it is 100% free.  And, in some cases, has a very useful byproduct going with it.  But you don't really need them, unless maybe you're going for a 10,000+cycle fortress.

[Oozinator]

25 minutes ago, Greep said:

I think people are obsessed because it's new, and thus fun (why we play games :D).  When you work it out, automized mushrooms is an extremely small footprint and it's the least labor intense food process in the game aside from pacu eggs, which are not really viable long term from what I've seen.  It's even slightly less resources than BBQ, when you consider each peppernut is about ~9KG/cycle polluted water.

Omelettes is interesting just because with certain setups, it is 100% free.  And, in some cases, has a very useful byproduct going with it.  But you don't really need them, unless maybe you're going for a 10,000+cycle fortress.

Only when you plant / farm them.
When you only use natural grown food, it's very easy.
Wild bristles are not worth the time, but maelwood/mushrooms and peppernuts..
When i have more then 3 in reach for a farm, i build one around = win..

[vovik]

1 minute ago, Oozinator said:

Only when you plant / farm them.
When you only use natural grown food, it's very easy.
Wild bristles are not worth the time, but maelwood/mushrooms and peppernuts..
When i have more then 3 in reach for a farm, i build one around = win..

Why we havent got the option to replant them and grow them same as wild? We already can exploit game to grow plants in wild, then why we cannot grow them with same speed as wild in farms? Its not a bug, its intended, then why not making life significantly easier? Why klei force people to use their binary design?

[Oozinator]

Just now, vovik said:

Why we havent got the option to replant them and grow them same as wild? We already can exploit game to grow plants in wild, then why we cannot grow them with same speed as wild in farms? Its not a bug, its intended, then why not making life significantly easier? Why klei force people to use their binary design?

ONI is easy.
Enough of every ressource.
Growing plants in the wild must have some negative stuff, like grow speed / farmtile.

[vovik]

3 minutes ago, Oozinator said:

ONI is easy.
Enough of every ressource.
Growing plants in the wild must have some negative stuff, like grow speed / farmtile.

Sure, it has, but it does not grow when replanted, dang it! it has both boxes checked for wild growth but doesnt grow likein wild... and that bugs me out

 

[Denisetwin]

14 hours ago, blash365 said:

I am not using eggs at all. Too much hassle to make sure that the right eggs are being used.

Only mushrooms and meat.

ditto this.  Except I have a seven plant blossom farm to make stuffed berry for the dupes with the higher requirements.  I keep it at seven as that's how many I can fit under one light and it's quick for a farmer to fertilize.