New geysers are awful

[Technoincubus]

75 cycle dormancy period? 92 cycle dormancy period?

They are practically useles now. Fertilizer power plants from good addition became a must, as without them there are no reliable power sources. Even coal generators are not as sable and nat gas geysers with astronomical dormancy periods cannot even sustain a small base.

Geysers needed a rework but this is a Blizzard style fix - from super effective to utterly useless.

[BlueLance]

And here I must be the only one who loves it. 

There are several forms of power generation, cycle between them. Running low on coal? Time to use that hydrogen I have been saving, Oh my automation has kicked in because that Natural Gas geyser is spewing out the good stuff, mmmm yummy. Natural Gas has run out, Oh Boy at least I have all that petroleum from that immense amount of Oil that always spawns at the bottom of the map.

Metal is renewable in some forms, so upgrade your power generators. Steam can now be made using the volcanoes, Carbon Dioxide from a geyser can be fed to slicksters or removed using carbon skimmers for water, sand isn't exactly a scarce resource so there is water, Polluted water geyser = more water, water/steam geysers = more water. Enough heat generation to boil water.

So i dno, I feel maybe your using too little of what is made available to you if power is your main concern. Batteries and hamster wheels if all else fails. My base runs off of Hydrogen / Nat Gas / Coal / Petroleum in that order.

With less Nat Gas being produced I am happy because so much of it just sat lying around that I started getting ready to freeze it all just so I could store more. Then this came out. 

Edit - I do not want another update nerfed because someone is unflexible, Germs were actually a part of the game at one point, but people didn't like the idea of building sinks and cried, now germs are a colourful pigment which just happens to multiply. 

[Technoincubus]

I cannot disagree with you more.

This change does not add any variety or force players to diversify their infrastructure.

I will not build any natgas pump or gens for natgas geyser now - I will build a fert.synth plant which will never stop for 97 cycles. And even if I will, now geyser barely can sustain its own infrastructure.

What is worse, water from already semi-limited resource moved to extremely limited. All water geyser gains could be used within several cycles and then it wll be gone for 100 or o cycles.

This update promotes tedium and workaround semi-exploitive solutions. Who used generator tuning, which required refined metal? None whom I know among my friends who play ONI, no streamer even touched it, except to see what it does.

[cpy]

We definitely need configuration for geysers. We need to be able to set conditions from non renewable base to barely one to fully renewable base.

[BlueLance]

11 minutes ago, Technoincubus said:

I will not build any natgas pump or gens for natgas geyser now - I will build a fert.synth plant which will never stop for 97 cycles. And even if I will, now geyser barely can sustain its own infrastructure.

This update promotes tedium and workaround semi-exploitive solutions. Who used generator tuning, which required refined metal? None whom I know among my friends who play ONI, no streamer even touched it, except to see what it does.

Unflexible. 

Metal is renewable now. So if you have excess metal, use it why let it sit doing nothing. I mean if you put it to numbers, there is enough metal to spew out hundreds of power upgrades without any new metal. That's several hundred cycles. Personally I do not use them, but I rarely have any power issues on the current experimental patch, but if I find a metal volcano I will use the metal because that means I do not need to use as much hydrogen or natural gas. Heck i would use steam power if I needed to.

Again, use a resource when you have it. Automation is there for a reason, you set it up and let it do the tedious management for you.

[SamLogan]

1 hour ago, Technoincubus said:

75 cycle dormancy period? 92 cycle dormancy period?

They are practically useles now. Fertilizer power plants from good addition became a must, as without them there are no reliable power sources. Even coal generators are not as sable and nat gas geysers with astronomical dormancy periods cannot even sustain a small base.

Geysers needed a rework but this is a Blizzard style fix - from super effective to utterly useless.

Natural Gaz geyser is not needed to get a lot of electricity. Before, Klei added the geysers system we made huge base without it.

[Risu]

Still waiting on them to nerf fertilizer makers so they being overpowered stops influencing their development of other systems. Due to those fertilizer makers petrol generators, steam generators, and now natural gas geysers, have foregone any balancing because nobody ever puts in the time to test them and report their opinions on them to the developers.
 

[Technoincubus]

Oh I am flexible.

I actively search for workarounds anв solutions to current problems. Flexibility is not using what you have, it is adapting to current problems and minimizing the harm. It is not about using what you are offered but NOT using what you don't need. Not using ineffective things.

For me that means that I will not build any infrastructure around nat.geysers - I won't even touch them - it is not worth the time and effort. Just like that in previous patches I never touched bristle blossom growing because meallice was sufficient to feed entire colony.   

 

[BlueLance]

7 minutes ago, Technoincubus said:

it is adapting to current problems and minimizing the harm.

Then adapt and stop complaining.

Simple solution. Voicing that you do not like something is fine and all, but it has been out for one day and since from the looks of it all you used was Nat Gas.

[Hanro50]

They buffed hatches...

This means they've indirectly buffed coal generation, now automation has a freaking use now. Its the rancher upgrade, not the geyser overhaul upgrade.

I don't agree that in order to make things useful, other things need to be hit by the nerf hammer of doom, but to be fair the game relies a bit to much on geysers as it is. 

You also have the option to run some steam turbine setups since those can make efficient use of magma 

Metal is renewable now and with some clever play you can up your production of power easily. Coal generators can be turned off with automation as well which can greatly reduce power wastage.

Also fertilizers are far from the only things that can produce 60g/s of nat gas for a mere 480w. Look into some of the petroleum stuff. You can get something that can basically give you 4320w net with just a little bit of oil, dupe power and ingenuity. 

After all geysers where nerfed, but there are other ways to survive

 

[Technoincubus]

1 hour ago, BlueLance said:

Then adapt and stop complaining.

Simple solution. Voicing that you do not like something is fine and all, but it has been out for one day and since from the looks of it all you used was Nat Gas.

What a hell are yout alking about? It is a forum for a EARLY ACCESS game. t was meant to gather feedback.

Also, I never said that my power system was mainly nat.gas based. I said natgas generators supplied from geyser is the best example of a game structure I will never use with new system, not because I based all my colonies on natgas geyser, but because it is not worth it.

Same with water, which is now semi-limited due to high demand in a colony and geysers unable to supply the colony with even basic requirements.

[Ray_Garraty]

2 hours ago, Technoincubus said:

Who used generator tuning, which required refined metal?

I use generator tuning a lot. I have 1 or 2 dedicated electrical engineers for this task. I also usually try to build smart batteries asap to shut my generators down via automation to avoid natural gas wasting. Natural gas geysers are too OP as of the Occupational update, good thing they nerfed them.

[greggbert]

I just don't see the problem.

I'm at turn 270, have 12 dupes, and 100% of my power comes from a single natural gas geyser hooked to 4 constantly tuned generators.  I have a valve set to 150 on my natural gas source, so it does not give the generators a full blast of natural gas.  I am also using all the Gas output from my refinery and fertilizer directly to the generators and the single geyser is keeping up fine.   Just found the second one.  Only one fertilizer maker.  Since My main food is fried mushrooms I always have way too much water and have not even touched a steam geyser yet. 

 

I don't see an end even close.

 

[Lifegrow]

6 minutes ago, greggbert said:

I just don't see the problem.

I'm at turn 270, have 12 dupes, and 100% of my power comes from a single natural gas geyser hooked to 4 constantly tuned generators.  I have a valve set to 150 on my natural gas source, so it does not give the generators a full blast of natural gas.  I am also using all the Gas output from my refinery and fertilizer directly to the generators and the single geyser is keeping up fine.   Just found the second one.  Only one fertilizer maker.  Since My main food is fried mushrooms I always have way too much water and have not even touched a steam geyser yet. 

 

I don't see an end even close.

 

In fairness though, cycle 270 is nothing - i'm curious what peoples thoughts on the proposed changes will be when we get further into the 1000+ colonies - ones where heat management become the only real goal of the game.

That and building absolutely everything out of metal and plastic  

[greggbert]

LOL maybe I'm just not that hard core.  If I'm at cycle  1000 I'm probably gonna take a break for a few months and play civ 6.

[Lifegrow]

Just now, greggbert said:

LOL maybe I'm just not that hard core.  If I'm at cycle  1000 I'm probably gonna take a break for a few months and play civ 6.

Sorry, didn't mean for that to sound like an insult - I just meant that realistically by cycle 270 you wont have built a "feature rich" colony - you may have a few basics dealt with like you mentioned a mushroom supply for food - but have you made it sustainable? are you farming slime? Are you balanced on water usage, polluted water generation, etc etc.

I'm not saying you have to play like this, just that a lot of people do - and a lot of people play the game to try and use most of the features at hand. In my latest playthrough, one of my goals is to use every method of power generation, for example. Also, I too relied on mushrooms heavily - but my next goal is to compliment those delicious fungi with bristle blossoms and sleet wheat, etc etc.

 

[SkunkMaster]

53 minutes ago, Lifegrow said:

Also, I too relied on mushrooms heavily

Same here, and i can tell I haven't had to grow a single mushroom in my new game, so far atleast.

Hatch egg production alone creates a lot of food, and it seems now the whole food eco system is much more balanced. You can now build a little of all and thrive just fine.

 

So far i really like the new update. - they just need to get rid of those silly bugs like critters not eating from the feeders, or game crashing when critters jump up on open door frames.

[chemie]

Water is my biggest concern.  Everyone is worried about Nat gas?  What water for O2?  Or water for food?  Or are berries and wheat now dead and eggs the forced food source because no water for 100 cycles?

[Amara313]

Just now, chemie said:

Water is my biggest concern.  Everyone is worried about Nat gas?  What water for O2?  Or water for food?  Or are berries and wheat now dead and eggs the forced food source because no water for 100 cycles?

I guess I've never had a base go for so long that I actually ran 100% out of water.  You can always clean water out of the slime bios and melt the frozen biomes.  There should be water for 1000's of cycles, unless you are building massive farms.  

I really think the developers are trying to push us away from permanent solutions to things.  Nat Gas Geysers that constantly erupt, water geysers that always give water.  It becomes more of a game of what can you do to survive if you don't always have everything you need.  If you don't rely only on sleet wheat and berries, but have some of each type of food, then your colony is more resilient to changes. And more fun. 

[SkunkMaster]

25 minutes ago, chemie said:

Water is my biggest concern.  Everyone is worried about Nat gas?  What water for O2?  Or water for food?  Or are berries and wheat now dead and eggs the forced food source because no water for 100 cycles?

Eggs are a fantastic source of food, right now atleast!

Virtually no input, other then what you feed the hatches, and the time of the dupe who groomes the hatches.  

Incubators don't generate heat, and only consume 120w. Making a farm now with hatches, just for food, is quite easy. I would even say Very easy.

[watermelen671]

6 hours ago, BlueLance said:

Then adapt and stop complaining.

Simple solution. Voicing that you do not like something is fine and all, but it has been out for one day and since from the looks of it all you used was Nat Gas.

*Coughs* Uh...what about the MAJOR backlash that happened when they released the day the Occupational Upgrade released?

[trukogre]

9 minutes ago, watermelen671 said:

*Coughs* Uh...what about the MAJOR backlash that happened when they released the day the Occupational Upgrade released?

People adapted and stopped complaining, from what I can see.

[SkunkMaster]

10 minutes ago, watermelen671 said:

*Coughs* Uh...what about the MAJOR backlash that happened when they released the day the Occupational Upgrade released?

That stems in the fact that the system was not fully developed. 

Now the story looks different, seeing the system is more of a hybrid of both systems, with added micro management on per dupe basis. 

 

What goes for geysers, i can't see any major backlash yet. What i see is the typical resistance to change, which usually dim out when people get more experience with the new patch. 

[watermelen671]

8 minutes ago, trukogre said:

People adapted and stopped complaining, from what I can see.

Actually, the entire thing was scrapped, and then reworked into what it is now.

[trukogre]

20 minutes ago, watermelen671 said:

Actually, the entire thing was scrapped, and then reworked into what it is now.

That's true, but it's also true that because development takes time, they had already started reworking it before people had a chance to adapt and give their second opinion,  like the disease system was ruined based on an overly hasty nerf, done before people had a chance to adapt.  They nerfed occupations so quickly that I don't honestly know what my final opinion of the old system would have been, I just didn't get enough hours in to give a real opinion post-adaptation period of that model--I also took a vacation in that time period where I was away from home/computer that contributed but still, it's a quick turnaround for these changes all things considered. And so, my original statement is still true; "people adapted and stopped complaining, from what I can see"--the fact that there was a rework doesn't falsify that statement, it just makes it harder to see what really happened, would people have adapted without the rework? no way to know for sure.