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Best Character to Start With for a Beginner?


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7 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

Re: Wicker's biggest drawback is sanity.

You're taking it out of context.

13 hours ago, LuxuryHeart said:

Wicker's biggest drawback is sanity.  That's not a good thing since new players don't really know much about sanity regain.

Wickerbottom doesn't gain sanity from building t1 science items. She has to deal with 2 Terrorbeaks to get out of insanity vs. other characters' 1. She needs 2-3 more sanity restoration items in comparison for a comfortable state.

What better way to discourage players from using her books or encourage over-preparation for readings when they haven't learned to fight their shadows yet.

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28 minutes ago, HamBatter said:

She has to deal with 2 Terrorbeaks to get out of insanity vs. other characters' 1.

What? Other characters are able to get stuck with two terrorbeaks as well. When you're insane you can have up to two shadow creatures chasing after you (more if there happens to be other players close to being insane) and there's always the possibility of both of them being terrorbeaks. That's not something unique to Wickerbottom.

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3 hours ago, Arash70 said:

WX78,

why?

Ease of exploration, health regeneration and caving

Absolutely not WX.

Why?

"were is base and do u have gears ne1?"

Also because noobs usually think he can eat monster meat.

14 hours ago, LuxuryHeart said:

The problem I have with Webber are the pigs.  Most new players don't avoid pigs, and travel in the morning (when they do travel).  I wouldn't suggest him until they are more comfortable with traveling at night.

But that's the whole point!  They're the jesters!  Why there isn't a mod to change the game's music to Yakkety Sax any time pigs or bunnymen draw aggro on Webber is a mystery to me.

 

@Sinister_Fang yes, anybody can be attacked by two terrorbeaks... but only Wicker has to kill two just to get her sanity back out of the danger zone.

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9 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

This sentence alone makes it sound like you aren't skilled enough to understand Wickerbottom.

topic

 

4 hours ago, grantis45 said:

Spider nests dont die in summer, not sure where you're getting this from.

Moreso referring to their burning, whereas Ponds don't. A new player might not be prepped enough to protect their Spider Nests from Summer smoldering, particularly with the Grass Traps around it potentially causing more fires. Much bigger deal if the source of your food burns than just the traps.

 

6 hours ago, JohnWatson said:

Same reason for Wigfrid, why she's popular is because she's popular. Go visit DST Steam Community and you'll be sure to find loads of players who believe that Wigfrid is the absolute best and most overpowered character.

Best nomad/low resource combatant. Great if you're playing with people who have no idea how to play, since resources will be pretty limited/drained by that.
Even better on public servers that lack protection mods. The fridge will be emptied a few moments after you fill it, and no amount of farming will change that.
...also good on servers that do have protection mods, since people will horde things and lock them in private containers for the aforementioned reason. She can get food easily even in those conditions...unless the server has MyHome, in which case 99% of the time one of the koala tracks will be just barely inside of a locked fence, along with any of the remaining pig/bunny huts. I have a real love/hate relationship with that mod.

But yea, even if people don't like to admit it, all but one every character has something that they are the best at even if some characters could stand to be better. It's a matter of whether you like to use their strengths/whether you'll be in situations where those strengths will be useful.

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14 hours ago, Sinister_Fang said:

Well, you have to admit you can see their logic there though. It's a living tree so you'd think a woodcutting tool would do some extra damage against it. I'll admit I was guilty of thinking that when I was still new to the game...

LOL!  When you think of it that way...

12 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

This sentence alone makes it sound like you aren't skilled enough to understand Wickerbottom.
Wicker still has access to mushrooms, cactus flesh, tam o shanters, even ice cream. The only sanity related drawback to Wicker is that she can't sleep... Saying Wickerbottom's biggest drawback is sanity because she can't sleep is like saying that a character's biggest drawback is hunger because they can't eat corn.
Sleeping is one of the worst ways to regain sanity (up there with flower picking and hugging Glommer), so playing Wicker is actually going to help new players in the long run since they won't be able to rely on it.

I'm great with Wicker and know multiple ways to gain sanity.  Though I didn't know as a new player, and I had to learn through the hardships.  Most new players think of flower garlands and tents to gain sanity, so she won't be easy for them.  This is why I say Wilson because he's balanced with no drawbacks.  

9 hours ago, JohnWatson said:

The reason why new players pick Wilson and Willow over other characters is because of popularity. Those two characters are on every DST promotional content. Same reason for Wigfrid, why she's popular is because she's popular. Go visit DST Steam Community and you'll be sure to find loads of players who believe that Wigfrid is the absolute best and most overpowered character. Remember that the Klei forums are a very tiny fraction of the entire playerbase.

Wickerbottom is still easy mode regardless if you're skilled or not. Her sole downside is merely that she can't sleep. I'd say that's an upside actually, because she prevents the player from wasting time.

Wilson is popular just like Mario.  Not only are they promotional, but they are balanced.  He has no downsides, and he has balanced stats; he's average.  Though the thing about average characters are, they get discarded eventually.  Sure Wilson is popular for new players as practice, though people eventually settle into their playing style.  Fighters want Wolfgang/Wigfrid, settlers want Wicker and Maxwell, gatherers want Webber and Wendy, and explorers want WX-78 and Willow.  

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13 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

Sleeping is one of the worst ways to regain sanity (up there with flower picking and hugging Glommer), so playing Wicker is actually going to help new players in the long run since they won't be able to rely on it.

Actually, as I was a beginner, sleeping was extremely useful for recovering, not only for sanity but also for health. So if a beginner doesn't have other, faster/better ways at hand, why not sleep? With time he will learn the other methods anyways, and the tent is a useful help on the way. And I think that, especially at the beginning, the goal is to simply survive, not to survive immediately the best way.

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On 03/07/2017 at 9:32 PM, JohnWatson said:

Wickerbottom is still easy mode regardless if you're skilled or not. Her sole downside is merely that she can't sleep. I'd say that's an upside actually, because she prevents the player from wasting time.

+1 to this. Unless you're specifically farming nightmare fuel or going adventuring in the caves or dancing with spiders every night, Wicker's huge sanity should be enough to give you a good start before you can build a base or prototype sanity-gaining items or food.

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On 7/3/2017 at 2:06 PM, HamBatter said:

You're taking it out of context.

Wickerbottom doesn't gain sanity from building t1 science items. She has to deal with 2 Terrorbeaks to get out of insanity vs. other characters' 1. She needs 2-3 more sanity restoration items in comparison for a comfortable state.

What better way to discourage players from using her books or encourage over-preparation for readings when they haven't learned to fight their shadows yet.

Thank you!  They are not realizing that this is for BEGINNERS.  I know that as a beginner, I wasn't thinking about how being insane could help me farm nightmare fuel.  I was thinking about how much of a nuisance it was, and how the tent won't help and the flowers aren't doing much.  I didn't have a lot of silk either since I didn't know you could use traps on spiders.  Wicker was not my favorite character at the beginning to say the least.  Though as I found other ways to gain sanity, I liked her a lot more and she's one of my mains now.

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On 7/3/2017 at 4:13 PM, Pyr0mrcow said:

But yea, even if people don't like to admit it, all but one every character has something that they are the best at even if some characters could stand to be better. It's a matter of whether you like to use their strengths/whether you'll be in situations where those strengths will be useful.

 

I'm just curious what you think Wes is best at -- besides humor value of course (where he really shines, especially running around w. a flower parasol or a whirly-fan)?  I grant, he's not bad for nightmare fuel farming, with the balloons being a good way to get sanity down and keep it there.  In fact that's my favorite way to bail on a game when real-life interferes, just crazy-up and farm until I miss enough kiting to die and then bail out.  But, realistically, Maxie is better at it.

 

On-topic:  I'm of the opinion that Wilson is best for new players.  No really important special advantages until winter -- where they do often find the beard useful -- and no disadvantages.

 

(but, really, Wes w. a parasol or whirly-fan is my goto character)

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The best way to teach new players is to teach them the easiest way.

4 hours ago, LuxuryHeart said:

you could use traps on spiders.

You could use your F key on spiders too. Takes three hits with a spear. Lone spiders can be stunlocked. Groups can be kited if you synchronise them, which is certain since they come out of the den simultaneously.

New players who use traps on spiders will find the game significantly harder than if they were to simply use their F key. Again, teach new players the easiest way. One trap can kill 8 spiders. One spear can kill 50 spiders. And let's not forget that spears are the only weapons you can use. With the Ham Bat, you can kill up to a maximum of 4284 spiders throughout its lifetime (assuming you just kill spiders non-stop for 10 days, even then, you can kill as many spiders as you want with it).

Let's also not pretend that traps are easier to make than a spear. One spear costs 2 twigs, 3 grass, and 1 flint to craft. Each trap costs 1 twig and 6 grass to craft. You need 6.25 traps to kill as many spiders as one spear can, which costs 6.25 twigs and 37.5 grass. That amount of grass would require a fairly large grass farm, which would be a pain to make, harvest, and maintain for new players.

EDIT: Let's also not pretend that traps are easier to use than weapons. Spiders can be killed in merely three hits from a spear, you will find that this is a great time-saver. Even in groups, they are still a doddle since they are very predictable. Just dodge every two hits. A Tentacle Spike or Ham Bat, which kills spiders in two hits, will save even more time. Meanwhile, traps are annoying to use and wastes time. Multiple traps means you've to going through multiple crafting animations. You then need to place down each trap with your mouse pointer. After a spider is caught, you need to pick them up so you then need to place them down individually again. How fun. 

In conclusion, traps are rubbish and waste your time. Just press your F key.

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On 7/3/2017 at 1:31 AM, LuxuryHeart said:

It's a reason that most new players use Wilson and/or Willow as opposed to Wicker.  

Do you mean fact? Do you have any data to back up that statement?

3 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

I don't think you should be giving beginners any advice, honestly.

LuxuryHeart, how many hours do you have in DST? Why would you recommend Willow if the character has a harder time staying sane than most? Based on your previous statements, you made it sound as if beginners should just use Wilson and Willow because everyone else does. If you're going to be giving out advice to beginners as to who they should start out with, at least make sure that you've given all the characters a try and have spent some time with them.

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Isn't LuxuryHeart the same player who posted that they never use golden tools and... yes, here it is:

Seasons: I only use a winter hat and thermal stone in winter.  Anything else is a waste of resources.  I only use an umbrella and straw hat for summer and spring since it's a dual purpose combo.  I mostly use top hats or mushrooms for sanity (so no garland or dapper vest).  I also don't use a feather or bush hat.

 

So while the enthusiasm is admirable, maybe there isn't really enough knowledge of the game yet to be offering advice.

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20 hours ago, JellyUltra said:

I don't think you should be giving beginners any advice, honestly.

I obviously know NOW, though I didn't as a beginner.  Though I guess I'm supposed to magically know everything about a game as soon as I get it.

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17 hours ago, TheKingDedede said:

Do you mean fact? Do you have any data to back up that statement?

LuxuryHeart, how many hours do you have in DST? Why would you recommend Willow if the character has a harder time staying sane than most? Based on your previous statements, you made it sound as if beginners should just use Wilson and Willow because everyone else does. If you're going to be giving out advice to beginners as to who they should start out with, at least make sure that you've given all the characters a try and have spent some time with them.

Most new players that I come across use Wilson since he's the default character.  They don't use other characters until later on.

Willow can stand by a fire and become sane, she can use sleeping rolls and a tent.  Garlands are good with her since it doesn't take much to become sane.  Her lighter in the day time is a great sanity boost.  

I have given characters a try as a beginner, and I didn't like a lot of them until I became more experienced.  The problem is that you're seeing this from a pros point of view.  I've said that once people know the game, they pick characters based on their style of play.  I use Wicker, Webber, and Wolfgang the most now because I know their advantages and how to get over their disadvantages.  Though I would not recommend them to new players at all because Wicker has problem with sanity (she can't sleep and she has no unique way of gaining it like Willow), Wolfgang needs a lot of food (which most new players have a hard time with), and Webber can't go by pigs (which a lot of new players go by).  

12 hours ago, Rellimarual said:

Isn't LuxuryHeart the same player who posted that they never use golden tools and... yes, here it is:

Seasons: I only use a winter hat and thermal stone in winter.  Anything else is a waste of resources.  I only use an umbrella and straw hat for summer and spring since it's a dual purpose combo.  I mostly use top hats or mushrooms for sanity (so no garland or dapper vest).  I also don't use a feather or bush hat.

 

So while the enthusiasm is admirable, maybe there isn't really enough knowledge of the game yet to be offering advice.

Oh no I conserve resources and don't like golden tools!  giphy.gif

 

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16 minutes ago, LuxuryHeart said:

Oh no I conserve resources and don't like golden tools!  

Well... you can just use the pig king to get some gold. It's easily renewable, just some cooked meat and you got 1 gold instead of having to waste flint on 5 different tools can get done with just 1 gold tool. 

But hey, what do I know, right? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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7 minutes ago, Chris1488 said:

Well... you can just use the pig king to get some gold. It's easily renewable, just some cooked meat and you got 1 gold instead of having to waste flint on 5 different tools can get done with just 1 gold tool. 

But hey, what do I know, right? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Meh, I would rather not.  I just don't care for golden tools, and I generally just make regular tools.  I have a lot of excess flint anyway, so I'll put it to use.

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The idea that the top hat is your best bet for sanity is probably more of a giveaway. I have gone back to flint tools when we've got more twigs and flint than I care to store, but that only tends to happen when I'm living in the caves for a good part of the year.

Theres nothing wrong with your play style and choices if they make you happy. It's just a bit premature to be offering advice to others before you're really familiar with the game. It's nice that you made the effort, though.

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Again, I don't think you should be giving people advice whenever you don't understand how the game works.

7 hours ago, LuxuryHeart said:

Willow can stand by a fire and become sane

If you sit by a fire for 10+ minutes, that is. She can get up to 11 sanity per minute, emphasis on up to, since you'd have to be burning multiple objects to get it that high.
If you'd rather run around wasting time and burning resources for sanity instead of just grabbing some mushrooms or cactus, then yes, Willow would be a good choice.

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 she can use sleeping rolls and a tent.  

Straw rolls and tents are awful for sanity. They convert hunger to health and sanity, but they also waste precious time. For Willow (the character you keep recommending) to get sane from just a tent, it would take two full minutes. In that time, you could've grabbed some cactus flesh, tumbleweeds, and been on the way to kill some volt goats, taking care of your sanity problems and more.

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Garlands are good with her since it doesn't take much to become sane.

Garlands are awful. Period. 1.33 sanity per minute isn't even enough to stop the sanity drain at dusk. It's not good as ANY character.

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Her lighter in the day time is a great sanity boost. 

The lighter is 0.6 sanity per minute. Even worse than a garland
Just because you see the little arrow on your sanity meter doesn't mean you're getting a great sanity boost.

And you know what? None of this even matters. Because insanity isn't going to instantly kill you like some people make it out to be. Nightmare creatures are one of the easiest mobs to kite in the game. Just hit them once, dodge, hit them once, wait for them to teleport, and repeat. You get your sanity back and some nightmare fuel.

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20 minutes ago, JellyUltra said:

1.33 sanity per second isn't even enough to stop the sanity drain at dusk.

1.33 sanity per second is more that enough against the dusk and the most monsters :p

But I guess you meant 1.33/minute ;) (The same goes to the lighter, btw)

 

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It sounds like we're drifting into debating specific tactics and items and individual player skill-levels ... in a thread about which character is a good choice to learn the game on.  I mean, is a garland being good or bad pertinent to which character is good to learn with?  Just sayin'.

 

To keep it on-topic I'll note that my favorite, Wes, is NOT a good choice for this.  I still think Wilson is the best, as he is the most generic and will teach you less character-specific habits.  (barring his beard making cold a bit easier -- but in defense of "still Wilson" most really new people won't make it to Winter anyway)

 

With that I'm off.  Time for laundry and dinner, and to go donate several boxes of books to charity.  Toodles!

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5 minutes ago, absimiliard said:

It sounds like we're drifting into debating specific tactics and items and individual player skill-levels ... in a thread about which character is a good choice to learn the game on.  I mean, is a garland being good or bad pertinent to which character is good to learn with?  Just sayin'.

 

To keep it on-topic I'll note that my favorite, Wes, is NOT a good choice for this.  I still think Wilson is the best, as he is the most generic and will teach you less character-specific habits.  (barring his beard making cold a bit easier -- but in defense of "still Wilson" most really new people won't make it to Winter anyway)

 

With that I'm off.  Time for laundry and dinner, and to go donate several boxes of books to charity.  Toodles!

Thank you!  Wilson is not my favorite character and neither is Willow.  I main Wicker, Wolfgang, and Webber.  Though even I can see that they aren't good for beginners, which most people in this thread aren't seeing.  They think their favorite character is the right character.  Not the case though.

Willow and Wilson are great because they are balanced with very few drawbacks.  Wilson is the best for beginners, though Willow is great too because of her lighter.  

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