After so much talk about Power Creep, here we are again.

[Szczuku]

4 minutes ago, Dextops said:

All this did was add more interesting mechanics and customization. You seem more upset at the fact that it was added in the way of skill trees than the actual skill trees themselves

Wormwood (finally) having an interaction with all this lunar stuff isn't the problem. The problem is that this interaction isn't naturally integrated with the gameplay or unlocked in some clever way, it's literally a toggle that a player might choose to enable. It's boring and uninspired.

Plus it's a 'one and done' deal; you get all 15 points and you get free bonuses for the rest of the game, not just that world. Because that's what they are, straight up extra perks, with no depth, shallow as a puddle.

If they were unlocked via... idunno some actual player effort and engagement and needed to be unlocked every playthrough, then sure, some of them would be pretty cool, I guess. Something like: butterflies no longer flee from Wormwood after he plants 10 flowers. After 40 days Woodie's wereforms become stronger, after another 40 he masters them. Overtime Wolfgang masters planar weapons and can use them more effectively. Scratch all this skill tree nonsense, add these perks the way I've described, remove the useless ones such as Wormwood's farmhand and bee perks and create some sort of... skillboard or something where you can see which skill's you've 'discovered' thus far, plus maybe some small hints on how to unlock some perks such as 'Wormwood would like to help flowers grow' or 'Woolfgang needs to practise using certain weapons'

[Well-met]

fix all the mob, wall and lureplant cheese then the perks could be justified

[Capybara007]

2 minutes ago, Well-met said:

fix all the mob, wall and lureplant cheese then the perks could be justified

why

[SadeceAtakan]

10 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

Something like: butterflies no longer flee from Wormwood after he plants 10 flowers. After 40 days Woodie's wereforms become stronger, after another 40 he masters them. Overtime Wolfgang masters planar weapons and can use them more effectively.

I wish it was like this. I'm not a big fan of unlocking something just by sitting at the base. 

[Well-met]

10 minutes ago, Capybara007 said:

why

to make the game harder and balance it out my guy

[Dextops]

13 minutes ago, BezKa said:

Those are free power ups. You can talk about 150 days, but that's next to nothing. Barely more than two in-game years. And the payment is one time only- every new world you start, you have those perks for absolutely free. People say those are "late game stuff", but they aren't

What’s exactly the problem with that? The same argument could’ve been made against the original reworks. It also would’ve been much worse if you had to redo the tree every world

 

14 minutes ago, BezKa said:

Skill trees are the most boring and uncreative way to implement new character perks. I'd be more accepting of them if the perks had to be activated in some kind of structure. Hell, keep the UI, just don't let those things clutter the menu, inspect screen and pop an annoying notification every time you survived another 10 days. I'd still be unhappy with that solution however.

That doesn’t really explain anything those are pretty vague terms. Yeah I agree some of the UI could use more work but to me  this was an amazing way to add more choices creativity and customization to the game .

 

54 minutes ago, BezKa said:

Skill trees just don't fit into the game, stylistically. The game was always self contained inside the actual world, + skins if you're into that. But those are also accessed via wardrobe, instead of just clicking an icon and changing your skin any time. The skill trees stick out.

I disagree again. I think they look nice and I like the details added once you choose an alignment. They have the same colours as the new crafting menu.

 

1 hour ago, BezKa said:

The whole Wilson thing. I hate skill trees, but if only one character was doomed by them, I could somewhat accept it. Now that everyone is going to have one, Wilson is still nothing. You can't even argue he's the starting character, because "he has a skill tree that guides players" isn't an argument anymore.

I really don’t get the whole Wilson argument. You guys make it seem like every skill tree is a copy of Wilson’s when that isn’t the case. Wilson still has all the perks he had from before this update. This is like someone getting new upsides and then getting mad when another character gets completely different upsides. It doesn’t make sense to me. Yes you can make the argument that Wilson’s tree sucks but that’s more a problem with his rework than this update.

 

 

This definitely shows more light on the other side of the argument and there are some things I agree with and hopefully Klei can think about including those but I think acting like these trees are the end of the world and ignoring all the amazing things they added and can add in the future is counterproductive. Characters like woodie who I would’ve never ever chosen in a million years because all his forms were useless and he suffered with moonstorms is now seeing more like a reoccurring pick to me. The same applies to wormwood. I’m really excited for the future skill trees as I expect it to make me branch out into other characters more often as before this most characters were relatively similar.

[Milordo]

4 hours ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Just to note, the skill trees are not late game, you can spawn in with all the points to spend on it day 1. Also things like Woodie's lunar perk which makes him have 0 downsides are kinda "eh".

This ^

1 hour ago, Dextops said:

Could you explain why? I’ve been very confused on why people seem to dislike this update and all I’ve really seen is insults and very flat surface level arguments.

There is my post also if you want more lights up in the argument

1 hour ago, BezKa said:

Someone mentioned how Walter already does it better- where his kit gets expanded by reaching places of importance, the ruins. Cursed rounds are actual good example of lategame content unlocking in-world. Balance and all that aside because I'm only talking about the unlocking part.

I think it was me right? Because I see almost nobody brings about the "surprise" progression perk of Walter in the discussion, nor Wanda ones....nor Wx for Costant sake...

[Dextops]

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

If they were unlocked via... idunno some actual player effort and engagement and needed to be unlocked every playthrough, then sure, some of them would be pretty cool, I guess. Something like: butterflies no longer flee from Wormwood after he plants 10 flowers. After 40 days Woodie's wereforms become stronger, after another 40 he masters them. Overtime Wolfgang masters planar weapons and can use them more effectively. Scratch all this skill tree nonsense, add these perks the way I've described, remove the useless ones such as Wormwood's farmhand and bee perks and create some sort of... skillboard or something where you can see which skill's you've 'discovered' thus far, plus maybe some small hints on how to unlock some perks such as 'Wormwood would like to help flowers grow' or 'Woolfgang needs to practise using certain weapons

I think more locks would certainly be very cool (such as the ones on ancient fuelweaver and celestial champion perks) and I really hope Klei adds more of them. A good example would be to instead of having the first 2 wormwood skills which are frankly quite useless make it instead so that they’re locks and he has to do something (like you said plant flowers ect) and by doing so you’re able to unlock that branch and use your insight points. It would allow for insight to mostly remain the same but allow for the unlocking process to be obtained more from achieving things than just waiting. Something I really hope Klei is able to integrate more into the branches other than just “kill afw to get your affinity perks”

[BezKa]

2 hours ago, Dextops said:

What’s exactly the problem with that?

The problem is, either integrate them with the character from the start, or make me pay in some way to get those. Otherwise it's undeserved and needlessly complicated.

 

2 hours ago, Dextops said:

That doesn’t really explain anything those are pretty vague terms.

I can't make you understand, I thought I made myself clear- using a template with clickable options feels bad to use, instead of unlocking a blueprint. Can you imagine going to the archives, and a notification pops up that you unlocked new recipes by just going inside. That feels so much worse than the cool puzzle you have to complete.

As for the parts where you simply don't agree with me because your opinion is different, I can respect that.

2 hours ago, Milordo said:

I think it was me right? Because I see almost nobody brings about the "surprise" progression perk of Walter in the discussion, nor Wanda ones....nor Wx for Costant sake...

That's possible, I have bad memory. Good job on expanding on your post btw, we seem to agree on a lot of things and since you explained it it's gonna be easier communicating with folks.

[PROfessor13]

At least they prevented a power creep with items and bosses, only characters. Now, here me out, planar attack and defense is a bit annoying, but it balances the beginning game with the post endgame. It should help scale with skill and how far you are, but it shouldn't invalidate the beginning of the game by making it (specifically the mobs) weak against your end-game gear. However it should be worth it. The Thulicite club pales in comparison to the dark sword because it does more damage. If they needed something to have people want to get it but also not make a x2 damage dark sword, making the actual dark sword useless when you get it. This helps with that. BUT, the fact is that you don't need planar stuff because unless you want it, you don't need it. This is a problem. If you don't need something that isn't better than what you have you'll never want to get it. They really should make it that after a year or something, something that a player can't just prevent/ignore, some mobs become different, planar versions. This could be an occasional annoying spider, up to something more detrimental like a planar deerclops. This would help keep the pre-endgame still be about the same while getting slowly harder, but also establishes the importance of planar gear.

[MondayNight]

I for one am on the fence regarding this personal skill tree concept. Or "power creep" when analyzing the character re-works.

Original DS was pretty simple and straightforward in what it offered, and how it achieved that. DST became more and more complicated with passing time and not in intuitive manner (for example the AFw and CC quest lines). Bringing "uncompromising" up is a moot point: DST very existence, namely a multiplayer experience, began as a compromise; aka 1st compromise made by having other players on map, which subtracted from original's isolating and apprehensive atmosphere foremost. Other players can revive, help or otherwise compensate for one's lack of knowledge, understanding and/or skill - hence biggest compromise in relation to original solo. (Also other players on map can alter to-the-point-of-sabotage, unwillingly or not, one's game session - un-moderated pubs profusely attesting to this - amping up Survival challenges by leaps and bounds; thus a double-edged.. compromise.)
Yes, it doesn't help original devs moved on from the active, day-to-day development of the game. Or Tencent's acquisition of KLei. With these, the passage of time and competition for revenue - DST being an online service and KLei's biggest triumph till now, a proverbial "golden goose" & "cash cow" - more streamlining compromises needed to happen to assure theoretical competitiveness in today's gaming market: appealing to the-biggest-possible audience (growing player base, bigger profits). The brighter colors palette, more clean/smooth texturing and borders, partial abandonment of the original sketch-like design and themes, plot-farming and pretty complex sailing mechanics, RPG-like quests plus now skill-trees - as stated by a dev time ago, DST "will be all these and more". One certainly could say "watering down" of what made DS successful. Or, from a business & entertaining pov: evolution in other, divergent directions. To present day this formula proved to be successful: "Don't Starve" (All Steam Reviews: 86.296 - Overwhelmingly Positive; Release Date: 23 Apr, 2013) had an all-time peak 9 years ago of 16.796 players, averaging nowadays ~ 3.800 players/day, totaling ~10.25 mil.sold copies. Meanwhile "Don't Starve Together" (All Steam Reviews: 273.404 - Overwhelmingly Positive; Release Date: 21 Apr, 2016) had an all-time peak of 115.925 players 2 months ago, averaging 48.000 players/day, while totaling ~36.55 mil.sold copies. Is not hard to see which product is more appreciated en large and what design philosophy backs it up. More-so: at what time each peaked - for DST was 2 months ago, on 27 April, 2023 when "From Beyond: Taking Root" new arc update dropped. At the moment of this comment, objectively, DST is more popular than ever. Original's "hardcore Survival fans" may not like DST's current direction, but from a business point it appears its design direction is a resounding win.

Likewise, a well-made Skills Tree mechanic is undeniably fun (could've been even better if its points were earned through active engagement in-game, actions giving appropriate amounts in relation to some adequate difficulty scale). Is it proper for DST? Personally would've opted only for Wilson to have it. Even so I reckon it will become a success. Circling back to "power creep" in relation to the character re-balances: yes, it happened. And, once more, bulk player-base seems to be enjoying it even (or precisely) in lack of bigger Survival challenges. Is it good for game's shelf life? Time will tell. As always, hope dies last and my hope is for DST Survival facet to get a complex amp up as well in future, and not solely via "Moon"/Shadow elements (we still don't have Ocean weather, Seasons' weather variants, RNG-dependent meteorological events, intricate biome evolution, seasonal mobs, etc).

 

PS: in relation to character re-balance design philosophies, I've tried in past OP's "Uncompromising Survival Mode", another friend tested it recently and results were.. not impressing, to say the least; all characters perks are so much toned down to the point of "Wilsonification" = Wilson with a bit of flavor on top, but nothing meaningful for diverse game-play - more-so regarding followers-oriented characters: their minions are so weak they become superfluous. Will gloss over the general impression of "giant battle arena" mod gives too, with waves of various mobs coming for player and their camp all the time. And just point at the strangeness and unnaturalness of how mobs, and mostly giants don't interact, in turn regressing mod to late 90s designs level: everything "goes for player", ignoring each-other and whatnot. Thus breaking the immersion DST has naturally, where world feels alive, complex, with creatures interacting, allowing players to use environment to their advantage and not solely battle/melee combat their way "to victory". If OP had same game balance/design hopes from KLei.. thread is understandable. Yet definitely not desirable for DST vanilla.

[Jakepeng99]

7 hours ago, Capybara007 said:

didnt they said more difficulty is something they look forward to implement

They said this for only the late game.

2 hours ago, MostMerryTomcat said:

I for one am on the fence regarding this personal skill tree concept. Or "power creep" when analyzing the character re-works.

Original DS was pretty simple and straightforward in what it offered, and how it achieved that. DST became more and more complicated with passing time and not in intuitive manner (for example the AFw and CC quest lines). Bringing "uncompromising" up is a moot point: DST very existence, namely a multiplayer experience, began as a compromise; aka 1st compromise made by having other players on map, which subtracted from original's isolating and apprehensive atmosphere foremost. Other players can revive, help or otherwise compensate for one's lack of knowledge, understanding and/or skill - hence biggest compromise in relation to original solo. (Also other players on map can alter to-the-point-of-sabotage, unwillingly or not, one's game session - un-moderated pubs profusely attesting to this - amping up Survival challenges by leaps and bounds; thus a double-edged.. compromise.)
Yes, it doesn't help original devs moved on from the active, day-to-day development of the game. Or Tencent's acquisition of KLei. With these, the passage of time and competition for revenue - DST being an online service and KLei's biggest triumph till now, a proverbial "golden goose" & "cash cow" - more streamlining compromises needed to happen to assure theoretical competitiveness in today's gaming market: appealing to the-biggest-possible audience (growing player base, bigger profits). The brighter colors palette, more clean/smooth texturing and borders, partial abandonment of the original sketch-like design and themes, plot-farming and pretty complex sailing mechanics, RPG-like quests plus now skill-trees - as stated by a dev time ago, DST "will be all these and more". One certainly could say "watering down" of what made DS successful. Or, from a business & entertaining pov: evolution in other, divergent directions. To present day this formula proved to be successful: "Don't Starve" (All Steam Reviews: 86.296 - Overwhelmingly Positive; Release Date: 23 Apr, 2013) had an all-time peak 9 years ago of 16.796 players, averaging nowadays ~ 3.800 players/day, totaling ~10.25 mil.sold copies. Meanwhile "Don't Starve Together" (All Steam Reviews: 273.404 - Overwhelmingly Positive; Release Date: 21 Apr, 2016) had an all-time peak of 115.925 players 2 months ago, averaging 48.000 players/day, while totaling ~36.55 mil.sold copies. Is not hard to see which product is more appreciated en large and what design philosophy backs it up. More-so: at what time each peaked - for DST was 2 months ago, on 27 April, 2023 when "From Beyond: Taking Root" new arc update dropped. At the moment of this comment, objectively, DST is more popular than ever. Original's "hardcore Survival fans" may not like DST's current direction, but from a business point it appears its design direction is a resounding win.

Likewise, a well-made Skills Tree mechanic is undeniably fun (could've been even better if its points were earned via active engagement in-game, actions giving appropriate amounts in relation to some adequate difficulty scale). Is it proper for DST? Personally would've opted only for Wilson to have it. Even so I reckon it will become a success. Circling back to "power creep" in relation to the character re-balances: yes, it happened. And, once more, bulk player-base seems to be enjoying it even (or precisely) in lack of bigger Survival challenges. Is it good for game's shelf life? Time will tell. As always, hope dies last and my hope is for DST Survival facet to get a complex amp up as well in future, and not solely via "Moon"/Shadow elements (we still don't have Ocean weather, Seasons' weather variants, RNG-dependent meteorological events, intricate biome evolution, seasonal mobs, etc).

 

PS: in relation to character re-balance design philosophies, I've tried in past OP's "Uncompromising Survival Mode", another friend tested it recently and results were.. not impressing, to say the least; all characters perks are so much toned down to the point of "Wilsonification" = Wilson with a bit of flavor on top, but nothing meaningful for diverse game-play - more-so regarding followers-oriented characters: their minions are so weak to the point of superfluousness. Will gloss over the general impression of "giant battle arena" mod gives too, with waves of various mobs coming for player and their camp all the time. And just point to the strangeness and unnaturalness of how mobs, and mostly giants don't interact to the point mod reaches the level of late 90s designs: everything "goes for player", ignoring each-other and whatnot. This in turn breaking the immersion DST has naturally, where world feels alive, complex, with creatures interacting, allowing players to use environment to their advantage and not solely battle/melee combat their way "to victory". If OP had same game balance/design hopes from KLei.. thread is understandable. Yet definitely not desirable for DST vanilla.

Alota this is you saying that we should be happy as this design makes klei more money, and that dst will be more successful to broader audiences by "Watering it down". If that were their goal i don't think much people would be happy.

 

Not saying that i think this. They said they want to make new players feel less clueless, and add lategame challenge for advanced players.

[MondayNight]

1 hour ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Alota this is you saying that we should be happy as this design makes klei more money, and that dst will be more successful to broader audiences by "Watering it down". If that were their goal i don't think much people would be happy.

 

Not saying that i think this. They said they want to make new players feel less clueless, and add lategame challenge for advanced players.

I haven't wrote "we" should be happy.

I just underlined current state of affairs for both DS and DST, popularity-wise, and what is more likely the motivation, as with overwhelming majority of companies out there: to have the biggest reach possible. How? By "peppy-ing" the game and cramming more genres into it among others: Farm sim? Check. Sailing sim? Check. Adventure RPG? Check. Etc? Very check! More-so since.. Tencent. What comes following year? Perhaps combat revamp - and for sure people will complain. The ever more funny thing is.. KLei really listened to (some) suggestions. From silly "monku prime piratu", to character perks, modifications, Gorge farming, to latest anti-earthquake pillar and much-much more. Devs even went pretty hard into Survival elements (since quite the number of "veteran" players were asking time-and-again for such amp ups) via initial Acid Rain "melting" clothing and armor (that had rain protection tags) or Boulders absolutely flattening everything around players till "megabasers" starting complaining en mass. Brightshades also spawn like bunnies in heat season over-and-over-and-over again on same player-modified spots (plot-farms, transplanted plants). Am sure more Survival mechanics, entities will come - some devs stated this in a stream. Likewise the subsequent complains.

"If that were their goal i don't think much people would be happy" - check again the numbers I pointed at, DST is played more than ever presently. And it was "watered down" compared to DS for years now, as stated in my post. "Slowly boiling the frog" case-scenario. Reality is bulk player-base doesn't care (the "sleeping giant" motif). Pretty shiny skins? Goofing with friends & garlands? Console-command spawning kitchen with toilet in middle? "Haha! Take my money!". People - hard-core fans of the original - on these forums are an absolute minority when looking at those "~36.55 mil.sold copies" low-ball estimations. We're probably 100 recurrent posters here ("Terror Below" Update announcement - 60 reactions to OP) bickering among one-another, some thousands lurkers and that's that. Even if DST becomes over time a Chn MMO with N "Captain Courage the Brave and Bold" quests, NPCs loitering everywhere one sneezes, amusing flim-flam islands, funny skins galore, bright neon colors a.s.o., and with appropriate marketing, cross-overs, events - player-base will very likely still grow in foreseeable future, and not complain (the silent/indifferent majority).

So Skill Trees are here to stay. Bulk player-base will be happy because "New update, wee!". And "we" can complain about balance. Or art. Or (retcon, with plenty plot-holes and inconsistencies) "lore". Or this:

See how happy Wormwood is Woodie's yeeting "his friends"? ("in-character", huh) Or the over-all drawings' quality reminiscent of Woodie's trailer?

"We" can complain. Or begrudgingly accept this is DST's direction. Or leave "for greener pastures" when our gaming sensibilities aren't met anymore - plenty games out there to choose from.

[Shuckster]

17 hours ago, NoodlemanNed said:

I think the game is actually surprisingly similar to how it used to be back when i started in about 2018. When i was new to the game i had a pretty hard time since i had no idea where i could reliably get food, or how to deal with all creatures who acted in seemingly random ways. Enemies like spiders and pigmen function exactly as they always did, common food items still havnt had their stats changed in all these years, the biggest difference for someone picking up the game is the plethora of new perks (although many of them require you to have a basic grasp of the game before they become remotely powerful). Even the toughest threats in the game like seasonal giant and wildfires become trivial not because wx has night vision, or because woodie can walk on water, its because we learned how to deal with those threats.

I believe the real reason the game has become too forgiving is because the "good" challenge that dst offers comes through a lack of experience, and if you play a game for years while keeping up with every new update, youre preventing yourself from ever experiencing that again. In order to actually benefit from all the power creep from updates you still need to learn the game enough to know that youre capable of such power. This is why people even today quit the game out of frustration for it being too hard, the game didnt get significantly easier, you just got significantly better.

While I had my reservations with the skill tree system, and some general ideas with how Klei has been with "balancing" recently, I started to find myself thinking this exactly. Fact of the matter is that this game's difficulty heavily revolves around player knowledge rather than strict "skill" for the most part, unless you want to speedrun or do self imposed challenges. Because of this, the game can never be as difficult as you initially experience it. We know so much that anything and everything thrown our way is easy to figure out, and anything that "aids" us just serves to make us stronger. I think we all forget how many players struggle with this game, and how we're not the norm of the player experience.

Even the skill tree is arguably not even that bad. It either improves weaker parts of a character's kit, or helps guide the player to better roleplay as their role on the team. Even some of the more expansive things like the Wolfgang's new dumbbells or Woodie's wooden crafts are not that impressive vs. things that already exist. Some of the crazier stuff you can get are locked behind "endgame" bosses anyway, and mostly serve to help with that role But it also gives players something to strive for and possibly even gives new players more incentive to both stick to a character and/or try out new characters. It even allows a player to edit a character more towards how we play. We also don't know what is coming down the line, the stuff that is coming later could be way harder to justify what "power creep" some of these skills and new items present. Do I think the skill tree is perfect? No. Not a huge fan of "universal" progression. And I do think some of these perks would be better off as permanent. Hell, I even still find myself questioning some of the "real character reworks." But I don't see it as a complete destruction of what DST is. 

My friend said it best while we were discussing this: "The game is still here, we just can't play it." 

[EatenCheetos]

I actually like the power creep, further specializing the characters differentiated them from one another more, which means that players are moreso encouraged to work together to utilize their abilities which makes the game more fun. Some of these abilities are super fun in their own right as well. In summary, this power creep maybe isn’t so terrible!

[WhackE]

23 hours ago, goblinball said:

as long as you aren’t killing bosses in literal seconds and there is still some semblance of challenge then it’s fine

Yeah this didn't age so well, did it?

[Arcwell]

Just now, WhackE said:

Yeah this didn't age so well, did it?

This was an infinite DPS bug and has been patched already.

[Hornete]

1 minute ago, WhackE said:

Yeah this didn't age so well, did it?

In fairness this utilized a bug that was just fixed in the recent patch.

The vine spawn callback would not reset when deequipping a brightshade sword, which is what allowed this poster to equip and re-equip a sword constantly to build up 100s of vine events to be pushed at once.

Edit: @Arcwell Ah you beat me to the punch, 

[WhackE]

3 minutes ago, Arcwell said:

This was an infinite DPS bug and has been patched already.

@HorneteI wasn't aware it was a bug, thank both of you for clarifying 

[Philip.]

On 7/7/2023 at 3:06 PM, SadeceAtakan said:

I wish it was like this. I'm not a big fan of unlocking something just by sitting at the base. 

This is exactly the biggest point why I hate the "skill tree" thing, because it doesn't really make any sence to gain any skills by just "being". There are just so many interesting ways how you can get all the various skills, but this just doesn't fit in the game at all (and I am not even talking about balance here).

[Jakepeng99]

On 7/8/2023 at 2:14 AM, EatenCheetos said:

I actually like the power creep, further specializing the characters differentiated them from one another more, which means that players are moreso encouraged to work together to utilize their abilities which makes the game more fun. Some of these abilities are super fun in their own right as well. In summary, this power creep maybe isn’t so terrible!

You don't need powercreep for characters to synergise though.  (Even before skill trees were added)Wortox and wormwood synergise very well together and none of them have powercreep. Wortox helps with wormwood's downside, and can help him craft his crafts, and in turn Wormwood can provide prescious resources for all.

[EATZYOWAFFLEZ]

On 7/7/2023 at 1:41 AM, BezKa said:

******* THANK YOU.I really didn't want to make a thread myself and get laughed at for crying again.

It's unbelievable, how an update that directly breaks one of the pillars Don't Starve was standing on, is met with enthusiasm and laughter at people who scream and point at the building collapsing. Skill tree for Wilson was pretty damn bad. Instead of making Wilson engage with the world to use his knowledge and do something with his beard, he got a outside-game clickable mod. This feels EXACTLY like clicking "configure mod" in the mod page, and adjusting values, just with bad choices. And now EVERYONE is getting one? What?

The current lategame doesn't warrant the buffs for these characters. I would gladly welcome new skills for them if THEY EARNED THEM. Instead it's either command, or AFK. I'm sick of people saying "you have to play over hundred days tho" you don't have to do ****. The timer doesn't reset when you die. It CARRIES OVER to other worlds, so once you do the "chore" your perks are completely free. And yet, the world itself has nothing to stand against our new overpowered skills.

Another thing that was essential to the Don't Starve experience was the lack of information. You can't just hover over the mob to learn how much health it has, it's damage, or examine an item to learn what it does. You have to find out YOURSELF. If you choose to do it via wiki or a youtuber, that's your choice. But the game will not hold your hand. Except now the scrapbook is there to chase that experience away.

Every time someone asked me what I loved about Don't Starve, it was that it didn't have tutorials, I could learn the world along with the character I'm playing as, MY knowledge, made THEM stronger. I always was sad that this experience happens truly only once. Only once you are new to the game, able to see the wonder, get killed by ******* coconuts falling on your head, shriek in panic when the funny bird starts chasing you. It was my biggest praise, because that's what made the game unique and fun. And it still managed to keep me playing after experiencing all that, it still had some challenge to offer.

I did not expect Klei would try to get rid of that experience, instead of making it even better for new players. Who cares about the world and what it has to offer when ding! a silly little icon appears! I wonder what it does! The point was that you had to get better to survive longer. Not survive barely enough, and get an upgrade to survive longer. Isn't it absolute nonsense to bring in players who need that in order to play the game? If they do, they probably won't ike what comes later anyway! What's the point???

"Character perks were there because they were people who went through different lives and suffered the consequences and reaped from their victories. Wigfrid committed to the bit, got stronger, but committing meant no more eating anything that isn't meat. Wolfgang was a scared, sensitive person, but he had a dream and worked towards it and got strong."

I said in a thread before. Now that these characters have skill trees, we don't know where they got them from. They have no lore or in-game explanations. They're just slapped there.

And I might have finally had a full on breakdown yesterday after learning the game I loved is getting spit on, but honestly it was coming since the Wilson rework. I should have prepared myself, that I'd be losing something I love very dearly, and not in the way I expected. I've only been here for 3 years, not even full. And even I, without needing to be there for 10 years can see how badly these updates damaged the game.

I know it's too late, and Klei generally doesn't remove stuff after it's been released, and that just makes it hurt even more. I can't do **** to keep the game I love. It's being literally taken away from me. I can't even look at the QoL of DS without feeling like it was an omen. Of Klei abandoning the principles of what makes their game unique and special.

I'm so, so disappointed. I don't know if any updates after this will be able to fix this. I think the game's gone.

And I know I'm being dramatic, but I'm not overreacting. This game was a piece of art, that meant a lot to me. And I mean A LOT. I can't even explain it to you without going deep into my personal life. This is a big deal for me, even if it's "just a game" for you.

Saying that adding accessible information to a game is bad is just ridiculous. Also you're 100% overreacting. Calm down and stop crying before you post.

[GolographGUSlo]

3 hours ago, EATZYOWAFFLEZ said:

Saying that adding accessible information to a game is bad is just ridiculous.

If it’s a problem than only thing that skilltree does is telling the player that there 2 things that you have to kill to unlock affinities. But it doesn't tell player what to do to survive nor how to play on picked character.

[LavenderLillie]

On 7/6/2023 at 9:58 PM, 00petar00 said:

I know that a lot of Wormwood mains will dislike the skill tree as they don't think he should have that much to do with plants but this will at least cement him as the farmer character so players aren't guessing on what role he should fill and this is the reason I haven't played him much, now if I decide to farm I will pick him.

Don't forget Wormwood's right-side affinity tree. He's got some fight in him.

[Evelo]

On 7/6/2023 at 10:28 PM, Scrimbles said:

I can't play old Woodie without modding the game.

I miss old Woodie. Lucy felt important back then.