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Why do people keep complaining about crafting tabs?


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I don't know why people think crafting tabs are bad. Klei could achieve the exact same thing by putting characters unique crafts (like Wigfrids songs) into a different tab (moving the songs into the magic tab for example) and it wouldn't make any of the characters more unique than they are now. Winona, Webber, Walter and Wolfgang all have crafting tabs, yet don't play the same at all and their crafts aren't similar at all unless you boil it down to "deals damage to thing", "builds structure", etc. If you have a problem with a rework complain about the actual issues with the items and not about a tab that essentially just makes it easier to find the items.

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I actually prefer for characters to have their own crafting tabs, its good for new players or anyone trying out a character they have not played.

It would be painful for someone to navigate all the crafting tabs to find their character specific buildings and items, as they wouldn't all be in the same tab.

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I've made identical thread some time ago and the response I've received is that no one actually minds them. 

It seems people cling onto the tabs when they have nothing else to complain about or make argument about. 

And joke about them, while actually not feeling negatively about their presence in the game. 

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The first problem is that most of the character specific crafting tabs are just that "character specific crafting tabs". Tabs with craftable items that cannot be used by other characters meaning the reason to go out of your way and actually craft the addons considered necessary maybe viewed as a waste of time by other players that don´t need those items or waste of materials if the player using the tab is getting the materials from another players base. The second problem is that orginally the only character with a unique crafting tab was Wickerbottom, which pretty much means that as Klei gives more and more crafting tabs to other characters they devalue her as a fun character. Why would you play a character that has a whole quirk surrounding a specific crafting tab if there are now dozens of characters like that. Not saying that that is all that is to her, but something simular happened to Webber where Klei added more characters with the "monster trait" people found him less enjoyable to play and requested a rework. So in conclusion, giving other characters unique crafting tabs was a bad idea, because it discourages teamwork and devalues other characters. Not to mention it´s pretty lazy and unimaginative.

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I guess people hate them because they have it in their heads that it makes characters like how a lot of people see Winona: a pick and switch character you only use for their items. It's not really the tab itself.

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I think people prefer characters with big wacky perks which change your playstyle drastically, instead of just random items which don’t impact the gameplay loop much. That being said, character-specific crafts can greatly impact the gameplay loop, so I guess people just want a reason to complain about characters they don’t like.

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Personally, I have 2 main issues with them.

 

1. They're pretty damn overused. While crafting tabs are a good way to differentiate characters, every re-work except Woodie's and Willow's have given their characters crafting tabs. It gets used *a lot* and can get a bit tiresome.

2. It's debatable whether or not the crafting tabs are needed most of the time. Sure, it makes sense in some situations, such as Wickerbottom or Wanda. But did Walter need a crafting tab for all his ammo types? Did Wolfgang need a crafting tab for his strongman equipment? Did Wigfrid need a crafting tab for all her songs? Sometimes it feels like they gave the characters a crafting tab for the sake of a crafting tab. Heck, Woodie got new craftables, but they were all put in the magic tab because it makes sense that the magical totems get put into the magical section. 

 

Anyways, It's Definitely not a bad trend, but I Wouldn't call it a good trend either. 

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5 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Character specific crafting tabs is just game clarity imo ~ I hope they keep doing it, maybe even go back and put Woodie / Willow / etc crafts in a character unique one.

As a console player having a unique crafting tab makes them easier to find then going through all existing tabs to find their exclusive crafts.

I would prefer it if they went back and did this for all the other characters too- especially if they plan to add more to them in the future.

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though i don't have much of a problem i think characters could be more creative if they didn't center around crafts but if that crafting tab is integrated into their gameplay well like maxwell i have no problem but if it isn't like wolfgang then it'll fall flat

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11 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Character specific crafting tabs is just game clarity imo ~ I hope they keep doing it, maybe even go back and put Woodie / Willow / etc crafts in a character unique one.

im totally with you. I just wanted to point that i like woodie's idols being in the magic tab, it gives "he is learning dark magic to control his curse"vibes

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22 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

Character specific crafting tabs is just game clarity imo ~ I hope they keep doing it, maybe even go back and put Woodie / Willow / etc crafts in a character unique one.

I too believe it would be better organized and more beneficial to have all characters have their special builds in character-specific tabs. In fact I would reckon game could benefit even more from a QoL update centered on organizing better all builds from all tabs, to be more intuitive and whatnot.

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28 minutes ago, Theukon-dos said:

But did Walter need a crafting tab for all his ammo types?

Yes, hell yes, it was necessary. Would you rather have ammo separated into the several different categories? Poop, Marble, Stone and Gold in Combat, Gem-based one in Magic and Thulecite in Ancient? Thats just a mess for something that can easily fit into a single specific category. I even think they should move his tent and his hat to his tab (and rename it into "Boyscouting" tab). As for Wigfrid, there is really no other place to put them. Are they magic? Are they food? They are combat at most, but some are also survival-ish.

Think of new players as well. Back when I started, I picked Woody and didnt realise I had totems until way later into the game (by then Goose was useless). Character-specific tabs also prevent confusion when someone is new to the character and dont realise they cant access a certain item once they swap to another. Anything that makes the understanding of the game easier is a plus.

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i dont really dislike them, but it does feel like all characters powers come from the items they craft now, and less so the character themself. For webber it still works since his power is his spider army, and the crafting tab is merely there to enhance his army and his control over it. For characters like wolf/winona, their power isn't so much themselves, but the items they create, which in winona's case works since she's an engineer, but for wolfgang, not so much. the only way he can be mighty is by working out? so all the combat, crafting, chopping, mining, etc isnt classified as working out?

personally i'd rather characters have innate perks rather than things they can craft to get stronger. take wigfrid for example, instead of having song items, they couldve had an ability wheel or something from which she could cast songs using the same inspiration system, but they'd be gated behind the same resource cost as the songs.

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1 hour ago, Baark0 said:

 take wigfrid for example, instead of having song items, they couldve had an ability wheel or something from which she could cast songs using the same inspiration system, but they'd be gated behind the same resource cost as the songs.

So you would be replacing her craftable Abilities with... the same craftable abilities?

Just because you would be moving the location of Wigfrid's craftable character specific buffs, doesn't mean that it's any different. At that point, you're just making what could easily be a crafting tab (like it is right now) more convoluted.

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3 hours ago, Maybe a dog said:

Yes, hell yes, it was necessary. Would you rather have ammo separated into the several different categories? Poop, Marble, Stone and Gold in Combat, Gem-based one in Magic and Thulecite in Ancient? Thats just a mess for something that can easily fit into a single specific category. I even think they should move his tent and his hat to his tab (and rename it into "Boyscouting" tab). As for Wigfrid, there is really no other place to put them. Are they magic? Are they food? They are combat at most, but some are also survival-ish.

Think of new players as well. Back when I started, I picked Woody and didnt realise I had totems until way later into the game (by then Goose was useless). Character-specific tabs also prevent confusion when someone is new to the character and dont realise they cant access a certain item once they swap to another. Anything that makes the understanding of the game easier is a plus.

Fighting. Walter's slingshot rounds would go into fighting. As would Wigfrid's songs, because all of them can only be used in combat and serve for combat.

 

As for new-player confusion, would they not see it from just scrolling through the item tabs? Frankly you could apply that argument to a lot of items

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28 minutes ago, Theukon-dos said:

Fighting. Walter's slingshot rounds would go into fighting. As would Wigfrid's songs, because all of them can only be used in combat and serve for combat.

 

As for new-player confusion, would they not see it from just scrolling through the item tabs? Frankly you could apply that argument to a lot of items

b/c why have clarity right? lol

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6 hours ago, BezKa said:

I've made identical thread some time ago and the response I've received is that no one actually minds them. 

It seems people cling onto the tabs when they have nothing else to complain about or make argument about. 

And joke about them, while actually not feeling negatively about their presence in the game.

huh, makes sense. I only brought this up cause i saw this still being used as a complaint even recently (even saw it in a poll of annoyances about the game) and it started really annoying me that people thought it was bad game design.

6 hours ago, Paribean said:

The first problem is that most of the character specific crafting tabs are just that "character specific crafting tabs". Tabs with craftable items that cannot be used by other characters meaning the reason to go out of your way and actually craft the addons considered necessary maybe viewed as a waste of time by other players that don´t need those items or waste of materials if the player using the tab is getting the materials from another players base. The second problem is that orginally the only character with a unique crafting tab was Wickerbottom, which pretty much means that as Klei gives more and more crafting tabs to other characters they devalue her as a fun character. Why would you play a character that has a whole quirk surrounding a specific crafting tab if there are now dozens of characters like that. Not saying that that is all that is to her, but something simular happened to Webber where Klei added more characters with the "monster trait" people found him less enjoyable to play and requested a rework. So in conclusion, giving other characters unique crafting tabs was a bad idea, because it discourages teamwork and devalues other characters. Not to mention it´s pretty lazy and unimaginative.

I mean having items for themselves directly impacts the team tho? Walter can fight without messing up another players aggro/kiting, Wickerbottom has tons of powers for the team, Wigfrid directly buffs her team, Webber can make spiders near the base for food and army's for combat, etc etc. I do kinda get that point about it making other characters less unique but that sounds like a nitpicky reason, since the closest thing to Wickerbottom's gimmick now is probabaly Wigfrid's songs which still are used for entirely different things. Even then Don't Starve had a few characters with tabs and i'd never say that devalued Wicker. The tab isn't THE characters gimmick, it's just a place to get to the gimmick, like Wolfgang's gembell would be put into the magic tab while the normal ones are in tools and his gym is in structures, that would be more annoying than the tab.

5 hours ago, Dextops said:

though i don't have much of a problem i think characters could be more creative if they didn't center around crafts but if that crafting tab is integrated into their gameplay well like maxwell i have no problem but if it isn't like wolfgang then it'll fall flat

That's actually a REALLY good point, I tried my best to think of any good reasons for the other side as I wanted to see if there was a point making the post, but yeah this makes sense. I do think most characters are fine with the tab but I agree characters like Wolfgang shouldn't of gotten one.

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3 hours ago, Baark0 said:

i dont really dislike them, but it does feel like all characters powers come from the items they craft now, and less so the character themself. For webber it still works since his power is his spider army, and the crafting tab is merely there to enhance his army and his control over it. For characters like wolf/winona, their power isn't so much themselves, but the items they create, which in winona's case works since she's an engineer, but for wolfgang, not so much. the only way he can be mighty is by working out? so all the combat, crafting, chopping, mining, etc isnt classified as working out?

personally i'd rather characters have innate perks rather than things they can craft to get stronger. take wigfrid for example, instead of having song items, they couldve had an ability wheel or something from which she could cast songs using the same inspiration system, but they'd be gated behind the same resource cost as the songs.

Your first point is actually pretty good and is similar to another persons point, but I feel like you chose the worst example at the bottom with Wigfrid's crafts, they could all be completely ignored and she would still be a unique combat character, adding them however just gives her better teamplay. I agree about Wolfgang, honestly he's the only rework I think has been outright bad. I think most of the reworks haven't made characters item reliant though, Wendy only uses the potions for bosses really, Wigfrid was mentioned above, Woodie can transform without the items, Willow would just be more similar to her solo iteration really, Webber would just have less control over his army, etc. It either just makes the character have slightly less to them or it entirely ruins them like Winona, Wolfgang, Wurt, Wickerbottom and Maxwell.

7 hours ago, planetearth said:

I'll be real I don't see the issue either way.

True, I just brought it up because asides from a few examples I've now been shown I still think it's a pretty none issue that gets overhated.

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Having a dedicated crafting tab vs. just putting it in magic/fight etc. makes no difference to me.

So the only potential problem is the degree to which characters have unique crafts.

One of the reasons why the game has them in my opinion is that the controls for this game is so anemic.  There are few ways for Wendy to interact with Abigail without using one of her items.

Another likely reason is to force players to work for stuff.  So even if Wendy could for example heal-buff Abigail using the controls only (not through a craft) they probably wouldn’t let that be possible.

But that’s an interesting question: could Wendy work the same way without her special crafts (excepting the craft for the flower)? Is that possible?

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People don't dislike the tabs, they dislike what's in them. Most character reworks add craftables and maybe a meter, that's what people complain about.

But honestly I think most mentions of it are just a joke pointing out how many there are.

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4 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

People don't dislike the tabs, they dislike what's in them. Most character reworks add craftables and maybe a meter, that's what people complain about.

But honestly I think most mentions of it are just a joke pointing out how many there are.

then you should reread some comments suggesting to put the items in the clssic tabs...

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