Wortox Needs to be Nerfed

[Mx-Pain]

Who´s Wortox ?

[Mike23Ua]

Another thing people seem to forget is that Wortox collects souls of all things that die near him rather HE kills them or not.. so a Wendy going Blender Mode on Spiders or Frog Rain too close to this Wortox can quickly cause him to “Overload”

although I feel like being able to carry stacks of nearly 20 is a bit Overkill.. if you can carry “stacks” of enemies to kill for soul creating purposes… maybe the max amount of souls you can carry in total can use a smaller limit (which would in turn make taking extreme caution around Abigail going blender mode on Frog Rain/Spiders even MORE important to him.)

And unless it was patched- When Webber died he Drops TWO Souls instead of One, one for the boy, one for the spider.

Wormwood on the other hand has no soul, so WHY he drops one or can be healed at all by Wortox just seems like a flaw to me.

But then again… maybe I just enjoyed the challenge of Wormwoods inability to heal so easily, Wortox trivializes this downside for Wormwood.

[NightfallsCurse]

22 hours ago, Maxil20 said:

(and in fact punishes you for trying to go past that cap)

You can actually hold more than 20 souls by holding stacks of mobs in your inventory to murder them later for more if you run out

22 hours ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Should we nerf Honey and Crops as well?

Yes, survival is too easy since the materials for their structures are super easy to gather early, so are seeds

[Guille6785]

6 minutes ago, ShadowQueen said:

Yes, survival is too easy since the materials for their structures are super easy to gather early, so are seeds

believe it or not in its current state the game is still pretty difficult for a lot of beginners

if you feel something makes survival too easy simply add your own restrictions, that's what everybody should do instead of trying to shape the entirety of the game to their own vision by asking for nerfs

[HowlVoid]

30 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wormwood on the other hand has no soul

Excuse me?

[Terra B Welch]

If you really think Wortox should be nerfed, make a mod for it.

[minespatch]

31 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wormwood on the other hand has no so

[DrMcGillacactus]

33 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

 

Wormwood on the other hand has no soul

 

where'd that come from?

[SomebodyRandom]

56 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wormwood on the other hand has no soul

Oh so that's why I have so many hours in DST, I sold my soul when I started playing Wormwood.

23 minutes ago, GrMcGillacactus said:

where'd that come from?

Wormwood doesn't drop a soul when dying nearby a Wortox

[HowlVoid]

13 minutes ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Oh so that's why I have so many hours in DST, I sold my soul when I started playing Wormwood.

Wormwood doesn't drop a soul when dying nearby a Wortox

I'm guessing his "soul" is in his gem.

Kinda how when you tear the mind stone out of The Vision it only leaves a husk behind.

[Behan]

Sometimes you guys forget that not all players have 500+ hours. Wortox is as rewarding for a middle skilled player as he is a nightmare for starters. That is certainly also considered towards balancing

[Mike23Ua]

1 hour ago, Guille6785 said:

believe it or not in its current state the game is still pretty difficult for a lot of beginners

if you feel something makes survival too easy simply add your own restrictions, that's what everybody should do instead of trying to shape the entirety of the game to their own vision by asking for nerfs

That’s sort of what they have been doing already is it not?? I mean the QoL updates have been targeted directly at making the game be as easy or as hard as you personally feel like playing at the time..

Having a lovely little menu full of things you can toggle on/off/more/less over is something that should NOT be completely overlooked..

Some of my world gens have things like Normal Bees NONE, Normal Beehives NONE Angry Bees MORE Hostile Hives MORE.. butterflies LESS but flowers MORE

My point here is that Klei has given us a Menu that does not require MODS to fix the game the way you want it to be.

You think killing butterflies for free souls as Wortox is too easy? Set butterflies to NONE, are you like me and think anything combined with 3 ice should result in Wet Goop? Set Ice itself so it spawns less or none at all..

Klei gave us OPTIONS without needing Mods and it’s time people stop overlooking them.

[me real life]

1 hour ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Wormwood doesn't drop a soul when dying nearby a Wortox

You're thinking of WX-78:

[HowlVoid]

13 minutes ago, Sunset Skye said:

You're thinking of WX-78:

I knew it. You all made me doubt my baby, a plague on your houses!

[ArubaroBeefalo]

2 hours ago, ShadowQueen said:

You can actually hold more than 20 souls by holding stacks of mobs in your inventory to murder them later for more if you run out

Yes, survival is too easy since the materials for their structures are super easy to gather early, so are seeds

and what is the difference between having 20 bees or 20 potatoes? sure, jumping but that is just fun in early not op

easy for who? because i know a lot of people that doesnt know how to pass most worlds throw the year without a lot of help. The game, if you dont spoil everything via guides or whatever, is difficult and takes time to learn all the scenarios where you can die 

edit: actually in that scenario i found in wortox a good character to help my newbie friends. Sure, makes easier to help friends but that makes him even better for a cooperative game. Few veterans can totally do crazy things no need of wortox to do every thing on the game easily but a veteran wortox with newbies makes a difference to help them (and in that way they dont get frustrated and quit the game before learning) 

[Guille6785]

25 minutes ago, Behan said:

Sometimes you guys forget that not all players have 500+ hours. Wortox is as rewarding for a middle skilled player as he is a nightmare for starters.

and he's also really underwhelming for very skilled players on top of that, """""""balancing""""""" wortox would be impossible because he offers completely different results at each skill level

[NightfallsCurse]

2 hours ago, Terra B Welch said:

If you really think Wortox should be nerfed, make a mod for it.

I have one answer...

NO

[Echsrick]

3 hours ago, Terra B Welch said:

If you really think Wortox should be nerfed, make a mod for it.

there alredy is one here if you dont like wortox just balance him yourself

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2449877271

[Terra B Welch]

5 minutes ago, ShadowQueen said:

I have one answer...

NO

Well too bad then, cause it seems the majority are against you and your suggestion of making Wortox worse then Wilson.

[NightfallsCurse]

1 minute ago, Terra B Welch said:

Well too bad then, cause it seems the majority are against you and your suggestion of making Wortox worse then Wilson.

Okay and? i don't care what others think, I just feel he needs to be nerfed

[cropo]

Well lets see what Wortox can do compared to other characters.

 

He can heal very easily, what other characters can match his healing? None, Wigfrid can sort of compete and she also gains sanity per hit which is both a detriment and a huge benefit depending on what you're trying to do. So we can consider this a really big plus in Wortox's favor.

He can teleport, at the expense of using up his healing ammo. Can any other character do this? No, but late-game players can easily replicate this ability even to the point where they can spam it reasonably. So we can consider this an early game advantage for Wortox. One of his greatest strengths is having an ability that an item you get later in the game can do. We can consider this a decent plus in his favor.

He can eat souls, at a cost of sanity and very low hunger regain rate, this also uses up his soul ammo. Can any other character do this? No, but they can easily replicate it by having kindergarden-level knowledge of the game, learn how to make meatballs and you've essentially solved your food problem. Before Don't Starve Together was even out, the number one challenge of the game was not in the procurement of food, but not dying to all the other hostile threats out in the game and that has not changed to this day.  This isn't really a big deal, like, at all. We can pretty much ignore this perk.

He takes half sanity loss from monsters, I guess this is nice? 

 

Now lets go over his disadvantages:

Not only is eating souls a terrible waste of time, hardly fufilling, and damaging to your sanity(which can be a benefit and a disadvantage depending on what you're doing). He actually requires double the amount of upkeep that traditional players do. While food is stupid-easy to obtain in this game for nearly all skill levels other than people who literally just booted up the game today, Wortox has to put in double the effort to get the same amount of luxury other characters have.  All healing foods have their potency severely crippled, discouraging their farming and use. All sanity boosting foods have their usage weakened as well, requiring double the inventory space in fights where sanity would be something you want to keep. If he has to eat twice as much to restore the sanity he loses from losing his souls, why not just not eat souls and eat normal food anyway?

 

He gets attacked by pigs and bunnymen, and he cannot befriend spiders. Unlike other characters who can just recruit an army to kill certain enemies like the Bee Queen, Webber who can just waltz into the labyrinth, recruit every depth dweller, and make the ancient guardian pee his pants without even glitching him onto a pillar and annihilate the Bee Queen with little manual input Wortox has to be able to fend for himself.

 

 

 

Wortox has decent advantages that fall off late-game, does not have the convenience of Wendy, cannot start spider wars like Webber for stupid-easy food, cannot start pig/bunnymen wars, does not do any extra damage like Wifgrid and Wolfgang, cannot hold very many of his own special item without losing a large chunk of sanity, needs double the food maintenence and sanity maintenence if you choose to eat souls for the pitiful hunger restoration and what does he get?  An early game lazy explorer and the ability to heal groups of people for possibly less than a spider poultice. 

 

 

In order to justify a nerf for him, you would have to comparatively nerf like 80% of the games content and other characters.  The only one true advantage he has over other players is being able heal other players for verrrrrry small amounts.

 

You should change your topic from ''Wortox needs a nerf'' to ''Don't Starve Together needs a nerf''.

[viberr]

me: reads title 

the title: WORTOX NEEDS TO BE NERFED

me: huh, haven't I seen this thread like eighty times before? guess it must have been Deja vu 

 

I do personally think Wortox needs to be a bit more unique with his abilities but nerfing him? nah man, Klei don't do that unless it's really important for whatever update they're working on and if they nerfed him, they'd have to nerf everyone else too.

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, cropo said:

He can heal very easily, what other characters can match his healing? None

Webber with spider nurses actually far exceeds his healing capabilities.

[cropo]

Just now, Mysterious box said:

Webber with spider nurses actually far exceeds his healing capabilities.

Yes with a setup Webber can outperform his heal, it's just kind of annoying having an army of nurses following you everywhere and not being able to build, if you don't use a mod not being able to go between caves etc. There is a lot of inconveniences with Webberse nurse spiders that you have to deal with. In comparison Wortox has pretty easy access to on-demand healing that works on groups of people as well and has an easier time managing the disadvantage of that.

 

I mean Webber with a bunch of spiders can outdps nearly anything in the game as well, the only reason I brought up...say the ancient guardian is because the labyrinth next to him is full of like 100 depths dwellers to recruit on the spot. I don't really consider ''batman prep time'' perks outperforming a characters natural perks to be a damning factor unless it's like a no-brain path you take in the game like getting a Lazy Explorer, there's very little reason not to get one.

 

Not saying Webber is by any means weaker or that Wortox is better than Webber, I just think that the convenience of Wortox's healing should be an important thing to consider when comparing his healing to other characters. With enough preperation I'd say just having everyone grab stacks of honey poultices and throw Wortox out of the picture completely for someone better would be the best option but again a lot of characters become irrelevant when you consider proper preperation.

[Mysterious box]

Just now, cropo said:

Yes with a setup Webber can outperform his heal, it's just kind of annoying having an army of nurses following you everywhere and not being able to build, if you don't use a mod not being able to go between caves etc. There is a lot of inconveniences with Webberse nurse spiders that you have to deal with. In comparison Wortox has pretty easy access to on-demand healing that works on groups of people as well and has an easier time managing the disadvantage of that.

 

I mean Webber with a bunch of spiders can outdps nearly anything in the game as well, the only reason I brought up...say the ancient guardian is because the labyrinth next to him is full of like 100 depths dwellers to recruit on the spot. I don't really consider ''batman prep time'' perks outperforming a characters natural perks to be a damning factor unless it's like a no-brain path you take in the game like getting a Lazy Explorer, there's very little reason not to get one.

 

Not saying Webber is by any means weaker or that Wortox is better than Webber, I just think that the convenience of Wortox's healing should be an important thing to consider when comparing his healing to other characters. With enough preperation I'd say just having everyone grab stacks of honey poultices and throw Wortox out of the picture completely for someone better would be the best option but again a lot of characters become irrelevant when you consider proper preperation.

To be fair you don't need a army all your healing needs should be fully handled with 1-3 nurses which can be stored in your inventory when going between shards and even then they're extremely cheap to make. The only thing he really has him beat on in healing is healing non Webbers but in exchange he doesn't need to waste time collecting souls. He also doesn't need alot of prep time to build up a army due to the trap exploit. 

By the way if spiders end up getting in your way you can always just put them in a chest or a backpack while your building by right clicking them to pick them up.

Wasn't trying to say whether Wortox or Webber was a better character just felt Webber was the better healer baring teamplay with non Webbers.