About Warly

[ShadowDuelist]

Ever since RWYS came out, Warly became another of the directly benefited characters since many of his special dishes and spices require farming vegetables. Nobody will complain that Warly is a bad character by any means, however I still feel he lacks one simple change to make him feel more rewarding.

I always keep thinking when Warly himself eats his special recipes, he should get a 2x duration on all his time based food special effects

No other food stat will be affected, so no extra healing, or extra hunger, or extra damage, or anything of the sorts. It just lasts longer on himself.

Spoiler

That is:
Spicy, sweetened, and garlic spiced foods effect will last 2x on him (extra time, not damage nor extra armor)
Volt goat jelly electric damage will last 2x on him (extra time, not damage) 
Glowberry Mousse light effect will last 2x of time on himself
Frog Fish Bowl waterproofing will last 2x time.
Gazpacho and Dragon chili salad's respective chilling and heating effects will last longer on himself.
Etc.

Why?
- Chefs usually have a refined palate, which also applies to Warly. They also have a deep understanding of the tastes combination, and effects of foods others don't understand.
It would make using the special foods on him more rewarding without making him OP, since his overall power level will not really change, it will just make him a bit cheaper. It's also a very simple change in terms of programming for Klei, just adjusting a few values and parameters, so it's not like they'd sink a lot of time into it.
It would be a tiny QOL change that could change Warly's gameplay as a whole.

Warly is fine leave him alone.
-True, but currently it's more rewarding to feed the others with the special dishes than himself. Which is fine, and this won't change that entirely, it will just add a bit more reward to play as Warly himself in a completely different way than, let's say, feeding a Woflgang spicy foods. 
If special effects lasted 2x on himself, he will probably use less and leave more for other players too.

I play Warly for the challenge, don't make him easier! Game is too easy! I hate you!
- Honestly I don't think this change would make him easier or harder in any way, just a bit cheaper and less grindy. The psychological effect of knowing that those foods are "special" on yourself will probably make many people re-consider about moving out of Warly once they have enough special foods. Of course if minimal effort-max damage output is your thing, this won't change your gamestyle at all, this is more aimed for the people like myself who likes being somewhere in the middle. And for those who like challenge characters, like I said previously, his overall power level will not be affected, his cons will remain the same since this change does not affect them.

But in any way I'm all eyes for your opinions, specially Warly mains opinions, so that is why this is here and not in suggestions. If you love it or hate it let me (and Klei) know

 

[Well-met]

Anything to get rid of pick&swap is a good addition

[kuroite]

21 minutes ago, Well-met said:

Anything to get rid of pick&swap is a good addition

Yep, i would even half the duration for everyone else instead of double it just for warly.

[ShadowDuelist]

2 minutes ago, kuroite said:

Yep, i would even half the duration for everyone else instead of double it just for warly.

But wouldn't that make the buffs too short?

[kuroite]

Imo, that would encourage people to stay as Warly to fully benefit the buff and make it more grindy for "pick&switch"er.

[Viktor234]

51 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

I always keep thinking when Warly himself eats his special recipes, he should get a 2x duration on all his time based food special effects

Who is going to care about that? Nothing will stop you from making two dishes instead of only one to double the duration of your own dish, especially when playing as Warly.

[Ohan]

I dont think it would make sense for his buffs to be worse on everyone else since the entire point of his character is to buff allies.

I personally dont care at all what pick&switch players choose to do and im tired of every balance discussion centering around them. a character should be fun to play, unique, and have special strengths and interesting downsides. I think Warly definitely hits the mark on all of those so id say hes fine tbh. 

having buffs last longer on him isnt going to change the minds of people who pick&swap warly to use spicy chaud-froid as Wolfgang, itll just make Warly more powerful which i dont think he needs after RWYS. 

[DaZoul]

1 hour ago, ShadowDuelist said:

I play Warly for the challenge, don't make him easier! Game is too easy! I hate you!

Jesus that's so aggressive 

But I actually like the suggestion. As others have mentioned, it makes him less of a pick-and-swap, I never was really concerned by characters being pick-and-swaps, but I do genuinely like the suggestion

[Well-met]

2 minutes ago, Ohan said:

I dont think it would make sense for his buffs to be worse on everyone else since the entire point of his character is to buff allies.

I personally dont care at all what pick&switch players choose to do and im tired of every balance discussion centering around them. a character should be fun to play, unique, and have special strengths and interesting downsides. I think Warly definitely hits the mark on all of those so id say hes fine tbh. 

having buffs last longer on him isnt going to change the minds of people who pick&swap warly to use spicy chaud-froid as Wolfgang, itll just make Warly more powerful which i dont think he needs after RWYS. 

nobody is stopping anyone from doing it

this idea gives an incentive and reward to those who don't, though.

[Cheggf]

I've always wanted this ever since I first saw someone suggest it (forgot who). Warly's one of my favourite characters and this'd make him a lot more fun to play.

Although I think instead of doubling the duration of buffs from Warly's special dishes, it should just double the duration of food effects in general. Almost all of the food buffs come from Warly dishes so it doesn't change much, but I think it just makes more sense for it to affect every food instead of specific foods. Off the top of my head that would add mushy cake, warming foods like spicy chili, and cooling foods like banana pops. Probably wouldn't include jellybeans, though, since that seems to be less of a food item due to Wigfrid being able to eat it and it possibly making it too easy to play around his downside. But I could see an argument being made for jellybeans being included.

[Bellium]

Making all of Warlys buff foods last for about a day on him sounds like a perfect change!

[Ohan]

2 minutes ago, Well-met said:

this idea gives an incentive and reward to those who don't, though.

isnt having the myriad of dishes and spices always available to you incentive and reward enough? I dont think anyone is picking and swapping warly for Moqueca or Fish Cordon Blue or Glowberry mousse, its spicy chaud froid. thats the dish that makes warly a "pick and swap". Full time Warly players already have the luxury of enjoying all of his dishes and spices more frequently and easily. 

double duration on buffs would just make his most problematic dish, spicy chaud froid, even more silly. The much needed farming overhaul was all the buffs that Warly needed. 

Anyone who would like Warly/ would be drawn in by his archetype, playstyle and perks is already playing him full time and having fun, i dont see why more incentive  in the form of making Warly have to cook less is needed. 

[Well-met]

2 minutes ago, Ohan said:

isnt having the myriad of dishes and spices always available to you incentive and reward enough? I dont think anyone is picking and swapping warly for Moqueca or Fish Cordon Blue or Glowberry mousse, its spicy chaud froid. thats the dish that makes warly a "pick and swap". Full time Warly players already have the luxury of enjoying all of his dishes and spices more frequently and easily. 

double duration on buffs would just make his most problematic dish, spicy chaud froid, even more silly. The much needed farming overhaul was all the buffs that Warly needed. 

Anyone who would like Warly/ would be drawn in by his archetype, playstyle and perks is already playing him full time and having fun, i dont see why more incentive  in the form of making Warly have to cook less is needed. 

I don't think all warlys are overflowing with infinite dishes in every situation. It's possible for games to not necessarily be thousands day old mega bases. sometimes limited ressources and having to suffer choices are a factor to consider.

having doubled duration also means he could benefit from the bonus for everyday tasks and not just specifically for one goal like a boss

[ShadowDuelist]

1 hour ago, Viktor234 said:

Who is going to care about that? Nothing will stop you from making two dishes instead of only one to double the duration of your own dish, especially when playing as Warly.

It seems to me more convenient to know that you can just use one special dish to last for longer: EG eat that glowberry mousse and forget about light in the ruins for a while. It's also nice knowing nobody else would get that effect.

I understand that not everyone would see it as useful according to their playstyle though, but for some playstyles, and for early game, it could be a nice little bonus.

 

20 minutes ago, Ohan said:

double duration on buffs would just make his most problematic dish, spicy chaud froid, even more silly. The much needed farming overhaul was all the buffs that Warly needed. 

The buff only affects himself, who already does not have any damage boost. It would probably let him cover long boss fights with just one, leaving more for the other players. Although I agree that the farming change was the most needed thing for warly. This is mostly a QOL extra.
 

[Ohan]

2 hours ago, Well-met said:

I don't think all warlys are overflowing with infinite dishes in every situation. It's possible for games to not necessarily be thousands day old mega bases.

Well yeah i think its evident that Warly is a mid/late game character by design.

2 hours ago, Well-met said:

sometimes limited ressources and having to suffer choices are a factor to consider.

And doubling buff duration would precisely eliminate these choices. if warly gets a 2 for 1 deal he simply gets more power earlier on at half the cost. 3 peppers and 3 garlics turns warly into wigfrid for half a day... warly's buffs, specifically those related to combat, are very powerful they should come at a noticable cost.  

2 hours ago, Well-met said:

having doubled duration also means he could benefit from the bonus for everyday tasks

If thats the goal, and even then i dont think he needs it but i would not be opposed to it, increase the duration of only day-to-day utility dishes instead. 

I just personally think that damage boosts like those of warly and wolfgang completely trivialize combat in this game and i wouldnt want to see those made better in any way. But again thats just my view on the matter. 

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I can agree that it was a pity, 'character flavor'-wise for warly to lose the increased stats from crockpot dishes perk he had in SW but idk if doubling all buff durations from crockpot dishes is the way to compensate for that. 

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edit: Also again would this discussion still be had if portal swapping didnt exist? Thats what it comes down to for me. Because the number of people who min-max to that degree are negligible and should not be weighed into balance considerations. Warly is already plenty powerful with 5 minute buff durations, his entire point is that he can make others equally as (or more) powerful than him.

His uniqueness comes from the fact that only he can make those dishes, spices, operate his machines etcetera, i dont think he is lacking in uniqueness for buffs to now also last longer on him. 

[Mysterious box]

I don't really see a need to double the duration yes it'd be convenient to haveall dish effects last 2 days or more but it's not like he really needs it he has his foods and the ability to cook high quality dishes on the go I feel that's good enough. I think people are too focused on the concept of pick and swap that they don't see the character for what they are it shouldn't be a bad thing that a cook can feed his friends in a team survival game.

[SilverBisexual]

Hmm, I agree with you. I actually like Warly as he is, and he is a fun challenge, but you make very valid points.

[GrandTardigrade]

5 hours ago, Well-met said:

Anything to get rid of pick&swap is a good addition

True, but I honestly think that this wouldn't stop most players from doing it. This suggestion would make Warly a little stronger, but it doesn't weaken the pick&swap meta on any way. On the other hand, making the special dishes take less effect on non-Warly characters wouldn't be good either, as it would encourage players to play solo. Maybe make the special foods take less effect if there is no Warly on the server? That sounds a little weird, but it might work. Although, to be honest, I'm fine with other players doing pick&swap as long as they don't manuretalk Warly "because you can just switch to Wolfgang".

[ArubaroBeefalo]

why nobody cries that wolfgang is a pick and swap character for boss fights? xD

[Grim the]

1 hour ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

why nobody cries that wolfgang is a pick and swap character for boss fights? xD

because you don't benifit from his perks after swapping back.

however, despite that you still benefit from the boss loot

[loopuleasa]

Warly is fine

 

Would love to have his food memory be queue based instead of timer based, to make him more actual to the original intention: variety of the palate

[Yuma Arcl]

21 hours ago, loopuleasa said:

Would love to have his food memory be queue based instead of timer based, to make him more actual to the original intention: variety of the palate

Definitely. It's okay he can only eat crockpot dishes, but the food memory just sucks. I think Wickerbottom's food downside fits more Warly than her.

Most of people who don't play Warly complain about the same thing: food. So if they somehow changed that, I'm sure the issue would be mostly fixed. Chefs DO eat the same thing many times (mostly to achieve perfection). Oh, and there you have it, a new mechanic! The more he cooks, the better the food gets (and this could be his food memory instead).

On 12/29/2020 at 11:24 AM, ShadowDuelist said:

I always keep thinking when Warly himself eats his special recipes, he should get a 2x duration on all his time based food special effects

I really think extending the duration would be great. But yeah, it wouldn't solve the swapping.

Maybe make the food 'go with Warly': Giving him an special ice box for storing his exclusive dishes and make it that only him can open it. So other characters must choose either to wrap, keep in bag/hand or use the food immediatly.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

1 minute ago, Yuma Arcl said:

Definitely. It's okay he can only eat crockpot dishes, but the food memory just sucks. I think Wickerbottom's food downside fits more Warly than her.

with his power, that downside is just to little

[Mysterious box]

1 hour ago, Yuma Arcl said:

Definitely. It's okay he can only eat crockpot dishes, but the food memory just sucks. I think Wickerbottom's food downside fits more Warly than her.

Most of people who don't play Warly complain about the same thing: food. So if they somehow changed that, I'm sure the issue would be mostly fixed. Chefs DO eat the same thing many times (mostly to achieve perfection). Oh, and there you have it, a new mechanic! The more he cooks, the better the food gets (and this could be his food memory instead).

I really think extending the duration would be great. But yeah, it wouldn't solve the swapping.

Maybe make the food 'go with Warly': Giving him an special ice box for storing his exclusive dishes and make it that only him can open it. So other characters must choose either to wrap, keep in bag/hand or use the food immediatly.

The thing is if you remove his food memory you effectively removehis downside as that is the only real penalty he has if kiel wanted to dial it back thi I could see them making his memory downside only effect hunger and not health and sanity values but that would still be abit too powerful.

Btw what you described about the ice box thing is basically his singleplayer version chef pouch.

All in all I'd say if they decide to tone warly down I'm not against it but I still feel his upsides are too powerful to remove food memory.

[pyroisshy]

Please just make the cookbook display which foods warly has yet to forget about eating