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i would like some QoL warly buffs but i dont think that buff would help much. Usually 1 volt goat jelly, spicy/garlic food is enough for a boss fight... (except toadstool which always takes forever). Then whatever time is left doesn't really matter. 

For me, I think it's weird that warly, the food character, doesn't have a favorite food like every single other character. It says a great chef doesnt discriminate his favorite or something like that, but then why doesn't he just get a boost to all crockpot foods like his single player version? In single player he gets a huge boost for all crockpot foods, and he can even eat raw foods - single player warly has it so much easier to sustain himself. DST Warly has to cook a ton if he's expected to cook for himself and for his team.

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1 hour ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Is that hard to remember what dish do you eat 16 minutes before?

Its bad design that if you leave the game in a Warly world and then come back a week later, you have to rely on memory to remember if you will benefit fully from certain foods. Warly's downside has no visual cues as to which food is ready to eat and which isn't, other than eating said food and potentially making you have to wait even longer. No other character has this kind of guessing with their downsides, and it could easily be fixed by just adding additional usage to the cookbook. 

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2 hours ago, Wardin25 said:

That wouldn't be really useful, since with voltgoatjelly + chily flakes he can end boss fights in far less than 2 days, specially with friends

You can use the extra time on fighting something else :D

Also this is aimed somewhat more for the early-mid game, when resources are still scarce and that extra time of the glowberry mousse while exploring the caves/ruins will be noticeable, or the sweetened food for the early mining sessions, or being in spring when you did not win the eyebrella, the spicy foods to remove naturally spawned spider nests, etc. It will also make using the foods for temperature control and waterproofing, easier to chain for longer periods of exploration or fights when in adverse weather.

In the late game when you have a lot of everything, there is no advantage from eating one special food or 2, so it won't change anything by that point.
Like I said, this is a small perk that will not change his overall power level, its only so he feels a bit more rewarding for using the special dishes on himself, instead of just giving them all to the Wolfgang of the group.

Direct changes to the food stats like he had at single player , have a high risk of turning him into an over powered character for a multiplayer environment. So this is a more modest approach with less balance issues risk.

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Thanks for this topic and developments, there are many interesting ideas !

Today, Warly is an extremely powerful support, but quite painful to play and bad as solo (as his day-to-day downsides surpass his powers if he's the only one to use it). And as a full-support character design is in my opinion not a good idea and solo play / personal fun is important (even if the game is called Don't starve together), the goal to make him more independent totally makes sense :)

The double-length seems indeed good, even more since some of his special dishes (fish cordon bleu / asparagazpacho / chili salad) are promising but actually under/never used because of their too short duration. The double-duration is a good way to help Warly solo without making him able to power-up a whole group of players with these "weather cheats".

And about the Warly's dish-memory instead of time-memory suggested by loopuleasa, I can't agree more. His current time-memory (equivalent to a 180-hunger memory) is easily bypassed by high-hunger dishes (meaty stew + meatballs = 212,5 hunger), really hard to deal with with low-hunger dishes (non-meat items) and totally blocks heal-dish spam for boss. This mechanic just encourages the player to turn into a butcher-Warly rather than actually looking for diversity...

I really like Warly and I recently wrote a rebalance proposition here.
-> It especially includes the 2 ideas above (double-duration and dish-memory), and more. If some of you are interested and haven't read it yet, feel free to read and react :)
I plan to start to code the mod based on this rebalance proposition in early 2021.

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14 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The thing is if you remove his food memory you effectively removehis downside as that is the only real penalty he has if kiel wanted to dial it back thi I could see them making his memory downside only effect hunger and not health and sanity values but that would still be abit too powerful.

Btw what you described about the ice box thing is basically his singleplayer version chef pouch.

All in all I'd say if they decide to tone warly down I'm not against it but I still feel his upsides are too powerful to remove food memory.

He has other penalties than food memory. His upsides are good? Sure, but you see that they only become "OP" or "too powerful" when you have enough resources and the right ingredients (which aren't easy - nor hard - to get), and by that time you pretty much "don't need Warly" (unless you Want to rush). 

Removing his food memory would have no impact on his upsides (the buffs), but it'd make him easier early game (when most players have a hard time, and one of the reasons he's a "switcheroo").

 

And yes, It's a single player version of his Pouch, but his recipes would only be able to be stored in those. It's a 'drastic measure' to stop the switching (if that's the problem).

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3 minutes ago, Yuma Arcl said:

Removing his food memory would have no impact on his upsides (the buffs), but it'd make him easier early game (when most players have a hard time, and one of the reasons he's a "switcheroo").

There is other characters if those players want an early game character 

Anyways, with 1 volt goat horn and 3 honey he gets a good damage buff in early to rush DF or BQ. No need of other spice to acomplish big things

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7 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Anyways, with 1 volt goat horn and 3 honey he gets a good damage buff in early to rush DF or BQ. No need of other spice to acomplish big things

It's not that simple. Preparations, kiting and items/food. The jelly is just a help to make it faster. Players that rush DF and BQ are skilled enought to do it without Warly buffs.

 

11 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

There is other characters if those players want an early game character 

And that's not a solution. They don't pick the character because they can play the early game. They pick the character because they like their style and gameplay.

(Some few exceptions).

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Just now, Yuma Arcl said:

And that's not a solution. They don't pick the character because they can play the early game. They pick the character because they like their style and gameplay.

then why picking a character that you dont like how it works?

i like how warly is right now, will be so helpful some love for the thermal foods but his memory downside is so interesting. Makes you think how affort some fights

i never prepare that amount of variety of foods (with others is just spaming piergies or some healing veggie) like i did when i fought beequeen the first time as him and that is something unique

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8 minutes ago, Yuma Arcl said:

They don't. That's the point.

And they never will no matter what you do aside from removing his downsides all together. 

The only reason warly is even viewed as a bad character is due to the fact he can share some of what people think are his only perks, while having downsides that people find annoying and don't want to adapt to with solutions for example food healing is a issue? Make medicine don't like that idea? Batbat is a thing still not satisfied? Use salt on the best healing food you can cook in mass  even at it's worst it'll still give around 20 hp of healing. As for his hunger all you really need to do is alternate high hunger dishes the flaw about variety isn't Warly's fault it's the game's there are too few dishes that give reasonable hunger and too few crockpot dishes for the amount of ingredients we have. If you really think about it wickerbottom would fall under the same category as warly minus the downside.

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10 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

Ever since RWYS farming update I've seen a lot more Warlys going around on pubs.
Maybe its just a coincidence of the places I visit, though, but I'm tempted to start playing him more often as well, as soon as I have time to resume playing after the holidays.

the old farms where the real problem of warly. You couldnt use all his tools without wasting tons of hours with such boring mechanic (old farms are fine in single player) making them totally useless

24 minutes ago, Yuma Arcl said:

They don't. That's the point.

you will find the answere in the workshop

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2 hours ago, Yuma Arcl said:

They don't. That's the point.

In this stat survey done in August 2020, Warly was, after Wes, the least popular free-character (Wortox/Wurt/Wormwood excepted then).

The "Reap what you sow" update may help him as his powerful spices/dishes become more accessible, but his downsides stayed the same and make him one of the hardest character to play.

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11 minutes ago, Nyr said:

In this stat survey done in August 2020, Warly was, after Wes, the least popular free-character (Wortox/Wurt/Wormwood excepted then).

The "Reap what you sow" update may help him as his powerful spices/dishes become more accessible, but his downsides stayed the same and make him one of the hardest character to play.

9snwcdgfadi51.png

Your not wrong about him being hard to adapt to for some players and while this might sound unfair but going by this very survey it seems most players don't play long enough to fully profit from his special dishes which is fair considering before the update most of his dishes required you to not only rush farming but locked you out of their ingredients the very next season meaning fully profiting from his abilities meant either starting in spring or waiting 4 real life hours considering most of dst's population plays pubs it's no wonder he was mostly unpopular but I imagine over the course of 2021 he'll jump afew places with reap what you sow. 

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37 minutes ago, Nyr said:

In this stat survey done in August 2020, Warly was, after Wes, the least popular free-character (Wortox/Wurt/Wormwood excepted then).

The "Reap what you sow" update may help him as his powerful spices/dishes become more accessible, but his downsides stayed the same and make him one of the hardest character to play.

Yep! Most people don't spend money on games and/or won't buy Ww, Wortox or Wurt, so that's why they're not higher on the list.

Also, I think this survey doesn't take in account "time played". It's a live count, so definitely most of those Warly's gave up.

https://dst.resamvi.io/  here you can check the numbers live. Warly is lower than before (even with RWYS). 

 

So yeah... I'm still correct.

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2 hours ago, Yuma Arcl said:

Yep! Most people don't spend money on games and/or won't buy Ww, Wortox or Wurt, so that's why they're not higher on the list.

Also, I think this survey doesn't take in account "time played". It's a live count, so definitely most of those Warly's gave up.

https://dst.resamvi.io/  here you can check the numbers live. Warly is lower than before (even with RWYS). 

 

So yeah... I'm still correct.

The play time thing could be said about all characters on the list making the argument invalid not saying it is but I feel it deserves mentioning that being said I do feel rather than food memory the bigger issue for the casual crowd with warly is even knowing how to make a dish and learning to fight as both are big and required learning to play warly keep in mind as well that the mass majority I've encountered don't know how to engage with the new farming system or how it compares with the old as realistically speaking most of this knowledge requires you to look it up which not everyone does.

 

On a side note while the community does a great job helping people with the game mechanics I kinda feel like kiel is going to need to release a official guide on don't starve either in game or with a ingame link to a webpage with info. I'm not saying they need to spoil everything just give them enough to get their head around the mechanics. Not saying content creators don't help but they don't always give easy access to basic questions people may have and not everyone uses the wiki or offical fourm either just my opinion on it tho.

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3 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The play time thing could be said about all characters on the list making the argument invalid not saying it is but I feel it deserves mentioning

Yes it could be said, but it wouldn't be a correct assumption. Here's how this graphic works:

If we have 10 people: 2 pick warly on the first month. Give up on him. Other 2 pick him the next month. Give up on him, we'd have a Warly pick rate graphic of 20% (2 out of 10). Now, if 2 pick him on the first month and 1 stays with him, and the same thing happens within the following months, we'd have at least 60% pick rate at the end of the 6 months.

Wendy's pick rate graphic is still high because people pick her and keep playing as her.

 

As I said before, even if they make Warly's downsides worse, it won't affect his abilities to make special dishes. If you make so that he's more "beginner friendly", his pick rate would certainly increase.

 

And about the guide: We have a lot of guides in YouTube and Google. I don't think Klei needs to make something like that (but It wouldn't hurt them to). BUT i'd love a more detailed info about characters in the game (on the selection tab). Most beginners enter a room and don't know anything about the caracters. Only a few words. They enter not knowing that Webber will aggro everything or that Wormwood won't heal from food. It's too vague

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On 12/29/2020 at 9:24 AM, ShadowDuelist said:

I play Warly for the challenge, don't make him easier! Game is too easy! I hate you!

holy crap just play wes he is the best character in the entire franchise for a challenge. Not that you are saying that op.

warly would become a super awesome character if this change was implemented, and I'd totally play him more because I almost never do.

 

 

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Now being played is more important that having a good character desing

Casual game styles will always be more trendy than difficult. Just see the game industry. Also, there is more new players than veterans so having variery to make happy everyone is a good thing. Numbers are nothing, if we are guide by that then Justin bieber>>all bands that arent as known as him

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13 hours ago, Yuma Arcl said:

Yes it could be said, but it wouldn't be a correct assumption. Here's how this graphic works:

If we have 10 people: 2 pick warly on the first month. Give up on him. Other 2 pick him the next month. Give up on him, we'd have a Warly pick rate graphic of 20% (2 out of 10). Now, if 2 pick him on the first month and 1 stays with him, and the same thing happens within the following months, we'd have at least 60% pick rate at the end of the 6 months.

Wendy's pick rate graphic is still high because people pick her and keep playing as her.

 

As I said before, even if they make Warly's downsides worse, it won't affect his abilities to make special dishes. If you make so that he's more "beginner friendly", his pick rate would certainly increase.

 

And about the guide: We have a lot of guides in YouTube and Google. I don't think Klei needs to make something like that (but It wouldn't hurt them to). BUT i'd love a more detailed info about characters in the game (on the selection tab). Most beginners enter a room and don't know anything about the caracters. Only a few words. They enter not knowing that Webber will aggro everything or that Wormwood won't heal from food. It's too vague

The first part is more a matter of opinion since we can't tell how many players give up playing warly but I will agree he turns people off his pub pick rate does seem to be on the rise tho but even more than food memory if you want him to bemore accessible rather than his downsides aiming at crock pot dish hunger balance would be the way to go.

As for the guides while they do exist alot of them have misinformation, half information, in same cases outdated information, and/or are colored by personal opinions not everyone looks to non official sources for their information and as the game's systems get more complex I can't help but feel it'll burn potiental new players.

 

Edit:to give a example while I'm not sure how true this holds overall but the vast majority of players I've encountered don't know how to use the follower system even some who play webber and most I've seen didn't even know beefalo taming exists.

I'm not saying kiel needs to make guide on all the content I'm saying they need to make a basic introduction to basic features to new players to get them started. Rather than food knowledge the biggest issue a new warly player would probaly face is the requirement to have basic competence in alot of areas and knowing how Warly's downside works.

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2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The first part is more a matter of opinion since we can't tell how many players give up playing warly but I will agree he turns people off his pub pick rate does seem to be on the rise tho but even more than food memory if you want him to bemore accessible rather than his downsides aiming at crock pot dish hunger balance would be the way to go.

As for the guides while they do exist alot of them have misinformation, half information, in same cases outdated information, and/or are colored by personal opinions not everyone looks to non official sources for their information and as the game's systems get more complex I can't help but feel it'll burn potiental new players.

 

Edit:to give a example while I'm not sure how true this holds overall but the vast majority of players I've encountered don't know how to use the follower system even some who play webber and most I've seen didn't even know beefalo taming exists.

I'm not saying kiel needs to make guide on all the content I'm saying they need to make a basic introduction to basic features to new players to get them started. Rather than food knowledge the biggest issue a new warly player would probaly face is the requirement to have basic competence in alot of areas and knowing how Warly's downside works.

They have that "guide" in their trailers so adding in the compendium them and telling "id you struggle try to watch these" can help a lot

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What if characters other than warly couldn’t eat his seasoned foods/unique dishes, but have to be force fed it by him instead? He would still be a pretty good team character and it would get rid of his issue with pick and swap

 

 

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