Questions for Developers

[Cairath]

39 minutes ago, Nicz said:

Also, reworking codebase days before launch seems like pretty good description of hell if you ask me

The OP said he's never even seen ONI code before. I've worked for well over 200 hours with it while modding and I gotta say, it's been a pleasure to work with, save for some quirks or extents of what Harmony can or cannot modify during run time (but the latter cannot be blamed on the game code itself)

 

OP made some funny comparison about writing 1000 lines of code which makes me thinks he's not experienced in the slightest, so he'd expect a big game to be written in a few months like it's a crappy school project. The notion of abandoning a game or rushing it to launch just to produce another bug-fest is so ridiculous to me I can't even find words. We programmers love our code-babies (for the most part).

[Majorchubby]

So far Klei is one of my fav developers and show how EA should be done. This game is still in EA I think until release.

[xialeth]

1 hour ago, Nicz said:

Leaving such advanced project completely scrapping all the work done (which i think OP suggests) is such a ridiculous notion, that only someone who have never worked professionally at software development would consider sane...

Huh, I see. I had understood it as "take what you've learned and build it anew without the old bugs", but maybe that was because I was primed to see it as such from my own experience. Might very well have been the case, but the way you put it: definitely yes. I viewed it as so ridiculous that it never occurred to me that someone might be actually suggesting it.

[Siromatik]

Just now, TheOwl said:

They meant EA as "Early Access", not as "Electronic Arts".

Hey how fast you did that, deleted my post like 3s after I posted it what the hell xD

[Oozinator]

16 hours ago, Xentios said:

Sometimes it is better to start a clean slate then trying to FIX bla bla.

[Angpaur]

5 minutes ago, Siromatik said:

Hey how fast you did that, deleted my post like 3s after I posted it what the hell xD

[Siromatik]

Ahah so true ! My brain is just melting, took me this whole wall of text to realise I was in another world (this is my new favorite emoticon)

Be COOL with me okay guys !

[suxkar]

I know one of these appear more or less every week (especially talking about multiplayer) and I know it might be fun to make fun of it but.. can we let this die and keep on talking about the game on other threads? 

[watermelen671]

16 hours ago, Yunru said:

Je nais parle par l'francais?

Spoiler

What you just said means: "I'm born by French?" 

Spoiler

It's: Je ne parle pas français.

 

[Yunru]

4 minutes ago, watermelen671 said:

What you just said means: "I'm born by French?" 

Well clearly that has to be wrong or it wouldn't... be... wrong?

[watermelen671]

15 hours ago, Ketmol said:

There are plenty of studios out there who will leave games unfinished, who will charge big money for DLC that fix the original game, or rather ship half a game, have in game pay to win store + sell rest of the game as DLC.

Otherwise known as the EA strategy.

[Yunru]

3 minutes ago, watermelen671 said:

Otherwise known as the EA strategy.

We do not speak of Evil Association.

[Nightinggale]

9 hours ago, Molay said:

Roughly speaking, Harmony gives modders the option to add, remove and modify game code.

For clarity, factorio only offers lua scripting. Rimworld offers Harmony, like ONI does.

Harmony was originally developed for Rimworld. However it's not designed to be Rimworld exclusive. Since both Rimworld and ONI uses Unity with managed code, Harmony can be used in both games. In fact from a technical point of view, modding the two games are so similar that I didn't have to install any tools in order to start modding ONI. I had everything set for modding Rimworld. This is for programming only. Apparently graphics and audio works differently, but I haven't really investigated how that works in either game.

9 hours ago, Molay said:

Rimworld for example can be modified in such a way, resulting in things that couldn't by done (or at huge performance cost) via scripting. There's some crazy rimworld mods that add things that were never meant to exist. Like magicians. And skilltrees. And vampires sucking blood. Combat extended which adds ammo and morale in fights (enemy suppression, forcing them into cover), fog of war, all kinds of stuff. With just lua scripting those things would at best be clunky or slow, and at worst impossible.

I wouldn't even say that's the craziest part of mods doing stuff not planned by the developers because I modded mod loading itself. Imagine you make a Rimworld mod, which adds a bed. You want it to appear in the build menu next to the other beds, so you write a line to place it after an existing bed (not doing so will just add it to the end). There is a mod, which adds a device, which boosts healing rate in nearby beds. You want that to work with your bed, so you add your bed to the list in that device, if that device is loaded. If your bed for some reason absolutely require some other mod, you add an error message if that mod isn't loaded, or an error if a specific load order is required and is violated.

The thing is the move command, check for other mod command and write error command are modded commands. To use them, the mod creator takes my mod (a single dll file) and includes it in his/her own mod. The user will never notice, but the mod will just work regardless of which mods it has to work together with. Adding animals usually adds conditional stats for a dog said and combat extended. In the past patch mods existed to make two mods work together. They are now obsolete because mods can conditionally patch themselves to match other mods.

I know Rimworld added some check for other mods and the Mod Manager mod also checks for mod load order and it has a UI. However those two came 2 and 3 major releases of Rimworld later and as such happened to show up just after I decided to stop development of my mod because it contained everything I could think of. I haven't stopped fixing bugs though, but for a long time that means only update to match changes in Rimworld.

I would say for modding something totally unplanned by the game developers, this one ranks fairly high. Rimworld supports crazy ideas like this. ONI does too, but Factorio doesn't even come close to allow something this far from what the game developers planned for. To be fair, Factorio can actually support adding stuff depending on which other mods are loaded, but that's because the game provided a command to check for that. The modders have no ability to add such a command without the aid of the game developers.

[Yoma_Nosme]

Oh man...I have to stop working...I always miss out on this epic forum battles...fml, right?

f work, play moa computha...I'm like the fat kid that comes at the end of the movie from summercamp and ask everyone how has their summer been while they clean up the crap from an alien invasion or so...

[Xentios]

Everyone is clear about everything in the topic so i don't need to add anything to them.

Except this;
You guys or I don't understand adverbs. I just said "maybe work on co-op". I don't think it is a must, would be a well addition but don't know if it would worth the work.  Know this; "Terraria" with co-op gives much more enjoyment then playing alone. Not sure it would do the same trick in ONI. So it was and still a "maybe". 

Thats all, don't understand why some of you give extreme responses. Have a nice cool day.

 

PS: Also can anyone point me a fast Harmony tutorial link? 

[blash365]

Funny how a guy with a Lionhead Studios Logo talks about code quality.

[Lurve]

6 minutes ago, Xentios said:

You guys or I don't understand adverbs.

This may help

Spoiler

 

 

[Ellilea]

1 hour ago, Xentios said:

Thats all, don't understand why some of you give extreme responses. Have a nice cool day.

Everyone's got their panties in a bunch (and rightfully, IMO) because you came here, to a forum full of players who beta test this game to make it better and better with each iteration, and wrote a huge ass post presenting a ridiculous notion that would **** every single person who loves ONI and wants to see it completed. Not to mention the dev team, who are working tirelessly on updates and upgrades instead of releasing a half-assed product, ignoring bugs, and saying "deal with it" like many other studios do.

On top of that you riled up a bunch of devs/IT techs who know how coding (not codding, cod is a fish, hence the fish memes) actually works so naturally they came to defend the devs and the game they like. I'm not coder myself so I won't be smartassing around, but even someone as inexperienced as I am can tell that bugs and bug fixes are NOT a reason to axe a game lol. ONI is fully functional, it's functioning well, and seeing tons of bug fixes in the notes is a GOOD thing. It's how the end of the development process looks like. Provided devs care, of course.

A lot of us also have no interest in multi-player whatsoever and we're a bit tired of seeing that suggestion keep popping up. Multiplayer features/versions have already ruined a lot of great game series, games, or concepts. There's also a billion of them out there for those who can't stand solitude. Pick and choose.