[Game Update] - 530962

[Mike23Ua]

1 hour ago, Cloakingsumo198 said:

Will spell placement and menu navigating be overhauled for controllers when Maxwell's rework comes out?

Opening a menu to emote or sort inventory freezes the character in place and the targeting for casting is kinda awkward for other similar items

I was hoping for some changes since Maxwell is gonna be doing a lot of both.

I thought things like this is why updates stay in beta as long they do, so that Klei can fine tune and tweak things.. unfortunately I don’t know if there’s enough people playing with a controller to step up & say “hey this feels pretty bad on a controller, can it please get some much needed tweaks?”

Im unable to play in the PC only beta phases, but if DST had a beta like Minecraft’s preview build I could properly test how it works on console before it goes live to the public branch.

I can understand though that doing so may be an unworthwhile endeavor for Klei.. just makes me a bit sad that there doesn’t seem to be enough people in the beta testing how things will work for us console folk. </3

[GreenBowers]

Honestly, giving it a bit of thought, I don't mind the variable times as much, though I feel like a distinction between players hitting caged targets and followers hitting caged targets would be pretty nice.

I view the function of the cage more so to put a pause on the trapped mob in order to collect yourself or perform some sort of function, like healing/sanity treatment/summoning, and I can see that if a player is smacking a caged mob, they probably don't need this breather. If they did need the time to recoup and perform some actions though, their minions are still just slamming away and lowering the time you have left. Idk

[LuneCaptor]

ignoring all the debates going on, does anyone have a comparison for maxwell animation cancelling (now vs last patch)? or at least a gif/video of how fast it is now

[Cheggf]

2 hours ago, Victor Haros said:

Oh bye max.

You're a good char before nerfs :/

KLEI, PLS DONT DO ANYTHING TO WURT.

She's perfect the way she is.

Patch notes could be like "the cost of all spells has been lowered from 0.2 to 0.05 fuel, duelist damage has been increased from 20-60 to 40-100, servants will now automatically put their items in the shadow inventory, Maxwell now has t1 magic known by default like Wickerbottom, Maxwell now starts with a dark sword, night armor, and magician's top hat, shadow prison's duration has been lowered from 12 to 11.5 seconds" and you guys would be talking about how he's a useless character because they nerfed shadow prison.

He still has twice the gathering potential of his previous version (who was already the best gatherer in the game), and gained the ability to use that on pickable and ground items instead of just trees, and it's independent of him so they're not bothered by treeguards and can work while he does something else. His duelists went from something most people wrote off as useless to the strongest and cheapest minion which can be infinitely respawned in the middle of combat for basically no cost. These minions both let him deal Wanda damage (while having several times the health of Wanda and having the duelists tank many hits for Max) or just fight things on his behalf while he safely sits on the sidelines. His sanity perk was enhanced with the ignoring of night armor and dark sword drains, effectively letting him get 36.67 sanity per minute above the rest, even stronger than his 20 per minute in DSA. He has 12 extra inventory slots and can teleport items around the map easily and for free. He can safely and cheaply get nmf and beard hair. He can easily kill mobs that run away or use ranged attacks. Shadow prison is still extremely strong even with it only lasting upwards of 6 seconds in a worst case scenario. He can set up snares in advance to protect him from unexpected danger like splumonkeys. He has all that and more. He is still clearly the single strongest character in the game.

P.S. He can still read Wickerbottom books, and her books alone make her one of the best characters.

Edited November 15, 2022 by Cheggf

[Mysterious box]

8 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

He still has twice the gathering potential of his previous version (who was already the best gatherer in the game), and gained the ability to use that on pickable and ground items instead of just trees, and it's independent of him so they're not bothered by treeguards and can work while he does something else. His duelists went from something most people wrote off as useless to the strongest and cheapest minion which can be infinitely respawned in the middle of combat for basically no cost. These minions both let him deal Wanda damage (while having several times the health of Wanda and having the duelists tank many hits for Max) or just fight things on his behalf while he safely sits on the sidelines. His sanity perk was enhanced with the ignoring of night armor and dark sword drains, effectively letting him get 36.67 sanity per minute above the rest, even stronger than his 20 per minute in DSA. He has 12 extra inventory slots and can teleport items around the map easily and for free. He can safely and cheaply get nmf and beard hair. He can easily kill mobs that run away or use ranged attacks. Shadow prison is still extremely strong even with it only lasting upwards of 6 seconds in a worst case scenario. He can set up snares in advance to protect him from unexpected danger like splumonkeys. He is still clearly the single strongest character in the game.

P.S. He can still read Wickerbottom books, and her books alone make her one of the best characters.

It really is crazy to me how often it has had to be said Maxwell is far from a weak character but is actually extremely powerful throughout this beta.

Edited November 15, 2022 by Mysterious box

[Cloakingsumo198]

31 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

I thought things like this is why updates stay in beta as long they do, so that Klei can fine tune and tweak things.. unfortunately I don’t know if there’s enough people playing with a controller to step up & say “hey this feels pretty bad on a controller, can it please get some much needed tweaks?”

Im unable to play in the PC only beta phases, but if DST had a beta like Minecraft’s preview build I could properly test how it works on console before it goes live to the public branch.

I can understand though that doing so may be an unworthwhile endeavor for Klei.. just makes me a bit sad that there doesn’t seem to be enough people in the beta testing how things will work for us console folk. </3

I feel like that is part of the issue controller players aren't the biggest group especially in the beta branch where it's pc only.

I made a post about it and it got buried extremely quickly.

But they are also mainly focusing on balancing and tweaking Maxwell's main abilities since the current update is all about him but these tweaks will help greatly smooth out his experience on consoles.

Please bring awareness to controller issues.

[SullyD]

With this nerf it makes no sense to use this skill, in the battle against bee queen it's good, but against other bosses, nahhh it's better not to waste time and sanity and keep hitting.

[Arcwell]

1 hour ago, LuneCaptor said:

ignoring all the debates going on, does anyone have a comparison for maxwell animation cancelling (now vs last patch)? or at least a gif/video of how fast it is now

Seems to be ~2 seconds now (down from ~2.5 seconds, which was down from ~3 seconds). Previously Maxwell would have to wait for the book to be closed in the animation, now you can cancel as soon as the pages stop flipping.

[Bonini007]

7 hours ago, V2C said:

Mudanças

• Os Servos das Sombras não fogem mais das criaturas das sombras que não são hostis ao seu invocador.
• Os Servos das Sombras não fogem mais do Esqueleto Reanimado se ele não estiver em combate.
• Mudanças na segmentação de criaturas das sombras (multijogador):
  • Para suas próprias criaturas das sombras, mirar e atacar funciona da mesma forma que de costume.
  • Quando você está louco, mirar e atacar funciona da mesma forma que de costume.
  • Quando você estiver com menos de 50% de sanidade, mas ainda não insano, a tecla de ataque não será mais direcionada automaticamente às criaturas das sombras de outros jogadores. No entanto, você ainda pode mirar e forçar atacá-los.
  • Quando você está acima de 50% de sanidade, você não pode mirar ou atacar as criaturas das sombras de outros jogadores.
  • Observe que, como uma dica visual, sua animação ociosa muda com 50% de sanidade.
• Frequência reduzida das dicas de fala do equipamento sombrio de Maxwell.
• Maxwell agora pode cancelar sua animação de lançamento de feitiços um pouco mais rápido.
• Shadow Sneak agora pode fazer com que Lavae, Woven Shadow e Birchnutter entrem em pânico.
• Shadow Sneak não será mais acionado por coisas que não podem entrar em pânico.
• Shadow Prison quebra mais rápido enquanto você está atacando o alvo através dela.
• As caixas de ataque AoE para Ancient Sentrypede, Eye of Terror, Retinazor, Spazmatism e Celestial Champion foram atualizadas para levar em conta o tamanho de seus alvos.
• Campeão Celestial agora se afastará das marionetes de sombra também na fase 3.
• Pulsos de Armadilha Iluminadora agora farão com que as marionetes de sombra sejam temporariamente eliminadas.

Correções de bugs

• Dragonfly se moverá enquanto ataca novamente.
• Corrigido um bug que fazia com que a mira de Bee Queen falhasse se ela ficasse presa na fase 1.
• Corrigido um bug que fazia com que o ataque de salto do Ancient Guardian falhasse ao mirar algumas vezes.
• Shadow Servants não vão mais pegar coisas das estruturas.
• Reparar as sequências de inspeção não será mais exibida para o Lazy Forager.
• Corrigida uma falha com o Stagehand.

 

Ver atualização completa

 

A vdd é que tem meia dúzia de pessoas que se acham d+, nem jogam com o boneco e ficam pedindo pra nerfar, e infelizmente vcs nerfam, bizarro.

[Master_NiX]

Love when people lose their minds and complain that they cant kill bosses by spamming two spells.
Even without prison, Maxwell with his clones is on par or even stronger than Wolfgang.
I agree with Prison being nerfed. Someone suggested making it as a retreat option by making Duelists stop attacking prisoned targets, which is also fine by me.
The fact hat Maxwell could trap Celestial boss and disable his attacks that is very broken imo.

 

Edit: was hidden for some reasons.

Edited November 15, 2022 by Master_NiX
I guess one word in particular was the reason for being Hidden?

[Cassielu]

I wish tweak the Shadow puppet's teleportation and target redirection again, they're too hard to get mob's aggro right now. Mob often ignored them and went straight to maxwell.

[Arcwell]

I've tried new Shadow Prison/AI changes against every boss, here's how they went compared to last patch:

Identical or nearly the same as before:

Spoiler

• Ancient Guardian
• Antlion
• Bearger
• Crab King
• Deerclops
• Klaus
• Malbatross
• Moose/Goose
• Shadow Pieces
• Toadstool

More annoying but strategy remains the same:

Spoiler

• Bee Queen
• Celestial Champion
• Dragonfly
• Eye of Terror

Shadow prison is no longer worth using (imo):

Spoiler

• Twins of Terror: Seems like it should be useful, the issue is it's unreasonably hard to keep the Twins locked since you can no longer attack their eggs while they're charging in place. As a result, peepers will often interrupt your casting animation, freeing the Twins. This could be fixed by allowing shadow prison to target peepers in their egg form, but until such time, I'd rather just use pan flutes.
• Ancient Fuelweaver: Was always sketchy because of the sanity cost and casting time in that fight, but now it doesn't even last long enough to keep FW locked between bone cages.

[LDee]

1 hour ago, Arcwell said:

I've tried new Shadow Prison/AI changes against every boss, here's how they went compared to last patch:

Identical or nearly the same as before:

  Reveal hidden contents

• Ancient Guardian
• Antlion
• Bearger
• Crab King
• Deerclops
• Klaus
• Malbatross
• Moose/Goose
• Shadow Pieces
• Toadstool

More annoying but strategy remains the same:

  Reveal hidden contents

• Bee Queen
• Celestial Champion
• Dragonfly
• Eye of Terror

Shadow prison is no longer worth using (imo):

  Reveal hidden contents

• Twins of Terror: Seems like it should be useful, the issue is it's unreasonably hard to keep the Twins locked since you can no longer attack their eggs while they're charging in place. As a result, peepers will often interrupt your casting animation, freeing the Twins. This could be fixed by allowing shadow prison to target peepers in their egg form, but until such time, I'd rather just use pan flutes.
• Ancient Fuelweaver: Was always sketchy because of the sanity cost and casting time in that fight, but now it doesn't even last long enough to keep FW locked between bone cages.

lmao, so instead of beating 8 bosses with a single, cheap strategy, he can now only beat 7.

Meanwhile every other character needs to come up with specific strategies based on each individual boss's kiting patterns and mechanics and/or spend huge resources to win.

Seems legit.

Edited November 15, 2022 by LDee

[Arcwell]

5 minutes ago, LDee said:

lmao, so there are only 2 bosses in the game where just spamming Shadow Prison and Duelists over and over again isn't a viable option.

Meanwhile every other character needs to come up with specific strategies based on each individual boss's kiting patterns and mechanics and/or spend huge resources to win.

Seems legit.

Bee Queen was the only one of those fights where I did nothing but spam prison and duelists, and even then it cost 28 cactus.

I don't see how having a viable alternative to holding F is a bad thing.

[BB Marioni]

Gotta say, I was satisfied with all the previous updates, except for the first one where the duelists were basically the same as they currently are. But I'm not particularly happy with this one. Most of the updates are actually good, but the prison and shadow monster changes are a bit rough. The shadows are simple, it's a big hit against beginners as I wouldnt be able to help them fight shadow monsters while they are still learning the game. Maybe at least making them being able to hit using forced attack at full sanity would still be OK.

As with the prison, I feel like before Maxwell had a choice of either having a dark sword and fighting alongside the duelists, or wearing a thurible and focus on CCing the enemies while the duelists do all the damage. Now it seems less viable to use a thurible at all as the prison duration would force you to get in the fight anyway. Before the prison's main purpose seemed to be to CC enemies to protect Maxwell's frail health. But now it seems the only purpose is to give Maxwell time to resummon duelists.

[LDee]

1 minute ago, Arcwell said:

I don't see how having a viable alternative to holding F is a bad thing.

Please list the 8 bosses in which other characters are able to win by simply holding down F without the need of specific boss knowledge and/or extensive resources.

I'll wait.

[Arthas Durotan]

Looks manageable to me. Most of the mobs will die before timer runs out (each mob have their own prison/timer right?)

But pillars really need some visual clues when it's about to break.

What if hitting with thurible increases the duration of the pillars? or pillar spell has the same AOE as wicker's books.

[Wolf 73]

As the former king of shadows，These two changes are really disappointing，Although the author may have regarded him as a tool man, he started to develop towards a tool man from the time of redoing，But I think that as the former king of shadows and under the background condition that the maximum HP is only 75, Maxwell should not only have such weak fighting ability, especially in the treatment of shadow monsters. Apart from the collection, he has no advantage over a former watchmaker，Especially after Maxwell's shadow raid, hatred will come to the body. It's really stupid. As a character who needs a lot of nightmare fuel, Maxwell has no advantage in obtaining nightmare fuel. First, there is no damage bonus for Hercules, and second, there is no distance advantage for Wanda. As a result, a character who relies on nightmare fuel to obtain nightmare fuel is inferior to a character who does not need nightmare fuel, This is also a funny point. Besides, the current combat ability cannot match Maxwell's high-risk and high return setting. Otherwise, why does he have only 75 HP,I hope to slightly enhance Maxwell's fighting ability and turn him into a very fragile but good damage character. Even if he doesn't have it, he should have a better ability to deal with shadow monsters, or have a faster way to obtain nightmare fuel. Even I think it is a good choice to turn the shadow censer into the materials required for Old Mai's exclusive weapon, so that Old Mai can have a stronger shadow weapon, I think it is very reasonable for a former king of shadows to make Maxwell have more comfortable fighting ability in the later period, rather than really being a waste hiding behind the shadow. The shadow should only be an extension of Maxwell's ability, not the main fighting method,I apologize for saying something wrong or wrong with my translator, but I really like the role of Maxwell, so I have a lot of ideas to say, but I don't understand English
 

[Wolf 73]

Based on the above mentioned Shadow Incense Burner can be used to make a powerful exclusive shadow weapon for Old Mai, I think it is a good idea again, so I hope the author can see and consider again. Just like Wanda can make exclusive items and weapons with thulium ore fragments and nightmare fuel, maybe this weapon can do special damage to shadow monsters, or have a longer attack distance and a larger range of damage, Then nightmare fuel is needed as durability. I think the former king of shadow should have the best understanding of the eternal field, so he should clearly know what kind of weapons in the eternal field can better survive in the world. And because Maxwell is related to shadow, it is reasonable to link weapons and equipment with nightmare fuel, And it should also be the effect of high risk and high return to make up for the disadvantage of old Mai's blood. It's not just about revising the shadow content of the Shadow Code. It seems that the role is not the character, but the shadow code. I think it's disappointing to redo the role,All I said are my own ideas. I may not be the best, but I am standing behind a person who likes Maxwell's role, and I strongly hope the author can see and adopt, or put forward suggestions
 

[edulopes]

8 hours ago, Cheggf said:

40-100, servants will now automatically put their items in the shadow inventory

Ah a good dream

[Lil K]

4 hours ago, Wolf 73 said:

As the former king of shadows，These two changes are really disappointing，Although the author may have regarded him as a tool man, he started to develop towards a tool man from the time of redoing，But I think that as the former king of shadows and under the background condition that the maximum HP is only 75, Maxwell should not only have such weak fighting ability, especially in the treatment of shadow monsters. Apart from the collection, he has no advantage over a former watchmaker，Especially after Maxwell's shadow raid, hatred will come to the body. It's really stupid. As a character who needs a lot of nightmare fuel, Maxwell has no advantage in obtaining nightmare fuel. First, there is no damage bonus for Hercules, and second, there is no distance advantage for Wanda. As a result, a character who relies on nightmare fuel to obtain nightmare fuel is inferior to a character who does not need nightmare fuel, This is also a funny point. Besides, the current combat ability cannot match Maxwell's high-risk and high return setting. Otherwise, why does he have only 75 HP,I hope to slightly enhance Maxwell's fighting ability and turn him into a very fragile but good damage character. Even if he doesn't have it, he should have a better ability to deal with shadow monsters, or have a faster way to obtain nightmare fuel. Even I think it is a good choice to turn the shadow censer into the materials required for Old Mai's exclusive weapon, so that Old Mai can have a stronger shadow weapon, I think it is very reasonable for a former king of shadows to make Maxwell have more comfortable fighting ability in the later period, rather than really being a waste hiding behind the shadow. The shadow should only be an extension of Maxwell's ability, not the main fighting method,I apologize for saying something wrong or wrong with my translator, but I really like the role of Maxwell, so I have a lot of ideas to say, but I don't understand English
 

Almost had a stroke reading this

[Wattata]

10 minutes ago, LDee said:

Please list the 8 bosses in which other characters are able to win by simply holding down F without the need of specific boss knowledge and/or extensive resources.

I'll wait.

I understand that you feel Maxwell's Duelists are OP, yes I think they are OP too, however no matter how OP the Duelists are, Maxwell cannot be used by new players as easy as using Wolfgang / Wendy / beginner-friendly characters. To use Maxwell, a player need to have good knowledge about : 

- Sanity management : Spamming Duelists and Prison sounds easy, but if we Summon 5 Duelist, our max sanity will be 50, casting Shadow Prison twice without recovering sanity will make Nightmare creatures appear and attack us. Yes this can be negated by Bone Helm, but then, how fast a player in a newly created world can defeat Ancient Fuelweaver ?

- how to craft dark sword and night armor : There are a lots of things that a new player need to learn when playing DST, creating Prestihatitator would not be a priority before a player know how to survive each season, repel Deerclops and Bearger and wildfires in summer, not to mention the whole things about cave and ruins...

Yes Maxwell can read Wickerbottom's books, but we need Bone Helm or many stacks of Jelly Salad /ice cream to use the books, how fast we can achieve either of these?

Yes new players can use Maxwell to learn DST but they will probably die from mobs hitting them because Duelist do not always keep aggro on enemies, and because kiting pattern for each mob is different, not to mention how to kite Terrorbeak.. I'm quite sure majority of us was tanking Terrorbeak (or running away from it) before we learned how to kite it on youtube / forum / wiki...

In short, Maxwell is powerful because he is a "reward" type Character that gives strong perks for experienced players to enjoy. When a player knows how to manage incoming damage with good armor, a 75 max health won't be a problem. A player that used in kiting enemies will have no problem kiting enemies while Duelists keep attacking, same with gathering Nightmare fuels, will a new player rush to lower their sanity and able to kite 1-2 Terrorbeaks? or know that rabbits will into beardling with Shadow Sneak? A player needs to have a firm grasp of the game before they can use Maxwell properly (same with Wanda, you can manage the danger in old-age Wanda and kite properly? here's Alarming Clock that slap yer enemy to dead in a tick tock, also here's a way to teleport around the Constant along with your friends because you are so good in DST)

I think Klei purposely designed Maxwell to be able to deal high damage and able to gather resource in more effective way because we experienced players already know the effective ways of gathering resources (grass gekko farm, lureplant boat/farm, pig farm, etc) and we know how to deal with bosses through our research and hours spent on watching youtube videos about DST bosses and reading DST wiki. Then Klei gives us Maxwell that have many perks (and some downside that experienced players can handle) because we have dedicated our time to play their game, it's a win-win solution for Klei and players. Plus, isn't it nice to see our friends enjoying playing Maxwell / Wanda and deal insane amount of damage to help beating the boss faster? it's only a lose-die solution for mobs and bosses in DST (hehehe)

Maxwell is a gift for us that are taking our time here, reading things in forum to learn more about DST because we love DST. I'm sure future reworks of other Characters will be a good one too, seeing how Devs listened well to players' feedback

I'm sure there will be something that I wrote here that is wrong or disagreed on, it has to be, because everyone thinks differently, i'm just sharing my point of view, thanks thanks for reading and peace

 

[Wolf 73]

30 minutes ago, Lil K said:

Almost had a stroke reading this

what

[user1464576869]

Do the shadows walls have any graphic indicating it's remaining lifetime? That would be neat?

[Seig Xeon]

3 hours ago, LDee said:

Please list the 8 bosses in which other characters are able to win by simply holding down F without the need of specific boss knowledge and/or extensive resources.

I'll wait.

Can you name the 7 bosses? I think you may be underselling the amount of effort, resources(including time), skill, and/or knowledge it takes Maxwell to do the shadow prison/duelist strategy compared to all other strategies against the vast majority of bosses in DST with the other characters on the roster. I would like to analyze your opinion (Maxwell has the easiest, cheapest, and requires less effort/knowledge against bosses. If I am misunderstanding your stance, please let me know). against these bosses, and my current knowledge about the game (1k hours Maxwell main so you know my perspective).

To steelman my stance:
Maxwell's prison/dueslist strategy is niche in superiority, and overall great in comparison (I want this rework to create this) to the rest of the options available.