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problem with warly and why he needs a rework


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On 8/13/2021 at 10:33 PM, Bugsworth said:

let me rephrase "rework" i mean just make his abilities more useful. he's good in a multiplayer setting, but i have no friends to play with. 

I always play alone and I'm still Warly main. Since we have an option to switch characters during gameplay it's really nice to prepare some buffs as Warly and switch to Wolfgang for a big fight to use them with greater benefits.

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I think I've figured it out after giving it some thought.

OP, do you do a lot of boss fights and ruins raids?

There are a bunch of Warly's recipes and spices that I use all the time, but come to think of it, it's mainly when I'm out to fight bosses or clean the ruins. For a play-style that doesn't include those, I can see OP's point. But no character is gonna suit every need. Warly is awesome for what I like doing!

(Just today to fight Fuel Weaver I've used four of the recipes/spices)

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29 minutes ago, sinisterrkid said:

OP, do you do a lot of boss fights and ruins raids?

thats mostly what i do. im doing a warly ruins clear right now in fact. personally i dont find warly's recepies to be that useful in the ruins. i hear lots of people say that the glowberry mousse is good, but personally i dont need it. i use miner hats and beefalo meaning i dont need armour, i can have a backpack and a thing for hand i guess. :D

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From a balancing standpoint it's a good thing Warly doesn't do anything truly exclusive to him. It would force people to play the character to get the benefit, which would sour even more people to him. What he gets is the convenience to cook faster and be an above average gatherer, explorer and fighter. Never the best, because that falls on more specialized characters, but better.

If you ask me the fundamental flaw to Warly is the burden of knowledge required to play him. Both the diet and the recipes, none of which is communicated or even hinted at in-game. Yes you can ignore the variety penalty by eating more than 180 hunger points every 2 days, but even that requires knowing about it beforehand.

His drawbacks are there to incentivize variety which is great, but then ironically playing as the cook character makes cooking harder on you, which doesn't happen anywhere else. You pick a combat character to have an easier time fighting, a gatherer to have an easier time gathering... Can you imagine if Wolfgang did less damage the more he hit with a Ham Bat? "I tire of this weapon, bring me a new one."

There's a couple solutions for this, but I'm starting to wander beyond the scope of this thread.

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2 hours ago, -Kiyo- said:

From a balancing standpoint it's a good thing Warly doesn't do anything truly exclusive to him. It would force people to play the character to get the benefit, which would sour even more people to him. What he gets is the convenience to cook faster and be an above average gatherer, explorer and fighter. Never the best, because that falls on more specialized characters, but better.

If you ask me the fundamental flaw to Warly is the burden of knowledge required to play him. Both the diet and the recipes, none of which is communicated or even hinted at in-game. Yes you can ignore the variety penalty by eating more than 180 hunger points every 2 days, but even that requires knowing about it beforehand.

His drawbacks are there to incentivize variety which is great, but then ironically playing as the cook character makes cooking harder on you, which doesn't happen anywhere else. You pick a combat character to have an easier time fighting, a gatherer to have an easier time gathering... Can you imagine if Wolfgang did less damage the more he hit with a Ham Bat? "I tire of this weapon, bring me a new one."

There's a couple solutions for this, but I'm starting to wander beyond the scope of this thread.

Depends on your outlook really if you don't know how to fight you can't use Wolfgang and if you don't know how to cook you can't use Warly believe it or not alot of players are bad at fighting and I've seen plenty of dead wolfgangs dying to low level threats. While Warly offers speedy convenience when you know how to play him you cook on the go while fighting or doing tasks so you never have to idle unlike other characters if your good. Also while downplayed his immunity dishes make it so that you never have to wait to warm up or cool down saving inventory slots and time spent warming up meaning that Warly spends the least time waiting of any character when played efficiently.

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On 8/13/2021 at 10:50 PM, Bugsworth said:

based

I'm %100 agree with you and those problems are in other characters too.

Wolfgang
-He is strong, okay but you can just use stronger things or be weak, what matter? The fight will just be longer.

Walter
-He have pebbles but we had darts, so damn you pebbles.

Wickerbottom
-She makes thing grow faster, bruh just wait to make them grow.

Wigfrid
-She have spear but hambat is better, so make her trash tier

Webber
-Can tame spiders, so what? It's not that important to be that strong, you just can run away from bosses and be pacifist, be vegan. Profit

Wurt
-She is green and vegan.

Woodie
-He can turn creatures that makes him stronger, faster or source gatherer. Like I said before it's ok to be weak. I don't need to be really fast, you can just take time and get same result. He can chop a forest in one minute, so what? What I will do with that much wood?

 

Spoiler

This is a joke btw

 

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17 minutes ago, Slagger said:

I'm %100 agree with you and those problems are in other characters too.

Wolfgang
-He is strong, okay but you can just use stronger things or be weak, what matter? The fight will just be longer.

Walter
-He have pebbles but we had darts, so damn you pebbles.

Wickerbottom
-She makes thing grow faster, bruh just wait to make them grow.

Wigfrid
-She have spear but hambat is better, so make her trash tier

Webber
-Can tame spiders, so what? It's not that important to be that strong, you just can run away from bosses and be pacifist, be vegan. Profit

Wurt
-She is green and vegan.

Woodie
-He can turn creatures that makes him stronger, faster or source gatherer. Like I said before it's ok to be weak. I don't need to be really fast, you can just take time and get same result. He can chop a forest in one minute, so what? What I will do with that much wood?

I know right, and what about Wormwood? Making food with pretty much no effort at all? Just starve.

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7 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

Depends on your outlook really if you don't know how to fight you can't use Wolfgang and if you don't know how to cook you can't use Warly believe it or not alot of players are bad at fighting and I've seen plenty of dead wolfgangs dying to low level threats.

Oh you're absolutely right, but generally when a novice Wolfgang dies the reason is made clear to them. They ran out of health. Next time let's try not to run out of health. That's a path to improvement.

Warly plays by nebulous rules written nowhere but the wiki, and tracked only internally by the game.
I'm not asking for a GUI element that tracks Warly's diet, mind you, but he could at least be able to inspect a dish and say "I've had this before."

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1 minute ago, -Kiyo- said:

and say "I've had this before."

he says so after eating. It's pretty obvious. Literally just remember what you ate last

Or is "I'd like to eat something different" after eating the same thing twice not straight forward enough?

 

 

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On 8/13/2021 at 2:41 PM, Bugsworth said:

you could kill deerclops faster than you can get two fish and froglegs. its also only last 5 minutes and is not reparable.

 

As someone who just loves playing Warly, I don’t know… I think like 99% of what you’re saying is a reach. He’s a great character with recipes that are actually fun that go beyond staying fed. 
 

He might not be for you. A lot of us love him. 

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On 8/14/2021 at 4:56 AM, Bugsworth said:

do you also secretly start in spring

my world might be bugged all the time i dont know that frog should have spawn only in spring  :frog:


 

18 hours ago, Bugsworth said:

thats mostly what i do. im doing a warly ruins clear right now in fact. personally i dont find warly's recepies to be that useful in the ruins. i hear lots of people say that the glowberry mousse is good, but personally i dont need it. i use miner hats and beefalo meaning i dont need armour, i can have a backpack and a thing for hand i guess. :D

wow .. how can u rush ruins with beefalo u must be really fast map exploler and resource gatherer to tame beef long enough to let u ride him with no armour my beef would be throwing me away infront of bishop and 3 rook for fun :wilson_cry:

u need start making utube and stream ,, i would love to learn from u 

 

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5 minutes ago, prettynuggets said:

wow .. how can u rush ruins with beefalo u must be really fast map exploler and resource gatherer to tame beef long enough to let u ride him with no armour

unmount and remount to reset buck timer before entering dangerous areas, a few days of riding a beefalo already give you a very decent amount of riding time

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Just now, Guille6785 said:

unmount and remount to reset buck timer before entering dangerous areas, a few days of riding a beefalo already give you a very decent amount of riding time

still ruins rush with beef with no extra armor is big ball move . he clear it too what a legend.

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5 hours ago, BezKa said:

he says so after eating. It's pretty obvious. Literally just remember what you ate last

Or is "I'd like to eat something different" after eating the same thing twice not straight forward enough?

 

 

Actually he has a fair point in the spirit of making the game more casual friendly which is the direction the game is heading a lot of complaints on Warly would probaly go away if kiel added a unique examination when he examines something he's already eaten recently and if the game suggested very basic crockpot recipes to him for first time players it wouldn't really take away anything for experienced players while lowering the learning curve for newer and less experienced players for the crockpot.

Actually that is one gripe I do have with the crockpot from a game design perspective is that the game doesn't hint at how to make it's recipes and heavily punishes experimentation a fair amount of recipes likely wouldn't have been found without data miners and it's likely what makes Warly seem to daunting from the outside.

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12 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

Actually that is one gripe I do have with the crockpot from a game design perspective is that the game doesn't hint at how to make it's recipes and heavily punishes experimentation a fair amount of recipes likely wouldn't have been found without data miners and it's likely what makes Warly seem to daunting from the outside.

I propose a chance for your character to suddenly get an "eureka" moment and suggest that the player try out the recipe for a random dish whenever the cookbook is opened or closed. Maybe as character announcement quote or it appears with a question mark on top of the dish square thing that when hovered says something like "Maybe I should try putting 2 frog legs, 1 large fish, and 1 ice on the crockpot".

Could also take this suggestion and change it to instead of showing the recipe, maybe show one of the ingredients or the food group of that dish.

There's also a crafting system common in some games where if you pick up an item, you then know how to craft something else with that same item you picked up. So could take something similar like that and show where that particular food can be used, so let's say you pick up a fig and then in your cookbook, 4 dishes have a notification on them and when clicked on them you can see one of the ingredients which is a fig.

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3 minutes ago, SomebodyRandom said:

I propose a chance for your character to suddenly get an "eureka" moment and suggest that the player try out the recipe for a random dish whenever the cookbook is opened or closed. Maybe as character announcement quote or it appears with a question mark on top of the dish square thing that when hovered says something like "Maybe I should try putting 2 frog legs, 1 large fish, and 1 ice on the crockpot".

Could also take this suggestion and change it to instead of showing the recipe, maybe show one of the ingredients or the food group of that dish.

There's also a crafting system common in some games where if you pick up an item, you then know how to craft something else with that same item you picked up. So could take something similar like that and show where that particular food can be used, so let's say you pick up a fig and then in your cookbook, 4 dishes have a notification on them and when clicked on them you can see one of the ingredients which is a fig.

I agree but i feel like it should recommend a lower efficiency version of dishes to encourage experimenting.

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2 minutes ago, SomebodyRandom said:

Maybe as character announcement quote or it appears with a question mark on top of the dish square thing that when hovered says something

I feel like character saying the name of the dish would be better. Still discovering the recipe, but many dishes have pretty obvious names. Closing the book, character says 'I feel like eating pumpkin cookies' you learn there is a recipe like that, and it needs pumpkins to be made. The rest is for you to figure out. 

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