Farming 101 - Grow Like Never Before

[Zeklo]

12 minutes ago, Ohan said:

omg thank you so much for adding the combinations! that mustve taken a lot of investigative work! i was trying to decipher them yesterday but it was taking so long lol. 

There are definitely a ton more possibilities. Part way through I was like "Wait, this isn't Don't Starve! This is math!"

Real crazy stuff. Going to be awesome seeing what combinations arise as time passes.

[.]

Meh, it's a bit complex.

[meowswing]

Thank you for this very helpful thread.

[Zeklo]

1 hour ago, Slagger said:

Meh, it's a bit complex.

It's only complex if you're trying to be as efficient as possible, and you definitely don't need to be. It just means you won't be reaping what you sow—some giant tasting look'n crops! 

But you'll get your average crops in no time, so long as you at least plant them in the right season.
EDIT:

2 hours ago, DaZoul said:

Cool, thanks! I'm still heavily interested in the Fruit Fly Mafia Gang though...

I did some testing and got them to spawn—I don't know the exact criteria but what worked for me was having 9 rotten plants and 1 fully grown plant. Any lower than that didn't seem to work.

[DaZoul]

1 hour ago, Zeklo said:

I did some testing and got them to spawn—I don't know the exact criteria but what worked for me was having 9 rotten plants and 1 fully grown plant. Any lower than that didn't seem to work.

I heard they can only spawn after day 35 like Giants

[Zeklo]

1 minute ago, DaZoul said:

I heard they can only spawn after day 35 like Giants

The base time is 35 days, however, each crop that rots (after the initial 9 maybe?) reduces the timer by half a day. So you could technically get them much earlier. I managed to get them day 28 while testing for example.

So essentially rip pub servers. 

[Owlrust]

I'll put this in my signature as another way to get back here if needed, thanks for sharing.

[ZombieDupe]

This all sounds too complicated and not worth the effort. Not even ONI has this much specification for growing plants. Just gonna stick to eating meats, honey, cactus and mushrooms I guess. I like to get things in mass, not take care of a single tomato like it's a child. You will starve many times over before farming mechanics make any sort of sense.

[Nino123]

I agree, it looks like to be a lil bit fastidious (but didn't tried actually). But interesting. Maybe we should have the choice to create a farm or use this  gardening system. Something like "if you don't mind or don't want to lose your time", just create basic farm plots (witch should be less efficient) or "if il like the idea and do want to plays with seeds and need big harvest", use this system. 2 options.

Or just simplify the system... ?

 

[Ohan]

5 minutes ago, ZombieDupe said:

This all sounds too complicated and not worth the effort.

u should try to approach it with an open mind and treat it as something new on its own instead of something that has replaced the old way of farming. Once u get the hang of it i think its definitely worth the effort. 2-3 fruit/veg and 3 species specific seeds in 4 days is not too bad at all. when you have the right combinations like the ones Zeklo was kind enough to share with us the only thing u have to do is tend  and water the crops once a day. and tending can be automated in several ways like: friendly fruit flies, playing music near them (beef horn, one-man-band, shell bells, panflute(xD)). 

I think it amounts to the same time investment as killing mobs for meat. 

[Zeklo]

1 minute ago, Nino123 said:

I agree, it looks like to be a lil bit fastidious (but didn't tried actually). But interesting. Maybe we should have the choice to create a farm or use this  gardening system. Something like "if you don't mind or don't want to lose your time", just create basic farm plots (witch should be less efficient) or "if il like the idea and do want to plays with seeds and need big harvest", use this system. 2 options.

Or just simplify the system... ?

I don't think there's much difference if any. If you ignore the mechanics it functions almost identically to the old plots, except more room. However, learning the mechanics and applying them will allow you to obtain harvests much quicker and more bountiful. I'm pretty sure it was created this way on purpose, so you could take your pick.

[ZombieDupe]

6 minutes ago, Zeklo said:

I don't think there's much difference if any. If you ignore the mechanics it functions almost identically to the old plots, except more room. However, learning the mechanics and applying them will allow you to obtain harvests much quicker and more bountiful. I'm pretty sure it was created this way on purpose, so you could take your pick.

Then what's up with all the weeds and crops that rot or whatever? You can't just leave them to grow now, can you?

8 minutes ago, Ohan said:

u should try to approach it with an open mind and treat it as something new on its own instead of something that has replaced the old way of farming. Once u get the hang of it i think its definitely worth the effort. 2-3 fruit/veg and 3 species specific seeds in 4 days is not too bad at all. when you have the right combinations like the ones Zeklo was kind enough to share with us the only thing u have to do is tend  and water the crops once a day. and tending can be automated in several ways like: friendly fruit flies, playing music near them (beef horn, one-man-band, shell bells, panflute(xD)). 

I think it amounts to the same time investment as killing mobs for meat. 

Open mind won't keep a full stomach. What do you eat while the crops grow? What benefit do the crops have that you get this little for so much effort? 2 - 3 veg and some seeds in 4 days sounds terrible when you need to get an average of 300 hunger points in that time. I can get 2 - 3 cactus flesh in like 4 seconds. Farming is still a waste of time. I do prefer planting more crops in one spot like you do in Gorge but this is too much.

[Parusoid]

10 hours ago, Zeklo said:

within a single plot

what is considered single plot? A single pitchfork tile? Or all connected pitchfork tiles that have the "garden" turf?

[ShadowDuelist]

2 hours ago, Ohan said:

Wormwood's wild crops are straight up worse now in several important ways compared to before where u traded longer grow time and spoilage on the vine for the ability to plant without huge resource investment via advanced farms. making farm plots is a lot cheaper now and everyone can practically plant as freely as Wormwood... as a quasi Wormwood main i sincerely hope Klei takes another look at Wormwood to make up for this 

Agreed, but I assume they will rebalance Wormwood accordingly after the new farming system has been entirely tweaked, balanced, and is on its definitive form.

Otherwise they would waste too much time rebalancing Worm accordingly after each time they make changes.

Many of his character specific items could use a second look as well.

[MondayNight]

This is beyond complicated. I appreciate the effort of breaking down the new Farming Mechanic, but from feeding stand-point these new Veggie/Fruits farms seem more of a death-trap for newbies/noobs/casuals than the old veg/fruit farms were. Looks nice on paper and probably for a game-in-game scenario, but realistically from efficiency view-point all this is not worth it. A basic trip trough some Grasslands/Deciduous biome assures all berries, carrots and mushrooms one needs for feeding and healing. Not to mention Kelp and Stone Fruits from mid-game forward (or early game for advanced player rushers). Likewise of note is Warly's indirect nerf to a certain capacity via this update.

Is ok KLei listened some of the player-base demands for Farms rework and Gorge appreciations, but - once more - all this feels way to complicated for bulk player-base - and game is already complicated enough as-is. Perhaps a player-triggered event separating old farming from the new or parallel branches would've been a better route. Time will tell. For me this update killed any toying on the Veggie/Fruits farm front. You win some, you lose some.

[Ohan]

Well what we have now is a farming system that allows for MUCH easier and faster mass harvests of a specific crop without needing to feed 66% of it to a bird. Thats what the main change is in my eyes. 

21 minutes ago, ZombieDupe said:

What benefit do the crops have

this is a valid argument in a world with stone fruits and kelp etc. farming for specific crops is now immeasurably easier and faster, which specifically Warly will greatly enjoy. The benefit for the other survivors who arent playing with a Warly is not as immediately noticeable. It would be nice if Klei decided to make vegetable dishes more competitive with meat dishes. that is the missing piece in my opinion. 

[Zeklo]

40 minutes ago, Parusoid said:

what is considered single plot? A single pitchfork tile? Or all connected pitchfork tiles that have the "garden" turf?

A single pitchfork tile.

42 minutes ago, ZombieDupe said:

Then what's up with all the weeds and crops that rot or whatever? You can't just leave them to grow now, can you?

Weeds are a minor nuisance to the player at best. The real problem is their effect on plants—which if you're ignoring won't matter. Yes, spoiling crops is an annoying change for vets, but it was bound to happen. It made no sense.

42 minutes ago, ZombieDupe said:

Open mind won't keep a full stomach. What do you eat while the crops grow? What benefit do the crops have that you get this little for so much effort? 2 - 3 veg and some seeds in 4 days sounds terrible when you need to get an average of 300 hunger points in that time. I can get 2 - 3 cactus flesh in like 4 seconds. Farming is still a waste of time. I do prefer planting more crops in one spot like you do in Gorge but this is too much.

2-3 veggies? You're free to have your opinion, but your statistics are very off. The last image in my thread was a 2x2 plot. In other words 6x6—this is on the small scale (this is just a single Garden Rigamajig).

12 Watermelons, 8 Carrots, 4 Potatoes, 4 Pomegranates, 4 Onions, 4 Garlic.

This selection of crops is entirely self-sustaining for nutrients, and the spring rain did all the watering. Oh, and did I say 12 Watermelons & 8 Carrots? I meant 24-36 Watermelons and 16-24 Carrots, because they're giant due to proper care (which was basically me working out a good mix of things to plant, you'll be able to wiki this eventually).

Watermelons are a terrible crop for hunger and yet that's a 300-450 Hunger from them raw alone, not to mention all the crockpot ingredients I just grew. And all it took from me was coming by at the end of each day to trigger some shellbells—the entire setup would be completely automatic with the Lord of the Fruitflies drop, yes entirely automatic. That means not only can I enjoy whatever delish meats I bring after adventuring, but also just gain veggies will no effort beyond planting.

Does it take some setup? Sure, but with the expansion potential due to seeds I don't think anything is going to be able to outmatch its production—especially if you're growing the good food varieties. Pumpkins with a similar setup? 900-1,350 Hunger for doing essentially nothing? Nice.

The time you put into farms is time put into a permanent food supply. You can't say the same about meat gathering.

There's no problem playing the day by day forager, or hunter of meaty yums. If you prefer that over this that's entirely fine. But calling this a waste of time or unviable is a bad take imo. Farms are more viable now than ever. There is absolutely no reason you couldn't survive entirely off them, which was hardly a dream with the previous system. As it stands, it's a playstyle choice more than anything, and who wouldn't want to passively generate veggies while they also do their normal routine?

[Rinkusan]

Amazing guide; thanks for the detailed breakdown!

With that said, I have several questions. Do you happen to know the amount of time it takes for the crop to grow? Is the growth rate affected by light and temperature like the old mechanics? Does happiness and watered status also affect growth rate? What exactly is the benefit to meeting the "family" criterium?

[Szczuku]

Question: Are there crops that like Winter? And if so, do they grow durring it?

[MondayNight]

1 hour ago, Zeklo said:

2-3 veggies? You're free to have your opinion, but your statistics are very off. The last image in my thread was a 2x2 plot. In other words 6x6—this is on the small scale (this is just a single Garden Rigamajig).

12 Watermelons, 8 Carrots, 4 Potatoes, 4 Pomegranates, 4 Onions, 4 Garlic.

This selection of crops is entirely self-sustaining for nutrients, and the spring rain did all the watering. Oh, and did I say 12 Watermelons & 8 Carrots? I meant 24-36 Watermelons and 16-24 Carrots, because they're giant due to proper care (which was basically me working out a good mix of things to plant, you'll be able to wiki this eventually).

Watermelons are a terrible crop for hunger and yet that's a 300-450 Hunger from them raw alone, not to mention all the crockpot ingredients I just grew. And all it took from me was coming by at the end of each day to trigger some shellbells—the entire setup would be completely automatic with the Lord of the Fruitflies drop, yes entirely automatic. That means not only can I enjoy whatever delish meats I bring after adventuring, but also just gain veggies will no effort beyond planting.

Does it take some setup? Sure, but with the expansion potential due to seeds I don't think anything is going to be able to outmatch its production—especially if you're growing the good food varieties. Pumpkins with a similar setup? 900-1,350 Hunger for doing essentially nothing? Nice.

The time you put into farms is time put into a permanent food supply. You can't say the same about meat gathering.

Now do this experiment, in tune with how old Veggie/Fruits Farms worked: plant first autumn a random batch of seeds, regardless of their season requirements. Pure random. Then ignore them, like within old system: no watering, no bothering with any nutrients intake. No "Happiness/Family/Killjoys" whatsoever taken into consideration. 0 Fertilization. NO input whatsoever after initial usage of a Hoe for digging and the actual planting of seed in hole. That's it!

What do I get after plants fully grow - assuming they even do that?

I repeat: like within the old system - plant and forget about. 0 tending whatsoever.

(hope the answer isn't "rot" because then we can't even talk about any type of efficiency, would be pretty self-revealing)

[Alandaradey]

11 hours ago, Gourmand said:

What do giant crops do and also I'm not a fan of how different the plants look compared to the actual crops when you harvest them

It's still in beta, they'll probably fix it later, I hope

[Psychomaniac]

This farming system feel kinda fun at first, but imo it's too much stuff need to maintain to get the GIANT crop.

Could be nice if klei simplify the progress a little bit:

Like:

Seasonal crops --- ok

Water & Fertilize --- 3 waters + 1 fertilizer (manure) at the beginning.

Plant what ever u want.

Happiness: Touching a plant, or a new item that auto play music and has a range indicator like Ice Flingomatic, a Gramaphone (the one in maxwell chamber)  play "rag time"  for a day (spin the crank for another day) could be nice,  and a bunch of music disks.

Family --- Skip this one

Killjoys --- ok

On harvest day --- either you harvest or dump 1 shot of super Growth formula and wait 1 or more day to get the Giant.

I like to farm, but for a Sole Survivor it's just too much work. Since a meat and 3 berries, or 1 meat, 1 egg & 2 cactus  still do just fine :D.

Or just make bird yield 3 seeds per veggie: 2 specific and 1 random (there is a mod for this, i know), and as a wormwood i could ignore the giant stuff and just plant seeds into the ground and come back later.

[Nino123]

like the gramaphone idea so much !

[Sapientis]

18 hours ago, Zeklo said:

Combinations

If you find any self-sustaining combinations be sure to share them (meaning nutrient loss is at 0)!
You can mix & match examples below to fill all 9/9 so long as the seasons match!

• 1 Pepper, 1 Onion [Autumn/Summer] 2/9
• 1 Onion, 1 Durian [Spring] 2/9
• 1 Garlic, 1 Pomegranate [Spring/Summer] 2/9
• 1 Carrot, 1 Corn, 1 Potato [Autumn/Spring] 3/9
• 2 Dragonfruit, 3 Asparagus [Spring] 5/9
• 3 Pumpkin, 2 Garlic [Autumn/Winter] 5/9
• 2 Carrot, 1 Potato, 1 Garlic [Autumn/Winter/Spring] 4/9
• 2 Dragonfruit, 2 Garlic, 2 Onion [Spring/Summer] 6/9
• 3 Watermelon, 1 Pomegranate, 1 Onion [Spring/Summer] 5/9

Example - 2 Dragonfruit, 3 Asparagus, 2 Onion, 2 Durian
Covers all 9 spots and is self-sustaining.
Note - Without multiple [4] of the same plant next to each other, the plant won't meet the family criteria. You can utilize multiple farmplots to achieve this!

Great guide, it actually made updated farming look simple and well thought!

I really like the combinations part so here's my idea of self sustaining minimalist Warly Farm:

Spoiler

It includes 8 Dragonfruits, 8 Garlics, 4 Peppers and 12 Onions. Edit: [Summer] 32/36
With better arrangement you can probably grow more big Dragonfruit and Garlic.

The fact crops don't grow big on edges made me think if they require to be in groups of 4 or if they require to be next to at least 2crops of the same type? Perhaps both?

[Zeklo]

18 minutes ago, Sapientis said:

Great guide, it actually made updated farming look simple and well thought!

I really like the combinations part so here's my idea of self sustaining minimalist Warly Farm:

  Hide contents

It includes 8 Dragonfruits, 8 Garlics, 4 Peppers and 12 Onions. Edit: [Summer] 32/36
With better arrangement you can probably grow more big Dragonfruit and Garlic.

The fact crops don't grow big on edges made me think if they require to be in groups of 4 or if they require to be next to at least 2crops of the same type? Perhaps both?

There needs to be 4 nearby (including the one in question) but I think crops can only detect 2 away. So they have to be bunched up, not a line.