Let's talk about dst pubs

[Szczuku]

Hello, new thread.

So almost everytime there are discussions about major changes/updates to the game there's always that one person that'll say something like 'An average pub server doesn't last an in-game year'. Keep in mind that I'm gonna use Klei-official server as an example of a pub.

I don't think that pubs should be used as a decisive factor when discussing this game. Because at the end of the day what are pubs? A bunch of random strangers let loose with no moderation. If someone joins a pub server they shouldn't expect anything more or less than people dying and world being restarted. To experience the game 'properly' one should either play solo or with friends. Pubs are where you go for crap and giggles, not to try and play the game.

Pubs have been, are and will always be a place where worlds are reseted, most players die/leave before a year passes and you don't get to experience all of content. And because of that they shouldn't be used as an excuse to tell somebody that their idea/suggestion is bad and shouldn't be considered by the devs

TL;DR While pubs should be taken into account when the devs work on updates they definitelly shouldn't be the thing that decides whether or not something makes it into the game.

Discuss... I guess

[Sweaper]

Pretty sure Klei doesn't take pubs in consideration that much, considering there are plenty of characters and content focused on mid to late game and not to mention it's already pretty poorly balanced if you're not joining during autumn there. But it doesn't hurt to make something better suited for early game/playing with strangers for those playing in there.

[Mike23Ua]

Xbox has never had them, so we don’t really care- What we do care about however.. is being able to host or play gorge and forge content

Because Xbox never had them... we never got to really play those events (and I don’t think we ever got Forge At all..) 

But nonetheless Klei should focus their updates entirely on making the game more accessible to YOU the PLAYER rather than worrying about what it does to a Public Server.

For example- maybe I want Deerclops to be tough as hell to beat, so maybe I want to ramp up her health & Damage, But at the same time.. maybe I want Firefly to be easy to fight solo without walls, planted bunny farms or any cheesy tactic.. so maybe I want to reduce her health when playing alone.

Maybe I want my world gen to simply spawn without having a pig king or Glommer statue, maybe I want my world to have extremely limited resources that can be found..

Maybe I want to increase the difficulty of Frog Rain and Spider Warriors by allowing the attacks the deal to do Poison Damage over Time, Just like their SW & Ham counterparts.

The TL:DR- Klei has a toggle menu full of various things you can toggle more or less of or on and off.... And by 2021, I hope they realize this menu to its absolute fullest potential.

[Szczuku]

6 minutes ago, Sweaper said:

Pretty sure Klei doesn't take pubs in consideration that much

Oh I don't really make these posts for Klei cuz what kinda power I, a forumer, hold to dictate game's developement. 

I suppose this post's more of a public announcement of sorts. Now that I think about it I may have chose a wrong name for the thread.

[Viktor234]

3 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

I suppose this post's more of a public announcement of sorts.

This post feels more like a "F*** the public players! Klei should priorize private games only!"

[Owlrust]

Fair enough; but (in my own opinion) I feel as though pubs are really only considered in upcoming content when it directly affects early-game play such as snowstorms and broken bone injuries mechanics being added to the 1st year or so, of which would directly affect players that would otherwise have no way of knowing. So I guess it's kinda like the equivalent of getting a new boss at work one day out of nowhere, only to be punished that very day for policies they put in place without you knowing about it.

[Frashaw27]

 

27 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

Because at the end of the day what are pubs? A bunch of random strangers let loose with no moderation. If someone joins a pub server they shouldn't expect anything more or less than people dying and world being restarted.

 

36 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

Pubs are where you go for crap and giggles, not to try and play the game.

Well that is your viewpoint, but not everyones. Sure, some people see pubs as a catalyst to rush and do short term challenges, but some people may also see it as a way to play the game they want to play with other random people, and seeing how this ragtag team can do to survive with these complete strangers. Yes, the general conciseness is that pubs are a veterans practice grounds, but some other people want to play with strangers for some quick time to kill. While your opinion is valid, it should not be the end all be all of what a pub is or can amount to be.

35 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

To experience the game 'properly' one should either play solo or with friends.

Well, that is sort of true for the solo part, but the friend part is entirely out of control. Since humanity has yet to make people replication technology, we don't have control other the other people in our lives, and because of that you can't just get a group together whenever you feel like playing. Sure, you can plan ahead but that also depends on everyone following the plan and everyone being interested and being available at the same time, which rarely happens. Even if you have a dedicated group, what do you do if you are alone and want to play the game? You either have the option of braving the unknown alone, or going on a pub server. Yes, the fleeting nature of pubs is something important, but it is still a "proper" way to play the game. The root of my problem with your statement is that you are taking pubs worth at your opinion instead of all the aspects it has to give. Yes, to some it is a lawless wasteland where grievers run amuck and dragonfly is dead before day 1, but there is also the people that see it a way to play the game with strangers, to see what their random cooperation can accomplish. Yes, it shouldn't be the main consideration when deciding content, but the way you disregarded pubs made me write this.

29 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Xbox has never had them, so we don’t really care

Anything beyond this statement, the one in the quote, doesn't belong in this thread. The quoted sentence above is what your opinion on pubs is, and nothing else is relevant to the thread. My opinion on stuff like the accessibility of forge/gorge content, my opinion on your personalized option to be applied to every player, and my opinion on adding optional difficulty on a game about difficulty has no bearing to the current subject because it is not what the thread is about, you just hamfisted your ideas in this thread where they don't belong. Stop this. Stop coming in on threads to argue about ideas that don't belong in the thread in the first place. If you want to argue about these ideas, make your own thread about them, but stop inserting them where they don't belong. 

[Bird Up]

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

To experience the game 'properly' one should either play solo or with friends. Pubs are where you go for crap and giggles, not to try and play the game.

Why would klei spend their money on hosting public servers, and all the new ones they just added, if it were an improper way to play the game. One of the reasons forge and gorge aren't around is simply because the cost of server upkeep. So these servers have a cost, but klei finds them worth it. They're totally a valid way to play. Public servers are popular and I wouldn't have much fun without them.

[Bellium]

As someone who basically only plays this game on public servers, and as such has never truly played past early to mid spring, I feel like there's not much Klei can do about pub issues. The new content they've added is great though! Things like sailing, fishing, traveling to lunar can all easily be done on pubs.

 

The big issue really comes from the sheer lack of recourses you can get if you join at any point after the first Autumn, and it's really just a big player issue. Everyone's keeping at least half a stack of the things they collected, never enough thermals/umbrellas to go around because no one ever prepares for other people, and if they do that person uses it for 5 days then logs off never to be seen again. As such people really just stay at base slowly draining recourses as they can't do anything else, which is the reason why I stopped joining servers that were at any point but Autumn.

All this is to say really, that I agree with your point that pubs shouldn't be the deciding factor on whether something is added or not, but they should still be heavily considered imo.

However I will say

1 hour ago, Szczuku said:

 To experience the game 'properly' one should either play solo or with friends.

If I wanted to play DST solo I would just load up DS, but I have far more hours in this game for a reason :V Also I'm trying really hard to get my friends into this game cause I love it

[Mike23Ua]

9 minutes ago, Frashaw27 said:

 

 

Well that is your viewpoint, but not everyones. Sure, some people see pubs as a catalyst to rush and do short term challenges, but some people may also see it as a way to play the game they want to play with other random people, and seeing how this ragtag team can do to survive with these complete strangers. Yes, the general conciseness is that pubs are a veterans practice grounds, but some other people want to play with strangers for some quick time to kill. While your opinion is valid, it should not be the end all be all of what a pub is or can amount to be.

Well, that is sort of true for the solo part, but the friend part is entirely out of control. Since humanity has yet to make people replication technology, we don't have control other the other people in our lives, and because of that you can't just get a group together whenever you feel like playing. Sure, you can plan ahead but that also depends on everyone following the plan and everyone being interested and being available at the same time, which rarely happens. Even if you have a dedicated group, what do you do if you are alone and want to play the game? You either have the option of braving the unknown alone, or going on a pub server. Yes, the fleeting nature of pubs is something important, but it is still a "proper" way to play the game. The root of my problem with your statement is that you are taking pubs worth at your opinion instead of all the aspects it has to give. Yes, to some it is a lawless wasteland where grievers run amuck and dragonfly is dead before day 1, but there is also the people that see it a way to play the game with strangers, to see what their random cooperation can accomplish. Yes, it shouldn't be the main consideration when deciding content, but the way you disregarded pubs made me write this.

Anything beyond this statement, the one in the quote, doesn't belong in this thread. The quoted sentence above is what your opinion on pubs is, and nothing else is relevant to the thread. My opinion on stuff like the accessibility of forge/gorge content, my opinion on your personalized option to be applied to every player, and my opinion on adding optional difficulty on a game about difficulty has no bearing to the current subject because it is not what the thread is about, you just hamfisted your ideas in this thread where they don't belong. Stop this. Stop coming in on threads to argue about ideas that don't belong in the thread in the first place. If you want to argue about these ideas, make your own thread about them, but stop inserting them where they don't belong. 

Wow okay then- here’s my opinion: Xbox one never had them, and since we’ve lived without them for this long we can continue to live without them. (And so could you if it came down to paying costs to run servers or putting that money into game updates)

THAT is my final opinion, have a good day.

[b l a n k]

I always (and almost only) play on klei's official servers, to a point I don't remember how I managed to play before they exist.

Yes you shouldn't expect anything more than people dying and the world being restarted, but does it matter ?
It depends of the goals you're aiming for, and how you want to play. You don't play the same way on a pub and on your solo world or with your friends.
I like joining pubs because I'm not alone and I can meet new people and play with them if I want to / if they want to, games are never the same and I can adapt my gameplay depending on what the others players are doing, even if that's just for few seasons. Trust me you have the time to do a lot of content in just few seasons, it also opens up more challenge possibilities, and you can change your goals to renew your ephemeral experience each time the server reset.

You consider pubs are for "craps and giggles" while playing with friends is the proper way to play the game, to me that's the complete opposite, this is again a matter of how you want to play and what are you aiming for.

Saying there is no moderation is half wrong as you have the right to vote kick / rollback when you become a minimum invested in your game session, I've done it countless of times. Griefers are a problem but we are not completely defenseless against them, in pubs you try to play around it.

The pubs' ephemeral nature have both upsides and downsides, if the downsides are too much for you and the pub life doesn't fit you, then you're not the public aimed by these servers and you can play the way you want, solo or with your friends. However, don't make it a generality.

[Well-met]

"real" dst are private servers.

public dst is just casual, short on/off games where you mess around for an hour and never see that world again.

[MondayNight]

 

7 hours ago, Szczuku said:

To experience the game 'properly' one should either play solo or with friends. Pubs are where you go for crap and giggles, not to try and play the game.

This is where you lost me. There isn't a "proper" way to experience DST. You may chose not to partake in pubs and that's ok. Yet generalizing personal (probably bad) experiences is not really wholesome. As a matter of fact one can do pretty much anything in pubs, more so with a competent crew - be it your friends or randoms: all bosses, all major milestone points (going to Ruins, to Moon archipelago, Hermit Island, doing specific farms like Krampi etc) in speed-run fashion. Just 1 aspect to keep in mind: all's fleeting and should be treated as such, without expectations. "Carpe diem!"

Spoiler

An old conclusive snapshot of a pub run with a friend and some random:

 

[Szczuku]

12 hours ago, Viktor234 said:

This post feels more like a "F*** the public players! Klei should priorize private games only!"

Bruh did I step on your toes or something? This is a public announcement of sorts. I already explained why

11 hours ago, Xantown7 said:

The pubs' ephemeral nature have both upsides and downsides, if the downsides are too much for you and the pub life doesn't fit you, then you're not the public aimed by these servers and you can play the way you want, solo or with your friends. However, don't make it a generality.

This isn't a 'I don't like pubs and neither should you'-type of post.

6 hours ago, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

This is where you lost me. There isn't a "proper" way to experience DST

Which is way I said that in 'quotation marks'. Yes, there isn't a proper way to play this game. However I think you'd agree with me when I say that a player should be able to experience all of content the devs add. The pubs with their unpredictive nature don't guarantee that to the players. That's what I meant. A 'proper' way to play is when you can get 100% of content out of the game. Basically what Well-met has said:

10 hours ago, Well-met said:

"real" dst are private servers.

public dst is just casual, short on/off games where you mess around for an hour and never see that world again.

So yeah... my point boils down to this:

Pubs have been, are and will always be a place where worlds are reseted, most players die/leave before a year passes and you don't get to experience all of content. And because of that they shouldn't be used as an excuse to tell somebody that their idea/suggestion is bad and shouldn't be considered by the devs.

Let me just edit the op real quick

[BeeClops]

A lot of the pubs i play reach 100+, and I've played on pubs that have reached 500+, and also 3k+ days. Of course i always expect the server to be reset the next day by griefers/newbies, but i have learned so much from random people and observing their strategies on pubs that i wouldn't have learned otherwise, playing alone or with my friends. You can absolutely, easily experience all the content in a public server. It won't happen if you do not play long enough or you're not skilled enough(in terms of rushing certain things in particular), but it is entirely possible. 

The devs should take pubs into consideration, they are an important part of DST in general.

[Intrepidpioneer]

Yea I feel like the state of pub servers is more a people problem than a klei problem. So it should be assumed that all content have the possibility to be acquired and move forward from there. As beeclops said previously, some world's last 3k days and more.

[JoSmoCoolStuf]

[HeatAndRun]

2 hours ago, JoSmoCoolStuf said:

I wonder which indescribable depraved structures and machinations built on forbidden knowledge and dark magic of most skilled technicians revere horribly twisted glitch existed in this server... 

"Chaotic Den" rather than "Catcoon Den". 

It's just a joke, you know.

[Maxposting]

On 6/28/2020 at 6:42 AM, x0-VERSUS-1y said:

 

  Hide contents

An old conclusive snapshot of a pub run with a friend and some random:

 

Oh DAMN

I WAS IN THAT BASE

[Mike23Ua]

The more I play Hamlet the more I think things like Public servers, or even that NewHome game coming to Mobile could use its very own personal home..

A Single structure you can place down Only once.. But it is YOUR Home, you can enter it, you can store your items inside of it and decorate it, this structure can’t be burned down or destroyed outside of PVP Enabled.

Important items obviously wouldn’t go into your house.. same as trying to take Chester into a Cave or Leave the game with the Celestial Orb.

Public worlds with dedicated “Homes” in them can not be rolled back or regenerated, Hamlet style homes would go a long ways in keeping your stuff safe when your not on a server, then you can load in, grab your supplies and leave your home for Adventure.

I feel like this is what NewHome May be aiming to do (since it’s been confirmed to be Multiplayer and also have your own customizable homes)

However.. even though Xbox One does not have Public Servers.. I believe that a Hamlet Style homes would be the best answer to grieving and keeping your stuff safe.

[fsp98]

i like public endless, sometimes you can comeback and it's not reset yet. I don't like playing solo anymore and I don't have many friends to play with for in-game years

[sudoku]

Like a lot of others on here I only really play on Pubs. I've played this game since the beginning and one of the best ways for extending longevity is by playing in pubs due to the randomness of the players you'll get, which I enjoy. I might play on a server that defeats every boss as soon as they can or a server where we're struggling to get resources for winter. It keeps the game fresh imo. 

Now I do think that new content should not FULLY be centered around pubs because it is largely true that the majority of pubs do not last til spring and I'd rather not see all new content be able to be done in the first Autumn. 

The issue I see with Pubs is not that the server dies out around spring but the fact that most players choose to reset the server back to Autumn rather than continuing where the server left off and I have been guilty of doing this in the past as well but have been trying hard to continue pubs where they left off.

I think Klei needs to address this issue but I'm not sure how. I don't think just flat out not allowing resets is the answer because Autumn servers are still the fullest and most popular. I think items like the occuvigil and cratered moonlens that allow players to see a base are good starts. And of course if more content is locked behind year 2 maybe people won't be so eager to reset pubs.

[GenomeSquirrel]

I support the pub only side in the terms that I don’t want content that takes hours to get value out of, Crabby Hermit for example. New content so far has been failing to be content, just trivia to read about on the wiki.

 

[wigfrids hat]

i dunno, pubs are where i go when i want to do the parts of ds solo that i like best without having to labor towards base-building or not being able to use everything i get, namely; cooking, gardening and roaming around picking up random tat to hoard. in a pub there are usually crockpots and fridges and chests and occasionally farm-plots. i can spend an hour or so making food and gathering up post-fighting goods without the problems of rot and clutter; if i don't use it someone else can.