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Claymator v2. Stay weak (no labor).


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Here's how I recommend you convert polluted water to polluted oxygen. And then, for example, to oxygen and clay.

The left reservoir can be any liquid lighter than your bypass (oil shown). A full tank will last 83k cycles.

Scale to preference. Note: above 1T/tile in the mid section will turn offgassing off. The oxygen room will always stay perfectly filtered and has no pressure limit.

Due to a bug, this will also purify PO2 of germs if the PW had them. (as of 2020/03/02)

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Reference: Claymator v1 (manual labor version). Separation method credit to @mathmanican as shown in that thread. Save file.

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42 minutes ago, psusi said:

How the heck does the drop of pwater teleport through the mesh tile?

There's crude oil covering the vent, so any liquid that comes from the vent that's not oil is teleported above.

I build most of my infinite liquid storages this way

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5 minutes ago, Craigjw said:

This build is far too magical for my liking, what about the magical infinite reservoir?  Couldn't you just have a bunch of these reservoirs for an infinite amount of any liquid?

PW off gassing depends on mass in the tile. The more mass, the more PO2 is produced, so no, using reservoirs would completely miss the point.

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Yes, I was failing to see that the reservoir isn't duplicating liquid, we just don't see the clip long enough to see that when 10kg of liquid has been consumed from the output, the input will shuffle a new packet of PW, It will just take a very long time to empty out.

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So what happens if you play it straight, no games exploiting the odd behavior of liquids in ONI? I.e. just make a similar-sized tank of polluted water? Is the offgassing rate particularly low if it's the normal limit of 1 ton of polluted water per tile?

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It would be slow, that's to be sure of.  From experience, if you have about 50+ width of PW off-gasing, only a 2-3 air purifyers are needed to completely purify the PO2.  Bear in mind also, that this isn't using any special system, so the off-gassing rate isn't optimal like it is in the above build.

there is 106,000kg of PW being used in this build, which quite a lot.

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Every game tick (1/10th of a second) there is a 0.1% chance to off gas 0.1% of the mass in an exposed PW tile. On average that should result in 6 off gassing events per cycle. If the amount of PW is 1000kg/tile then that's 6kg/cycle. Not much when you consider dupes use 60kg/s. So if you instead supercompress the PW to 100t per tile then we're suddenly talking decent numbers. Enough to supply 10 dupes with oxygen, or make an obscene amount of clay.

Remember though that there needs to be less than 1800g of gas in the tile directly above the PW. That's why the corner swap pump is so effective in such a set up as above.

And even the set up above isn't using the corner swap pump to it's full potential.

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2 hours ago, Gus Smedstad said:

So what happens if you play it straight, no games exploiting the odd behavior of liquids in ONI? I.e. just make a similar-sized tank of polluted water? Is the offgassing rate particularly low if it's the normal limit of 1 ton of polluted water per tile?

Yes. Saturnus already posted the numbers. (I thought offgassing was checked 5 times a second not the 10/sec Saturnus mentioned but is not an important distinction in this case as even the doubled 6kg/cycle is still basically useless) Now keep in mind that you also need to keep the tiles completely full without overfilling. 

If you're against over-pressure storage to increase PO2 production then you're better off using bottles of polluted water as they offgas significantly more volume than standing polluted water. 

The downside to bottles is its impossible to do (in vanilla at least) completely dupe free. (Algae terrariums, deconstructing reservoirs, pitcher pumps, plumbers emptying pipes, etc, all requiring some dupe interaction) 

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2 hours ago, Neotuck said:

There's crude oil covering the vent, so any liquid that comes from the vent that's not oil is teleported above.

I build most of my infinite liquid storages this way

What?  It isn't being teleported above.  In fact, it appears that it is being deleted.  I just noticed the second vent at the bottom that is actually filling the overpressure pwater tile.  I guess the top one that is trickling is just acting as a beat pump to pull up whatever po2 comes off and then it is either deleted or teleported down through the airflow tile to join the overpressure pwater tile.

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3 hours ago, psusi said:

How the heck does the drop of pwater teleport through the mesh tile?

Although already simply answered, many details are here as well:

1 hour ago, Craigjw said:

Yes, I was failing to see that the reservoir isn't duplicating liquid

That's right. The reservoir is an ordinary (finite) supply of liquid. The magic is when a droplet falls and is less than 10g, it disappears on the next frame. So our 100mg output swaps out the gas for us then vanishes. The feedback to the reservoir is needed when we over-pressurize.

1 hour ago, Gus Smedstad said:

Is the offgassing rate particularly low if it's the normal limit of 1 ton of polluted water per tile?

Very slow indeed. This only starts becoming a practical source at around 100T in the tile, IIRC.

The popular MOGOM design can use manual labor to make bottles, and you can use a similar bypass design to keep the room vacuumed to give the bottles 100% uptime (like v1).

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5 minutes ago, psusi said:

What?  It isn't being teleported above.  In fact, it appears that it is being deleted.  I just noticed the second vent at the bottom that is actually filling the overpressure pwater tile.  I guess the top one that is trickling is just acting as a beat pump to pull up whatever po2 comes off and then it is either deleted or teleported down through the airflow tile to join the overpressure pwater tile.

Yep. The upper vent is just a bead pump to move PO2 to allow for all offgassing. 

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1 hour ago, Gus Smedstad said:

 Is the offgassing rate particularly low if it's the normal limit of 1 ton of polluted water per tile?

The rate can be affected by several factors.  First, there's the "random chance per tick" that determines if off-gassing will even happen that tick.  So four times per second, there's a chance that PW will off-gas some PO2.  The "chance per tick" is modified by room pressure.  At around 1800g of gas, items will stop offgassing.  At vacuum, the items will off-gas almost continually.   The next factor is the amount of mass that is off-gassed.  I think the amount from a puddle is 1% of the total mass, but I can't remember for sure.  Its pretty low, and it only checks the amount present at the surface touching gas or vacuum.  So if your pool is 10 tiles wide and 20 tiles deep, the amount of liquid in the 10 tiles across the top is all that is counted.  This can cause HUGE fluctuations in production when you're around the max liquid mass.  For example, at 999.9kg per tile, you have 9999kg of available surface mass to off-gas.  However, if you add another 10kg to your pool, you now have 9.9kg of available surface mass because your top layer is limited to 1000kg/tile, so the 9.9kg is pushed up to the next free tile and spreads across the 10 tile width of the pool's surface.

So, if you're going to do off-gassing from a normal pool, you should set it up so that your surface with the gas is as long as possible.  You should also regulate the mass of liquid per tile to be under 1kg so that you don't accidentally create a very thin surface layer reducing your output.   Third, you should build your design such that the gas pressure is as low as possible. 

I've used a design like this in the past and it was fairly effective.  Not as good as a massively overpressurized tile, but it still worked.

Spoiler

Sorry, I'm not in sandbox and I don't feel like loading a different world.

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Start with everything in a vacuum.  Fill the mesh tiles with water, then start pumping PW into the snaked airflow chamber.  The deoderizers will keep the PO2 pressure very low inside the chamber, giving the PW the most chance to off-gas.  Your surface area is 14x5 or 70 tiles, giving you the same off-gas rate as an overpressurized tile (or PW bottles) with 70,000kg of PW.

 

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1 hour ago, SpreadsheetGamr said:

Cool build!  Massive improvement over the original design.  Can it work without the drip-teleporter if you limit it to 5 deoxidiers?

The "drip teleporter" is a bead pump that keeps the gas pressure over the tile of compressed PW low enough to always trigger off-gassing.  It also forces the PO2 up into the airflow tiles, keeping the pressure high enough for all the deoderizers to operate.  It isn't critical to the design, but your output will drop significantly without it.  Each deoderizer will remove 100g/s of PO2 from the airflow tiles, so if you limit yourself to 5 deoderizers, you're only going to be able to process 500g/s of polluted oxygen.  Without the bead pump you'll have some 'starvation' at the ends because the gas will need time to disperse from the point where it off-gasses.  This means a further reduction in O2 produced. 

Lets say that the two end deoderizers lack the PO2 "pressure" to operate 1/3rd of the time.  The next closest fail 1/6th of the time, and the center has a 100% up time.  In 6 seconds, you'll produce (90g * 6) + 2(90 * 5) + 2(90 * 4) = 2160g of clean oxygen.  With the bead pump forcing the PO2 up away from the surface, all 5 will run 100% of the time because they'll have adequate pressure.  This is 5(90 * 6) = 2700g of clean oxygen produced over 6 seconds.  That's 540g more, or 90g/s.  Basically, you've got 5 deoderizers producing the same O2 as 4 just because the gas needs to disperse away from the super compressed pool if you don't use the bead pump.

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9 minutes ago, KittenIsAGeek said:

The "drip teleporter" is a bead pump that keeps the gas pressure over the tile of compressed PW low enough to always trigger off-gassing.  It also forces the PO2 up into the airflow tiles, keeping the pressure high enough for all the deoderizers to operate.  It isn't critical to the design, but your output will drop significantly without it.  Each deoderizer will remove 100g/s of PO2 from the airflow tiles, so if you limit yourself to 5 deoderizers, you're only going to be able to process 500g/s of polluted oxygen.  Without the bead pump you'll have some 'starvation' at the ends because the gas will need time to disperse from the point where it off-gasses.  This means a further reduction in O2 produced. 

Lets say that the two end deoderizers lack the PO2 "pressure" to operate 1/3rd of the time.  The next closest fail 1/6th of the time, and the center has a 100% up time.  In 6 seconds, you'll produce (90g * 6) + 2(90 * 5) + 2(90 * 4) = 2160g of clean oxygen.  With the bead pump forcing the PO2 up away from the surface, all 5 will run 100% of the time because they'll have adequate pressure.  This is 5(90 * 6) = 2700g of clean oxygen produced over 6 seconds.  That's 540g more, or 90g/s.  Basically, you've got 5 deoderizers producing the same O2 as 4 just because the gas needs to disperse away from the super compressed pool if you don't use the bead pump.

Don't forget that without a corner swap pump you'd also need to pump out the oxygen as well or the pressure of it will quickly stop the process.

In the build presented the cleaned oxygen is basically a waste product.

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3 minutes ago, Saturnus said:

Don't forget that without a corner swap pump you'd also need to pump out the oxygen as well or the pressure of it will quickly stop the process.

No, you don't need to pump the oxygen out.  In the build presented, there is no method of removing oxygen from the room, yet the deoderizers are continuing to function.  AFAIK, they don't 'over pressurize' like vents and deoxidizers do.  Algae terrariums don't over-pressurize either.

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I did a test and, from eyeballing it, it looks like the deoxidisers run about 50% without the bead pump.  Seems like a reasonable trade off for simplicity.  There's no need to limit to 5 deoxidisers like I originally imagined.

simpler.png.8da48194765591df0f87e9ab2fe1dde8.png

Edit: I should clarify, I did a test, then discarded it.  The screenshot above is for illustrative purposes only and was not exactly how I did the test.

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15 minutes ago, KittenIsAGeek said:

No, you don't need to pump the oxygen out.  In the build presented, there is no method of removing oxygen from the room, yet the deoderizers are continuing to function.  AFAIK, they don't 'over pressurize' like vents and deoxidizers do.  Algae terrariums don't over-pressurize either.

That's what I'm saying if you re-read what I wrote.

1 minute ago, SpreadsheetGamr said:

I did a test and, from eyeballing it, it looks like the deoxidisers run about 50% without the bead pump.  Seems like a reasonable trade off for simplicity.  There's no need to limit to 5 deoxidisers like I originally imagined.

simpler.png.8da48194765591df0f87e9ab2fe1dde8.png

Run it a little longer until the oxygen pressure builds up and stop the process completely.

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5 hours ago, SpreadsheetGamr said:

How would the oxygen pressure impact what's happening below the waterlogged mesh tiles?

It won't. That build will happily fill the oxygen room to any pressure without stopping, regardless of the particulars below. The water keeps the gasses from mixing and the deodorizer has no limit to pressure.

Without the bypass pump, you won't be able to off-gas until the PO2 pressure goes below about 1500g. So there will be some downtime while waiting for that, but it works. If your PW tile is truly massive, it might only need to off-gas once every 10-100 cycles, though.

With the bypass pump, there's essentially no limit to how big you want to make your array, because it will keep the pressure up to 1T per tile while allowing for full uptime on off-gassing.

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7 hours ago, SpreadsheetGamr said:

How would the oxygen pressure impact what's happening below the waterlogged mesh tiles?

Oh, apologies, didn't notice the water in the mesh tiles. Nice. Arguably even more cheeky than corner swap pump but nice nonetheless.

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1 hour ago, Saturnus said:

Oh, apologies, didn't notice the water in the mesh tiles. Nice. Arguably even more cheeky than corner swap pump but nice nonetheless.

What I find most cheeky about this build is the staggering amounts of oxygen it can produce for such a small heat & electrical cost. :shock:

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