What makes character con good/interesting?

[Desblat]

1) Wilson is OP no cons. Default gameplay

2) Willow. Low sanity. Requires sanity management. Countered by Bernie, not sure if low sanity is a real con. 

3) Wolfgang. Higher Sanity drain. Requires sanity management, not really a problem. Easy and not interesting. 

4) Wendy. Lower damage. Changes weapon choice, makes befriending mobs more valueable option. Easy? Kinda. Interesting? Probably.

5) Wickerbottom. No sleeping, needs fresh food. Insomnia cuts out content, no tents, no sleeping bags, bad design. Unfresh food requires to pay more attention to food sources and farming. Easy? Kinda. Interesting yes. 

6) Wx. Moisture penalty. Need more items to stay dry. Easy? Yes. Interesting? Not really. 

7) Winona. Hungry Wilson. Food hunger penalty is annoying, not challenging. Interesting? No.

8) Maxwell. Low health. Changes gameplay making direct combat risky. Interesting? Yes. 

9) Wormwood. No Food healing. Thats tough one. Changes gameplay, requires farming for poop. Pretty decent. 

10) Warly. The most challenging con in DST. Same dishes penalty seems wrong, but the idea is very good. 

11) Wortox. Gameplay is very diffrent. Either eat souls and become insane or eat normal food and become bottomless stomach. Pretty good. 

12) Wurt, Woodie haven't played as them, cant judge. 

13) Wigfrid. Carnivore. Decent penalty, changes diet approach. 

14) Wes. OP. 

The further character is from Wilson, the more gameplay is changed, the more interesting con is. 

What do you think? What would you change to make chars more interesting? 

[Booklover]

16 minutes ago, Desblat said:

1) Wilson is average no cons. Default gameplay.

2) Willow. Low sanity. Igniting random fires. Requires sanity management. Seems pretty unique. Interesting? NO. Easy - yes. (IGNITING FIRES?? What version are you playing on?)

3) Wolfgang. Higher Sanity drain. Requires sanity management, not really a problem. Easy and not interesting. (WHAT. Okay so out of all his cons the ones you choose is the irrelevant ones? For Wolfgang, his biggest con is probably hunger management. Easy? No. Interesting? YES.)

4) Wendy. Lower damage. Changes weapon choice, makes befriending mobs more valueable option. Easy? Kinda. Interesting? Probably.

5) Wickerbottom. No sleeping, needs fresh food. Insomnia cuts out content, no tents, no sleeping bags, bad design. Unfresh food requires to pay more attention to food sources and farming. Easy? OPOPOP. Interesting FAQ NO. (Unless you're Warly, Wormwood or Wortox sleeping is crap and her pro already says f u to her "need fwesh food" "con".)

6) Wx. Moisture penalty. Need more items to stay dry. Easy? Yes. Interesting? Not at all. (wtf is "need more items to stay dry"? Dood. WX78 is the same as any character except he takes damage from being wet.)

7) Winona. Hungry Wilson. Food hunger penalty is annoying, not challenging. Interesting? No. (Only annoying for people that don't main bottomless stomach survivors. "Hungry Wilson" is an effed up way of saying she is basic. She is NOT. She is very different from Wilson.)

8) Maxwell. Low health. Changes gameplay making direct combat risky. Interesting? Not really. (Wearing armour and having healing food basically removes this con making it "meh".)

9) Wormwood. No Food healing. Thats tough one. Changes gameplay, requires farming for poop. Pretty decent. (This is one of the great ones.)

10) Warly. The most challenging con in DST. Same dishes penalty seems wrong, but the idea is very good. (Good character for pros wanting to challenge themselves. Only problem is that noobs keep using him and making wet goop.)

11) Wortox. Gameplay is very diffrent. Either eat souls and become insane or eat normal food and become bottomless stomach. Pretty good. (Next to Wormwood in greatest.)

12) Wurt, Woodie haven't played as them, cant judge. 

13) Wigfrid. Carnivore. Decent penalty, changes diet approach. Easy? YES. Interesting? Kinda meh.

14) Wes. OP. (Haha...)

The further character is from Wilson, the more gameplay is changed, the more interesting con is. 

What do you think? What would you change to make chars more interesting? 

This is from a person who doesn't actually research the characters much. Either that or they haven't played in 300 years.

First off, who do you main?

Also, check the quoted part because I edited it.

[Misa22]

For the dude above... Let's not be condescendent, please. Adding CAPS and a bunch of interrogation signs doesn't make you being more right, since this is an extremely subjective topic. Willow IS interesting, btw. 

 

I actually agree with Wolfgang not being THAT interesting. I like the "eat and become buffed" thing, multiple forms are always cool, but i have always felt something was missing. Dunno how to fix him though. 

Wurt is interesting, I guess, but not SUPER interesting (I like her). Not being able to spam meatballs is nice. 

I find Warly kinda meh because there is a workaround about his stuff: whenever you are at 0 hunger, eat 4 meatballs. By the time you are hungry again, the "meatball timer" is done. Repeat.

I like the new recipes and seasonings, though. Meta changes are always welcomed. 

[Mike23Ua]

1 hour ago, Desblat said:

1) Wilson is OP no cons. Default gameplay

2) Willow. Low sanity. Igniting random fires. Requires sanity management. Seems pretty unique. Interesting? Yes. Easy - yes. 

3) Wolfgang. Higher Sanity drain. Requires sanity management, not really a problem. Easy and not interesting. 

4) Wendy. Lower damage. Changes weapon choice, makes befriending mobs more valueable option. Easy? Kinda. Interesting? Probably.

5) Wickerbottom. No sleeping, needs fresh food. Insomnia cuts out content, no tents, no sleeping bags, bad design. Unfresh food requires to pay more attention to food sources and farming. Easy? Kinda. Interesting yes. 

6) Wx. Moisture penalty. Need more items to stay dry. Easy? Yes. Interesting? Not really. 

7) Winona. Hungry Wilson. Food hunger penalty is annoying, not challenging. Interesting? No.

8) Maxwell. Low health. Changes gameplay making direct combat risky. Interesting? Yes. 

9) Wormwood. No Food healing. Thats tough one. Changes gameplay, requires farming for poop. Pretty decent. 

10) Warly. The most challenging con in DST. Same dishes penalty seems wrong, but the idea is very good. 

11) Wortox. Gameplay is very diffrent. Either eat souls and become insane or eat normal food and become bottomless stomach. Pretty good. 

12) Wurt, Woodie haven't played as them, cant judge. 

13) Wigfrid. Carnivore. Decent penalty, changes diet approach. 

14) Wes. OP. 

The further character is from Wilson, the more gameplay is changed, the more interesting con is. 

What do you think? What would you change to make chars more interesting? 

Maxwell down right SUCKS!!! bottom line the dude needs a Rework and he needs it badly.

Why? When you Build a shadow clone.. another player Whacks said Shadow Clone and kills it.. why can’t this effing things blink in and out of existence when ANOTHER PLAYER attempts to hit them like Crawling Horrors can?

Whats worse is Maxwell doesn’t even get back the Damn ingredients he had to use to summon them.

I hate Maxwell because of this and simply WONT play as him until he is Reworked.

————————————

Wormwoods no Food healing is a Non-Issue. Build a Tent or a Siesta-Lean-To, Wear Armor, carry buckets of poop, OR heal using Healing Slaves (your best choice for on the go action probably)

Wickerbottom I play her often.. but the No sleeping thing is never an Issue for me, the only thing it manages to successfully do is keep Wicker from getting presents under WintersFeast Trees.

Wurt is OP with very few actual downsides..

Winona’s Constant hunger penalty insures that the fridge full of food you had stockpiled remains mysteriously empty.

Wigfrid gains health and Sanity from wearing her battle helm and whacking things with her battle spear so she is slightly almost as OP as Wurt.. & not to mention she can live off Meatballs and Meaty Stew forever.

Wendys downside isn’t that she is weak- it’s that Abigail is so dumb she tags behind miles off the screen, won’t attack the dogs that are chasing Wendy unless Wendy circles around back towards Abigail intentionally kiting them towards her, When she DOES choose to attack something it’s usually Swamp Tentacle or Mating Beefalo Which will kill her quickly And to top all that off don’t bother trying to Heal Abigail because she’s going to float away from you when you get close to her.

———————————

TL:DR- Wendy is #1 in line for a Rework, Followed very closely behind by the disappointing not so magnificent magician Maxwell.

———————————

[Desblat]

1 hour ago, Booklover said:

This is from a person who doesn't actually research the characters much. Either that or they haven't played in 300 years.

First off, who do you main?

Also, check the quoted part because I edited it.

Kinda my mistake with Willow, I read the wiki and it said that she ignites fires, I haven't played her a whole. 

I am not talking about pros of characters here. Only about cons. And the only con winona has is hunger drain from crafting. Is that wrong? 

Game provides way too much food thus higher hunger drain is a very small issue. 

For wx you need better water repelling. Because he is damaged by water, you can tolerate more wetness as Wilson as you do as wx. That's really small con, nearly nothing and it changes gameplay very little. But thats all we've got for him. 

[Mike23Ua]

Willow doesn’t set fires when she’s insane.. if she did that would just be annoying and I would feel bad for all the Willow players I’ve kicked out of my game session and banned for “Setting my Alchemy Engine On Fire”

Winona has a few cons- Other players can interact with and destroy her structures... this shouldn’t even be an option in COOPERATIVE Servers.. but it is. Other then that yes I guess her only Downside is her annoying workers hunger schedule.

But Maxwell.. his biggest con is Himself, the dude is supposed to be the “Puppet Master” & he can’t even properly manage to summon shadows of himself that other players can’t smack in one hit & destroy.

Abigail may be dumb.. but I gotta give her credit for one thing- if Another Player attempts to Smack her they are probably going to regret it.

[Desblat]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

 

Wickerbottom I play her often.. but the No sleeping thing is never an Issue for me, the only thing it manages to successfully do is keep Wicker from getting presents under WintersFeast Trees.

nd by the disappointing not so magnificent magician Maxwell.

———————————

Problem with insomnia is not the stats you can't gain from sleeping, the problem is - you can't use tents at all - meaning that some of the game content becomes useless for you (2 sleeping bags and 2 tents), I don't like such a desing.

Maxwell badly needs more love, I totally agree here.

 

42 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Willow doesn’t set fires when she’s insane.. if she did that would just be annoying and I would feel bad for all the Willow players I’ve kicked out of my game session and banned for “Setting my Alchemy Engine On Fire”

That was a thing in one of earlier versions of her, that's why she was so soon to get rework.

[WoodieMain45684]

Since you said you haven't had much experience with Woodie and his downsides I'll explain it here:

Woodie is played two ways, you either frequent his forms, or you don't.

If you play the latter way then Woodie's "Downside" is the fact that he gets more treeguards. In most cases, this is a buff, but it becomes a hassle in the late-game because it will take a significant portion of your time to deal with the treeguards that spawn. Whether or not you want the living logs is up to you, but I always find myself with significantly more living logs than nightmare fuel, meaning I'm wasting my time fighting more treeguards. (I could pacify them, but they would usually just end up wandering somewhere else). (Which is why I recommend using beaver in the lategame if you just want wood)

If you play the first way by using Woodie's form quite often, then most likely your "Downside" will be all the extra hunger you consume when you use a wereform. Any hunger above zero will be consumed in order to maintain the form. What this encourages is actually a pretty unique playstyle that hasn't been used by any other character: the do starve playstyle. Keeping your palate light and hunger close to zero means that you incur less of a penalty each time you transform and will waste less food.

In short, Woodie's downside depends on how you play him. Frequent wereform user? Minimize the hunger penalty. Don't do that often? More treeguards, can't regularly eat monster meat, hassle during full moons. To be fair, it kinda makes sense that Woodie's non-form penalty is light because human Woodie is just basically Wilson who can chop a bit faster. His downside only really happens when he tries to take advantage of his curse.

[cantbeatdaboss]

4 hours ago, Desblat said:

4) Wendy. Lower damage. Easy? Kinda. Interesting? Probably.

Hotel? Trivago.

[Ezaroth]

2 hours ago, Desblat said:

Problem with insomnia is not the stats you can't gain from sleeping, the problem is - you can't use tents at all - meaning that some of the game content becomes useless for you (2 sleeping bags and 2 tents), I don't like such a desing.

Kinda agree with this. Cons that blocks you from certain contents is not a good design. For example, for Wigfrid/Wurt, instead of not being able to eat Meat/Vege at all, they should be able to but at the cost of sanity. For Wicker, sleeping would not raise sanity but should still raise health (resting instead of sleeping).

[GenomeSquirrel]

It’s a matter of can this character do something that no one else can do or would otherwise be much harder.

Cons generally don’t matter, there are hats.

[Sweaper]

5 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Wurt is OP with very few actual downsides..

Winona’s Constant hunger penalty insures that the fridge full of food you had stockpiled remains mysteriously empty.

[Parusoid]

More appropriate post title would be "my opinion about characters' pros and cons" 

[Maxposting]

9 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Maxwell down right SUCKS!!! bottom line the dude needs a Rework and he needs it badly.

Why? When you Build a shadow clone.. another player Whacks said Shadow Clone and kills it.. why can’t this effing things blink in and out of existence when ANOTHER PLAYER attempts to hit them like Crawling Horrors can?

Whats worse is Maxwell doesn’t even get back the Damn ingredients he had to use to summon them.

I hate Maxwell because of this and simply WONT play as him until he is Reworked.

Just because someone killed your shadow doesn't mean that maxwell is bad, he is actually one of the fastest gatherer characters, only limited by 4 shadows and the tasty nightmare fuel.

[Mike23Ua]

59 minutes ago, __IvoCZE__ said:

Just because someone killed your shadow doesn't mean that maxwell is bad, he is actually one of the fastest gatherer characters, only limited by 4 shadows and the tasty nightmare fuel.

Nightmare Fuel is almost impossible to obtain early in this game... you guys are thinking about day 3855 Maxwell.

I am talking about Day 1 Maxwell- yeah try that..

Bottom Line: Other players shouldn’t be able to DESTROY them in COOPERATIVE Servers.

I also don’t see Maxwell as all that great of a Gather character either.. ESPECIALLY when you compare him to Wurt-

all you gotta do is go to a Swamp and offer a few Merms some Carrots, Veggies or WintersFeast Fruitcake and they will follow you around chopping tree’s and rocks for you.

 

[Well-met]

22 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Nightmare Fuel is almost impossible to obtain early in this game... you guys are thinking about day 3855 Maxwell.

I am talking about Day 1 Maxwell- yeah try that..

Bottom Line: Other players shouldn’t be able to DESTROY them in COOPERATIVE Servers.

I also don’t see Maxwell as all that great of a Gather character either.. ESPECIALLY when you compare him to Wurt-

all you gotta do is go to a Swamp and offer a few Merms some Carrots, Veggies or WintersFeast Fruitcake and they will follow you around chopping tree’s and rocks for you.

 

Everything you post is incorrect

and i dont even play maxwell

[Mike23Ua]

6 minutes ago, Well-met said:

Everything you post is incorrect

and i dont even play maxwell

Uh huh sure- But When Another  Player whacks Abigail she either KILLS Them or she reverts back into her flower form.

NOT a few flower petals that I’ll need to go and gather more resources in order to ReSummon.

And THAT is the Difference Between WENDY & MAXWELL. 

Please though- Do Insult me some more. 

Maxwell needs a fix why can’t we all just agree on something for once? Dang. You literally just admitted yourself you don’t even PLAY Maxwell..

[Hornete]

8 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Please though- Do Insult me some more. 

@Well-met insulted you in no way.

[Mike23Ua]

5 minutes ago, Hornete said:

@Well-met insulted you in no way.

How is saying that everything someone posts is incorrect not a direct insult? 

Thats literally the same thing as saying everything I post is meaningless non-sense.

Which translates well into: Everything I say is a waste of your time and I have no purpose even being here.

[Well-met]

34 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

Uh huh sure- But When Another  Player whacks Abigail she either KILLS Them or she reverts back into her flower form.

NOT a few flower petals that I’ll need to go and gather more resources in order to ReSummon.

And THAT is the Difference Between WENDY & MAXWELL. 

Please though- Do Insult me some more. 

Maxwell needs a fix why can’t we all just agree on something for once? Dang. You literally just admitted yourself you don’t even PLAY Maxwell..

I don't play Maxwell and I'm still well aware his gathering is top tier. I don't play Maxwell and I'm still well aware nightmare fuels isn't as rare as you think.

[Swag Master69]

2 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

Nightmare Fuel is almost impossible to obtain early in this game... you guys are thinking about day 3855 Maxwell.

I am talking about Day 1 Maxwell- yeah try that..

ok

I used a controller to show that this can be done on console too.

[Frashaw27]

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Nightmare Fuel is almost impossible to obtain early in this game... you guys are thinking about day 3855 Maxwell.

With 2 duelists and one worker (usually digger if you are near base) you can remain insane forever. Your sanity cap is literally lower the threshold to become insane and thus that is the fastest way to n. fuel in the early game. While this is rather obscure, items like raw green caps and gloomer goop give -50 sanity which is long enough for you to get a few n. fuel. It may be slightly harder for make well to go coco, but not that much harder.

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Bottom Line: Other players shouldn’t be able to DESTROY them in COOPERATIVE Servers.

Ah yes and allow the infinte logger and digger to completely elminate any trees or marble bushes (using miners) on the base because they can't do anything but kick the griefer and hope they don't get back on. They are allowed to be destroyed because they can be used for a very easy form of griefing, even if it is unintentional. Sure, a torch can get the job done and a wilson with a axe can do the same thing but the difference is that they can be stopped (to a extent) while the shadows can be fully stopped fully and this ensuring no griefing is going on. There is also the fact that you need to take into consider context. You are out in the middle of the woods chopping trees and sombody punches them? They are a d***. You are going to a base full of chopable/mineable materials? They are just trying to make sure you don't mess their forests up. It just common maxwell ettiqute to remove your puppets before retuening to base. Context matters.

2 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

all you gotta do is go to a Swamp and offer a few Merms some Carrots, Veggies or WintersFeast Fruitcake and they will follow you around chopping tree’s and rocks for you.

Puppets follow you forever. Beaides the inital summoning cost, their services are free to use and can be cleanly gotten rid of when you no longer need them. Sure Wurt can match maxwell with enough merms, but he only needs to spend nightmare fuel and a tool to use them compared the increading amount of food needes to use all of your merms. There is also the point that the puppets can be summoned from anywhere as the merms must always spawn from thwir house and then you have to take that into account when traveling.

1 hour ago, Mike23Ua said:

Uh huh sure- But When Another  Player whacks Abigail she either KILLS Them or she reverts back into her flower form.

NOT a few flower petals that I’ll need to go and gather more resources in order to ReSummon

While yes, Abigail has the ability to be resummoned with thw same flower, she also needs time to recharge after she has been desummoned. In this time period, you are essemtially a weaker wilson. While Maxwell is also a weaker wilson without his puppets, he can also summon them wherever amd whenever he wants. Want mine bolders? Pull out the codex and make some puupets. Want to chop trees? Pull out the codex and make your puppets. Want to dig graves? Pull out the codex and make some puupets. This simple process makes his puppets much more versitile and player chpice them a majority of other compaions. Their ability to be replaced is also useful as it serves the purpose all other compaions have, being cannonfodder. Sure this cannonfodder can punchback but you still value your life versus all of theor replaceable faces. The puppets just cut out the middle man of the respawn period and allow you to spawn them at will.

Sincerely, A Maxwell (co) main.

[torauma]

Woodie's cons? there are none.

[Starlogy]

Personally, I find downsides that you cannot patch up with other means more interesting. That's why I prefer to play Wigfrid over Wolfgang- Wolfgang is straight up better with a negligible downside, while Wigfrid has a constant downside: Maintaining hunts in the early game, and being locked out of mushrooms and Dragonpies in the lategame.

It's also a big reason why I believe WX is just flawed as hell: Every benefit he gets comes with the downside of taking damage from rain. Rain. It's not a downside, it's a minor inconvenience. Hell, it has a double function of making him spark, meaning he doesn't need light for the night while it rains.

Hopefully Klei plans on making WX, Wolfgang's, and Wickerbottom's downsides more than minor inconveniences.

[NormalPinkerton]

5 hours ago, Mike23Ua said:

How is saying that everything someone posts is incorrect not a direct insult? 

Thats literally the same thing as saying everything I post is meaningless non-sense.

Which translates well into: Everything I say is a waste of your time and I have no purpose even being here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbole