What's wrong with Woodie?

[Szczuku]

Werebeaver should be able to vore Wormwood

[Pedro cc]

having LUCy in your BAckpack is a NIGhtmare DON't put lucy  in a backpack or she Won't stop yelling: It'S tO dArK hErE

[Owlrust]

Woodie is my all-time favorite character, but I had to shelve him because of the following reasons. For one, I think the biggest flaw about him are mostly the things he cannot do rather than "doing wrong", on TOP of his downsides. He's a lumberjack, a pretty decent one at that ("decent" is the word I'm focusing on here); but he's pretty outclassed by the ranks of Maxwell or heck even maybe Warly now. Not to mention the other ways of harvesting wood like the Bearger or Forest Stalker being the most useful. Secondly, full moons are just AWFUL to deal with since you have to spend almost the whole night gnawing on wood to stay human otherwise you'll turn and lose sanity at 90/ min (normally as the beaver might I add) and potentially health as well due to the rapid loss of log meter. Cutting trees reduce the log meter by a butt-ton which means you are basically losing a log per tree if you want to stay human. The pinecone sanity regen is nice, but Wormwood does it better. Lucy is...alright, but she lacks true usefulness when you don't immediately need to chop (I have put her in a chest so many times because I want the inv space for better stuff), and furthermore lacks any significant damage to be noticeable.; gosh her voice is so ear-wrenching, it drives me nuts to have to hear it 24/7. 

Now onto the fun part, the big beaver boi himself. At first it sounds really cool to chop trees so fast, but in reality, you are gonna go insane rather quickly and have to revert when you find that shadow creatures won't let you chop in peace; not to mention the measly 25% dmg reduction that blocks next to nothing, or the damage that ALSO does next to nothing (27.2 regular and 44.2 against trees...or rather Treeguards which is still pretty awful dmg output). And yes. He can't swim. As a beaver naturally does. I've heard it before. 240 insulation and 70% wetness resistance is ok, but not enough to be a viable solution to any in-game problem considering that human Woodie can get items to do the same or better. 

All in all, his main downside is that he..well, frankly...has too many; and doesn't really provoke a "We sure could use a Woodie right now" sort of reaction from people. He really just doesn't DO anything special like say Wickerbottom or Wolfgang can, and is often overlooked because of how heavy his downsides are when compared to his benefits. Sorry for the rant, I trust they will do something great for him *knock on wood*.

[Ornge]

His wood bar is so annoying to deal with

[Lakurius]

woodie is high b tier but ok!!

[EllisonCharlie]

The Forge Woodie was great because he had a cool perk that was super important to the team, DST Woodie is... meh. His best trait is easily outshone by another character who has even more perks than just gathering. Now Warly with his spices makes him even more irrelevant. I hope Woodie's rework is super cool, even if just for the lore aspect. I want to know about Lucy!

[SinancoTheBest]

I love playing as Woodie, he's simple but fun. Has good HP, good Sanity, good hunger, cold resistance, no need to ever worry about an axe, cuts fast, very easy sanity management- beaver for drain, planting for gain, a fourth meter to spice things up etc. But Warebeaver is very weak, whenever I don't have a moon dial screaming at me that it's going to be Fullmoon tonight, I inconveniently become beaver, make some mass deforestation and turn back. It's not too bad at deforestation but it's very weak if you're attacked and that sanity drain instantly calls forth shadows. It's a weak gimmick at best- I avoid becoming a beaver at all. Therefore Beaver should be buffed first if it's going to be a significant part of his character.

[56933043043]

So Woodie's supposed to be the lumberjack here, isn't he? But Maxwell just seems to do his job at collecting wood better than he himself can(Maxwell can have FOUR puppets chop wood for him without him needing to lift a finger, or could swap one of them to dig up the stumps once the others are done). He's pretty outclassed at the moment by Maxwell in that regard.

On top of that, Werebeaver is a very situational transformation:

-You can only break down structures that can be hammered, chopped, mined, or dug up.

-You will have your sanity be constantly drained, which can be useful for spawning shadow creatures(any character can go insane quickly by constantly jumping through a wormhole so this isn't exclusive to the beaver)

-You do less damage than a tentacle spike, an easy to obtain weapon.

-Your hunger meter does not go down.(One of the only perks here that is completely unique)

-You have 20% damage innate damage reduction(a grass suit gives 60% damage reduction)

-You have a 10% boost to your movement speed.(For reference, magiluminescence is also 10%, walking cane is 20%)

- You have full on night-vision, which is useful underground.

-However, the beaver doesn't benefit from any head slot, hand slot or chest slot items and can't use any other items, so using moggles with some armor or a speed boost item outclasses as Woodie outclasses the beaver easily, as you can have multiple of these benefits all at once without sacrificing your use of other items, including healing items that the beaver can't use.

Woodie's playstyle also isn't all that interesting. Even with the Werebeaver kept in mind, it's just an animal with no armor that doesn't starve with some minor perks sprinkled onto it that can't do much more than destroy and fight(also isn't very good at that last thing)

[Osbalop]

I think Woodie has a similar problem to pre-rework Willow, a wierd, nor very usefull main perk (Lumberjack and firestarter), even if Woodie was better than Maxwell it ´s impossible to make him better than Bearger without it being really stupid OP one-shotting tree eater

Because of this I think they should give small buffs to the lumberjack part, make Werebeaber more like Wilba and really focus on his secondary perk. (like they did with bernie) Being Canadian!!

Some way to better control pigs and bunnys and maybe making tham be able to help Woodie in other situations (kinda like monkeys with Wilbur) would be much more interesting than Wood chopping machine Number 3

[WoodieMain45684]

I don't really need much for myself.

1. Stumps should take 1 gnaw or are uprooted whenever the beaver gnaws a tree down.

^This is one of the major points to why Maxwell is a better lumberjack than Woodie because he can take care of the stumps with a minion as well. Right now Woodie uses three gnaws to dig up a stump which is the equivalent amount of time it takes to gnaw a medium tree down. 

2. Beaver needs higher dmg and resistance because it takes to long to kill the shadowcreatures off of you.

^Another point since Maxwell can equip armor and weapons while farming to fight off any threats. Right now you can fight off the shadowcreatures as werebeaver if you get stuck in perma insanity, but it takes A LONG TIME because of the low 27.3 dmg and your mistakes are heavily punished because of the low 25% armor.

3. Woodie could have a way to pick up wood faster. Examples are: lucy hopping around and tossing wood into piles while left on the ground, wood that is chopped from trees goes strait into woodies inventory, or trees gnawed by beaver drop no wood and their wood is vomited back up in stacks upon transforming back to woodie (<- My friends idea).

^Maxwell already does this since he can use his minions to do the work actions and hold space. Right now the longest part of lumberjacking for Woodie is picking up the mess afterwards.

4. Beaver Swimming.

^Because he's a beaver.

 

Optional to me, but probably wanted by a large majority of players.

1. A way for the beaver to regen health solo.

2. Beaver inventory management and map visibility.

 

 

[minespatch]

Maybe make his model smile? If they can make Warly's redesign have cheekbones, I think it'd be nice to have Woodie be a chill smiler. His lines don't match his grumpy face.

[WoodieMain45684]

I wouldn't say that Warly outclasses Woodie's wood harvesting abilities tbh even if Warly is under the effects of sweetener. Warly DOES however have a nice pool of other things he can do while Woodie's only gimmick is wood harvesting. (And speedy map revealing)

Though if you had the option: a sugar rush beaver or Woodie is probably the best chopping speed in the game aside from boss monsters or a huge pig army. The only problem now is the stumps and the pickup speed in regards to just getting the wood.

Sanity can be managed by planting cones before transformation. Seriously, a stack fills your sanity bar all the way. It would take literally around 2 minutes of solid werebeaver time to actually go insane if you just plant your cones before you hoedown. Though not having to do this would also be nice.

 

[mr._.tete]

He's no longer that unique. With characters like Maxwell and Warly 50% increased resource collection speed + upcoming ROT update really makes his glorious wood chopping skills, well useless (and we don't use wood that often as well).

So if you ask me what's wrong with Woodie? You can not have him on your team and you don't gain anything or lose anything at all, like 0 profit 0 loss.

Bonus

What change I'd like to see in Woody are :

1. Wearveaver permanent form - You can choose to stay in Beaver form as long as you want but constant sanity drain

2. Cannot heal using food, only through wood (which heals like only 10 hp)

TBH I don't know Woody, played him once for like an hour maybe but his abilities and how people constantly talk about how useless he is just makes me refuse to play him.

[Queron81]

17 hours ago, Canis said:

THIS, YES FOR THE LOVE OF GOD. Klei, *please* re-draw his portrait for his rework.

It also strikes me as slightly uncharacteristic. Also, that doesn't really look like Woodie at all now that Im staring at it.

Right. That's how I see Woodie:

Spoiler

[Canis]

49 minutes ago, Queron81 said:

Right. That's how I see Woodie:

  Hide contents

This is a cursed image

 

 

Also, I don't need yall to comment anymore problems, the thread I needed them for is out now
https://forums.kleientertainment.com/forums/topic/109725-why-woodie-sucks-and-how-to-fix-him/