No wort or AETN help

[TheEvilMango]

I'm planning on trying a no wort or AETN run something I've never done. Any advice on how to keep the base from over heating?

[0xFADE]

you should be able to get to steam generators before your base dies of a heat death.  If you are keeping yourself from worts and AETN you probably wouldn't be using the 40c output from the water sieve either.

[SharraShimada]

You can run cooling gas/liquid through ice-biome for a long time before the cooling drops. By that time, you should have switched to steam turbines to kill heat.

[Saturnus]

The new ice maker makes it a lot less challenging to do a "no wheeze/AETN" challenge.

[Lilalaunekuh]

1 hour ago, 0xFADE said:

If you are keeping yourself from worts and AETN you probably wouldn't be using the 40c output from the water sieve either.

Ok about the no wort and no aetn challenge:

Been there, done that. (And I mean to a cycle count where heat really matters >1 000 cycles.)

=> The easiest and earliest way I used to "delete" heat was the water sieve ...

[Exa]

a simple liquid cooler with 0 maintenance required. only enough power.

layers 

 

Spoiler

if you want to cool more than 28°C you should just add more thermo aquatuner

[Abt9]

Is that the steam turbine setup? ..that simple? No additional pumping?

[Exa]

mmmh... 7 weezewort though, but optional as the turbine overheat at 1050°C, so you can add more steam turbine above for cool it down

[Abt9]

Just now, Exa said:

mmmh... 7 weezewort though

You can simply replace it with thermo regulators tho

[Nostas]

theres already a thread about it by GemeinerJack.

My "No Wheez, no AETN" Challaenge Base

 

He uses PW Cooling loops from the Bathroom.

I really liked this idea and implemented it in my own base

[Exa]

and cool slush geyser is free win

[KittenIsAGeek]

11 hours ago, TheEvilMango said:

I'm planning on trying a no wort or AETN run something I've never done. Any advice on how to keep the base from over heating?

Most of my bases have rarely used wheezeworts or AETNs.  I have used them from time to time, but generally speaking they don't get used at all.  You can set up a variety of builds to shuffle heat around to where it either becomes useful, or it gets removed. 

For example, you can use aquatuners to heat up a pool of polluted water.  As the water gets hot, send it through a sieve. The clean water will come out at 40c, so if your PW is 80c, you've removed a large amount of heat.  

Another technique is to pump the hot PW into a chamber where you can boil it.  The steam then passes through a steam turbine and gives you clean water as an output.  You can set up counter-current pipe configurations to cool the clean water and pre-heat the polluted water, reducing the amount of power needed to boil the PW.

You could also do a series of transfers: move heat from clean water into crude oil until it turns to petrol.  Move the heat from the petrol into polluted water until it boils.  Send the steam through a turbine to produce clean water. Move the heat from the hot clean water into crude oil... If you use aquatuners, you'll need a lot of power, but you could probably set up some counter-current systems to reduce your energy costs.

 

[JohnFrancis]

@TheEvilMangoHave you given much though to ranching? Critters are far more heat resistant than plants, hatches can survive up to 70C if memory serves. You could run your base at 45C (I am not sure if dupes will be ok with that though) meaning running water sieves would be plenty of heat destruction enough to keep you going until plastic and steam turbines.

[Gus Smedstad]

I am using no wheezeworts or AETNs in my present colony.

I screwed up quite a lot in the beginning. In hindsight you can ignore early heat for most of your colony except your farm. I really should have insulated that. Instead I used emergency measures, namely mining ice from cold biomes, and then building ice tempshift plates to cool my farm. That works but it's awkward, and you can't do it forever.

I did have a hatch ranch, but it didn't produce anywhere near enough meat to keep my Dupes alive. I really needed farming.

I didn't find the ice maker that useful. I'd heard good things about it, but for a variety of reasons it didn't help that much. Mostly it was the manual water delivery, and it sat idle quite often because of that.

Early on I used polluted water in my metal refinery. Once it got to about 85 C I'd run it through a sieve. That helped with a significant part of early heat.

I pushed hard for petroleum so I could get plastic for steam turbines. Once I had steam turbines, and lots of power to run aquatuners, all my heat issues went away. Steam turbines remove far, far more heat than either wheezeworts or AETNs.

My first steam turbine went to cooling my petroleum refinery and generators, because those generate a scary amount of waste heat. If I hadn't addresses that my base really would have gotten cooked.

My second turbine went to cooling an insulated farm.

My third turbine was for a new metal refinery running petroleum as a coolant. Now instead of just deleting the heat, I could get energy back from it. Anything above 190 C went to heating the steam chamber of the turbine, and then back to the metal refinery.

 

[Abt9]

Btw, does wheezeworts give meaningful cooling at all? I just found out that Water sieves are much more consistent, reliable and gives quite a bit of cooling.

[beowulf2010]

1 hour ago, Abt9 said:

Btw, does wheezeworts give meaningful cooling at all? I just found out that Water sieves are much more consistent, reliable and gives quite a bit of cooling.

Wheezeworts give a decent amount of cooling. If in a decently high pressure hydrogen room (2kg+) they generate a flat 12kDTU of cooling.

They're the "worst" cooling option purely because they are literally free. All you need is a 1x3 space for the pot and wort. 

3-4 worts will cool 40C oxygen from an electrolizer to the low teens in around 25 radiant air pipes. 

4 worts will keep up with condensing all but the top 10% or so of cool steam vents. 

2-5 worts will keep a steam turbine cool while it's cooling other things like metal volcanoes (2 for every  gold I've had recently), Aquatuners (needed 4 for a looping aquatuner cooling system permanently running 95C water down to under 20), and refinery coolant (4 worts cooling a pair of steam turbines kept up with a double refinery setup making both iron and steel). 

Heck, while they're best in hydrogen, they work well other places too. 

1 wort in the middle of a water seived bathroom looped water system will keep the whole room from overhesting. 

2 worts will bring a natural gas geyser room to negative temp fairly quickly if you keep it in the 2-4kg range. 

[Syrcan]

Interestingly enough. I have started about a week ago a challenge on max diffifculty, no wheezewort/AETN, and no geyser. The awkward spot for me was when I had to setup oxygen from electrolyzer. I had no choice but to accept that oxygen would be at a temperature of 40°C until I get an actual cooling going.

Screenshots of my base are in spoilers, do not check them if you want to keep the challenge... challenging!

Spoiler

 

My base got rather warm (by my standards) sitting at around ~35°C in my bathroom (despite using ceramic insulated pipes) and the drecko stable. I had to use Ice-E fan taking ice from a frozen biome to grow mealwood for the dreckos.

Now my cooling is active and my base is back to "green" temperature.

 

Spoiler

 

Note: the Aquatuner / Steam Turbine combo is absolutely insane. 1 aquatuner cooling polluted water has even be enough for me to cool oxygen down to 15°C for a whole 60 dupes in another of my challenges.

[Abt9]

4 minutes ago, Syrcan said:

no geyser.

This sounds painful. Any source of water?

[Zorku]

Not wort or AETN means that you probably just want to keep the bathrooms well away from your farm, and maybe rush to insulate the farm. 

Normal industry stuff applies. If you keep your generators cold then the gas they make comes out just as cold, And you can pump really hot liquid into most buildings to delete heat, since the outputs of everything besides generators and your HVAC machines are fixed temperatures. 

The best way to keep your base at a particular temperature after awhile will be a radiator of basic pipes (no need for radiant) circulating -probably polluted water- through the spaces you need cool, where the stuff in the pipes is a little bit cooler than where you want the base to stay. You keep that coolant nice and regulated with whatever aquatuner setup you prefer, and then just dump the heat from the aquatuner into a biome you don't care about for awhile, and dump it into a steam generator when you have plastic.

[Nightinggale]

On 5/2/2019 at 8:32 PM, KittenIsAGeek said:

For example, you can use aquatuners to heat up a pool of polluted water.  As the water gets hot, send it through a sieve. The clean water will come out at 40c, so if your PW is 80c, you've removed a large amount of heat.  

I did that at some point, except I heated the PW to 110 C. This allowed my toilets to both remove heat and produce germ free water. Works really well, but it did take a while to heat the water up to the "working temperature" as it contained 30 ton of water. It contained 4 aquatuners and water intake in one end and pump in the other. The water should intentionally flow slowly from one end to the other to give it time to make it germ free regardless of how germy it was or germ type. In the end I realized I made it too big

Even though it actually worked quite well once it was heated up, I still won't recommend it. Today you should use chlorine to get rid of germs and send the heat to a steam turbine. Still it shows one of the things I really like about this game: there are plenty of solutions to the same problem, often solutions Klei themselves didn't think of before release.

[chemie]

I never uses Aetn since they were never near where I wanted them.  Weeze are convenient but they have given us so many other tools  they are not required at all.   A single slush geysers is way more powerful than all the aetn on a map combined.