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BOT Tuja

Your Character Balance Ideas

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maradyne    4,491

Eh...personally, I wouldn't mind the Sanity thing as much if it weren't one of his many strong points
Like, for the NM Fuel farming, he's such a good pick for it because it's easier to keep his Sanity low and he can kill the Shadows much faster with less weapon durability loss and an even easier time avoiding hit. And even if you are hit, he has a healing mechanic to make your items go farther.
I can play Maxwell and lock myself at low Sanity with Puppets, or make a visit to a Green/Blue Shroom forest with almost any character and achieve better Sanity loss than Wolf's drain...but his Sanity drain is just one perk among many.

 

I don't think I've had Wolfgang hit his Wimpy form unintentionally while playing him since shortly after starting single player DS eons ago. Food's pretty easy to manage even if you don't have a Wendy or Wicker. So...to me at least, his Mighty/Normal forms are the only comparison points. Not to mention that even Wimpy form is a perk, if you use it right. You get more out of your healing items if you let him go Wimpy, lowering his max HP, and then heal up, because his health scaling is based on percentage of health you have rather than the actual number.

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pedregales    353
14 minutes ago, Finx said:

Here the issue isn't Wolfgang, its an obselete gameplay mechanic know as sanity that when depleted is more of a benediction than a threat. [...]

That is debatable. While being insane is a bit too rewarding (specially if you are playing a character like Maxwell), it is also true that this character has an easier time getting and staying insane, and unlike most other characters, he can deal with nightmare creatures with ease as long as you have a decent "belly", without using too much durability from weapons.

Calling the sanity mechanic obsolete is a bit undeserving considering the other functions it has, and the other functions it can have. By that merit we can say Wolfgang's wimpy form is obsolete as it has almost no true purpose than be a way too easy to manage "punishment", the only moment you wouldn't mind being wimpy is if you are base building.

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Finx    88
1 hour ago, lifetheuniverse said:

Eh...personally, I wouldn't mind the Sanity thing as much if it weren't one of his many strong points
Like, for the NM Fuel farming, he's such a good pick for it because it's easier to keep his Sanity low and he can kill the Shadows much faster with less weapon durability loss and an even easier time avoiding hit. And even if you are hit, he has a healing mechanic to make your items go farther.
I can play Maxwell and lock myself at low Sanity with Puppets, or make a visit to a Green/Blue Shroom forest with almost any character and achieve better Sanity loss than Wolf's drain...but his Sanity drain is just one perk among many.

Killing shadow creature faster what are you expecting from a character that his main perk is doing more damage? To call his sanity drain modifier a "strong" perk is kind of exaggerating it. Its only 10% more that you lose and only when hugging monster or from darkness. At this point I could exaggerate too and come say that Wendy is op because Abigail can slay horde of splemonkey (which are considered to be the most dangerous creature by many) all by herself or that Wigfrid hp leech combine with an inventory full of marble suit/night armor allow her to mitigate all the damage without even sweating. But doing so would be hypocrite of me and isn't helping in any shape or form.

If you really care about losing sanity there is plenty of ways to do so available to any character that are way more effective : eating raw meat, monster meat, lichen, blue and green mushroom, raw cactus, gloomer goop, hop back and forth in a wormhole, equip dark sword/night armor, nightmare amulet, bone helm, spam lazy deserter, torch flicking in the dark, evil flower field, etc.

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x0VERSUS1y    3,548

Frankly all this thread shows in the end is why devs don't (and shouldn't) consider random people balancing and re-working propositions - 'cause they go all over the place into pure opinion territory. As stated: how many heads, that many ideas!

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pedregales    353
2 hours ago, x0VERSUS1y said:

Frankly all this thread shows in the end is why devs don't (and shouldn't) consider random people balancing and re-working propositions - 'cause they go all over the place into pure opinion territory. As stated: how many heads, that many ideas!

I think in this case is more fear to change (or fear to Willow-syndrome). But in general yes, it's hard to make a balance change for any game even if it is completely justified, even if just 5% of the fan-base gets disappointed in the change, that 5% can easily be thousands of people depending on the game (and even a hundred is a big number), and can be very vocal about it.

But of course, any balance change made, even by devs, is going to go down in "opinion territory", and most changes go into "testing territory" to make sure they are good.

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maradyne    4,491

Yea, obviously they shouldn't take any random idea off of the forum and implement it as-is. We're just throwing around ideas because we feel that there need to be changes and have felt that way since Beta.
...I mean, we can and have actually come up with some great, well thought out update concepts, but we're just restating things that've already been heavily detailed in the past and seemingly didn't seem to get consideration by the team, so there's little point in putting in the effort again.

 

...wish I could find that really good making-Wes-a-team-player-but-not-changing-his-difficulty-or-gameplay-at-all suggestion. Basically making him an aggro magnet, so he's no longer purely a bad pick for any team, but still the same challenge character for the actual player; actually raising his difficulty to a level closer to Single Player.
IE Giving Wes a mechanic that makes him a meaningful and useful pick to a team, but that doesn't change the idea of 'has trouble staying alive'.

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Viktor234    2,475
31 minutes ago, lifetheuniverse said:

...wish I could find that really good making-Wes-a-team-player-but-not-changing-his-difficulty-or-gameplay-at-all suggestion. Basically making him an aggro magnet, so he's no longer purely a bad pick for any team, but still the same challenge character for the actual player; actually raising his difficulty to a level closer to Single Player.
IE Giving Wes a mechanic that makes him a meaningful and useful pick to a team, but that doesn't change the idea of 'has trouble staying alive'.

I'd suggest to remove his actual cons and add him a 25% increased penalties (Bigger Health/Sanity penalty by spoiled food, monster food, physical damage, etc.), turn him into an aggro magnet but whenever enemies are about to focus him, they should randomly choose between him and one of his balloons.

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maradyne    4,491

Changes to any of his downsides ended up angering the WES ES BES crowd, tho.

 

I've remembered the basics of the suggestion. Still can't find who did it and where.
...actually, I just tested it, and the search function doesn't pull up archived topics that I know exist and have the link to. Is there a way to bypass that?

 

Basically...
Player-Hostile Aggro Priority:
Wes > Balloons > Other Players

So Wes is the most likely target for aggro; while Balloons could be used to manipulate aggro, and would help out the team, Wes is still who the mob in question would target once that aggro breaks or the Balloon pops, if he's nearby.
Mostly think about Hounds/Depths Worms in this scenario, and how their aggro works.

 

 

I envision a beautiful world where 10 Day One Wilsons gather in base, and all of the Hounds that spawn for them swarm toward our lord and Mimior, only to be dragged around in circles and picked off one by one by a horde of unarmed nooblets.

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FreyaMaluk    5,002
On 12/17/2018 at 4:43 PM, slendyproject said:


Maxwell:

- Make shadow duelists similar to the forge ones. They dont exist as a mob anymore but show some kind of indication on the HUD that they are with you. After Dealing a certain amount of the damage the same animation should play that plays in the forge doing some burst damage. The more duelists you have the higher and more frequent is the damage they do. This way Max can dedicate all his sanity to become a fighter character or fill in the role of gatherer as he does now.

I like this.. that's the right idea for shadow duelist IMO and it could totally work for normal DST too

*sip*

----

Now the critical ones:

Woodie and Willow... So much said about these two over the years.. IMO they just aren't fun to play with (sorry to all fanboyz). I've played them myself.. multiple times..

Willow is not that bad IMO, she is still manageable.. although not FUN.. better said, not as fun as in DS.. IMO she is another lesser version of Wilson, which in turns makes no sense to pick her at all cuz then I would just play Wilson instead

Woodie.. he got the shortest end of the stick.. poor guy.. I mean ik how to play him, but for real he is just annoying in DST.. unless u are playing a full stationary type of game.. awesome nightmare fuel factory, but he needs the most support than any other character in the game... the most grieving problem I see is the illogical lack of natural armor for his beaver form.. I mean I think that change alone would make him ten thousand times more interesting and fun to play with... In DS he was like.. Oh I'm cursed.. but Oh boy it's fun to be a beaver.. in DST it's like... I'll completely avoid turning into a beaver ever.. no matter what..

Winona... she is just the most bland and uninteresting character ever... the definition of vanilla.. I hope the devs reconsider and give her something unique and cool.. some of her recent looks are awesome (verdant, victorian), which is greatly appreciated :) but she def needs some love

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Donke60    3,083

well i better check up on the forums see what has happened, its been a long time
*sees thread*
man things never change, god I feel old, and @x0VERSUS1y beat me what i wanted to say on like page three of this thread, which i read all of god rest my soul, and then set me on fire cause death is boring. Anyway I always featured Wes as a bargain character in my mind and a Faustian one at that, meaning whatever he could do was so much worse then what he had to give up. and he could give those items to other characters that he made to be a true team player or use them himself with some revision. And you may ask why would anyone use this and the answer is novelty cause and bragging rights cause those are two main things that I see drive the DS community. espically wes players, which at this point are on a level of meme that I say 4chan is just kid friendly. anyway this rebalances the character makes him fun, maybe even throw in a few minor mechanics. gives hardcare players a chance to show off how big their balloons are to their fellow mimes. and gives new players some charming look at that what is this moments.

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Obviousclone    51

wx-78 should only lose 2.2 sanity per minute instead of the usual 3.3 sanity per minute for each ghost on the server.

The exception is if the ghost is that of another wx-78 in which case he loses 4.4 sanity per minute for each wx-78 ghost on the server.

beep boop destroy all humans zip zap sympathy module not responding

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Mr.Mulk    1,163

I personally think the community's inability to conclude on the constitution of an actual rebalance is the single largest entity holding back us from helping Klei make actual changes.

It's hard to take us seriously when half the people on the threads (Not this one to clarify) are making suggestions that would break the characters and cause even more imbalance, and the other half are making awful rebalance suggestions that wouldn't change anything. (Again not pointing any fingers to this thread)

The only thing actually consistent is the level of inconsistency in rebalance suggestions given, which is unfortunate.

Mark my words, if we ever actually want to see a real rebalance we have to achieve some goals:

  • Come up with some actually sane rebalance ideas that neither break the characters and make them OP nor not make any difference
  • Actually be unified as a community on these rebalances and make this clear to Klei, it looks unprofessional and dumb when attempting to suggest a rebalance only to get bogged down in arguments about what it's actually constituted of

That's my thoughts on the subject. Personally I'd love a rebalance, like almost all of the community I've encountered would. You'd have to be pretty blind to not see some of the issues in the game's balancing. I don't think Klei is deaf to what we're saying, but our inability to actually give them a sane, unified community idea is certainly not helping them to actually consider a rebalance.  

Spoiler

Anyways bring back fire immunity and modified inventory burning for Willow. ;)

 

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FreyaMaluk    5,002
5 hours ago, Mr.Mulk said:

I personally think the community's inability to conclude on the constitution of an actual rebalance is the single largest entity holding back us from helping Klei make actual changes.

It's hard to take us seriously when half the people on the threads (Not this one to clarify) are making suggestions that would break the characters and cause even more imbalance, and the other half are making awful rebalance suggestions that wouldn't change anything. (Again not pointing any fingers to this thread)

The only thing actually consistent is the level of inconsistency in rebalance suggestions given, which is unfortunate.

Mark my words, if we ever actually want to see a real rebalance we have to achieve some goals:

  • Come up with some actually sane rebalance ideas that neither break the characters and make them OP nor not make any difference
  • Actually be unified as a community on these rebalances and make this clear to Klei, it looks unprofessional and dumb when attempting to suggest a rebalance only to get bogged down in arguments about what it's actually constituted of

That's my thoughts on the subject. Personally I'd love a rebalance, like almost all of the community I've encountered would. You'd have to be pretty blind to not see some of the issues in the game's balancing. I don't think Klei is deaf to what we're saying, but our inability to actually give them a sane, unified community idea is certainly not helping them to actually consider a rebalance.  

  Reveal hidden contents

Anyways bring back fire immunity and modified inventory burning for Willow. ;)

 

tbh I disagree. there has been consistency in the posts asking for specifics for rebalance ideas over the years and for what I've seen the devs are indeed a bit deaf to rebalance suggestions cuz I believe that from a min-max resources perspective they prefer to concentrate on new content or events, etc as an indie studio.

ofc not everyone agrees perfectly on suggestions but asking the whole community to agree on every single idea about character rebalance is a bit unrealistic IMO

the devs do know many people aren't happy with some characters and they can probably pull game data on most played characters and most gameplay time per character etc... this is not like something we can't actually prove..

they could open a poll or something similar if they want opinions.. but the problem is that even if they did they cannot even make a decision based only on that cuz the majority of players do not check the forums, considering language barriers, simple lack of interest to be active or ignorance that the klei forums even exist.

I would prefer they would rely on gameplay data to draw conclusions

blaming the community for not presenting a perfectly unified voice on this is such an easy way to transfer the blame on us. In a perfect world people would have the same opinion, but we don't live in a perfect world unfortunately. But even so, I consider that most people have been consistent asking for concrete character rebalance ideas.

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Tapirus    1,726
6 hours ago, Mr.Mulk said:

You'd have to be pretty blind to not see some of the issues in the game's balancing.

Well, some people prefers see NEW content (mobs, items, biomes, etc.), others are fine with the current situation of the characters and some ones just don't care this stuff about Game's balancing.

So, not everybody wish Balance, because have diferent opinions. Not because they're "blinds".

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Donke60    3,083
7 hours ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Actually be unified as a community on these rebalances and make this clear to Klei, it looks unprofessional and dumb when attempting to suggest a rebalance only to get bogged down in arguments about what it's actually constituted of

doesn't that just point out. how hard it is to re-balance something.  unless something is legit broken everything Kiel is going to do will be in a grey area. and so honestly I would do nothing like Kiel has done. because if i made a balance I just imagine. all threads from then on where "this balance patch broke *this* fix it. or it sucks.

At the same time I do recognize why people are so angry. you can play the character you want. however that doesn't stop people from giving you flak or the fact that the character you want to play, you might like everything but you can't play them for long cause they don't feel good to play. But then that just brings us too the solution even the devs says on occasion. Just use mods. and that for the most part is what your going to have to do and what most have resigned themselves to doing.

 

 

7 hours ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Come up with some actually sane rebalance ideas that neither break the characters and make them OP nor not make any difference

This is all subjective. because playstyle . and people's skill lvl towards the game, unless the character themselves actually start breaking you can see everything as fair game.

However don't worry fellow forumer lurkers and users. this little fur will be your voice :p

Now where is my megaphone?!

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Mr.Mulk    1,163
Spoiler
4 hours ago, FreyaMaluk said:

tbh I disagree. there has been consistency in the posts asking for specifics for rebalance ideas over the years and for what I've seen the devs are indeed a bit deaf to rebalance suggestions cuz I believe that from a min-max resources perspective they prefer to concentrate on new content or events, etc as an indie studio.

ofc not everyone agrees perfectly on suggestions but asking the whole community to agree on every single idea about character rebalance is a bit unrealistic IMO

the devs do know many people aren't happy with some characters and they can probably pull game data on most played characters and most gameplay time per character etc... this is not like something we can't actually prove..

they could open a poll or something similar if they want opinions.. but the problem is that even if they did they cannot even make a decision based only on that cuz the majority of players do not check the forums, considering language barriers, simple lack of interest to be active or ignorance that the klei forums even exist.

I would prefer they would rely on gameplay data to draw conclusions

blaming the community for not presenting a perfectly unified voice on this is such an easy way to transfer the blame on us. In a perfect world people would have the same opinion, but we don't live in a perfect world unfortunately. But even so, I consider that most people have been consistent asking for concrete character rebalance ideas.

 

Almost any rebalance thread breaks apart rapidly with everyone throwing in their lots on what they think would constitute a good rebalance, and then promptly spends the rest of the thread in petty arguments about those ideas. There's absolutely no way this helps Klei actually figure out a good way to rebalance, or incentivize them into actually wanting to make a good rebalance. If anything, this helps give them an excuse to not listen, since the ideas being given are a jumbled mess. That's all I'm saying, not "blaming" the community for really anything besides being disorganized and scattered.

Also raw game data probably isn't the best source simply because:

  • It's hard to collect without infringing personal information rights (I've actually asked a dev about character playtime in regards to adjusting character item droprates on this before and their response stated this)
  • It's inaccurate as the game's average playtime is very small (the average person opens the game once or twice and never again, and there's no way those people care about the meta or even know what it is) 
  • People don't just play the meta characters, most of the people I know play whoever they want based on the characteristics of their choice
  • It's even more effort than just listening to the community, which they have been, but since we can't form a cohesive thought beyond "we want rebalance reeeee" they aren't going to risk actually putting any effort into making changes

Also I'm fairly sure Forge data (if that's what you're thinking of for example/comparison) was collected serverside, not clientside which is a huge difference in privacy rights.

Now the suggestion for a poll I actually like that, it would potentially be a good way to actually get the people who care about the game's opinion in a clean, clear format giving Klei actually competent feedback. So there may be something to that suggestion.

Spoiler
3 hours ago, Tapirus said:

Well, some people prefers see NEW content (mobs, items, biomes, etc.), others are fine with the current situation of the characters and some ones just don't care this stuff about Game's balancing.

So, not everybody wish Balance, because have diferent opinions. Not because they're "blinds".

 

"Let's keep adding new content onto an already broken foundation and hope the problems go away" is never a good way to develop a game. But hey, that's just my opinion.

Spoiler
2 hours ago, Donke60 said:

doesn't that just point out. how hard it is to re-balance something.  unless something is legit broken everything Kiel is going to do will be in a grey area. and so honestly I would do nothing like Kiel has done. because if i made a balance I just imagine. all threads from then on where "this balance patch broke *this* fix it. or it sucks.

At the same time I do recognize why people are so angry. you can play the character you want. however that doesn't stop people from giving you flak or the fact that the character you want to play, you might like everything but you can't play them for long cause they don't feel good to play. But then that just brings us too the solution even the devs says on occasion. Just use mods. and that for the most part is what your going to have to do and what most have resigned themselves to doing.

 

 

This is all subjective. because playstyle . and people's skill lvl towards the game, unless the character themselves actually start breaking you can see everything as fair game.

However don't worry fellow forumer lurkers and users. this little fur will be your voice :p

Now where is my megaphone?!

 

This is a fair point. Rebalancing is very hard, and coupled with the effects I'm talking about there's no way it helps. Also what some people define as being OP is in fact subjective to an extent. I mean it's not hard to realize Wicker is OP even if you've played the game for 5 minutes.

Anyways if I'm wrong here surely that means there is a unified community effort attempting to put forth their all agreed upon rebalance ideas, which if that's the case I must be blind because every rebalance thread has about 10+ different solutions all from different people and some are good and some are terrible. Then there's that one guy who doesn't want a rebalance and is super vocal about it who promptly starts arguing with everyone else and it devolves into an unprofessional mess.

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Tapirus    1,726
37 minutes ago, Mr.Mulk said:

"Let's keep adding new content onto an already broken foundation and hope the problems go away" is never a good way to develop a game. But hey, that's just my opinion.

I don't think develop a game is easy, because that takes a lot of time and effort. 

Example: Don´t Stave franchise was released in 2013 (6 years ago) and the devs has put a lot of dedication since the beggining.

Also, what do you mean with "hope the problems go away"? They still making updates for DT & DST and helping the users with problems in their accounts. 

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Mr.Mulk    1,163
Spoiler
1 minute ago, Tapirus said:

I don't think develop a game is easy, because that takes a lot of time and effort. 

Don´t Stave franchise was released in 2013 (5 years ago) and the devs has put a lot of dedication since the beggining.

Also, what do you mean with "hope the problems go away"? They still making updates for DT & DST and helping the users with problems in their accounts. 

 

This is a straw man but I'll humor it.

I never said rebalance was easy. In fact I said the exact opposite. That's not the point of suggesting a rebalance, because it's not easy. I never said the devs haven't put in a lot of dedication, in fact I'm friends with a couple of them and have seen the effort they put in. And finally, to your final query what I mean is the common mentality of using new content to cover up issues, which is a tactic used by companies like Bethesda for example. If that new content includes rebalancing mechanics or items cool, but often it's just a band-aid being put on a bullet-hole.

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Tapirus    1,726
11 minutes ago, Mr.Mulk said:
  Reveal hidden contents

 

This is a straw man but I'll humor it.

I never said rebalance was easy. In fact I said the exact opposite. That's not the point of suggesting a rebalance, because it's not easy. I never said the devs haven't put in a lot of dedication, in fact I'm friends with a couple of them and have seen the effort they put in. And finally, to your final query what I mean is the common mentality of using new content to cover up issues, which is a tactic used by companies like Bethesda for example. If that new content includes rebalancing mechanics or items cool, but often it's just a band-aid being put on a bullet-hole.

I understand, but I think the rebalancing stuff is something that developers are studying (maybe having long, internal conversations) and takes more time than we think.

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FreyaMaluk    5,002
4 hours ago, Tapirus said:

Well, some people prefers see NEW content (mobs, items, biomes, etc.), others are fine with the current situation of the characters and some ones just don't care this stuff about Game's balancing.

So, not everybody wish Balance, because have diferent opinions. Not because they're "blinds".

 I feel like people who don't care about character rebalance don't even play many character in the first place or they just play only obe character they like... and that's ok. But I personally like to change characters cuz it adds a fresh experience to the game... but dome characters feel just boring ... even there us not a perfect consensus on all the balance ideas some are pretty consistent. 

Willow and Woodie needs serious rebalance

Winona needs something special. 

If we open this three criteria for a poll... I guarantee you we would have at least 85% approval to these changes... now the specifics on how to rebalance Woodie and Willow are clear too IMO. We have listed this so many times I could almost copy paste it from at least 20 threads.

3 hours ago, Donke60 said:

doesn't that just point out. how hard it is to re-balance something.  unless something is legit broken everything Kiel is going to do will be in a grey area. and so honestly I would do nothing like Kiel has done. because if i made a balance I just imagine. all threads from then on where "this balance patch broke *this* fix it. or it sucks.

At the same time I do recognize why people are so angry. you can play the character you want. however that doesn't stop people from giving you flak or the fact that the character you want to play, you might like everything but you can't play them for long cause they don't feel good to play. But then that just brings us too the solution even the devs says on occasion. Just use mods. and that for the most part is what your going to have to do and what most have resigned themselves to doing.

 

 

This is all subjective. because playstyle . and people's skill lvl towards the game, unless the character themselves actually start breaking you can see everything as fair game.

However don't worry fellow forumer lurkers and users. this little fur will be your voice :p

Now where is my megaphone?!

Many people play in public servers so the "just use mods" considers only that you play with friends or alone... and I can assure that a large fraction of the player base play mostly in public servers.

I agree specifics on character rebalance might be tricky... but there are common ideas like... Woodie should have some natural armor as beaver... Winona feels very vanilla and she should have some cool ability that suits her kinda "handy" personality.... Willow doesn't feel that special cuz her fire queen theme wasn't well translated to DST... (non-existent overheating resistance, lack of substantial fire resistance)

Regardless of playstyle, I'm sure most players would agree on those

Moreover, think about this... it's no coincidence that the most buffed characters in the forge were Woodie and Willow. I don't think people played Woodie and Willow as much in DST as they they played them in the Forge and then forgot about them after the forge was over.

1 hour ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Now the suggestion for a poll I actually like that, it would potentially be a good way to actually get the people who care about the game's opinion in a clean, clear format giving Klei actually competent feedback. So there may be something to that suggestion

Again... I think you aren't  considering that there are many people in other countries who really care about the game but don't know much English... to make a poll fair then Klei should create a format available in all languages,  and they haven't done that for the oficial translation for the game soo...  I don't see that happening. 

For instance, China and Russia have a large DST crowd and only very few representation in the forums, but we cannot simply say other people outside the Anglophone world don't care simply cuz they aren't in the forums. Same with Latin America and Spain... lots of people don't know English well enough but they gather in Facebook and discord groups and care about DST same as u.

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Donke60    3,083
2 hours ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Anyways if I'm wrong here surely that means there is a unified community effort attempting to put forth their all agreed upon rebalance ideas,

There is no unifying force and prolly will not be one ever. how DS balances itself is very freeform and unclear. That's why you get so many ideas for reblancing and suggestions. because with a few exceptions you can take a character in any direction. From giving them minor buffs to building them around an existing mechanic to making entirely new ones. every DS character is an example of one of these designs. winiona. Wig, and WX are about buffs to an extent using their own mechanics to make want they do more powerful or sustainable. Warly.. Webber. Wendy are all built around existing mechanics Cooking or the follower system. and Maxwell. Woodie. and Wickerbottom play around with mechnics entirely unique to them. wolfgang is hard though i couldn't decide to put him with the buff category or the mechanic one, and maxwell when he was made into DST had an entire mechanic rework. so that doesn't shut down the possibility  of changing how a character plays while keeping a few fundamentals the same.

So with all these ways of how to approach a character when trying to "rebalance" them  its hard to have a unified consensus of the character A should be like this Character B should do this. You can make the case that these characters need changes. but how to go about changing them is where most of the problem lies.

 

 

1 hour ago, FreyaMaluk said:

Again... I think you aren't  considering that there are many people in other countries who really care about the game but don't know much English... to make a poll fair then Klei should create a format available in all languages,  and they haven't done that for the oficial translation for the game soo...  I don't see that happening. 

having a universal poll. is very hard if not unrealistic. the best you could do is make a muti-page poll translated into several languages and then spread it like wildfire across platforms. But i believe that is very messy leaves a lot of room for error. and would only be useful for the bare basics of information.

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Petit Citron    93

I wouldn't say some characters need to be reworked only because they're too powerfull or weak. I'd rather say some need to be reworked because they simply lack interest, and by interest I mean something fun, special or enjoyable that makes us actually wanting to play them.

Webber is the right exemple : he's rather weak (still decent at least) compared to others, but he offers a unique playstyle. 

i'm aware DST has never been about perfect balance between characters, but rather a diversity between gameplays, strategies and themes. However some characters are almost blank, like Winona, others are totally unique but way too poor or not manageable enough, like Woodie. 

I still think there's not a lot to be done, and that shoudn't obliterate new game content.

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Mr.Mulk    1,163

Ironically the language barrier only exacerbates the disorganization holding the community back from being able to make a unified effort for rebalances, which I still believe would be necessary if we wanted any semblance of a shot at making an actual difference. If we really want it as a community, as I do believe we do, we'll need to actually coordinate and agree upon exact details. Not totally impossible, but incredibly difficult to pull off.

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Donke60    3,083
20 minutes ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Ironically the language barrier only exacerbates the disorganization holding the community back from being able to make a unified effort for rebalances, which I still believe would be necessary if we wanted any semblance of a shot at making an actual difference. If we really want it as a community, as I do believe we do, we'll need to actually coordinate and agree upon exact details. Not totally impossible, but incredibly difficult to pull off.

but you couldn't I don't think i've seen a game ever appease everyone. when they had a balance patch. your asking thousands of players to unify to actually make a balance patch. which is unrealistic. your asking for us to move as one which is impossible unless we were a hive mind. the correct action, would be if the devs or someone gave us guidelines to how to balance the characters. cause atleast then we would have a basis and it wouldn't be disputable because a dev or someone with the authority gave it too us. We can't be asked to do it ourselves because of how I mentioned there are so many ways to approach the issue,  even if this all happened it all fell into place.. I ask you is it even worth the effort?

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FreyaMaluk    5,002
26 minutes ago, Mr.Mulk said:

Ironically the language barrier only exacerbates the disorganization holding the community back from being able to make a unified effort for rebalances, which I still believe would be necessary if we wanted any semblance of a shot at making an actual difference. If we really want it as a community, as I do believe we do, we'll need to actually coordinate and agree upon exact details. Not totally impossible, but incredibly difficult to pull off.

again there are similar ideas for most rebalance posts, specially concerning Willow, Woodie and Winona..

I've already seen threads integrating polls with the most popular suggestions...

maybe instead of repeating "we are not unified" and dwelling about it ad nauseam, we write an open letter to Klei with a poll with the most suggested character rebalance ideas for the aforementioned characters... I can help translating the questions into Spanish and German.

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