[CONTENT WARNING] I hope Klei can explain what is“Our Chinese community are largely supportive”

[sudoku]

All of this uproar is exactly why Klei made the decision they made.. 

Its not about censorship.. Its about the fact that if you put anything in the game that can trigger these types of discussions, people will continually talk about it and argue about it even though at the end of the day an artist was simply designing a moon themed skin that included a star hat.

There is no bad intention there, and i think most people would understand that.  Klei is making a survival game for entertainment purposes and when an art asset starts sparking these types of discussions it detracts from this. 

 

That said, I think where Joe got into a bit of trouble though is speaking for the chinese community as a whole because, although i am not chinese, i think that it is a sensitive issue for the chinese community to speak on their behalf.

Honestly, the fact that this has gone so far is just sad and considering theyve had discussions in the past about whether or not to keep the forums up, i hope this doesnt reignite those talks.

 

Point blank, as a fan of DST who comes on the forums to read and discuss the game, I want to do just that read and discuss topics about the game and not to see people arguing about religious or political interpretations of in-game art. Its a shame that this issue had to blow up, but the fact that it did cements why they try to avoid/remove these pitfalls.

[Clarence Ho]

as a chinese i don't think i am the one of angry chinese players

the main idea of angry chinese player in tieba.baidu.com think klei should not fear of political correctness and hurt the Chinese buyer, most of them think 70% or higher ratio DST player are chinese and they think klei should respect chinese player more than player from other country.

every country has its own prohibition, jewish may think Star of David as an ominous sign, in chinese is about CCP, they don't dare to violate CCP‘s rule but they don't want klei comply with jewish political correctness, sometimes i think they just want to release their anger, beacuase china has so many economy and political problems

but in my opinion klei change the wigfrid skin is not a good decision, as i think the Star of David is not as known as Flag of Nazi Germany

[firoborn]

28 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

I dont believe that is the real reason sounds like they are deflecting....

Regardless of the reason, it was very badly handled. They should of let the small arguements slide for a day or two and waited until it escalated to jump in. 

Im probably in part to blame for bringing additional attention to the change. My bad Klei, my intention wasnt to excalate it, i wasnt too happy with the religious bias myself tbh but people losing their minds over it is abit too much.

Altho it sounds like for some of the chinese players that this is the straw that broke the camels back. However Klei was right to ban that mod that did p

Religious bias? What religion is being favored here I don't understand what you are trying to argue

[Clarence Ho]

49 minutes ago, -Nick- said:

That's not the reason Klei changed the skin at all. They had stated the reason for the change was not because of offending someone. Thier real reason for the change was:

"to not leave small things people would argue over for no reason"

This meaning to stop people talking about pointless arguments. 

just find this post but the reason why the angry chinese player be so angry is that they want to be angry

[Gashzer]

Just now, firoborn said:

Religious bias? What religion is being favored here I don't understand what you are trying to argue

Because if you remove one thing that may possibly offend people of one religion, you have to remove all things that could offend all other religion too. Otherwise you are being bias towards the first religion which is Judiasm in this case.

For example, you can eat pigs in DST, that is against a major world religion... are they going to remove that? No ofc not. So why change the wigfrid skin?

The reason i argued against the change is to prevent Klei setting a precedent of bowing down to the first person who gets offended and changing stuff in the game, cause speaking selfishly i just dont want my own game effected by other peoples bad ideas. They 100% bowed down in about 5mins to that original topic. 

Anyway debating real life problems is not why i come to the DST forums... 

 

 

[Pet Rock]

6 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

For example, you can eat pigs in DST, that is against a major world religion... are they going to remove that? No ofc not. So why change the wigfrid skin?

If you can choose not to eat pig in real life you can do so in-game.

[Catteflyterpill]

16 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

Because if you remove one thing that may possibly offend people of one religion, you have to remove all things that could offend all other religion too. Otherwise you are being bias towards the first religion which is Judiasm in this case.

For example, you can eat pigs in DST, that is against a major world religion... are they going to remove that? No ofc not. So why change the wigfrid skin?

The reason i argued against the change is to prevent Klei setting a precedent of bowing down to the first person who gets offended and changing stuff in the game, cause speaking selfishly i just dont want my own game effected by other peoples bad ideas. They 100% bowed down in about 5mins to that original topic. 

Anyway debating real life problems is not why i come to the DST forums... 

 

 

Because the issue is about leaving in religious symbolism that can be used to misinterpret Klei's viewpoints? Like you're doing right now. They're not showing religious bias, they're just making a small change to something that went under the radar that they don't want to accidently be representative of something they're not trying to represent. I feel like JoeW made this really clear in his post, you're just being inflammatory. 

[JazzyGames]

1 hour ago, Gashzer said:

For example, you can eat pigs in DST, that is against a major world religion... are they going to remove that? No ofc not. So why change the wigfrid skin?

Us Jews don’t eat pork. Have any of us ever complained about this being in the game? Or is this whole argument a massive straw pig?

Honestly, the explanation for the change has been given over and over and I astounded that so many are still convinced that Klei has some nefarious religious bias.

[Ksha]

3 hours ago, webberer said:
3小时前，webberer说:

Now that Klei have offered you guys refunds, could all of this just end? What else do you need? You know, just complaining all day here is really not gonna solve anything but make others unpleasant? Please, bring your reasonable advice and we all sit down and have a serious discussion for this. What do you think?
既然克蕾答应给你们退款，这一切能结束吗?你还需要什么?你知道吗，整天抱怨真的解决不了任何问题只会让别人不愉快?请把你的合理建议带来，我们都坐下来认真讨论一下。你觉得呢?

I need speakers who make arrogant remarks to pay, I think this is a reasonable suggestion.To offend a group so much in language is incompetent for a company spokesperson

[Antynomity]

4 hours ago, chirsg said:

Unrelated, how do I go about getting a full spool refund for weaving wigfrid's helmet prepatch?

I don't know who to message because it's not something with a dollar value great enough to get another skin, but I'd appreciate getting the full 1350 than getting the mere 450 and being at a loss.

I think you can do that on the transactions page on the rewards points page on your klei account.

[_zwb]

13 minutes ago, JazzyGames said:

Us Jews don’t eat pork.

I think he's referring to Islam but yeah, nobody ever complained about it.

[Gashzer]

1 hour ago, Catteflyterpill said:

Because the issue is about leaving in religious symbolism that can be used to misinterpret Klei's viewpoints? Like you're doing right now. They're not showing religious bias, they're just making a small change to something that went under the radar that they don't want to accidently be representative of something they're not trying to represent. I feel like JoeW made this really clear in his post, you're just being inflammatory. 

 

Klei or us dont get to pick and choose what is offensive or not offensive. You are drawing the line at religious symbolism like thats the only thing that can be determined as offensive. 

Im not saying Klei has some nefarious religious bias. I maintain the best thing they could have done is to not change the skin. Because now they have accidently left themselves open to be misrepresented, the very thing they ironically tried to stop.

Well no matter everyones opinion, the fact is Klei made a terrible PR decision. I preferred the old wigfrid skin but im not gonna refund it cause i am loyal to supporting klei.

Even if they dont make the most intelligent decisions sometimes. 

[Catteflyterpill]

2 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

 

Klei or us dont get to pick and choose what is offensive or not offensive. You are drawing the line at religious symbolism like thats the only thing that can be determined as offensive. 

Im not saying Klei has some nefarious religious bias. I maintain the best thing they could have done is to not change the skin. Because now they have accidently left themselves open to be misrepresented, the very thing they ironically tried to stop.

Well no matter everyones opinion, the fact is Klei made a terrible PR decision. I preferred the old wigfrid skin but im not gonna refund it cause i am loyal to supporting klei.

Even if they dont make the most intelligent decisions sometimes. 

I don't think it's a terrible PR decision. I think most rational people who aren't trying to undermine Klei or are trying to make a mountain out of a molehill, don't really mind the decision or see it as a sign of the end times. I think most people, including myself, are just tired of people making such a big deal out of this on the forums. It's a tiny skin change, and it's really annoying to see this all dragged out. 

[Mike23Ua]

15 minutes ago, Catteflyterpill said:

I don't think it's a terrible PR decision. I think most rational people who aren't trying to undermine Klei or are trying to make a mountain out of a molehill, don't really mind the decision or see it as a sign of the end times. I think most people, including myself, are just tired of people making such a big deal out of this on the forums. It's a tiny skin change, and it's really annoying to see this all dragged out. 

Sure that’s one skin, but there are others that share that same star design.. and one in particular that I’m actually very fond of the way it CURRENTLY looks hint: (it’s part of the Big Top Collection and it looks like a stack of Circus Balls/Wheels with Stars on them)

If you ask my personal Opinion on the Matter Klei should’ve just added an Optional Filter to toggle On/Off possibly sensitive symbols/icons? I mean.. there’s a freaking Teleocator Focus Skin and Goat Head Walking Cane skin that would convince any RELIGIOUS person that those skins encourage Devil Worship & Satanic Rituals.

But is that a logical way of thinking??? Well No- But could it lead to some of my favorite skins getting Edited or Completely pulled from the game? 

ABSOLUTELY and that’s what concerns me the most…

[firoborn]

Also why did the Chinese community start fuming over this? I understand that they didn't like Klei speaking on their behalf but if I am correct they where angry even before that

[Ulisesvolador]

2 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

But is that a logical way of thinking??? Well No- But could it lead to some of my favorite skins getting Edited or Completely pulled from the game? 

ABSOLUTELY and that’s what concerns me the most…

Yes it could, but that won't happen.

[whiteking]

11 minutes ago, firoborn said:

此外，为什么华人社区开始对此感到愤怒？我理解他们不喜欢Klei代表他们说话，但是如果我是正确的，他们甚至在那之前就已经很生气了

For religion, at the beginning, only some people were angry, while others were just unhappy. But when they found that Klei wrongly claimed that Chinese players were very supportive of this matter (I really hope this is a misunderstanding), almost all Chinese players became angry

[firoborn]

I mean CHRISTmas is in the game and nobody has complained about that I don't know how adding or removing religious simbolism changes anything or demonstrates religious bias on kleis side to me it just demonstrates religious bias on some players side if anything 

[JoeW]

14 hours ago, whiteking said:

Chinese players have expressed their opinions here, and Klei claims that they cannot represent Chinese players. They have staff in the Chinese community to understand their opinions, and Chinese players "strongly support Klei". Perhaps this was true ten days ago, but now, Chinese players are very angry

Last night, I updated my post to say the following

On 6/27/2023 at 3:19 PM, JoeW said:

And - please know that the messages above are not representative of our Chinese player community at all. We have inhouse staff that monitor and run our Chinese social media and do translation as well. We're aware of how the community feels. Our Chinese community are largely supportive and awesome.
UPDATE: The note about players in China was strictly speaking about most players in China are not inappropriate as shown in the posts above. I apologize for any confusion. https://t.bilibili.com/812140971197202435?spm_id_from=444.41.0.0 

The intention of the statement was to make people aware that the links that I posted were not representative of the players in China. Because those posts were highly inappropriate I wanted to make sure it was said that they do not represent Chinese players.

I did not want players to read what I had written at the top of that post and believe that what I had meant was that Chinese players were to blame for the changes and were not to blame because of the inappropriate posts. "Our Chinese community are largely supportive and awesome." Was meant to be about the community itself, not the decision. 

I don't want this to sound like I am blaming it all on a miscommunication of understanding, I should have worded that better to begin with. 

My intention was not and is never to say that any one group of people feels about a decision we have made.

Furthermore my statement "We're aware of how the community feels." was meant only to acknowledge that we are reading the feedback. It was not intended to say that we know everything that everybody feels about everything in China. 

At the time that I wrote that post, I was unaware of the posting in Tieba and was only speaking of our own official social media.

I apologize for the miscommunication. I will work with our team to make sure something else is posted in this regard and ensure we keep better informed
going forward. 

An additional post can be found here: https://t.bilibili.com/812434802797969417?spm_id_from=444.41.0.0

[Maxposting]

2 minutes ago, firoborn said:

CHRISTmas

Winter's feast is supposed to be an ambigious winter holiday though?

[Hupo]

9 minutes ago, JoeW said:

Teiba

Tieba in fact.

[Clarence Ho]

9 minutes ago, firoborn said:

Also why did the Chinese community start fuming over this? I understand that they didn't like Klei speaking on their behalf but if I am correct they where angry even before that

How to make Chinese people angry about one thing

1. gather some evidence related or unrelated

2. with some inductive words

3. post it on the internet

when they see this post they get pissed off. anger can be for no reason

https://tieba.baidu.com/p/8478732748?pid=147938963770&cid=147947228195#147947228195

this post is the first post i see in tieba DST part related this wigfrid skin change event, titled f**k you, money back, are you sorry for us! with the clip of joew's response to [Game Update] - 562556 then they taged this with religous bias and arrogant to chinese player, all of them get pissed off, the words on the clip are translated by browser but they may ignored it

language and the GFW can block most of chinese and their minds, some of tieba DST member note that what they are angry for? but they just release their emotion and the men who post it delete that post by him/herself. neither chinese and player from other country can stop it

[JoeW]

5 minutes ago, Hupo said:

Tieba in fact.

Thanks. 

[firoborn]

14 minutes ago, Maxposting said:

Winter's feast is supposed to be an ambigious winter holiday though?

I see it as Christmas on a trenchcoat 

[Dragonboooorn]

China mods and Wigfrid helm skin is cool and epic, but can we have Warbucks back now? 

There is characters such as WX, Wendy and Maxwell who have clearly grim themes, some might even say, inappropriate things in their backgrouns, quotes and what not.

It is sad to know that some  characters are treated "special", while other are just removed from existence. I liked played Warbucks, and enjoyed his "explorer of the New World from 15－18 centuary" vibe. 

I honestly didnt get chance to see his "racist" quotes or whatev people were talking about, but you guys added this quote in a first place and could delete or replacr it, and everyone will be happy in the end. Instead you deleted him and play pretend like Warbucks never existed.

I cant understand how can someone hate and be offended by a video game character.