Should Meatballs, Pierogi and other recipes be nerfed?

[AllFunNGamez]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

I watch you stream sometimes and you are a very nice down to earth person. I like that you always try to engage with everyone.  

But seriously, make 10 or so beehives and just watch the money roll in like its nobodies business. I plat the 6 flowers around every hive, catching butterflies isn't that hard anyways. They regenerate honey so fast! All sumer and early autumn they are packed in a single day.

My man, do yourself a favor, please. Build those money makers!

I gotta just rip off that bandaid and stop making meatballs all together I feel like that is the only way to prevent it from happening. I have a friend who wants me to purely play Warly to learn my lesson lol

[HowlVoid]

43 minutes ago, AllFunNGamez said:

I gotta just rip off that bandaid and stop making meatballs all together I feel like that is the only way to prevent it from happening. I have a friend who wants me to purely play Warly to learn my lesson lol

Lol maybe dont go that far haha.

So I just did this at my base so you can see my setup. Even thought its messy, I get stuck and try to conserve my torch for some reason haha. Still in a few seconds I collect about 9 meatballs worth of hunger. For one person its enough.

You can make more for more people. I forgot to show my fridge but I have 80 honey there that's going to waste. My hives are full again after 1-2 days autumn-summer and about 4-5 days in spring. So I never bother to make more hives. Because of the very high spoilage rate you can collect enough to last all winter beforehand. 

Honey is op. All it takes is a few seconds of harvest time. Please klei don't nerf.

Its basically haxx. Good luck!

 

[1moregame]

On 4/29/2021 at 12:11 PM, AllFunNGamez said:

have actually played DST for over 4000 hours but I am being honest when I say this I still rely on Meatballs and only give other recipes a chance when I have to. I do not play a lot of longer games of DST I prefer short round bursts of boss fighting and map regeneration for specific reasons. 

I think a lot of people missed this point of yours. You aren’t playing for long haul scenarios where setting up complex pig/bunny farms, potato farms or even beehives would make any sense at all. I can see how in this situation meatballs would become the default as you can make them from the items you accumulate by simply playing. 

[HowlVoid]

4 minutes ago, 1moregame said:

I think a lot of people missed this point of yours. You aren’t playing for long haul scenarios where setting up complex pig/bunny farms, potato farms or even beehives would make any sense at all. I can see how in this situation meatballs would become the default as you can make them from the items you accumulate by simply playing. 

But there is nothing complex about what I showed? You dont need the scale mail. Also, its pretty hard for me to imagine someone not going out of their way to collect ice (need pick), collect berries (need to fertilize plant), and collect monster meat (only monster meat I get is from hounds). 

This is a one time setup that completely frees you up to do anything you want. Don't spend time collecting food is all I am saying. 

Also playing for the long hual the whole point of the game? To see how long you can survive? I made that set up in like 5 days. 

[AllFunNGamez]

8 minutes ago, 1moregame said:

I think a lot of people missed this point of yours. You aren’t playing for long haul scenarios where setting up complex pig/bunny farms, potato farms or even beehives would make any sense at all. I can see how in this situation meatballs would become the default as you can make them from the items you accumulate by simply playing. 

Yeah I am not playing long drawn out Megabasing I prefer the shorter times spent in DST to practice and fight bosses quick and challenge myself. If I were to megabase I feel it would be easier access to everything but even still it might still feel like Meatballs are at arms reach. 

[1moregame]

1 hour ago, HowlVoid said:

Also playing for the long hual the whole point of the game? To see how long you can survive?

That is how you and I might play, but that isn't how I have often seen Travis playing.  It is scenario based setups and boss fights as he said.  5 days is 40 minutes of real time...if you are only playing a world for a handful of hours total, then this wouldn't actually provide as much payoff and would be potentially boring for his viewers as he sets it up.  

[Echsrick]

i know how to nerf meatballs lets make everyone become warly that way they dont only use meatballs

[AllFunNGamez]

2 hours ago, Dr.Medic said:

i know how to nerf meatballs lets make everyone become warly that way they dont only use meatballs

Webber with a Warly Mask

[Cheggf]

3 hours ago, Dr.Medic said:

i know how to nerf meatballs lets make everyone become warly that way they dont only use meatballs

Warly is one of two character where meatballs is actually a good recipe.

14 hours ago, 1moregame said:

I think a lot of people missed this point of yours. You aren’t playing for long haul scenarios where setting up complex pig/bunny farms, potato farms or even beehives would make any sense at all. I can see how in this situation meatballs would become the default as you can make them from the items you accumulate by simply playing. 

You do not get ice by "simply playing", you have to explicitly go out of your way for it. If you're going out of your way to get food there's way better options than meatballs, and even more since the RWYS update made farming not only viable but very powerful.

[clickrush]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

Warly is one of two character where meatballs is actually a good recipe.

You do not get ice by "simply playing", you have to explicitly go out of your way for it. If you're going out of your way to get food there's way better options than meatballs, and even more since the RWYS update made farming not only viable but very powerful.

For hunger recipes that are not meatballs specifically I think one needs to access farming as you said, which has become more powerful but also requires more setup, planning and energy. Or big meat, which requires specific base locations or setup. Or fishing which is I didn’t do enough in this version, but I think it might be the most powerful option.

[Cheggf]

1 minute ago, clickrush said:

For hunger recipes that are not meatballs specifically I think one needs to access farming as you said, which has become more powerful but also requires more setup, planning and energy. Or big meat, which requires specific base locations or setup. Or fishing which is I didn’t do enough in this version, but I think it might be the most powerful option.

I do not believe that RWYS or big meat farming takes more effort than ice farming. Instead of walking around the map with a pickaxe for ice, you could walk around the map with a hammer for pig skin. Then you're securing both large meat and pig skin, and in a permanent way instead of an ephemeral way that takes 3.63 daily ice per player. A stack would disappear in only 11 days from just a single player.

[LinknAllie]

No

[Ellilea]

On 4/29/2021 at 8:16 PM, Nettalie said:

Meatballs barely pay out hunger-wise, Pierogi still require 2 to 3 meats to even get the eggs most of the time and idk what other recipes your'e referring to, but a lot of recipes are really really good besides the things people usually default to. Plus, farming can net you a ridiculous amount of foods for various purposes already, so I don't think meatballs and pierogi are all that problematic personally.

What? You throw in the most garbage meat you can find (monster meat works), combine with it literally random other food, and you get meatballs. Never need to hunt, never need to farm, never need to try. I really dislike that recipe, always have, and always eagerly used mods that nerf it. And if they nerf raw berry hunger as well, great. Might have to actually think about food every now and then.

[Cheggf]

13 minutes ago, Ellilea said:

What? You throw in the most garbage meat you can find (monster meat works), combine with it literally random other food, and you get meatballs. Never need to hunt, never need to farm, never need to try. I really dislike that recipe, always have, and always eagerly used mods that nerf it. And if they nerf raw berry hunger as well, great. Might have to actually think about food every now and then.

How do you get monster meat & other food if you never hunt, farm, or try?

[clickrush]

1 hour ago, Cheggf said:

I do not believe that RWYS or big meat farming takes more effort than ice farming. Instead of walking around the map with a pickaxe for ice, you could walk around the map with a hammer for pig skin. Then you're securing both large meat and pig skin, and in a permanent way instead of an ephemeral way that takes 3.63 daily ice per player. A stack would disappear in only 11 days from just a single player.

I would say it’s probably more efficient to collect meat from a close source. Both beefalo and pighouses can be moved with very little effort. Maybe a day or two? Or just camp nearby them or volt goats.

Ice is just very time efficient as well, in a day you collect several stacks or you can split it in smaller chunks.

in any case I agree. Meatballs has a role as an early to midgame food until you pput in the small setup effort to make better stuff.

[Nettalie]

22 hours ago, Ellilea said:

What? You throw in the most garbage meat you can find (monster meat works), combine with it literally random other food, and you get meatballs. Never need to hunt, never need to farm, never need to try. I really dislike that recipe, always have, and always eagerly used mods that nerf it. And if they nerf raw berry hunger as well, great. Might have to actually think about food every now and then.

Well okay then let's crunch a few numbers.

Meatballs restore 62.5 Hunger, 5 Sanity and 3 Health.
Monster meat on its own restores 18.75 hunger and takes 20 Health and 15 Sanity, Berries restore 9.375 hunger, multiplied by 3 that makes 28.125 Hunger.
This results in a net hunger profit of 15.625 Hunger, 20 Sanity and 23 Health overall.
All in all, simple, makes Monster meat beneficial and not too shabby.

But now compare this to farming something like potatoes, which takes a tiny bit more effort for crops which can make almost any other food source unneeded.
One of the better ones would be the Potato for 25 hunger and 20 Health per cooked potato, which is not much on its own, but when considering the sheer mass scale you can farm them at, as well as how deceptively easy it is to grow large potatoes, which yield about 2.5 times the usual amount you'd farm, they can very very easily be considered better in this case.

All it takes for a giant potato is one guano per potato (which can be provided by excess seeds from farming or bypassed entirely by using a crop such as tomato, which provides the needed nutrients), watering maybe once or twice per growth stage (not necessary if it rains), tending to it once per growth stage (not necessary if you have a fruit fly and really easy to do on a large scale with instruments such as a one man band or beefalo horn), not having any weeds around (which cant happen if the turf is occupied entirely) and having at least 4 within a tile's radius of each other.
If everything is done right this can easily result in pretty much an entire year's worth of food with what is really not that much effort once you do go for it. Really the only downside to this is you have to start out growing random seeds which can grow into weeds, but that's overall not a large issue since you still benefit from "unwanted" crops in the time it takes to get the crops you want.
And speaking of crops, this was just a single example of many crops at your disposal that can provide anything from hunger to health and sanity with pretty much the same amount of effort.

Meanwhile getting meatballs requires you to actually go out and grab meat (most of the time monster meat, can be obtained from hounds or spiders) and filler (which can be ice, but berries are usually used just as much if not more since they grow in more than a single season). This has to be done periodically though since 62.5 hunger is not even a full day's worth of hunger and the ingredients do not stay fresh that long.
This cycle of grabbing meat, collecting filler, cooking takes a considerable amount of time overall, as although these actions are not all too time consuming on their own, this time will definitely add up due to how frequently they will need to be repeated.
That then results in spending just as much time, if not more, just to deal with hunger.

That's not to say meatballs are bad, just that there's definitely better ways of obtaining food in the game already and getting food was never even a big issue in the first place. If anything by only using meatballs, people rob themselves of better and more engaging options for food, despite there being said options.

[TheDoughboy1917]

I'm going to echo other people in this thread and say I don't want these dishes nerfed, but I'd like to see weaker dishes get some kind of buff.

[Mike23Ua]

Despite the name of the game being don’t starve... starving actually is probably your least likely method of dying.

the odds of being struck by a meteorite field and killed while at low health are higher then actual starvation happening.

However I believe that’s a good thing as well- the “challenge” of Dont Starve should come from having to fight mobs, explore the environment etc... 

For example when you play as Wigfrid her meat only diet has you happily slaughtering otherwise cute Catcoons for vital meats survival. 
 

So I purpose the question: Is it the recipes you hate??? Or is it how Easy it is to obtain them that needs to be nerf’d?

Meaty Stew is way more OP than Meatballs, and Meaty Stew is easy to mass produce by simply building you a few pig houses in/near your base so you can kill your meats and survive forever.

The health food pierogi would be 100x harder to obtain if the only way to get Eggs was by chasing down and gathering eggs from enemy mobs WITH them (Tallbirds, Snakes from SW etc..) 

Instead- we can pretty much just capture a bird and feed it for endless supply of egg.

Its not the food recipes that need changing.. it’s the Method of which we obtain said food that could use an overhaul.

[Azamagon]

Well...

 

[AllFunNGamez]

If we all think about it we had it super easy with how fast wickerbottom could grow 500 million crops of wormwoods. Klei turned around and said okay hold on a second here lets prevent this its too over powered. 

They also then made it so you needed to do a bit of work in order for seeds and farming to payout. I think if we are going down this road for making Don't Starve Together a bit harder instead of allowing for endless food supply we will eventually see certain numbers changing for our recipes. 

I do understand that meatballs are not the main problem here it was just an idea I had obviously it was overshadowed by people thinking that I have no idea how to make or manage other recipes. The truth is I never saw any reason to care about them that was why I suggested season recipes in order for a balance and promotion of trying different foods throughout the years. 

It would make you do new recipes and hopefully avoid your simple recipes for example me mass eating meatballs. Not that we need a restriction on this but I really do think it would make you experiment more and brand out on your cookbook more.

Like I said though I do understand why my idea was wrong just still think it has a bit of possibility to it.

[1bubbainpa]

11 minutes ago, AllFunNGamez said:

If we all think about it we had it super easy with how fast wickerbottom could grow 500 million crops of wormwoods. Klei turned around and said okay hold on a second here lets prevent this its too over powered. 

Ah yes, the good old days of slave labor.

Problem was that you had to recycle so many crops to the bird in an attempt to get even get a sizeable amount of food from future harvests. Plus you basically need wormwood planting an entire screenful of crops.

It was funny, but best we move on from that planting strategy.

[Cheggf]

15 minutes ago, AllFunNGamez said:

If we all think about it we had it super easy with how fast wickerbottom could grow 500 million crops of wormwoods. Klei turned around and said okay hold on a second here lets prevent this its too over powered. 

They also then made it so you needed to do a bit of work in order for seeds and farming to payout. I think if we are going down this road for making Don't Starve Together a bit harder instead of allowing for endless food supply we will eventually see certain numbers changing for our recipes. 

I do understand that meatballs are not the main problem here it was just an idea I had obviously it was overshadowed by people thinking that I have no idea how to make or manage other recipes. The truth is I never saw any reason to care about them that was why I suggested season recipes in order for a balance and promotion of trying different foods throughout the years. 

It would make you do new recipes and hopefully avoid your simple recipes for example me mass eating meatballs. Not that we need a restriction on this but I really do think it would make you experiment more and brand out on your cookbook more.

Like I said though I do understand why my idea was wrong just still think it has a bit of possibility to it.

RWYS is a million times stronger than Wickerbottom + Wormwood ever hoped to be. For the same amount of time Wormwood can, by himself without also wasting someone else's time, now give 1 crop instead of 0.33 crops, or if he invests a bit more time he can get 2.75 crops. Wickerbottom similarly is a lot better of a farmer now since farming is actually worth doing so her book can be very useful in getting the farm started. Wormwood's wild crops were a bad meme before RWYS and if you invested all that effort into any other food source it would give far more food.

1 hour ago, Azamagon said:

Well...

 

37.5 hunger meatballs so literally every single recipe for it deletes a bunch of hunger except for 3 ice which barely gives any. Why not just remove meatballs entirely at that point?

[Masked Koopa]

5 hours ago, Cheggf said:

RWYS is a million times stronger than Wickerbottom + Wormwood ever hoped to be. For the same amount of time Wormwood can, by himself without also wasting someone else's time, now give 1 crop instead of 0.33 crops, or if he invests a bit more time he can get 2.75 crops. Wickerbottom similarly is a lot better of a farmer now since farming is actually worth doing so her book can be very useful in getting the farm started. Wormwood's wild crops were a bad meme before RWYS and if you invested all that effort into any other food source it would give far more food.

37.5 hunger meatballs so literally every single recipe for it deletes a bunch of hunger except for 3 ice which barely gives any. Why not just remove meatballs entirely at that point?

You could make the same argument regarding fistfull of jam, where the main utility is to be able to use meat as filler by turning it into eggs, so arguably the reverse to benefit wigfrid, I would suppose?

Personally I think instead of nerfing meatballs, doing something about ice being a full filler would be a better idea. Either making it classify as inedible like nightmare fuel/twigs/bone shards or setting a cap on how many you can use as filler would make it less silly in terms of how well it synergizes with monster meat, but also make it more reasonable to then let the player access ice in other ways, making recipes that require ice a little more accessible. Like perhaps being able to freeze and then mine ponds using an ice staff.  

I think it's fine to like the way things are RN, but in my opinion ice lies in a bit of a tricky situation in that while it is needed for some neat recipes and a pretty important summer item (assuming you don't go to caves, which many players do not), it is also a rather powerful filler for how accessible it is and must therefore be quite limited by season. I understand being able to use 1 or even 2 ice, but 3 ice being equal to any other filler just seems a little off to me.

[Azamagon]

16 hours ago, Cheggf said:

37.5 hunger meatballs so literally every single recipe for it deletes a bunch of hunger except for 3 ice which barely gives any. Why not just remove meatballs entirely at that point?

The main thought of this nerf was to make it a "noob trap", siilar to Ratatouille and Fist Full of Jam, and only making it effective if using Ice (same as the other two recipes).

But, considering the thoughts and ideas shared in this thread, that's probably way too harsh. So I'd probably just change it to not accept more than 1 Ice instead. I actually indirectly nerfed it in one of my earlier iterations where I suggested a meat recipe called "Cold Cuts", which needed 0,5 Meat and 1 Ice (which would become the first temperature-lowering meat dish, btw).

[Cheggf]

1 minute ago, Azamagon said:

The main thought of this nerf was to make it a "noob trap", siilar to Ratatouille and Fist Full of Jam, and only making it effective if using Ice (same as the other two recipes).

It already is a noob trap like ratatouille and fist full of jam, and it already is only effective if you're using ice. Nearly every single way you can make meatballs will not give any stats, take stats away, or give such a small amount that it's not worth waiting for it to cook in the crock pot.

2 minutes ago, Azamagon said:

But, considering the thoughts and ideas shared in this thread, that's probably way too harsh. So I'd probably just change it to not accept more than 1 Ice instead. I actually indirectly nerfed it in one of my earlier iterations where I suggested a meat recipe called "Cold Cuts", which needed 0,5 Meat and 1 Ice (which would become the first temperature-lowering meat dish, btw).

Other than Warly, Wigfrid, and people who don't know how to use the crock pot, meatballs already aren't made very much because it spoils fast, doesn't give much hunger, and barely gives any health. And why do you even hate ice so much? Kelp is a much better filler, which you would still be able to use with this weird nerf.

That weird nerf would do nothing to people who know how to use the crock pot and just make everyone who doesn't slightly more wasteful. Or they'll just keep making wet goop over and over again and not understand.