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dearmad

Sad but true, the new disease system has caused me to quit playing...

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blash365    590
16 hours ago, 0xFADE said:

I've got people running around sick.  The real sad part about it is I don't really care.  Before if you started getting infected you had to make a change.  That immunity started dropping you needed to drop everything and make sure that dupe didn't get sick or they would be out of commission or at worst dead.

We still have not met severe deseases.

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Gus Smedstad    351
2 hours ago, Junksteel said:

The feeling of wasting of time is devastating.

I don't feel like I'm wasting time. Dupes are doing plenty of useful things in the contaminated areas. They just have to wear space suits while doing it.

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DaveSatx    103
20 hours ago, dearmad said:

With the new disease system I find I don't want to bother playing the game anymore. I'm not asking for change, or ranting, just sharing how it's made me feel. I'm not saying it's too hard, or too whatever, it's just the feel of the little microcosm has changed into something I no longer enjoy.

I don't enjoy having always at least 1-2 dupes Ill, and no way to prevent that that isn't gamey- or cheese tactic. It's trivially easy to do in a cheese way, but... meh. I don't connect and care about the little dupes in the same way I did.

Also I used to fear slimelung (for example). And build carefully to control for it and keep my habitat healthy. Now? Who cares...

So I've found I put the game aside and moved on, which makes me sad. It took me awhile to isolate why I had left the game, and finally I figured it out when I just cold stopped in my current game when one dupe got poisoning and another slime lung and all it meant to me was some coughing and work slow down... (or go take a pill) I think it's the work slowdown that is just annoying. It's not like an actual interesting crisis, it's just... bleh, boring and pointless imo.  It doesn't interestingly involve me... oh here's a pill, now go on your way. I used to have dupes have to take CARE of a seriously sick friend, and it was connecting me to the tale of the colony...

I wasn't totally happy with the previous disease system, don't get me wrong- but the heart of this new system isn't for me.

How you feel is important, to you and others who feel like you.  I don't agree with the reasons you give but that is irrelevant.  Medicine was totally irrelevant before - 100%  I could go 600 cycles without needing a medbay if that.   now you need one, you need to plan ahead and you NEED things like coal and balm lillies to keep your dupes working efficiently.  to me it gives more depth to a very very very useless and boring mechanic.  is it perfect? hell no.  we need more info/responses to the whole 'got exposed/is infected' trope. lol

I've enjoyed every change they've made so far and accept the game for what it is, the developers intent.  if its not for you anymore - i wish you happiness in an other game. I don't understand the modern need to whinge about how we feel in an ineffective way (not aimed at OP btw) and am glad you spoke up - too many don't do more than rage-quit and maybe troll post :)

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Gus Smedstad    351
2 hours ago, DaveSatx said:

I could go 600 cycles without needing a medbay if that.   now you need one

You don't, really. Not if you're careful about preventing infection in the first place. Or if you just ignore disease, since the penalties are pretty minor.

As for "needing" to make cures, it's really the reverse. In the current system, you can let Dupes suffer with slimelung and it's not important. In the old system, it was truly debilitating and ignoring it led to death. A med bay used to be a sensible precaution, now it's largely unimportant.

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Mullematsch    205

I had a giant problem with food poisoning and kept having to make a lot of medicine and micro it until I stored all my food in chlorine. There were a bunch of germs on it which in the past was not an issue. That fixed it for me: 

image.thumb.png.136bc17975aafe50a8237c441ce82615.png

More pictures: 

Spoiler

 

image.thumb.png.96ecdbd9bfabad4d227377f62e183e47.png

image.thumb.png.c7656a89e74c4cfe3441accb5179b83f.png

image.thumb.png.1c3569f763b7d7b8a23bf95bb37421d8.png

image.thumb.png.79e358abb6eac1f63edb89cd25d525da.png

 

 

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argh223    13

I made a similar post in the 'suggestions and feedback' section. Totally agree. I started a new playthrough for QOL3, and I ended up leaving the game after < 50 cycles. Don't know if I can drag myself back.

For a game that encouraged planning ahead, calculation, eg:

  • Food production vs consumption (will I take on more dupes? Can I feed them sustainably?)
  • Resource production or availability vs consumption (how much water and dirt do I have for mush bars? can I migrate to mushrooms?)
  • Heat output and capacity (better not build that power plant close to the base without insulation. It'll heat-death the farm tiles)
  • Disease: (That slime biome is terribly infested with germs. I'll have to be careful and watch the germ count on my dupes, and have a medbay just in case)
  • Resource conservation: (If I want that biome and it's (critters, plants, whatever) to survive, I'll need to make sure I insulate the abyssalite again after breaching in)

Why did they take a step backwards, I wonder?

Disease is now just a persistent annoyance. Not lethal, nor a calculable factor. Mae, that has been working for days in the polluted area with billions of germs in it, she's fine. Leira, she breathed in 1000 germs as she walked through a stray pocket. Guess who got sick? (makes absolutely no sense). I wonder why there is even still a germ counter.

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Doddler    52
8 minutes ago, argh223 said:

Not lethal, nor a calculable factor.

How is it not a calculable factor? It's incredibly consistent. Was there more than 500-1000 germs on the food they ate? 22% chance they get sick. Did a dupe breath air with slimelung? 12% chance they get sick. You can see the chance they get sick right on the character after they're exposed. The game even goes well out of it's way to ensure these percentages are consistently applied so as to prevent surprises, so if 9 dupes get exposed to slimelung (each 12% chance, a total of 108%), only one of them will get sick, every time. You can't predict who, but it'll be one of the exposed dupes. If and when they get sick, you can suck it up and work at reduced efficiency, you can treat them, or you can work to prevent germ exposure.

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avc15    358

I mean, to the people who say, just ignore illnesses now. Minor illness causes a dupe to lose a lot of productivity for a few cycles. They can't complete long distance errands because of the breath debuff (which will also cause a sick dupe to use way more oxygen if sent outside the start area). When they remain in base they hardly get anything done.

At least for the minor illnesses, there's a reason to keep a stock of pills on hand, and also to keep your base meticulously clean early on.

Everything takes a little while to get used to. This new system isn't bad it just needs time.

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Ellilea    698

I might be alone here, but I quite liked the previous immunity-based system. It was very clear and allowed for calculated actions. Not a fan of the RNG % of falling sick regardless of exposure.

What I wouldn't mind is some germs being stronger than others (causing faster immunity drop/guaranteed infection).

But yes, first and foremost, I agree with those who say that some diseases should pose a serious threat and not just a slowdown and annoyance.

There was nothing like the realization that slimelung got into the base and the immunities are dropping. Organizing quarantines, purging the base, healing the dupes that needed healing before time ran out, making sure the caretakers were okay/had someone to get them back up by the time they also succumbed to the thing. It was a state of emergency threatening the deaths of many of my beloved dupes. And when they all lived and the base was clean it felt good. Like an accomplishment, disaster averted, lesson learned, all that good stuff that makes games so bloody addictive :)

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Gus Smedstad    351
22 minutes ago, Ellilea said:

I might be alone here, but I quite liked the previous immunity-based system. It was very clear and allowed for calculated actions. Not a fan of the RNG % of falling sick regardless of exposure.

I think almost everyone preferred the immune system. The issues were mostly in implementation. In particular, the old immune system was so resilient that food poisoning was pretty much nonexistent. You could be ridiculously sloppy and Dupes would just absorb the e coli they were consuming with their food. I would have preferred that they keep the immune system as it was, but lower the thresholds so that consuming a few thousand germs was dangerous, rather than requiring 100 thousand or more before there was an impact.

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goboking    1,524
1 hour ago, Ellilea said:

I might be alone here

You're not.  I agree with every word of your post.

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Duplo52    24

I liked the old system. I cared for my dupes if they got Slimelung. Yes Food poisoning and Hypothermia(or Hyperthermia I cant remember) were rather under tuned but at least Slimelung had a place. I think a combination of it being deadly still and allowing for slow care or meds would be a nice balance. It could bring back a reason to care for dupes health. Personally I am well over a few hundred cycles and have yet to build anything medical unlike before. Could I to save time and be productive? Maybe. Do I care to though? Not really.

Is there any way to test just how much time is wasted coughing etc vs farming the lillies and making the meds and doing the doctoring stuff to cure said illness?

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Khullag    120

i also couldn't force myself to play more than 100 cycles (and usually for me it's the time when all the fun starts), because of disease system in QOL3. old system was good and i was really careful with slimelung. now i just do not care.

i had sterile base but somehow like 1000 germs slipped into my base while i was building oxygen room and voila - after few cycles 1 dupe is running and coughing with slimelung germs, few cycles more - 3 dupes, few more - all of them. and it's all from small packets of infected air (compare 1k germs to 1kk germs on slime cell). and it was really frustrating to watch how this RNG-based crap is taking over my base. so i just ignored diseases completely and i didn't feel to my surprise any penalty for that which is ridiculous on its own.

and i was playing ignoring sick dupes, but eventually perfectionist inside of me said that he had enough of this uncontrollable crap...and i stopped playing ONI :(( which is my favourite game and i have like 900 hours in it. i'm just waiting now for release patch with new stuff...

PS: i would rather have brutally punishing diseases (like slimelung before QOL3 if you do not treat it - as result you lose your duplicant), than insignificant random-based poopylung

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5 hours ago, Ellilea said:

I might be alone here, but I quite liked the previous immunity-based system. It was very clear and allowed for calculated actions. Not a fan of the RNG % of falling sick regardless of exposure.

There was nothing like the realization that slimelung got into the base and the immunities are dropping. ... And when they all lived and the base was clean it felt good. Like an accomplishment, disaster averted, lesson learned, all that good stuff that makes games so bloody addictive :)

Nope, you're not alone. As many others have said, I too enjoyed the immunity system, but feel it should've been a little harsher for things like Food Poisoning. Slimelung felt suitably dangerous (slow death by suffocation if untreated. Basically pneumonia), but, as Gus mentioned below:

4 hours ago, Gus Smedstad said:

I think almost everyone preferred the immune system. The issues were mostly in implementation. In particular, the old immune system was so resilient that food poisoning was pretty much nonexistent. You could be ridiculously sloppy and Dupes would just absorb the e coli they were consuming with their food.

I didn't have to do a darned thing for Food Poisoning. Never had them wash hands before cooking (didn't they read the 'all employees must wash hands before returning to work' sign in the bathrooms!?) and didn't care if the germs got into the fresh water source. No one got it, so I didn't bother to pay attention to it. I, too, would like to see the old immunity system back and tweaked so:

A) Food Poisoning is actually a problem. It still isn't with the new medicine system, it just costs me some resources in tablets and boop, they're fine again. (Though it did at least finally make me install a sink into the kitchen.)
B) Different diseases take down immunity faster than others. This gives things like Zombie Spores more chances to instill the fear they deserve. Gives certain diseases the added sense of danger to go with their severity. (Seriously, though, I have a block of CO2 with over ONE MILLION Zombie Spore germs in it. wtf?)
C) The more germs a dupe is exposed to the faster the immunity can drop. (No more, oop! Walked through a tile of 100 germs! Guess who's gonna be in your clinic tomorrow!? This gal!)
D) Exposure to multiple illnesses means you can get more than one at a time and they all do damage to your immunity.

As a person who has had pneumonia, food poisoning, and ear infections ALL AT THE SAME TIME (dear lord, WHY!?), this is very much a thing in real life and, dear merciful dupe creators, do you wanna avoid that. Perhaps it would be a little too much for the game, but I feel like it would add a decent sense of complexity in that, "Okay, this dupe got exposed to slimelung today. I will want to keep them working either in the swamp biome or in the base. I don't want to risk exposing them to (insert new disease from one of the three new biomes) and getting them double infected." Means breaking your work force into various teams so no one dupe, or team, is exposed to multiple illnesses at a time. (Unless you wanna play risky and be a dare devil like that.)

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renkousami    0

I vastly prefer the new system. It provides an actual use for medical equipment. While no longer lethal, the loss in productivity is large enough to merit your attention.

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Sasza22    2,103
1 hour ago, renkousami said:

I vastly prefer the new system. It provides an actual use for medical equipment. While no longer lethal, the loss in productivity is large enough to merit your attention.

The thing is a lot of us enjoyed the crisis that might have happened. Playing on the edge of the chair, knowing a mistake in handling the slimelung can cause the colony to collapse and dupes to die. Now we just get a minor annoyance if we ignore it.

The best thing Klei could do is add more severe and lethal diseases that need to be played around in the new biomes placed farther from the start so that we can get the minor diseases as a sort of tutorial and that we got tools to handle them when they come.

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