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Asteroid Destruction: Intended?


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So the top layer of the map is almost completely gone now. Heat is slowly creeping through into the 2nd layer of biomes. All the Abyssallite layers are stripped out. I'm having to waste all my time making steel and cutting off heat spread into my base. Is this what it's supposed to look like by Cycle 850? Bear in mind, i spent several hours fixing the first biome i found which died even though it was under the prefab... This was back in Cycle 300 and it was already wrecked.

oni-asteroid-heat-death.png

I can't seriously be expected to build a Steel shell over the entire asteroid by... a rough estimate... of cycle 500?

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Well, it what is you do now. Rush steel production, and protect surface. There is enough fossil in oil biome to double cover surface from side to side.

I did it by cycle 500. 2 biome totaly destroyed, 3 partilly. But on a plus side i had a lot of cooked dirt, and a lot of readily available steam for my rocket.

And purely for protection bunker tiles a cheaper, then doors.

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Was this map generated prior to Space Industry? They patched a few things, including regolith influx, biome destruction from impacts, and the Gravitas Facility is immune.

I've breached the surface after cycle 200 (took my sweet time doing things right) and everything on the surface is still -60C in most places, with only a superficial layer of hot regolith. My Gravitas Facility has some piled up regolith, but nothing significant, and several shove voles are alive.

I remember prior to the patch during the preview, my save file looked much like yours after cycle 300, but I started a new game a few days before SU released, and have had zero trouble with surface punctures or excessive regolith. Yet.

Edit: here's a screencap of cycle 200.

111111.thumb.png.6aa23103c2f4bcbcf4b7d432f4617919.png

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Fossils? I've just been using egg shells, Pacu mostly. It seems a bit extreme to require this when there's so much more to juggle without impending doom above us.

Yeah i started this colony on the main branch a few days before the patch hit. It was destroying through the Gravitas Facility until i went high enough to render it in. As soon as i could see the tiles, the meteors stopped raining on that area.

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2 minutes ago, Xuhybrid said:

Fossils? I've just been using egg shells, Pacu mostly. It seems a bit extreme to require this when there's so much more to juggle without impending doom above us.

Yeah i started this colony on the main branch a few days before the patch hit. It was destroying through the Gravitas Facility until i went high enough to render it in. As soon as i could see the tiles, the meteors stopped raining on that area.

One block of fossil is 300kg, which is 150kg when dug. 100kg of fossil crushes into 5kg of lime, which is as much as 2.5 pacu hatchings. Even what's superficially available in the oil biome is enough to get a good start on a shield. If you want to ranch for eggshells, use shine bugs, as they breed the same speed, but are FAR easier to ranch. Phosphorite is much more plentiful and renewable than algae.

From the Cosmic upgrade and onward, until very recently, players were put on a death timer, as meteors would very quickly core out the asteroid through several layers, as well as insane amounts of regolith. The only real way to deal with this was to rush to the surface and immediately construct the shield.

I'm not sure why your world is still getting cored out, as meteors shouldn't be doing that much damage in the latest version.

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That still doesn't seem like much Lime but better than waiting for eggs. I heard Pacu eggs have the most mass so i'm assuming Shinebugs are at least close? You're right that they're easier to ranch, especially early.

I'm wondering if the first 300 or so cycles in the old version is what caused the issue. Once i updated, the damage was probably done?

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27 minutes ago, Xuhybrid said:

That still doesn't seem like much Lime but better than waiting for eggs. I heard Pacu eggs have the most mass so i'm assuming Shinebugs are at least close? You're right that they're easier to ranch, especially early.

I'm wondering if the first 300 or so cycles in the old version is what caused the issue. Once i updated, the damage was probably done?

Shinebug eggs are 1/10th the mass of hatch eggs and 1/20th the mass of pacu eggs. 

You need a lot of shinebugs.  But they do breed fast.

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26 minutes ago, Xuhybrid said:

That still doesn't seem like much Lime but better than waiting for eggs. I heard Pacu eggs have the most mass so i'm assuming Shinebugs are at least close? You're right that they're easier to ranch, especially early.

I'm wondering if the first 300 or so cycles in the old version is what caused the issue. Once i updated, the damage was probably done?

Not like much lime? It's a LOT.

I just spent a minute in debug excavating all the fossil available out of curiosity, and in my map there was about 63.7 tons of fossil, which is enough for 3185kg of lime, which is sufficient for 318 bunker tiles. That's enough for a complete bunker shield, with some left over.

2 minutes ago, Soulwind said:

Shinebug eggs are 1/10th the mass of hatch eggs and 1/20th the mass of pacu eggs. 

You need a lot of shinebugs.  But they do breed fast.

They're 1/10 the mass, but they still produce 1kg of eggshell per egg. Pacus produce 2kg. I haven't used ranching as a primary source of lime, but I know a lot of people say it's way easier and faster than pacus, which are a nightmare to keep alive once algae is depleted.

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12 minutes ago, crypticorb said:

Not like much lime? It's a LOT.

I just spent a minute in debug excavating all the fossil available out of curiosity, and in my map there was about 63.7 tons of fossil, which is enough for 3185kg of lime, which is sufficient for 318 bunker tiles. That's enough for a complete bunker shield, with some left over.

They're 1/10 the mass, but they still produce 1kg of eggshell per egg. Pacus produce 2kg. I haven't used ranching as a primary source of lime, but I know a lot of people say it's way easier and faster than pacus, which are a nightmare to keep alive once algae is depleted.

As far as i know domesticated pacu don't die out if left alone without food. They still maintain population. So you feed them to desired numbers, then treat them like wild ones. Problem with pacu it's to maintain water temperature because, gulp/tropical pacu can die if hot/cold enough.

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1 minute ago, Fischer_L said:

As far as i know domesticated pacu don't die out if left alone without food. They still maintain population. So you feed them to desired numbers, then treat them like wild ones. Problem with pacu it's to maintain water temperature because, gulp/tropical pacu can die if hot/cold enough.

I'll have to test that theory about pacus maintaining population, I was sure that all domesticated critters will halt all reproduction if starving.

As for the temperature part, it's easier than you think. The cold fish can survive water as hot as 25C, and the tropical fish can survive in water as cold as 5C, which is a pretty large range. Normal pacus have a huge livable range, and have a 2% chance to drop variants eggs. Keeping water static temperature isn't all that hard with insulated tiles.

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1 hour ago, crypticorb said:

Not like much lime? It's a LOT.

I just spent a minute in debug excavating all the fossil available out of curiosity, and in my map there was about 63.7 tons of fossil, which is enough for 3185kg of lime, which is sufficient for 318 bunker tiles. That's enough for a complete bunker shield, with some left over.

They're 1/10 the mass, but they still produce 1kg of eggshell per egg. Pacus produce 2kg. I haven't used ranching as a primary source of lime, but I know a lot of people say it's way easier and faster than pacus, which are a nightmare to keep alive once algae is depleted.

Well the numbers you mentioned (200Kg of Fossil per Steel) and the amount of Fossil i saw just didn't seem like a lot if 1 tile is 150Kg. I admit though that i haven't scanned more than two screens of the oil biome.

57 minutes ago, crypticorb said:

I'll have to test that theory about pacus maintaining population, I was sure that all domesticated critters will halt all reproduction if starving.

As for the temperature part, it's easier than you think. The cold fish can survive water as hot as 25C, and the tropical fish can survive in water as cold as 5C, which is a pretty large range. Normal pacus have a huge livable range, and have a 2% chance to drop variants eggs. Keeping water static temperature isn't all that hard with insulated tiles.

Yeah i can confirm this. I bred up some to get their numbers up and then stopped feeding. They were "Overcrowded" but still laid 1 egg at about 80% of their life. So pretty much like a wild Pacu.

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2 hours ago, Xuhybrid said:

Is this what it's supposed to look like by Cycle 850?

No, it doesn't. We did many report since Cosmic Upgrade and Klei changed the damage done by the meteor by 50% with the last version and fix the regolith accumulation. So now, it should be better, I didn't try a new game with the latest version of Space Industry.

I guess your save it's from Rocketry Upgrade or before, so it's "normal" that your surface has been destroyed.

About the steel, you can make enough steel (64 tons for 32 doors) at cycle 300 if you focus on it. Fossils are a great help and hatchs can refined really quickly the iron you need.

About, your surface don't worry, I had the same problem in Cosmic Upgrade and I manage to restore it and continue to cycle 2500. Mostly now it's pretty easy to pump the hot steam and use it for your rocket.

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26 minutes ago, yoakenashi said:

Did someone say shield?!:

I’m waiting until we can build one of these for our asteroid home :D

 

I second that!

 

Seriously, a new mean to get steel has also been implemented in Space Industry, for when all fossils are gone and the Rainforests burned down:

The two Satellites I spotted have 33% and 35% Steel and are only 30k km away. Meaning ultimately that one/I can turn 2700kg Petroleum+2700kg Oxygen into 700kg Steel plus "waste" (1400kg Glass&Copper as well as any CO2 I do not like to keep from the launch&return) or 2700kg+2700kg Oxygen Hydrogen into 1050t (plus waste), every 10 cycles.

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31 minutes ago, SakuraKoi said:

I second that!

 

Seriously, a new mean to get steel has also been implemented in Space Industry, for when all fossils are gone and the Rainforests burned down:

The two Satellites I spotted have 33% and 35% Steel and are only 30k km away. Meaning ultimately that one/I can turn 2700kg Petroleum+2700kg Oxygen into 700kg Steel plus "waste" (1400kg Glass&Copper as well as any CO2 I do not like to keep from the launch&return) or 2700kg+2700kg Oxygen Hydrogen into 1050t (plus waste), every 10 cycles.

What consumes the glass and copper in a launch?

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ONI is a game about trial and error and you get more efficient while planning more ahead in subsequent runs. Getting wrecked by meteors is nothing unusual if you don't grasp their impact yet. In my current base I covered the entire surface with bunker doors in the mid 200's, while having dug out about 1/3 of the fossil at most. Granted I played this game a lot and I already knew that I wanted to protect the surface ASAP and how to do it. I also played with 24 dupes which really helps to speed up the midgame. Often beginners will get frustrated with early/midgame failures and reduce the number of dupes they accept to a small number like 8 to 12 or so. I did that too until I realized how slow the game progresses as soon as you enter the mid game if you have only few dupes.

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I have 75 duplicants at about 300 cycles, and I have 4 steel tiles built. I play this game a lot too and also know what to expect, I just get distracted easily - ooo look a geyser!
 
Meteor destruction, even when it was more severe, is never the end of world. It can dealt with in many ways, but all of them require a little patience. Focus is not needed - now I’m going to go back to breeding squeaky pufts and ignoring the surface :p
 
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On 10/22/2018 at 6:09 PM, Xuhybrid said:

I can't seriously be expected to build a Steel shell over the entire asteroid by... a rough estimate... of cycle 500?

You are  seriously expected to do so. Does not need to be finished by cycle 500, you can also put a temporary shell in place and keep repairing it. You can also put steel or several layers of rock tiles over the most critical spots on the surface for a while. You are also expected to be in the oil-biome by then, in order to mine the fossils you need for that steel-shell.

On 10/22/2018 at 11:45 PM, clickrush said:

 I also played with 24 dupes which really helps to speed up the midgame. Often beginners will get frustrated with early/midgame failures and reduce the number of dupes they accept to a small number like 8 to 12 or so. I did that too until I realized how slow the game progresses as soon as you enter the mid game if you have only few dupes.

12 dupes is about the maximum you can feed with sleet wheat from natural growth. It is not a problem to get a shield in place in time with 12 dupes though. My rule-of-thumb is to explore the surface and in the oil-biome (for fossils) no later than cycle 300. With the reduced meteor-damage we have now, cycle 500 may be enough. You can also patch breaches or weakened areas temporary with other than steel tiles.

But yes, this is a "catastrophe" game, were you are hit with one crisis or another with little warning for a long time. The meteors are just one of them.

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3 hours ago, Gurgel said:

You are  seriously expected to do so. Does not need to be finished by cycle 500, you can also put a temporary shell in place and keep repairing it. You can also put steel or several layers of rock tiles over the most critical spots on the surface for a while. You are also expected to be in the oil-biome by then, in order to mine the fossils you need for that steel-shell.

12 dupes is about the maximum you can feed with sleet wheat from natural growth. It is not a problem to get a shield in place in time with 12 dupes though. My rule-of-thumb is to explore the surface and in the oil-biome (for fossils) no later than cycle 300. With the reduced meteor-damage we have now, cycle 500 may be enough. You can also patch breaches or weakened areas temporary with other than steel tiles.

Bu yes, this is a "catastrophe" game, were you are hit with one crisis or another with little warning for a long time. The meteors are just one of them.

Yes you do fine with 12 dupes. My goto number was 12 and then 16 for quite a while now. Before occupational it was even lower at 6-8 (both stress and food were a non-issue then and there was much less duplicant interaction needed). I'am not saying it isn't viable, just that it is slower. You can keep your dupes stress free even after the exosuit engineer training with just mushrooms and transition to stable sleet wheat and berry farms later on when you have the time and ressources to do so. My current number is 24 and the progression was just much smoother once I got past the early game. My next base will probably have 32 dupes if I can figure out how to optimise the game's performance better towards the late game.

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3 hours ago, clickrush said:

Yes you do fine with 12 dupes. My goto number was 12 and then 16 for quite a while now. Before occupational it was even lower at 6-8 (both stress and food were a non-issue then and there was much less duplicant interaction needed). I'am not saying it isn't viable, just that it is slower. You can keep your dupes stress free even after the exosuit engineer training with just mushrooms and transition to stable sleet wheat and berry farms later on when you have the time and ressources to do so. My current number is 24 and the progression was just much smoother once I got past the early game. My next base will probably have 32 dupes if I can figure out how to optimise the game's performance better towards the late game.

True. Maybe I just stick with 12 because I reload forever before finding a dupe I like when I print the next one. And yes, game performance is much better with lower numbers of dupes. But 24 or 36 dupes would probably be something I should indeed try.

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Thanks for the feedback by the way. I started over and headed into the top around Cycle 125-150 and managed to get Steel started for the weakest parts by about 175. Eventually felt safe around 275 and capped off the last piece at around cycle 350. Stuck with 6 dupes all of the way.

One thing i will say on reflection though, is that once you're done with the early game survival of food, water and heat, the mid game is a mad rush for Steel and only Steel. It just takes so much time compared to all the other things. I had to forego anything interesting besides capping a steam vent, in order to complete the shield. If i hadn't learnt about fossils i have no idea how i'd have managed it lol.

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