Permadeath in Don't Starve Together announced as OPTIONAL

[jbeetle]

When you guys think of permadeath, it's more like "permadeath, but nevermind"

[Snob]

Should there be Permadeath in Don't Starve Together?

 

Answered, now lock the thread please. There's no more to discuss.

[J20hawkz]

Should there be Permadeath in Don't Starve Together?

 

Answered, now lock the thread please. There's no more to discuss.

Wrong. There are plenty things to discuss. Once I find out more information I'll edit the OP.

I guarantee someone will make a new thread on permadeath once this is R.I.P asking or discussing identical things to what we have already discussed. Don't know about you, but I don't have the energy to repeat myself again

[Snob]

Wrong. There are plenty things to discuss. Once I find out more information I'll edit the OP.

I guarantee someone will make a new thread on permadeath once this is R.I.P asking or discussing identical things to what we have already discussed. Don't know about you, but I don't have the energy to repeat myself again

And so my personal mission to lock this thread has begun.

 

If someone DOES make another thread about the same topic, just lock the thread and direct them to the stickied post. Simple as that.

 

EDIT: Make the new OP redeemable and I'll think about it.

[J20hawkz]

Hmm...I was going to do that anyway

Ok seems appropriate. I'm actually running out of things to say.

BUT

There are still a few months left till release and I doubt Klei have set anything in stone yet. So until Don't Starve Together is officially out I don't see the problem with leaving this thread open so others can discuss.

It goes without saying. Have nothing to say don't post. But obviously let others share their thoughts.

I'll decide on the right time to lock these threads. Or if I hear anything from Klei.

[J20hawkz]

Edited the OP to reflect what has been announced.

With Permadeath being an option, I personally feel there is no need to have any new/alternate ways of reviving. The mechanics we have in place for Don't Starve is more than enough.

Anyone new/wants to play casually in Don't Starve can set permadeath to off and enjoy playing with friends without the risk of losing your entire game.

For those who enjoy the tense nature of Don't Starve with permadeath are you satisfied with how it will work and the risk it will run if you die and can't come back to the same world you worked so hard to build with your friends? Are you happy to let them carry on playing in that world while you wait? Are you happy to start a new game with other friends? Will you be happy to start a new game if a friend you wanted to play with died and can't come back?

Please share your thoughts.

[mitboy]

I will set permadeath to on, play with friend, kill him (without PvP you can use something like spiderhat) and grab my new base.

[J20hawkz]

I will set permadeath to on, play with friend, kill him (without PvP you can use something like spiderhat) and grab my new base.

But aren't you stealing your own base? Technically.

[mitboy]

But aren't you stealing your own base? Technically.

Now it ONLY mine

[Doctor H. Derp]

For those who enjoy the tense nature of Don't Starve with permadeath are you satisfied with how it will work and the risk it will run if you die and can't come back to the same world you worked so hard to build with your friends?

 

Sure, but then again how often do I die anyway?

Only thing I'd worry about killing me, really, is PvP, and if we're all doing PvP with permadeath on, how long is that world going to last in all honesty?

 

Are you happy to let then carry on playing in that world while you wait?

 

There's always other games to play. Hell, I could just play SP DS until they're finished.

 

Are you happy to start a new game with other friends? Will you be happy to start a new game if a friend you wanted to play with died and can't come back?

 

Usually I just restart a world once I survive long enough to the point I feel bored. I've restarted countless worlds. What's one more on top of the pile?

[Zandorum]

For Perma-death I think that a player should go into a Spectator mode where your a ghost and you can fly around instead of being banned or something along of those lines, you do not affect anything but if a player doesn't want you around they can wack you once and you respawn at a random spot. This would also introduce the possibility of some way of other players ressurecting a player and make a possibility that you'd need the person near by to resurrect them.

 

Now obviously if a player while in Spectator mode was being annoying you'd kick/ban them but I feel this would be a good alternative as well as a potentially fun gameplay feature.

[TheUltimateGinj]

Here are my ideas:

http://forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/37693-resurection/

[BeastNips]

New to the forums, my first post! 

 

From what I can tell, the vast majority want perma-death in some form, while also there are significant numbers that don't want it. While an optional perma-death functions seems the easy comprise, it doesn't really address the issue. 

 

I'd like to put forward some thoughts on the issue.

 

The Problem With Perma-Death Being Optional

While getting the most number of votes, this seems to be less popular in the comments, possibly suggesting many players didn't want any of the three options, but preferred optional perma-death over the other two- best of a bad situation. The issue for players like me is that we like having a death penalty, a real death penalty, but we can't see ourselves playing very much when we have to restart every time someone dies. On the other hand, if we remove perma-death we won't play for very long either, as it's just too easy and removes the thrill of don't starve. A perma-death on/off option would be a loser either way, I would assume or hope many players would agree. 

 

 

Resurrection

I think it's fair to say many believe there should be some way to resurrect a player. This seems reasonable since death-proofing is available in singe player, the mechanics just need to be tweaked. I would suggest Meat Effigies and Touchstones should be activated then bound to the player that activated them, as having multiple uses may unbalance the game, and effectively be no perma-death. The fairness of this may or may not remain applicable depending on how multiplayer is balanced. [Important] A Meat Effigy or Touchstone would be rebound if a new player touches it after the initial player, switching the death-protection to the new player. 

 

What happens when you die?

While the ghost ideas have been utterly destroyed (to say it lightly), I don't believe they aren't without some merit. The problems with this are boredom, due to both the length of time it may take to resurrect, and/or the limited functionality with the world; a further problem is that a ghost may explore the world unhindered.

 

I propose when a player dies they become a ghost. The ghost will:

• Be immune to physical damage.
• Be unable to interact with the world.
• Be unable to venture beyond discovered terrain (corresponding to living players maps)
• Emit light equivalent of a low-burning campfire.
• Reduce sanity of nearby players within the light radius.
• Will not starve or go insane.
• Can be resurrected by various items. 

 

The ghost player becomes a scout, capable of keeping tabs on the already explored environment. This removes the insta-win of ghosts exploring the world, yet leaves something for the player to do (check on the size of spider farms, tree growth etc). 

 

Returning to Life.

If a ghost activates a Resurrection item - a Meat Effigy, Touchstone or amulet on the floor - the ghost will be returned to life as if they had died and had been resurrected. This removes the need for a new resurrection item.

 

Exploring is Boring!

Yes, you're right. But frankly... Don't get killed, eh? Death is a punishment, so be punished. However this shouldn't always be the case. This idea would be a mid-cost item that would allow ghosts to gain corporeal form within a limited radius. Probably a structure would be most suitable. This would allow a radius (maybe as large as a full-burning camp fire) in which the ghost gains physical form and can interact with the world) This item would cost less than the Meat Effigy, but still be hard to come by. This would allow the ghost to tend the farm and do general base type things, alleviating the boredom slightly. If the ghost leaves the radius it become incorporeal again. Ghosts can not damage anything.

 

Summary

I feel the changes would address many of the concerns players have:

1. If you die without death-proofing then you're dead (or a ghost), but players can now use death proofing retrospectively, providing one player remains alive. 
2. Death carries a significant penalty, but it doesn't require a restart. (unless everyone dies)
3. If all players become ghosts, the game ends.
4. Ghost will have something to do by default (scouting explored areas), and more to do if the living players put in some work (corporeal-form-generator). However this play-ability is limited, giving a real penalty to death. 
5. Ghosts will not assist players in combat.
6. Resurrection uses standard items/structures instead of adding new things.
7. A optional perma-death on/off function (standard restart with no items when set to off) for players that don't wish for death at all. However if perma-death is enabled it is possible to resurrect players. Hardcore perma-death would be possible too with no resurrection options. 

 

Additional Note

It would be nice if the ghost form was similar to insanity, in the sense that it's a negative thing, but yields advantages (nightmare fuel etc). It would be interesting if some multiplayer-unique item required a player in ghost form to get, therefore being an additional thing players must do at some point. However this would not stay true to keeping singleplayer as an equal experience. 

 

Hope you like my thoughts everyone.

[Clock]

Alright i got an idea, if you die you leave a body, you come back as a ghost nothing will see you, this includeds Players, NPCS, etc, Players Can revive you by Using 5 Night mare fuel, And 1 Heart Stone/

[LightningYu]

Would it be a MMO, then there should be Permdeath always on - but since it`s not, there should be Optional. It makes me kinda Angry, how people want to force to other their will. Each Player should have the opportunity to decide himself, how he want to experienced that Game with his Friends...

 

[Dudedude]

I think that it'd be a good idea to have to resurrect a player... sort of like in Mario Brothers games where if you lose all of your lives your buddy has to grab 100 coins to give you an extra life. While a player's dead, however, they can spectate the other player until revived, possibly by meat, or maybe a craftable. The world wouldn't fully be over until all players perished. Sort of a best of both world kind of idea.

[J20hawkz]

I think that it'd be a good idea to have to resurrect a player... sort of like in Mario Brothers games where if you lose all of your lives your buddy has to grab 100 coins to give you an extra life. While a player's dead, however, they can spectate the other player until revived, possibly by meat, or maybe a craftable. The world wouldn't fully be over until all players perished. Sort of a best of both world kind of idea.

The spectate idea has been quite popular. I wonder if Klei will consider it.

[SilverBone]

Im sorry if this was already suggested, but what of there is something a player can do to revive them? Of course to keep it a bit harder there would be a 50% chance that the player that had died IS fully dead and can't be revived unless given a Life Amulet (if that's what it's called, I haven't played DS in a long time). If the dead player isn't fully dead (._. ), then you do a revive on them, but it'd cost like 100 sanity, 50 hunger, and 50 health. Or maybe if lightning strikes where the players corpse is it could revive them, OR by having the surviving player place a lightning rod right over the dead player, and once lightning strikes it slowly revives the player. For the dead player, you could possibly be able to control the "soul" of the character which cannot die, can't harm anything, can't be seen by another player, and anywhere it had explored on the map doesn't actually "count" so you can't just do easy exploring. Or we can do something more bland like: "No perma death" - "Settings for perma death" - "Perma death so you have to sit there watching a player"

[J20hawkz]

Im sorry if this was already suggested, but what of there is something a player can do to revive them? Of course to keep it a bit harder there would be a 50% chance that the player that had died IS fully dead and can't be revived unless given a Life Amulet (if that's what it's called, I haven't played DS in a long time). If the dead player isn't fully dead (._. ), then you do a revive on them, but it'd cost like 100 sanity, 50 hunger, and 50 health. Or maybe if lightning strikes where the players corpse is it could revive them, OR by having the surviving player place a lightning rod right over the dead player, and once lightning strikes it slowly revives the player. For the dead player, you could possibly be able to control the "soul" of the character which cannot die, can't harm anything, can't be seen by another player, and anywhere it had explored on the map doesn't actually "count" so you can't just do easy exploring. Or we can do something more bland like: "No perma death" - "Settings for perma death" - "Perma death so you have to sit there watching a player"

Well I've been playing Terraria online and with that you have the options to allow permadeath or die and lose coins and stuff (haven't played it for too long). I guess Don't Starve would probably do the same. You die (no way of reviving) and probably lose all your gear as a severe form of "punishment".

[Hawx541]

Awww, 1 view off of 9001...

[the truthseeker]

like DST itself, permadeath should be optional whether the players agree to use it or not, including revival options if allowed in DST (like in the single-player game.) Those who want the hardcore/ironman options can then be satisfied and others who want more lenient/easier learning curve time to play can choose that for their game. 

[Hogweed]

Clearly most people want the option. I had tried this game at a friends once, and would not buy it because I dont have a lot of time to play, and having to keep restarting was just much too repetitious for me. This game has a goal, and having to play it over and over God knows how many times times to get to the end is ridiculous. Especially if you have taken so much time to create multiple bases, explore caves, getting everything perfect, then WHAM! Its all gone??? Talk about loss of motivation to want to go through all of that again, knowing it can happen again and again.

 

 Regardless of the Devs idea and what they want this game to be, many people will not touch it because they dont want all their work and effort to be just deleted, I think that is terrible, and I think a lot of people who have been gamers for a long time would agree. If the people want it and its not there, Kleie is not going to sell them the game.

 

  When you consider that 99% of the games out there allow you to return and finish the game, I think most people need that assurance before committing themselves to playing. I know I do, I only bought the game after learning there were mods that keep you from having your game files deleted on death. I was not aware of the methods of getting around it, or I might have bought it sooner. I think if other very popular games had this same mechanic, they would not have been very popular!!

 

 But the fact remains, the vast majority of gamers have expectations about a game, and having your game files deleted is not one them.

 

Please offer the option!

 

[XirmiX]

Hmm... The "benefits" and drawbacks have been discussed, so here is my suggestion to this:

If you were in a permadeath world, may be then a new world would generate for you. While it would supposedly be hosted still by your friends (if your friend is the host), you would have moved on/passed away quite literally... To the next world. Without dying via teleportato you could move on to the next world with whatever in your inventory you have while if you have no reviving materials to rez you automatically (meat effigy, life giving amulet at the time of your death or touchstone. Telltale heart would not work for this) you'd move on to the next world but as if it was a fresh start. If say you then died again and cannot rez, but the world you were just in has none else there, then the third world would be where players from the first world would go to when going through teleportato and the second world would be wiped out of existance as there would be no more players around and it would be a drag to move on to that and then again to the third world. Any thoughts on mechanics like this to be implemented?

[Pyromailmann]

Gah! The necro of a thread over a year old.

Seriously, guys, this is irrelevant now.

[Scrimbles]

Yeah great, just casualize the game a whole bunch.

 

I'm sure the game won't get COMPLETELY old for new players within a month or two.

Edit: Ah boy the necro. Ma bad.

 

Edit2: I already know a couple people who got casual mods and got bored of Don't Starve within a week. I warned them, but they didn't listen.