If Klei keeps up their current pace with skill tree releases, it will have taken them 3.6 years to complete them all

[sudoku]

Why after 4 years of waiting for character refreshes to finally be completed did we decide to essentially repeat the same endless cycle and resource drain yet again? 

Klei is completely scatterbrained when it comes to content design. They start things and don't finish them. They make big plans and then put them on pause to work on other parts of the game. I mean its great that they have decided to slow down their release schedule but like can we please just focus on a single thing at a time? 

Don't get me wrong the new content they showed off on stream looks cool, but like I feel like I'm a parent yelling at klei to finish their math homework before they begin on their book report, and thats not even mentioning the incomplete spanish and art homework sitting on the same desk.

Edited March 3 by sudoku

[Milordo]

Well said, but it's their signature since original Don't Starve. They are not balanced in every shape or form and are bad at balance itself. They always went straight on adding and adding and adding content (although I admired them a lot to be still creative even after 10 years, it's amazing). The "new" videogame marketing that they approached on 2019, only emphasized this problem. It's their only weakness ever since and always has been....

And that's why I still love and support them <3

[-Variant]

I'm not particularly enjoying the skill tree/rework purgatory either but I really don't think calling them "scatterbrained" is going to be all that beneficial. 

One of my biggest fears with skill trees was the fact that they'd eventually have some that missed the mark and would need their own updates to be reworked.
I.E Skill tree reworks. It seems we've hit that mark.
I'll take what I can get out of it, though. But I think I would've preferred not needing to go through the cycle in the first place, ideally.

[BezKa]

It's not too late to drop the trees With only a few it will take way less work to integrate some of the needed skills into characters that have them, and just do tweaks to characters that need them than realizing it was a mistake after all characters get a tree that will need removing

(I am deluding myself. Someone send help)

[sudoku]

18 minutes ago, -Variant said:

I'm not particularly enjoying the skill tree/rework purgatory either but I really don't think calling them "scatterbrained" is going to be all that beneficial. 

I dont mean it as an insult - just an observation that their updates are all over the place.

Its hard to get excited about something new when youre still waiting on the other things you were promised - and it just makes the wait all the more exhausting.   

[Swiyss]

I just think that skill trees need more development time IF they plan to make it vey good. That is why they came back to some things and adjusted them along the way. Which is already a good thing they did.

Still I understand where you come from. However insulting them like that won't help.

We have to just be more active when these skill trees come out and try to give as much feedback as possible, so they can see it and hopefully make it even better than it is.

Like the current willow affinity spells being fixed, that should've been fixed in the beta, but there was too many things to focus on at once.

Their intention is great, so just be patience I guess.

[sudoku]

16 minutes ago, Swiyss said:

However insulting them like that won't help.

Why are people making out like scatterbrained is this huge insult? I myself can get a little scatterbrained if I'm trying to do too many things at once. Its about as much of an insult as calling an angry person mad. 

Yet posts insinuating the devs are spitting on our faces by not making a skilltree close enough to your liking is totally fine and not insulting in any way?

20 hours ago, Swiyss said:

Klei need to adress this after this arc ends. And learn to never release unfinished updates ever again and simply "move on". They're spitting on our faces with the Wilson skillset thing.

I dont mean to start drama but like, come on.

Edited March 4 by sudoku

[Swiyss]

Just now, sudoku said:

Why are people making out like scatterbrained is this huge insult? I myself can get a little scatterbrained if I'm trying to do too many things at once. Its about as much of an insult as calling an angry person mad. 

Yet posts insinuating the devs are spitting on our faces by not making a skilltree close enough to your liking is totally fine and not insulting in any way?

 

Spitting on our faces is like denying the feedback from the majority. We clearly saw that happening because I made a poll, and almost everyone agreed that wilson need another touch up, but klei said they won't, which is kinda spitting on our faces in a sense.

That is not an insult, that is trying to show how people feel about the feature itself. And that it needs some touches.

Dude, just don't think too much of it. I could understand your ideas and where you came from. I know that expressing things that way made you say things exactly how they were thought, but like.. we gotta atleast say "not trying to be rude for the sake of it, but x, y and z are really bad and you guys need to do this without being too much that" 

Even if it feels like an insult, still they will understand your intention, which is far better than filtering ALL your feedback just because you said an oopsie.

And this is not "drama", this is a normal conversation. Some people don't like to argue and it is ok. Just don't act like we're trying to hurt you as a person.

I liked your post, agreed with you and even filtered the "Insults" because I understand your main point. Don't worry still, you did nothing wrong.

I am not an english native speaker too, so I'm still learning about what is an insult and what is not. Personally I don't care about them, but I think we gotta maybe be vigilante about ourselves. Atleast that's what they wrote in the community guidelines, "just don't be a jerk".

[ZeRoboButler]

I was not aware there was such discourse over Wilson of all things, I do have to wonder what people actually want from Wilson if changes were to happen.

(side note the "spitting on our faces" bit seems a touch over the top)

I highly doubt that Wilson will actually never be touched up again, but he is definitely on the back burner since he serves his purpose of..."curious man attempts science, curiosity gets the best of him", kinda just seemed like a way of personifying a new player in the form of a character. (with a minor obsession with puns...)

in regards to update focus, yeah it is a bit odd, but since im not a member of dev team or aware of their creative process there isn't much to talk about other than what is seen at face. Stuff seems to be working out for them, I only wish the content could come out faster. 

[Mike23Ua]

Actually…

Wolfgang, Woodie, Wormwood, Willow, Wigfrid & Wilson have all been given skill trees.

Klei states in the roadmap that each of the 4 upcoming QoLs will feature 1-2 new skill tree refreshes.

Soooo If we only got 1 skill tree per these 4 QoLs, that’s 4 skill trees down, if we got TWO per QoL.. that’s the entire character roster ain’t it? 

Edited March 4 by Mike23Ua

[. . .]

2 hours ago, sudoku said:

Why are people making out like scatterbrained is this huge insult?

It's 2024 literally half of all words that exist are insults didn't y'know? 
As the famous saying goes... "Sticks and stones can break my bones, but your words hurt me even more."

Edited March 4 by . . .

[Baark0]

Skill trees are a neat concept but I definitely agree that they were a mistake, simply due to the fact that we just finished up all the character refreshes (technically havent due to Wilson not getting one) and that skill trees are going to take time away from adding new content to the game. Would've preferred to see characters get minor updates (like Wortox) rather than what is essentially character refreshes 2.0.

[Szczuku]

7 hours ago, -Variant said:

One of my biggest fears with skill trees was the fact that they'd eventually have some that missed the mark and would need their own updates to be reworked.
I.E Skill tree reworks. It seems we've hit that mark.

Did I understood you correctly; you are glad that so far Klei is making skill trees that are good enough because you were worried that they'd eventually have to redo them?

But aren't we seeing like their 3rd take on Wormwood's skills and a second for Willow's? Not to mention that at the current rate we might face the same issue we had with the reworks: the earlier reworks/skill trees being way weaker than the ones made at the end

Not to fearmonger but I'd say that you've yet to see if the skill trees work out

I'd say that they won't, on account that almost every update after a skilltree update the devs have to put aside some effort in order to touch-up a skill tree.

So not only are they throwing the game's balance and feeling of accomplishment out the window but they are also bloating the devs schedule and need to be revisited

[Habakkuk]

11 hours ago, Baark0 said:

Skill trees are a neat concept but I definitely agree that they were a mistake, simply due to the fact that we just finished up all the character refreshes (technically havent due to Wilson not getting one) and that skill trees are going to take time away from adding new content to the game. Would've preferred to see characters get minor updates (like Wortox) rather than what is essentially character refreshes 2.0.

 

15 hours ago, -Variant said:

I'm not particularly enjoying the skill tree/rework purgatory either but I really don't think calling them "scatterbrained" is going to be all that beneficial. 

One of my biggest fears with skill trees was the fact that they'd eventually have some that missed the mark and would need their own updates to be reworked.
I.E Skill tree reworks. It seems we've hit that mark.
I'll take what I can get out of it, though. But I think I would've preferred not needing to go through the cycle in the first place, ideally.

I was against all reworks, but would accept some small changes in character like Winona, Willlow and Wortox. When the reworks ended I and my friends were very excited thinking that something big like a new DLC or a giant update was coming. We all were saddened for the skill trees, we wanted new adventures not a new cicle of reworks that now looks like a rework infinity loop that we don't know when it will end.

And how the skill trees work is the worst part, RPG like mechanics that are nothing like DST that is a very original game. Why bring it from RPGs when the original is better? 

Edited March 4 by Habakkuk

[Cheggf]

Agree with everything 100%.

7 hours ago, sudoku said:

Why are people making out like scatterbrained is this huge insult? I myself can get a little scatterbrained if I'm trying to do too many things at once. Its about as much of an insult as calling an angry person mad.

People just like being defensive of Klei or something, idk. The idea of it being an insult literally did not even cross my mind until reading the comments complaining about it being an insult. I just thought it was an adjective, I've never seen anyone use scatterbrained as an insult before.

[gamehun20]

2 hours ago, Cheggf said:

use scatterbrained as an insult before.

Even if it was used as an insult it's one of the most tame ones

[Jakepeng99]

 

21 hours ago, sudoku said:

Why after 4 years of waiting for character refreshes to finally be completed did we decide to essentially repeat the same endless cycle and resource drain yet again? 

Klei is completely scatterbrained when it comes to content design. They start things and don't finish them. They make big plans and then put them on pause to work on other parts of the game. I mean its great that they have decided to slow down their release schedule but like can we please just focus on a single thing at a time? 

Don't get me wrong the new content they showed off on stream looks cool, but like I feel like I'm a parent yelling at klei to finish their math homework before they begin on their book report, and thats not even mentioning the incomplete spanish and art homework sitting on the same desk.

This is what your post makes me think of lol.

The riff content assignment is upcoming too.

[mkemal23]

17 hours ago, Baark0 said:

Would've preferred to see characters get minor updates (like Wortox) rather than what is essentially character refreshes 2.0.

Yeah. They were nailing it with the minor updates tbh. If only they continued doing the same thing for other characters(Winona etc.) And made some additional Qol updates I personally would have been much happier.

But flashy abilities sells more, I guess.

Edited March 4 by mkemal23
Grammar

[HowlVoid]

It's almost like they didn't already explicitly explain why they're doing this.

To retain more players, it's their #1 complaint of the game outside this forum(lack of progress).

But let's keep pretending they don't know what they're doing and let's keep pretending we know better about the game . While at the same time being so passionate about the game because it's their ideas we fell in love with, ironic.

This update is for the newer players while also trying to cater to us AND retain long time players that mega base. If they're doing too much of something it's trying to please everyone. 

I see you Klei, keep up the good work.

Edited March 5 by HowlVoid

[Swiyss]

14 minutes ago, HowlVoid said:

It's almost like they didn't already explicitly explain why they're doing this.

To retain more players, it's their #1 complaint of the game outside this forum(lack of progress).

But let's keep pretending they don't know what they're doing and let's keep pretending we know better about the game . While at the same time being so passionate about the game because it's their ideas we fell in love with, ironic.

This update is for the newer players while also trying to cater to us AND retain long time players that mega base. If they're doing too much of something it's trying to please everyone. 

I see you Klei, keep up the good work.

It's like a new knowledge update was dropped into our brains. Now everyone knows this.

[YouKnowWho]

I don't really see what the big deal is. All they showed were a couple tweaks to some of the skills, not full-scale reworks.

[-Variant]

21 hours ago, Szczuku said:

Did I understood you correctly; you are glad that so far Klei is making skill trees that are good enough because you were worried that they'd eventually have to redo them?

No, my wording may have been off, but I was explaining that what I feared would happen, and didn't want to happen, did in fact happen.
I currently have a fair chunk of issues with the skill trees as a whole currently.

[Evelo]

4 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

If they're doing too much of something it's trying to please everyone. 

I do agree with that. Even if I don't like it (frequently adding bosses) I would rather Klei stick to their guns. I don't like skill trees and want them removed. But if Klei (and they likely will) sticks to them, then good on them. Not everything is for everyone and that is okay. (Even if I dislike it.)