hot takes Your Dont Starve Together Hot Takes

[GhostyToasty]

2 minutes ago, Raven Idol said:

if they'll keep him as the high risk no reward character he unfortunately is now. 

I mean, he spawns in with a free walking cane. That's a pretty good reward for anyone who can easily manage sanity 

[Raven Idol]

1 minute ago, GhostyToasty said:

I mean, he spawns in with a free walking cane. That's a pretty good reward for anyone who can easily manage sanity 

Woodie can do something similar for the cost of some wood and two insight, the difference being it's a little weaker but (afaik) unlimited, and that's on top of everything else Woodie can do. Besides his small assortment of balloons, including the genuinely helpful ones like speedy, the only thing Wes can offer is being a punching bag in some instances. Outside of moments like lightning strikes and hounds, Wes doesn't really deliver that "his bad luck benefits his friends" thing that he's built around, like what's seen in his short. All I want for the mime is more of that theme in more practical, meaningful ways. Ideally, he should be a high risk/reward character, even if most of that reward is at his detriment.

[chirsg]

turns out wanting the commander helm buffed is a hot take. Who knew common sense was a character flaw.

[Just Ragnar]

Wolfgang would be so much better balanced if they made some nerf for example you lose 5-25 (depends on enemy, spider 5, bosses 25, beefalo 15, pigs 10 as examples) mightiness when hit, but regen 1-5 mightyness when hitting the respective enemies. Want double damage? Don't get it. Would it make tanking difficult? Not really, it'd just encourage dodging a hit every once in a while, increases the skill floor for such an easy to get double damage. Every other damage multiplier has to be earned or skillfully maintained or is on a character with a downside that changes your playstyle somewhat, i don't see why Wolfgang's doesent.

[grm9]

15 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

Every other damage multiplier has to be earned or skillfully maintained or is on a character with a downside that changes your playstyle somewhat, i don't see why Wolfgang's doesent

because other characters with combat perks have much more perks that aren't related to combat than wolfgang, e.g. wanda's teleport, backstep, unique refuelable weapon that you can get in the first few days that has more range than most other weapons, free healing etc. in comparison to wolfgang's x1.5 work speed, 1% chance to break something instantly when hammering/mining/chopping and faster rowing speed                                                                                      

[Just Ragnar]

19 minutes ago, grm9 said:

because other characters with combat perks have much more perks that aren't related to combat than wolfgang, e.g. wanda's teleport, backstep, unique refuelable weapon that you can get in the first few days that has more range than most other weapons, free healing etc. in comparison to wolfgang's x1.5 work speed, 1% chance to break something instantly when hammering/mining/chopping and faster rowing speed                                                                                      

Sure, lets ignore 10% more speed when normal, damage doubling of followers, no speed penalty from marble suits or piggybacks, 15% chance to instantly break anything while working, all available 7 seconds after you spawn. He can use all his perks (aside from the perks everyone barely uses) the moment he starts the game.

Compare this to Warly, who has 33% damage protection equipmentless if you farm for stuff, 1.7-3x damage if you farm for stuff and its spring or dfly, wetness immunity if you farm for stuff, equipmentless lantern if you farm for stuff (which other characters can get but worse), faster working if you farm for stuff, seasonal protection if you farm for stuff, all temporary, while also having the most impactful downside in the game, he has to farm for temporary buffs.

(wanda's downside gives her semi health regen and wormwood has straight up health regen)

 

[grm9]

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

Sure, lets ignore 10% more speed when normal

you rarely stay in normal form and it's pretty much just to cancel the piggyback penalty, also doesn't work if you're on a beefalo

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

damage doubling of followers

it only lasts for like 10 seconds from what i remember since it can only be used while normal and stops working when mighty and you need to keep increasing mightiness to activate it so you'll turn mighty soon after applying the buff, it's useless 

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

no speed penalty from marble suits or piggybacks

you're probably tanking if you're using marble armor so that's irrelevant because you can just swap it to something else if you're going to try to dodge, could count piggyback but that still doesn't apply when on a beefalo and you rarely need the additional slots from it

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

15% chance to instantly break anything while working

forgot about the increase from skill tree       

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

He can use all his perks (aside from the perks everyone barely uses) the moment he starts the game

unless you're trying to kill a specific boss and stop playing after that this doesn't matter much, wanda can get the clock in the first 2-3 days too, maxwell gets good dps after you get thule stuff while being the best at resource gathering from day 1, wigfrid has songs etc.

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

wormwood has straight up health regen

12 per day during most autumn days 

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

while also having the most impactful downside in the game

having to eat meaty stews that you, unlike everyone else, can cook anywhere?

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

Compare this to Warly

so are you asking for a warly buff or for a wolfgang nerf? It'd make more sense to ask for a warly buff instead of trying to make a character that you don't play as weaker for some reason 

1 hour ago, ShyRasan123 said:

equipmentless lantern if you farm for stuff

isn't it just 2 small glow berries 2 berries

[Just Ragnar]

7 hours ago, grm9 said:

so are you asking for a warly buff or for a wolfgang nerf? It'd make more sense to ask for a warly buff instead of trying to make a character that you don't play as weaker for some reason 

Im asking for Wolfgang to require more skill and for Warly to be worth playing aside from switch to: make dish: switch from.

7 hours ago, grm9 said:

having to eat meaty stews that you, unlike everyone else, can cook anywhere?

You'd be suprised how impactful that ends up being compared to other downsides. You could of course go koalefant hunting all autumn but that wouldnt set you up well for winter. A lot of great sanity sources close down, you're unable to get quick healing from roasted vegetables and have to prepare a lot of dishes, either more than others or more varied ones. His perks to make up for this are all very inaccessible or replacable compared to Wolfgang's, who has no downside and very similar perks but 23/7.  More damage, more defense (marble armor), more work efficiency except 23/7 and you have more. the only thing Warly has left to cling to for relevancy is a tamed beefalo.


tl;dr of my hot take: wolfgang shouldnt have mightyness 23/7 super easily
tl:dr of Warly opinions: Warly should be one of the next to get a skill tree and it better be a good one

[grm9]

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

Im asking for Wolfgang to require more skill

wanda first then, the supposed glass cannon character still needs to get hit by fuelweaver 7 times before needing to heal when old with night armor equipped, for example, while wolfgang isn't supposed to be a glass cannon and has less perks than wanda in long term 

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

Im asking for Warly to be worth playing aside from switch to: make dish: switch from

wolfgang nerf won't help with that

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

You could of course go koalefant hunting all autumn

or you could do AG, BQ (not food, but healing if it's an issue and bundling wrap for meat), dfly etc. first for meat and kill things that drop meat on the way like tallbirds, catcoons etc.

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

that wouldnt set you up well for winter

you only need 4 twigs 5 flint 10 rocks 2 grass 

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

A lot of great sanity sources close down

you could just wear shanter after winter to stay at near full 

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

you're unable to get quick healing from roasted vegetables and have to prepare a lot of dishes

get a beefalo or kite 

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

His perks to make up for this are all very inaccessible

that's the issue with warly, it's annoying and hardly worth it to go out of the way to get spices, especially when playing solo and it becomes pointless after you find lunar/get celestial orb 

20 minutes ago, ShyRasan123 said:

more defense (marble armor)

you can just unequip it before walking away 

[Mysterious box]

Time for a extra spicy take. The reason powercreep is going so crazy is in large parts due to survival being so easy on average and people not wanting to put in effort to surviving.

I'm sure tons of people will have problems with that statement but there are some very easy examples to point to. Sleeping, medicine, and the like aren't used much by most people because healing food is so readily available.

Walter's slingshot actually feels far more useful post rift because rift enemies provide a much better advantage to ranged combat because the danger the pose making tanking less viable.

There are plenty of other conveniences push the need for powercreep but I feel these are good enough examples to start. To be clear though I'm not saying this is a bad thing just something I talked about with friends and wanted to hear people's thoughts on.

[grm9]

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

because healing food is so readily available

or beefalo

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

Walter's slingshot actually feels far more useful post rift because rift enemies provide a much better advantage to ranged combat because the danger the pose making tanking less viable

it doesn't, rift enemies are still too easy to kill without getting hit assuming that you have brightshade staff for varg (slingshot is much slower, especially the first shot, so it wouldn't work without speedboosts unlike brightshade staff and even if it would work, still less damage per projectile if it bounces more than twice) and fire staff for deerclops 

[Mysterious box]

27 minutes ago, grm9 said:

it doesn't, rift enemies are still too easy to kill without getting hit assuming that you have brightshade staff for varg (slingshot is much slower, especially the first shot, so it wouldn't work without speedboosts unlike brightshade staff and no bounce) and fire staff for deerclops 

The slingshot is still easier for most fights and without using end game resources in the end game. The staff is nice but it isn't strictly better than the slingshot in the end game the hound gun on the otherhand...but even then you need time to get it in the end game.

[grm9]

1 hour ago, Mysterious box said:

The slingshot is without using end game resources in the end game

roughly 200 thulecite ammo (130 thulecite ammo if every second ammo spawns a shadow tentacle that hits the boss at least once) is more expensive in comparison to 0.635 of a pure brilliance and 0.635 of a brightshade husk     

2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The staff is nice but it isn't strictly better than the slingshot

it deals more damage per projectile as long as there are at least two targets 

2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

The slingshot is still easier for most fights

yes but they aren't hard anyway, you just circle around bearger and walk away from deerclops 

2 hours ago, Mysterious box said:

but even then you need time to get it in the end game

one year or less 

[Mysterious box]

59 minutes ago, grm9 said:

roughly 200 thulecite ammo (130 thulecite ammo if every second ammo spawns a shadow tentacle that hits the boss at least once) is more expensive in comparison to 0.635 of a pure brilliance and 0.635 of a brightshade husk 

I'll be honest I don't think thulecite rounds are worth it in general I just stick with marble.

 

1 hour ago, grm9 said:

it deals more damage per projectile as long as there are at least two targets

Your not wrong but again slingshot makes a fine alternative.

1 hour ago, grm9 said:

yes but they aren't hard anyway, you just circle around bearger and walk away from deerclops 

Not saying they are hard but they do punish tanking and being sloppy in general which is what makes the slingshot feel less bad in the situations.

[Theukon-dos]

The only reason the gap between combat and non-combat characters """needs""" to be closed is because combat challenges are the only thing Klei seems capable of making now a days. We've hardly gotten any new survival challenges sense, well, ever.

 

And the ones we have gotten? Sandstorms are both seasonal and biome locked. Sinkholes and cave ins can be shut off by killing Antlion every year. Rot was awful and was justifiably removed. Acid Rain was so atrocious that it was absolutely gutted in the Terrors Below beta until they could make it atleast tolerable a month or so later. And lunar hail is just earthquake debris on the surface.

[GhostyToasty]

As much as I love Wurt.. She really isn't as good as us Wurt mains say 

 

She really does need a buff. She's outclassed by Maxwell in every category 

[Szczuku]

The devs should run an experiment in 2024 and instead of doing the 'monthly' updates scheme they should just work on a big update throughout the year, like Terraria devs do.

Cuz, let's be honest, dst devs can't do monthly updates. Between waiting a month after an update release to drop a beta, it lasting 3 weeks, which makes it 2 months per update actually, and the update usually being released in a rushed state, with the beta subforum still brimming with discussion and feedback, it's clear that Klei isn't keeping up with their arbitrary update quota

Maybe silently working on a big update, dropping a beta in June and releasing it in December would be a better way of handling dst.

[grm9]

9 hours ago, Theukon-dos said:

We've hardly gotten any new survival challenges sense, well, ever

out of curiosity, what would you suggest then?

19 minutes ago, Szczuku said:

Maybe silently working on a big update, dropping a beta in June and releasing it in December would be a better way of handling dst

probably no because a lot of people won't play inbetween updates for long        

[Theukon-dos]

On 12/17/2023 at 2:17 AM, grm9 said:

out of curiosity, what would you suggest then?  

Hard to say. Klei's already doubled down on combat perks, so even if more seasonal events where added, there aren't many tools characters have access too in order to off set them.

 

Well- ok, here's an example. You know how Wurt has that perk where fish survive 4x longer in her inventory, and how this lets her carry around Scorching Sunfish and Ice Breams to offset the temperature of winter and summer respectively? If there where where instances where it got really cold or really hot, and usual technics to off-set this either don't work or wheren't as effective. Then that fish perk would be significantly more valuable sense it would be able to offset these colder tempatures aswell.

 

Or, another example. If there where instances where food was genuinely scarce, then characters who are good at producing food like Wormwood or Warly could serve a valuable niche by either producing more food or greatly extending the rations they already have.

[arubaro]

2 hours ago, Theukon-dos said:

Or, another example. If there where instances where food was genuinely scarce

they can make some kind of "global moon epidemic" so stuff you kill drop rot until you do something. In that way you dont destroy herds neither make plants and mobs go extinct while you remove some food sources forcing players to use other methods

On 12/15/2023 at 6:32 PM, ShyRasan123 said:

and for Warly to be worth playing aside from switch to: make dish: switch from.

warly is worth playing, just because you and others dont like to deal with a fun downside doesnt mean warly isnt the favourite character of many players

i fear his skill tree. Klei might treat his like they did with woodie's skill tree, removing downsides because people only want power without downdides

[Paxtonnnn]

1 hour ago, arubaro said:

i fear his skill tree. Klei might treat his like they did with woodie's skill tree, removing downsides because people only want power without downdides

I feel like Woodie's main downside was removed because a LOT of people only saw it as something that made playing him miserable doing moon storms. I haven't experienced this myself but it doesn't sound like a very interesting downside in that scenario, just annoying

[arubaro]

39 minutes ago, Paxtonnnn said:

I feel like Woodie's main downside was removed because a LOT of people only saw it as something that made playing him miserable doing moon storms. I haven't experienced this myself but it doesn't sound like a very interesting downside in that scenario, just annoying

and i agree something was needed but just adding "pick this perk and your curse is removed" is an awful and lazy way of fixing it. Not even an item given by wagstaff

and i wasnt only refering to that. The tree also removed penalties from eating idols, hunger set to 0 when you come out of wereforms and insanity inmunity during transformations

now woodie is basically wilson with powerful and useful forms and i fear klei adding something similar to warly in the form of "dishes gives you more stats" "food penalty last less time" "dishes gives you sanity bonus" and other silly suggestions i read over the years that would ruin his downside.

hot take coming:

Warly doesnt need anything of that kind because is strong enough to dont need to repeat much healing foods, if someone needs 3 or more healing dishes with warly's atack and defense buffs is their problem, not warly's.... Bonus on dish is awful and was suggested many times, ruins the concept of needing to make variety of foods and look after the best dishes. Why i would cook different healing or sanity dishes if i can simply repeat a couple of times a buffed perogie?? also completely removes out of the table the use of healing items for those warlys that werent as good, makes you not need to look after powerful armor like night armor for ruins cleaning to prevent needing much healing

the biggest downside as warly is managing his sanity, thing that has been easier with the addition of banana shakes and bearger bin. You can bring 2 sanity dishes without need more space in situations where you needed them. Which arent much because you have x3 damage, FW falls before banana shakes gives little stats...

there are a lot of lazy people that only want boosts without payoffs

just see how nobody complained about wigfrid's downside isnt respect for many foods. The skill tree update was the time to fix that

/rant

 

 

klei pls, only give warly new dishes, butcher Wilson's perk and increased timer on buffs from his own dishes (dont apply it to jelly beans). They can add a planar spices like pure dreadstone powder planar damage buff and pure brillance powder planar armor food buff

[Kevinnator]

Dunno how hot of a take this is but planar mechanics were necessary for the "hardmode" they're making. It's pretty well thought out in my opinion but will require some characters to be a little reworked for their perks to work when rifts are active. It seems skill trees try and fix this by giving characters at least a few skills that can help them out when rifts are active (Wigfrid currently being the most prepared I think, she can literally get a planar weapon and protection before activating rifts. Yes Dreadstone armour exists but the commander helmet gives a bit more planar protection with its skill).

Considering you'll likely be able to get 90-95% damage reduction fairly easily around the time you start rifts, something that pierced armour was necessary if they wanted to avoid bloating damage numbers. Same goes with weapons, if they didn't want to bloat the health of the new enemies then giving them regular damage protection was a smart choice.

It also doesn't make old gear redundant. Hambats and football helmets for instance are still very viable to use against the normal threats because planar weapons don't deal much more damage against normal enemies and planar protection only protects against, well, planar attacks.

[grm9]

6 hours ago, arubaro said:

they can make some kind of "global moon epidemic"

i've had an idea for a mod that would spawn brightshades before rifts, but they would take up entire biomes (including enemies, things built by players maybe, mob spawners, rocks, wormholes etc.), be invincible and only become vulnerable without dropping loot after death and with killing all brightshades nearby after dying after rifts get opened, both making survival harder and forcing people to fight bosses, since some people say that some people get bored because survival is easy and they don't need to interact with bosses, maybe that could only get enabled after the first year so people that already kill CC and FW during the first year don't get their strats ruined

[grm9]

40 minutes ago, Kevinnator said:

Considering you'll likely be able to get 90-95% damage reduction fairly easily around the time you start rifts, something that pierced armour was necessary if they wanted to avoid bloating damage numbers

making tanking unviable was pointless because rift bosses' attacks are extremely easy to dodge anyway and that removes any strat variety, making them boring

41 minutes ago, Kevinnator said:

It also doesn't make old gear redundant. Hambats and football helmets for instance are still very viable to use against the normal threats because planar weapons don't deal much more damage against normal enemies and planar protection only protects against, well, planar attacks

brightshade sword requires two less hits to kill nightmares than ham bat and rift armor has football helm normal damage absorption and x2.667 of a football helm's durability and the materials required for repairing it are abundant

it also sucks that all planar does is adding another reason to use rift armor instead of anything else, they added damage that was supposed to not be blocked by armor and then added armor that blocks that damage and there's still bone armor anyway