How do you guys think woodie isn't op?

[edulopes]

9 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

If your that good at the game.. maybe, but I am not, and I do still get hit by it despite attempting to dodge its attacks, not only do I get hit by it but I also probably end up going insane and end up having to run away from the newly spawning TerrorBeaks that want to tag themselves into the fight. I am a fairly skilled player- I’ve even managed to kill most bosses at least once (with exception to the super late game more obscure ones or the ocean ones)

People really need to stop trying to “skill-Check” one another.

I still get my ass handed to me by Deerclops sometime.

The DIFFERENCE is that Without Healing Items, and Sanity items.. your probably in for a bad day..

well a boss is still a boss i give you that, but  in the end of the day of the True bosses ( not counting spider queen and tree guardians) he is the weakest boss By far)
the true question of the deer clops is killing him fast, or just using the super cheap cooked catcus flesh 

[Antynomity]

Yes, let's nerf another thing because it can kill deerclops in X seconds!

[Jakepeng99]

Oh no, uh... nerf Maxwell instead!

[edulopes]

1 minute ago, Jakepeng99 said:

Oh no, uh... nerf Maxwell instead!

[Captain_Rage]

4 hours ago, abrocator said:

I think they just mean to hold F while having those items equipped.

"/.../ the healing is so good that, like mentioned before, as long as you charge through the ice spell Klaus' fight becomes so laughably easy that you can just hold 'f' the entire time and win". 15:58.

Spoiler

 

[Spino43]

Imagine telling being able to kill klaus slightly easier is OP when wanda and 2 lureplants exist.

[Picklesaurus]

21 minutes ago, Captain_Rage said:

"/.../ the healing is so good that, like mentioned before, as long as you charge through the ice spell Klaus' fight becomes so laughably easy that you can just hold 'f' the entire time and win". 15:58.

[Wonz]

What's calling things OP or balance for in game like this?

PvP is non existent. You never see people complaining or asking to make it a thing, especially that everyone knows the combat is too simple for it to work. 

Are you gonna compete with someone? Why not do this on even grounds and pick the same character.  

Think some perk/character/character's ability makes it too easy? Use another one/simply don't use it.

[Spino43]

16 minutes ago, Wonz said:

PvP is non existent. You never see people complaining or asking to make it a thing, especially that everyone knows the combat is too simple for it to work. 

@Mike23Ua

[Lardee]

1 hour ago, Captain_Rage said:

"/.../ the healing is so good that, like mentioned before, as long as you charge through the ice spell Klaus' fight becomes so laughably easy that you can just hold 'f' the entire time and win". 15:58.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

As stated in the video, this was before they nerfed the healing from 3 HP every 5 seconds to 1.5 HP every 5 seconds.  Since then, you're going to get destroyed if you try to just tank him.

[Wonz]

7 hours ago, Lardee said:

9 hours ago, Captain_Rage said:

"/.../ the healing is so good that, like mentioned before, as long as you charge through the ice spell Klaus' fight becomes so laughably easy that you can just hold 'f' the entire time and win". 15:58.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

As stated in the video, this was before they nerfed the healing from 3 HP every 5 seconds to 1.5 HP every 5 seconds.  Since then, you're going to get destroyed if you try to just tank him.

Someone complains about moose while wigfrid exists, being arguably cheaper and not arguably far far stronger.  

[Jakepeng99]

10 hours ago, Captain_Rage said:

"/.../ the healing is so good that, like mentioned before, as long as you charge through the ice spell Klaus' fight becomes so laughably easy that you can just hold 'f' the entire time and win". 15:58.

  Hide contents

 

They halved it, which was mentioned i  the video aswell.

[Fufuji]

He's totally not OP against current planar entities.

[Captain_Rage]

14 hours ago, Lardee said:

As stated in the video, this was before they nerfed the healing from 3 HP every 5 seconds to 1.5 HP every 5 seconds.  Since then, you're going to get destroyed if you try to just tank him.

You mean you get to the last phase of one of the hardest hitting bosses before succumbing simply by face-tanking? This is omega lol. If you are serious about making Woodie even stronger then there is no hope in this place. Cheers for checking, though. The same armor reduction mechanic ought to let Woodie survive an explosion from 7 Gunpowder, where 1 Gunpowder is enough to kill every other character in the game with the same amount of equipment. Just for the record.

[Notecja]

On 7/24/2023 at 2:32 PM, paodocevoante1 said:

Does he need buffs?

Yes. Because in late game Woodie is practically obsolete and suddenly his "barely a downside" becomes a real curse and suffering. Even with buffs I think he might still suffer in late game, but at least he is back to be playable. Also he is only character to be crippled for Wagstaff minigame during nightime (without skill tree... skill tree allows to change that).

[JazzyGames]

Here seems like as good a place as any to throw in my two cents about Woodie.

I generally agree that the vast majority of his abilities are frontloaded on the early game, similar to Wilson's skill tree (extra insulation, torch toss, etc). That said, the weremoose mastery makes Woodie one of the strongest choices currently for dealing with rift mobs. You can easily tank the shadelings and inkblights in the caves, and without having tested a ton I would imagine a single moose transformation could probably take out a few herds of deadly brightshades. Goose with the speed boost feels about on par to a beefalo with glossamer saddle, with the added advantage of being able to traverse water so I'd still use it for late-game sea exploration and travel to islands.

Moose is still effective with the majority of boss fights that don't require much aside from fighting, certainly not a form I would use against BQ, FW, Malbatross, or Toad. The late-game benefit of moose seems to be his effectiveness against rift mobs and bosses that you tend to repeat such as shadow pieces, Deerclops, and Klaus. Yeah you can do these fights in human form but the savings in resources is one that I value very highly in longer worlds.

Even before considering the absolute game-changing affinity skills I'd say the skill tree is an immense improvement to the character overall.  Not at all OP compared to Wolfgang but certainly a respectable choice of character. Thank you for celebrating Canada appreciation month with me.

[W0l0l0]

Wish the moose could have a bit of progression. It's so hard trying to balance something for the whole game when you have access to it day 1.

[DegenerateFurry]

I feel like people who're arguing that Woodie is OP are ignoring the fact that there's certain bosses he can't really do solo in moose form without cheesing them to make their mechanics not work. You can't really do Crab King, Fuelweaver, Toadstool/Misery Toadstool, Bee Queen, or Malbatross as the moose alone, for example. Even Dragonfly still requires walls and you have to fight it enraged for a good chunk of the fight, which is extremely easy to die doing unless you've completely mastered charge cancelling. Meanwhile, any character (including normal Woodie) can fight those the normal way and win, and Wolfgang can do it while doing double damage with basically no downside. 

The were-moose does also have a downside: it can't eat food to heal, which is one reason why fighting Bee Queen with it by yourself doesn't work too well (that and its AoE capabilities just aren't good enough, unlike Abigail's). No spammable healing is a big enough downside that it's Wormwood's primary downside and it's one Wanda also has. Were-forms can't use items at all, too. Meanwhile, Maxwell is still better at gathering resources than Woodie and is also at least on par with him in most combat situations, and is probably a bit better on average, just with the downside of having to be a bit more careful about not getting stunlocked because his health is lower. 

[paodocevoante1]

4 hours ago, DegenerateFurry said:

I feel like people who're arguing that Woodie is OP are ignoring the fact that there's certain bosses he can't really do solo in moose form without cheesing them to make their mechanics not work. You can't really do Crab King, Fuelweaver, Toadstool/Misery Toadstool, Bee Queen, or Malbatross as the moose alone, for example. Even Dragonfly still requires walls and you have to fight it enraged for a good chunk of the fight, which is extremely easy to die doing unless you've completely mastered charge cancelling. Meanwhile, any character (including normal Woodie) can fight those the normal way and win, and Wolfgang can do it while doing double damage with basically no downside. 

The were-moose does also have a downside: it can't eat food to heal, which is one reason why fighting Bee Queen with it by yourself doesn't work too well (that and its AoE capabilities just aren't good enough, unlike Abigail's). No spammable healing is a big enough downside that it's Wormwood's primary downside and it's one Wanda also has. Were-forms can't use items at all, too. Meanwhile, Maxwell is still better at gathering resources than Woodie and is also at least on par with him in most combat situations, and is probably a bit better on average, just with the downside of having to be a bit more careful about not getting stunlocked because his health is lower. 

Does this video show otherwise, or do you really think that the moose transformation offers negative points that don't even come close to the extremely positive points?

this video was before the healing reduction but hey, it should be normal to defeat all these bosses just by going after some monster flesh and grass and nothing else, at most set the stage (as it was in the Bee Queen)

as you mentioned Maxwell who is extremely strong, even he has to go after resources and be careful with the low life but at least he went after the items, or will tell me that taking 3 monster meats and 2 grams to receive regeneration, damage reduction and decent damage is the rest of the attributes that the transformation gives him is comparable to going after shadow armor and a dark sword

[Mr. Tour]

4 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

Does this video show otherwise, or do you really think that the moose transformation offers negative points that don't even come close to the extremely positive points?

 

What mos people is arguing is that he is not OP

He is strong, but not broken

[Mr Giggio]

On 7/24/2023 at 10:32 AM, paodocevoante1 said:

is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving

a standart character can do it in LITERALLY one minute

Less if the player knows how to cancel animation

Even less with a better weapon

And less with damage multiplier

 

[Mysterious box]

7 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

as you mentioned Maxwell who is extremely strong, even he has to go after resources and be careful with the low life but at least he went after the items, or will tell me that taking 3 monster meats and 2 grams to receive regeneration, damage reduction and decent damage is the rest of the attributes that the transformation gives him is comparable to going after shadow armor and a dark sword

Tbf nightmare fuel is a easy resource to amass and with Maxwell's shadow sneak it's as easy as picking grass reeds are literally picking grass mash those two together and you get night armor which makes Maxwell quite tanky while having the advantage of healing with food making him effectively more tanky than the moose. As for dark swords living logs comes easy to him due to his deforesting capabilities and only get easier as the days go on. While he loses in aoe he's got the moose beat in boss battles with survivability and damage simply due to inventory access and powerful minions and this is before he even has a skill tree.

[Lardee]

9 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

Does this video show otherwise, or do you really think that the moose transformation offers negative points that don't even come close to the extremely positive points?

this video was before the healing reduction but hey, it should be normal to defeat all these bosses just by going after some monster flesh and grass and nothing else, at most set the stage (as it was in the Bee Queen)

as you mentioned Maxwell who is extremely strong, even he has to go after resources and be careful with the low life but at least he went after the items, or will tell me that taking 3 monster meats and 2 grams to receive regeneration, damage reduction and decent damage is the rest of the attributes that the transformation gives him is comparable to going after shadow armor and a dark sword

Considering that almost all of these bosses can be beaten with a hambat, a football helmet and a light source, it's absolutely reasonable for a form that's entirely focused around combat to be able to beat these guys, especially after Woodie invests all his skill points into the Weremoose tree.

[Picklesaurus]

10 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

as you mentioned Maxwell who is extremely strong, even he has to go after resources and be careful with the low life but at least he went after the items, or will tell me that taking 3 monster meats and 2 grams to receive regeneration, damage reduction and decent damage is the rest of the attributes that the transformation gives him is comparable to going after shadow armor and a dark sword

Sometimes people forget most bosses are time gatted and than they end up looking at Moose in a vacuum situation. Yes, 3 monster meats and 2 grasses is cheap, but the Moose idol doesnt advance the serve time so you can actually fight most bosses  - nor advance chores in the case of celestial champion questline. By the time I get to fight most bosses I have already gotten much safer and , depending on the charater, better  gear than Moose... which usually happens in the first autum after I have rushed ruins and returned with thulecite crowns, suits, magi and nightmarefuel for the first darkswords.

Some characters make this more obvious than others: Maxwell can get thulecite gear first autum which buffs his spells as much as shadow armor and magician tophat and while I'm playing Maxwell this way not only do I feel more in control of situations during boss battles but I also deal more damage than Moose;  WX is a character I have been having a lot of fun with lately - aside from maxwell - , he allows for a really careless playstyle if you so choose with upgrades, after I have rushed ruins with him - which is super easy - not only have I gotten thulecite gear and Magi but I have also gotten more gears than I know what to do with... nah I know what to do with gears, it is WX EASY HEAL CITY BABY! I use them at bosses as heal and sanity early game, each one heals him for 60 HP and 50 sanity, before I have gone trought half a stack of them I usually have already gotten Jelly beans from BQ and than I start to use Jelly and pierogies as my main heal. I acquire those things while playing normaly and it is way more confortable than depending on post nerf Moose regen heal.

Did you know that middle aged wanda has higher DPS than Moose after acquiring alarming clock? I'm not talking about Old wanda,  yes Middle aged wanda has a considerable higher DPS than Moose without needing to hit a combo and dealing damage at a safer distance. She can acquire alarming clock first autumn and it is really easy to replenish her weapon with nightmare because of how easy it is to kill nightmare creatures with it. But I shouldn't talk much about wanda since I played her little when compared to Maxwell and WX.

When I'm not looking at Moose in a vacuum I dont find him OP, strong yes but OP no, unless I also consider others from the host OP, and even in that possibility there would be other characters that I would look at before making my way down the list to reach Moose/Woodie.

[Jrramon_GOLD]

Are you guys really saying having a day 1 walking cane isn't op, and also having a helmet where you can easily craft without the use of precious pigskin.
The walking cane used to be an item you have to wait until winter to get and now you can get it day 1 without any effort, it doesn't help how easy it is to cheat in insight points as well.
Woodie can also take down klaus, deerclops, and other bosses easily. 
He is a jack of all trades! 
He can kill bosses and enemies
He can gather tons of resources
He can travel the world and more
Also there are 2 other things he can do
 

Spoiler

Were beaver can easily grief with his tail slap and has become the new willow where you will get banned immediately if you have it
There's a command which allows you spend insight and the command ignores all pre requirements. So you can have both shadow and lunar alignments at the same time.
Do you guys not see how OP this is?

Look I would agree on all of these changes if they made the world harder. The game has become so easy now because of all of the buffs characters have gotten. The skills trees have no downsides and it makes the ones with the skill trees outshine the harder. I'm just hoping they add new challenges in the next update