How do you guys think woodie isn't op?

[paodocevoante1]

I don't speak english so there may be mistakes
my point is that with the mastered Weremoose form it is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving, and while I was playing with my friend new to the game he managed to defeat klaus literally only with one transformation (or 2 I don't remember) and this being a transformation that can be achieved in the early days
And so Woodie being a great explorer, an excellent combatant and an above average character to collect resources.
Does he need buffs?

[Ardyn]

Isn't it normal to defeat deerclop without avoiding it?

[ALCRD]

Ah yes Deerclops the hardest of DST bosses totally unbeatable by facetanking her or moving slightly behind her when she does ice slam to avoid all damage.

[Ironkid]

3 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

I don't speak english so there may be mistakes
my point is that with the mastered Weremoose form it is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving, and while I was playing with my friend new to the game he managed to defeat klaus literally only with one transformation (or 2 I don't remember) and this being a transformation that can be achieved in the early days
And so Woodie being a great explorer, an excellent combatant and an above average character to collect resources.
Does he need buffs?

My friend, humanwoodie (and any character) can do this to. Slap on a helm and marble suit and go nuts. he needed this buff because hes been one of the worst characters for too long. All of his power and usefullness is frontloaded to the very early game. You think woodie is op? how do you not see every other character besides three of them are super op (if you think woodie is op)?

[abrocator]

Moose is great early game but can’t be made better later outside of some minor things like using jellybeans.

Lardee (as well as others) has some ideas about letting Moose use a limited bodyslot, like only allowing amulets. Which is interesting:

• Magi for movement speed
• Life amulet for health regen
• Iced for freezing opponents

If you wanted to nerf early game Moose I guess you could remove the passive, built-in health regen and instead allow him to regen with the life amulet. That could nerf him early game while buffing him mid/lategame.

Of course if that is too limited (you can get a life amulet pretty early) then you could expand with more kinds of amulets or whatever other restricted bodyslot items.

[Brago-sama]

Why is deerclops always the baseline for op. Wes with a hambat, logsuit and a campfire could kill him in 50 seconds

[Deimos001]

You can't solo defeat Klaus without kiting i tell you that, yes, you need 2 transformations and deerclops isn't even a treat you can literally darksoul her and walk through after she attacks and strike 5/6 punches, shell be dead in like 1 minute or less you can also tank all the damage with marble armor. A huge disadvantage is that you can´t access your inventory thus you can´t heal which is important when fighting, his new regen skill was necessary.

Woodie losses hunger faster, as a woodie main for a long time i always need to bring food with me, plus you get hunger penalization after turning which also drains your sanity, in comparison to other carachters he was considered a bad one, after this update he is finally playable at least.

[MadMatt]

3 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

defeat klaus literally only with one transformation

This has always been possible, it's now just been upgraded from a useless way to show off to a now actually good way to fight him. You're also completely ignoring all the other raid bosses which the Moose does still struggle with btw. If post-rework Maxwell exists then current beta Weremoose has every right to continue existing in it's current state.

[skile]

Here before moose gets nerfed for having the ultimate ability to defeat Deerclops. 

[ALCRD]

5 minutes ago, skile said:

Here before moose gets nerfed for having the ultimate ability to defeat Deerclops. 

After using Volt Goat Jelly .. and during totally naturally occuring rain.

[Gashzer]

40 minutes ago, abrocator said:

Moose is great early game but can’t be made better later outside of some minor things like using jellybeans.

Lardee (as well as others) have had some ideas about letting Moose use a limited bodyslot, like only allowing amulets. Which is interesting:

• Magi for movement speed
• Life amulet for health regen
• Iced for freezing opponents

If you wanted to nerf early game Moose I guess you could remove the passive, built-in health regen and instead allow him to regen with the life amulet. That could nerf him early game while buffing him mid/lategame.

Of course if that is too limited (you can get a life amulet pretty early) then you could expand with more kinds of amulets or whatever other restricted bodyslot items.

But why does the moose need to be better late game? Moose outcompletes wolfgang/wanda/wigfrid/ in certain situations even in the latest of late games. Fighting any hordes of mobs including the 3 ink blights the moose is ALWAYS better than the 3 of them. Yes killing ink blights with brightshade staff is easy too but what is more useful per inventory slot, 1 brightshade staff or 10 moose idols? 10 moose idols are far more useful by being alot cheaper to mass produce/"repair" and is stronger vs hordes.

So woodie is actually better than wolfgang/wigfrid/wanda for certain combat situations... not bad for a generalist character? Then goose is as fast as a regular beefalo now, which is fantastic if you cant be bothered taming a beefalo late game. Beaver is great for lategame resource farming.

Woodie is easily as op as maxwell, wanda and wolfgang now. His forms are so easy to craft for how strong they are. 

[MadMatt]

13 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

But why does the moose need to be better late game? Moose outcompletes wolfgang/wanda/wigfrid/ in certain situations even in the latest of late games. Fighting any hordes of mobs including the 3 ink blights the moose is ALWAYS better than the 3 of them. Yes killing ink blights with brightshade staff is easy too but what is more useful per inventory slot, 1 brightshade staff or 10 moose idols? 10 moose idols are far more useful by being alot cheaper to mass produce/"repair" and is stronger vs hordes.

So woodie is actually better than wolfgang/wigfrid/wanda for certain combat situations... not bad for a generalist character? Then goose is as fast as a regular beefalo now, which is fantastic if you cant be bothered taming a beefalo late game. Beaver is great for lategame resource farming.

Woodie is easily as op as maxwell, wanda and wolfgang now. His forms are so easy to craft for how strong they are. 

How are you gonna say that Woodie is OP because one of his forms is better than combat characters in a specific combat situation? Wendy is OP because she outperforms Wolfgang vs hordes, so where's her nerf? She gets to use Abigail for FREE! 

It makes no sense to argue a combat form needs to be worse than combat characters in every scenario, when there are scenarios where using the form is DETRIMENTAL. Everyone always looks at the theoretically amazing parts of the Moose, which most of the arguments apply to before the beta where most everyone agrees he's among the worse, but ignore his shortcomings. 

[paodocevoante1]

22 minutes ago, Chev_bug said:

You can't solo defeat Klaus without kiting i tell you that, yes, you need 2 transformations and deerclops isn't even a treat you can literally darksoul her and walk through after she attacks and strike 5/6 punches, shell be dead in like 1 minute or less you can also tank all the damage with marble armor. A huge disadvantage is that you can´t access your inventory thus you can´t heal which is important when fighting, his new regen skill was necessary.

Woodie losses hunger faster, as a woodie main for a long time i always need to bring food with me, plus you get hunger penalization after turning which also drains your sanity, in comparison to other carachters he was considered a bad one, after this update he is finally playable at least.

But there's the point, sure Deerclops is a very easy boss, but even to fight him you'd have to make armor (in case your cait isn't that good) and grab something to beat but being woodie you literally only need a few monster meats and two grams and that's it, you got decent damage with a high armor stamina along with regeneration

Now with Klaus, it's the same thing, it would be normal to come in the winter and just get some monster meats and grass and that's it?

About his desvantegens the only one that really matters is sanity, because about hunger how hard is it for you to take 2-4 meatballs in your inventory in exchange for a transformation that buffs you to a point where you don't have to worry about looking for resources like armor, sword or if winter will make you cool down

[Lardee]

Being able to beat Deerclops without moving doesn't make you OP, that's something literally any character can do for very little resources.

Klaus is the Moose's best matchup and the easiest raid boss. Being able to beat the easiest raid boss after learning how he works doesn't make the moose OP.

 

Tell your friend to fight Dragonfly, Bee Queen, Crab King or Fuel Weaver with the Weremoose and let me know if you think he's still OP.

22 minutes ago, Gashzer said:

So woodie is actually better than wolfgang/wigfrid/wanda for certain combat situations... not bad for a generalist character? Then goose is as fast as a regular beefalo now, which is fantastic if you cant be bothered taming a beefalo late game. Beaver is great for lategame resource farming.

If the moose was OVERALL better than Wolf/Wig/Wanda then you'd have a point. Being better than the trio in very specific situations does not mean Woodie isn't a Jack-of-all-Trades.

The Goose is not a late game alternative to a Beefalo considering you have to waste 3 monster meat, 3 seeds and all your hunger whenever you want to travel from point A to B.

Your Beaver take is spot on.

[paodocevoante1]

1 hour ago, Ironkid said:

My friend, humanwoodie (and any character) can do this to. Slap on a helm and marble suit and go nuts. he needed this buff because hes been one of the worst characters for too long. All of his power and usefullness is frontloaded to the very early game. You think woodie is op? how do you not see every other character besides three of them are super op (if you think woodie is op)?

I sure there are a lot of op characters, I think characters like Wanda, Maxwell and Wolfgang are extremely good characters, but I don't know if it's normal for Woodie to defeat Klaus with only 1-2 totems having this transformation while he has the other two totems that helps him be more useful, but I'm not going to lie that Woodie before this beta was a pretty bad character 
And there's another point that I don't know how he deals with all the bosses, the strongest boss I saw him defeating was on youtube where a guy with Moose defeated DragonFly just using totems (and food of course)

[paodocevoante1]

11 minutes ago, Lardee said:

Being able to beat Deerclops without moving doesn't make you OP, that's something literally any character can do for very little resources.

Klaus is the Moose's best matchup and the easiest raid boss. Being able to beat the easiest raid boss after learning how he works doesn't make the moose OP.

 

Tell your friend to fight Dragonfly, Bee Queen, Crab King or Fuel Weaver with the Weremoose and let me know if you think he's still OP.

If the moose was OVERALL better than Wolf/Wig/Wanda then you'd have a point. Being better than the trio in very specific situations does not mean Woodie isn't a Jack-of-all-Trades.

The Goose is not a late game alternative to a Beefalo considering you have to waste 3 monster meat, 3 seeds and all your hunger whenever you want to travel from point A to B.

Your Beaver take is spot on.

But my point about having talked about deerclops is that I don't think all the characters can literally defeat him standing still without moving an inch while healing and tanking every possible hit, I mean, the other character would have to go after some armor before fighting and some weapon
But I'll admit that I never tested to see if a Marble's armor and a hambat could defeat Deerclops by getting all the hits

[Mysterious box]

4 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

my point is that with the mastered Weremoose form it is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving

Wes can as well time to hand out some nerfs.

[Lardee]

5 minutes ago, paodocevoante1 said:

And there's another point that I don't know how he deals with all the bosses, the strongest boss I saw him defeating was on youtube where a guy with Moose defeated DragonFly just using totems (and food of course)

If you're referring to the video below, that was me using the Weremoose before they nerfed the healing and even then, the fight is WAY more dangerous than just fighting Dragonfly with Woodie's human form since you can eliminate enrage with the panflute.  Being able to beat DF with 2 idols and some healing food by putting yourself at WAY more risk than fighting it normally does not mean the Weremoose is OP.

 

 

6 minutes ago, paodocevoante1 said:

But my point about having talked about deerclops is that I don't think all the characters can literally defeat him standing still without moving an inch while healing and tanking every possible hit, I mean, the other character would have to go after some armor before fighting and some weapon
But I'll admit that I never tested to see if a Marble's armor and a hambat could defeat Deerclops by getting all the hits

Even if we ignore the costs for using the Weremoose (3 monster meat and all your hunger), does Woodie being able to defeat Deerclops easier than every other character mean he's OP if all the other characters can do it almost as easily?

[BrunoMasterNps]

4 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

I don't speak english so there may be mistakes
my point is that with the mastered Weremoose form it is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving, and while I was playing with my friend new to the game he managed to defeat klaus literally only with one transformation (or 2 I don't remember) and this being a transformation that can be achieved in the early days
And so Woodie being a great explorer, an excellent combatant and an above average character to collect resources.
Does he need buffs?

a Skill tree apenas deixou ele Utilizavel, antes as transformação dele estavam muito fracas, a forma de combate era Pior do que um persongem normal com equipamentos de luta, a forma de coletar dele não era nem a mais rapida do jogo tipo ele é um lenhador e não era o melhor personagem pra coletar madeira? a forma de ganso é a unica decente, agora com a skill tree conseguiram deixar ele realmente bom e ele tem que escolher 1 das 3 formas pra masterizar se fosse as 3 formas masterizada ai sim seria broken 

[paodocevoante1]

3 minutes ago, BrunoMasterNps said:

a Skill tree apenas deixou ele Utilizavel, antes as transformação dele estavam muito fracas, a forma de combate era Pior do que um persongem normal com equipamentos de luta, a forma de coletar dele não era nem a mais rapida do jogo tipo ele é um lenhador e não era o melhor personagem pra coletar madeira? a forma de ganso é a unica decente, agora com a skill tree conseguiram deixar ele realmente bom e ele tem que escolher 1 das 3 formas pra masterizar se fosse as 3 formas masterizada ai sim seria broken 

Realmente antigamente ele era podre de ruim mas tá maluco, pega grama e carne de monstro você já consegue matar Klaus e até dragonfly poupando o tempo de ter que ficar pegando os recursos necessários, o verdadeiro ponto do post era mostrar que com pouco recurso que o woodie gastava ele recebe essa transformação muito braba do alce 

[Mysterious box]

Honestly something that seems to happen a lot when talking about the moose is his upsides are highlighted but his downsides aren't.

• He lacks access to healing items meaning the "infinite armor" people says he has doesn't exist because unlike a normal survivor he can't heal aside from his now miniscule regen or jelly beans which is a boss drop
• He has a gap before and after transformations where he can get hit with no way to prevent it while completely unarmored
• He lacks access to items hindering his ability to engage certain boss mechanics
• He's punished for playing too safe due to the need to hit or get hit to maintain his meter while also being punished for playing too aggressive because of his lack of on demand healing

Something else that's always brought up is that the moose is cheap however that falls in line with gear in general. Spears are cheap, hambats are cheap, football helms are cheap, and as time goes on living logs becomes very cheap as well. What the moose offers is high damage, defense, and aoe attacks in exchange for higher stakes combat it strike the line between risk and reward whereas before the risk far outweighed the reward.

 

[edulopes]

5 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

eremoose form it is possible to defeat Deerclops without even moving

first you can do this with any caracter
primeiro de tudo voce pode fazer isso com qualquer boneco, ate o thalz explica isso bem 

5 hours ago, paodocevoante1 said:

managed to defeat klaus literally only with one transformation

second normal klaus is one of the easiest bosses in the game, enraged klaus is an nigthmare but normal klaus is easy, wanda makes the figth trivial wolfgang gan almost burst klaus woodie just dosent waste that many resources to do it, and even more he is locked in the moose mode, if he messes up he cant heal
klaus e muito facil cara, simplesmente o boss e uma marmita, o klaus quando mata as renas e dificil, e ainda mais um wolfgang tunadao da MUITO mais dano que o woodie e a wanda faz a luta ser patetica, entao oq o woodie faz no maximo e transformar a luta em um gasto inferior de recursos se ele erra ele pode morrer por nao poder se curar consistentemente
.


all you need in this game is preparation
tudo que voce precisa nesse jogo e setup, cada boneco tem o seu

35 minutes ago, paodocevoante1 said:

Realmente antigamente ele era podre de ruim mas tá maluco, pega grama e carne de monstro você já consegue matar Klaus e até dragonfly poupando o tempo de ter que ficar pegando os recursos necessários, o verdadeiro ponto do post era mostrar que com pouco recurso que o woodie gastava ele recebe essa transformação muito braba do alce 

pensa comigo wolfgang consegue matar a DF com ham bat e tipo alguns pierogis e umas 3/4 armaduras de marmore, e talvez ainda menos recursos agora com os buffs dele, so um comparativo, essas skill trees sao alem de preparaçoes para os mobs futuros, sao opcionais voce nao precisa usar, e no caso de recursos, cara se voce parar pra pensar nesses bosses inicias, nao se precisa de MUITO 

think with me wolfgang manages to kill the DF with ham bat and like some pierogis and some 3/4 marble armor, and maybe even less resources now with his buffs, just a comparison, these skill trees are in addition to preparations for future mobs, they are optional you don't need to use them, and in the case of resources, man if you stop to think about these initial bosses, you don't need A LOT

[Mike23Ua]

2 hours ago, Brago-sama said:

Why is deerclops always the baseline for op. Wes with a hambat, logsuit and a campfire could kill him in 50 seconds

If your that good at the game.. maybe, but I am not, and I do still get hit by it despite attempting to dodge its attacks, not only do I get hit by it but I also probably end up going insane and end up having to run away from the newly spawning TerrorBeaks that want to tag themselves into the fight. I am a fairly skilled player- I’ve even managed to kill most bosses at least once (with exception to the super late game more obscure ones or the ocean ones)

People really need to stop trying to “skill-Check” one another.

I still get my ass handed to me by Deerclops sometime.

The DIFFERENCE is that Without Healing Items, and Sanity items.. your probably in for a bad day..

[abrocator]

4 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

If your that good at the game.. maybe, but I am not, and I do still get hit by it despite attempting to dodge its attacks,

I think they just mean to hold F while having those items equipped.

[Mysterious box]

6 minutes ago, Mike23Ua said:

If your that good at the game.. maybe, but I am not, and I do still get hit by it despite attempting to dodge its attacks, not only do I get hit by it but I also probably end up going insane and end up having to run away from the newly spawning TerrorBeaks that want to tag themselves into the fight. I am a fairly skilled player- I’ve even managed to kill most bosses at least once (with exception to the super late game more obscure ones or the ocean ones)

People really need to stop trying to “skill-Check” one another.

I still get my ass handed to me by Deerclops sometime.

The DIFFERENCE is that Without Healing Items, and Sanity items.. your probably in for a bad day..

While not the most interesting way to fight deerclops all you need to kill it is to use a log suit, a spear, and a campfire. The campfire can't be broken by deerclops and while your near it you can't be frozen. Deerclops also has very low hp so it'll die if you keep holding F. That being said fighting deerclops without using this method can be fun in it's own right.