Wanda and Celestial Portal

[vlagort]

I have often heard that "Celestial Portal" is an unbalanced thing, I myself did not think so before the appearance of Wanda the fact is that when you re-select the same character, he will again be given all the starting resources in this case, three "Time Pieces" and one "Ageless Watch" so it turns out that with the help of "Celestial Portal" for Wanda, you can have an infinite source of "Time Pieces"without going into ruins. I believe that it is necessary to fix this flaw and the first thing that comes to my mind is when re-selecting the same character, do not give him starting resources.

[Yuuko]

You can rush the lunar island to get the moonstone to upgrade the portal, but you'll still need to get purple gems for the moon lens, idol, AND shadow manipulator.  You could get lucky digging graves, but more likely you'll need to take out dfly.  Also there is the RNG that the Celestial Orb actually drops lol.

Its quicker to just raid the archives.  You can get plenty of thulecite.  You'll still need luck digging graves, but since you're in the caves you can add stalagmites and cave ins as extra chances, and your number of required purple gems drops from 3 to just 1.  Still might need to clear dfly, but much less likely.  Also mushgnomes are always present on the way to the archives, where totally normal trees can be hard or even impossible to find, and spawning treeguards is even more rng (especially early game [but only when you want them lol]) and you do need to craft a shadow manipulator to get that alarming clock...

imo its fine.

[vlagort]

 

8 minutes ago, Shosuko said:

You can go to the archives and get enough thulecite pieces for plenty of new time pieces.  nbd tbh.

Do remember that the celestial portal upgrade requires a decent amount of moon rock AND rng that the !@#$ thing actually drops.  You also need purple gems for the moon lens, idol, AND shadow manipulator.  You might get lucky digging graves, but probably need to take out dfly really... still requiring a decent amount of effort.

imo its about equivalent in time and effort, though maybe not danger, to rushing the ruins.  Especially if you have moderately skilled help on dfly.  Probably easier to rush dfly and find archives than either upgrading portal OR rushing ruins.

The problem is that this is an infinite source of" TimePieces "after the creation of the" Celestial Portal " and in large quantities.

[Yuuko]

1 minute ago, vlagort said:

 

The problem is that this is an infinite source of" TimePieces "after the creation of the" Celestial Portal " and in large quantities.

Doesn't matter - You can dupe thulecite and deconstruct those for infinite pieces too.

(sry my original post was heavily updated before you replied)

[HowlVoid]

Not sure what having a ton of time pieces is good for though.

After my fourth ageless clock I no longer need any more.

Don't need any more alarming clocks after the first.

Backtrek watches are balanced around Mactusk rng.

I dont use the reviving watch because its worse than a life giving amulet (solo).

Backstep watches you only need 1.

After raiding the ruins once and crafting all of the above, I still have about 15 or so time pieces in a chest. Having a surplus of them is honestly not game breaking. Having an inventory worth of ageless watches is far worse than what a single stack of pierogie can do.

[vlagort]

1 minute ago, HowlVoid said:

Not sure what having a ton of time pieces is good for though.

After my fourth ageless clock I no longer need any more.

Don't need any more alarming clocks after the first.

Backtrek watches are balanced around Mactusk rng.

I only use the reviving watch because its worse than a life giving amulet (solo).

Backstep watches you only need 1.

After raiding the ruins once and crafting all of the above, I still have about 15 or so time pieces in a chest. Having a surplus of them is honestly not game breaking. Having an inventory worth of ageless watches is far worse than what a single stack of pierogie can do.

But you went to the ruins.

[HowlVoid]

3 minutes ago, vlagort said:

But you went to the ruins.

Yes but its not necessary. I have so many ageless watches from breaking the walls before the ruins. That's actually how I got my first alarming clock. You can also just locate the ancient archives (very safe) and obtain watches that way which may be significantly faster than setting up the portal.

[ALCRD]

And you can have infinite Bernies as Willow. Spider nests as Webber etc etc.

Nothing really changed since Wanda was introduced. That's how it always was with the portal and you want it nerfed now?

Why? It's not really op or quick way to get. By the time you have the portal set up you usually have more than you need for your essential crafts if you were decently active in the world.

[vlagort]

it is easier to create a cocoon or bernie yourself.

 

[ALCRD]

3 minutes ago, vlagort said:

it is easier to create a cocoon or bernie yourself.

 

Its faster and easier to rush archives for thulecite fragments yourself than wait up to 1 ingame year to get the portal set up.

Also think about people who play without caves. How they gonna get more time pieces huh?

[Yuuko]

18 minutes ago, vlagort said:

But you went to the ruins.

I think you are putting more emphasis on the ruins then it deserves.  They aren't that difficult to get into.  Anyone who's been able to live through a year in game can probably get in far enough to craft.  BUT if they were supposed to be a requirement for Wanda to craft time pieces they'd just require a psudoscience station like every other thulecite requiring craft...  Yet they don't...  I take this to mean Klei didn't intend "visiting the ruins" to be a requirement for crafting time pieces.

Especially when you can get enough thulecite for several more time pieces from the archives very easily, which is all I've needed for my personal use.

I find an alarming clock, backstep, and 2 ageless cover my personal needs fully.  That's only 2 time pieces more than you start with.  You could use her second chance watches instead of lga, but with Klaus handing out lga's I don't have that on a high priority.

And like @HowlVoid said backtrek watches are gated by how many walrus tusk you get...  And honestly if you find yourself with a dozen of those to spare, I think you'll find a chest full of time pieces along the way lol

[vlagort]

 

Caves can be added after the creation of the world

[ALCRD]

2 minutes ago, vlagort said:

 

Caves can be added after the creation of the world

Not for people who get lag when playing with caves. Why should Wanda be severely gimped for them?

And you are still ignoring the fact that even with caves its still easier and faster to rush archives for more than enough time pieces than Wanda will ever need since her crafts are recyclable..

[vlagort]

You need to go to the archives. to get a portal, you just need to sit on your ass

 

[Pruinae]

The Celestial Portal is really broken, but not in this case, after the first year the time pieces don't really matter, with the Walrus Tusk being the real problem.

[ALCRD]

8 minutes ago, vlagort said:

You need to go to the archives. to get a portal, you just need to sit on your ass

 

And your point is? 

What part of "it's FASTER and easier" you don't  understand?

Archives are not dangerous when deactivated neither is finding them any epic feat and they have more than enough thulecite for Wanda to use.

By the time you get the portal set up you would have explored the entirety of the caves like 3 times over.

You make it sound like you need endgame gear to even set foot in the ruins lol when all it takes is a lantern some food and usual basics that one would carry on surface.

For Wanda ruins are especially easy to traverse.

[Mike23Ua]

Over on Xbox I’m finding Wanda to be very useful and Dare I say this even “Newbie” player friendly (thanks to a special clock that takes people exactly right back to their dead carcasses) But she is also VERY Unmultiplayer friendly in her current design.

Because her crafts require Thelucite other Wanda players “steal” clock parts from Wanda’s that die- I’ve had this happen several times so it’s not just a problem with who I play in the room with- it’s a problem with Wanda’s crafts needing what they need to the point it’s actually easier to just take them from another Wanda or abuse Celestial Portal.

Now as I said in another thread I can’t judge how Wanda plays NOW because for all I know Klei may add enemies made of Thelucite that make getting it as trivial as living logs are Now.

I for one would opt for a change in her crafting recipes or a hard Nerf’d limit as to how many Watches Wanda can actually craft & carry at once.

The celestial portal trick is a good way of NOT needing caves to get Wanda’s crafts: but I imagine this would be less problematic if there were surface enemies such as maybe an area where those centipedes from archives roam the surface off on their own little island and drop Thelucite fragments when killed.

I also wouldn’t mind if they hard Nerf the celestial portal itself- making the orb require a trip to Lunar Island maybe tied to doing something.. to obtain instead of just having it spawn from random meteor shower in the very early game days.

[Yuuko]

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I also wouldn’t mind if they hard Nerf the celestial portal itself- making the orb require a trip to Lunar Island maybe tied to doing something.. to obtain instead of just having it spawn from random meteor shower in the very early game days.

Rushing the celestial portal usually requires a trip to the lunar island to get enough moon rocks anyway - and you're still waiting for the celestial orb to drop, which is RNG.  Could drop day 1, could be over a year.  Plus the extra purple gems...  Too unreliable and time consuming when you can just walk into the archives and gather 32 thulecite pieces, making 4 extra time pieces guaranteed in any server you join.

Quote

Because her crafts require Thelucite other Wanda players “steal” clock parts from Wanda’s that die- I’ve had this happen several times so it’s not just a problem with who I play in the room with- it’s a problem with Wanda’s crafts needing what they need to the point it’s actually easier to just take them from another Wanda or abuse Celestial Portal.

Wanda won't drop her alarming, ageless, or back step clocks on death.  I don't see how a different Wanda could steal these from me...  and I don't see why I'd care if they took any others...  What are they gonna do?  Revive the dead ppl for me?  Okay ^_^  and 100% I'm NOT clogging my inventory space with the warp watches lol.

This really comes back to what others have said - Wanda doesn't need that many watches...  Nor is she overly concerned about having very many time pieces.  Just 2-3 extra time pieces outfits a single player comfortably.  Any more then that is for building a network of teleport watches (gated by walrus tusk far more than time pieces) or having a few second chances lying around.

imo - I think these kind of concerns are indicative that someone is maybe unfamiliar with ruins or archives, or long term wanda play.  I've played maybe 20-30 hours of Wanda since release (my work hates me lol) and I can assure you - archives are the quickest, easiest, and most reliable source of the 2-3 extra time pieces you'll want.  And that's all you'll want for a while because walrus tusk is the real gate keeper.

(Also archives synergizes better with rushing alarming clock then a ruins rush.  If you're rushing ruins b/c you want time pieces you're wasting time and effort.  Only rush the ruins if you want ruins gear.)

[prettynuggets]

1 hour ago, vlagort said:

it is easier to create a cocoon

aint gonna waste my precious reeds for spoder egg

its easier spamming portal :3



geez so many people asking for things to be changed . to make it even harder to play ..
i like the way it is .people always say many things is so easy etc . i dont think making it harder will make u any good tho. cus how hard it is if u already made once u can do it more next time (i bet u already kill clestial champion multiple time? isnt it hardest boss when released? but now its just another boss to beat) .. then u will ask for more hard core gameplay ... maybe these people should try to play with their toes instead to make it even harder 

[ArubaroBeefalo]

Honestly. Who would waste 1 moon rock instead of 3 thulecite? Hurts wasting moon rock for that But yeah, the portal shouldnt give items

[lakhnish]

You still need to wait for the Celestial Orb to spawn. Sometimes you can get really bad RNG and wait till like day 70 for the meteor to spawn too.

Until the orb has spawned, you still have to go to the ruins and/or archive biome if you want to get more time pieces.

I like to have 3 watches early game (for bosses) and the Alarming Clock, so I have to go down into the caves to get more Thulecite cause you simply don't spawn with enough time pieces.

The only thing I can see is that you farm the pieces for your teleportation hub, but you are still locked by Walrus Tusks. At that point, would it even matter about the portal? 

 

[Mysterious box]

2 hours ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Honestly. Who would waste 1 moon rock instead of 3 thulecite? Hurts wasting moon rock for that But yeah, the portal shouldnt give items

I don't see the problem the portal gives you nothing that can't be easily made so why should it matter if people get starter items when switching even more so for the cost of a idol.

 

5 hours ago, HowlVoid said:

Having an inventory worth of ageless watches is far worse than what a single stack of pierogie can do.

Honestly despite this comparison being made often a lot really swings in the watches favor more than people think sure you can't use the watches whenever you want but in the early game there's not a big enough threat where you need that much healing and by the time you get dark armor enemies won't do enough damage to really need a huge amount of healing assuming your not going around tanking bosses. Better yet this also means Wanda saves a huge amount of time as she has no need to actively pursue healing. Some might even argue it's counter productive to even pursue sanity outside of boss fights after she has access to magic.  

[QuartzBeam]

3 hours ago, Shosuko said:

you're still waiting for the celestial orb to drop, which is RNG

 

49 minutes ago, lakhnish said:

You still need to wait for the Celestial Orb to spawn. Sometimes you can get really bad RNG and wait till like day 70 for the meteor to spawn too.

You can craft both the Portal Paraphernalia and the Moon Rock Idol at the Celestial Altar, which can be done in the first autumn.

[ShadowDuelist]

The portal should be balanced around having a cooldown, to fix plenty of other gamebreaking things that can be done with that outside and unrelated to Wanda. Not around items given on change, TBH.

By the way if you play on potato pc and can’t play with caves, the celestial is the only way you can get to see and use all Wanda’s watches on the same play through.

[ArubaroBeefalo]

Just now, ShadowDuelist said:

The portal should be balanced around having a cooldown

i dont think so, it will be so annoying

what if i want to change character just to have a decoration, i would need to wait to change to the character i actually play in that world just because people use perks like if they were playing with more players?