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Wanda info video


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1 minute ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Nothing stops you to bring red gems with you NM and gold when cleaning ruins and do the same in a way better way

Why would i do that when i have a instant reverse death button that costs nothing to reuse except waiting 2 mins if i happen to die too quickly in same spot (which can happen with life giving amulet too.)

And just go about my caving like nothing happened and save my gems and gold for other things or if multiplayer for characters who would need them more.

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3 hours ago, Szczuku said:

Ah yes, because every forum user is a troglodyte that cannot comprehend a decently made video overview of a character and draw some conclusions. And so they simply bandwagon and say that she's broken with no way to back that up whatsoever.

On a more serious note...

She is definitelly op and unnecessarily so. It feels like Klei gave her all of those op items to compensate for her different health... except that everyone will probably easily remember to use her 'restore health' watch. If the numbers are correct than all you have to do is use that watch as soon as it's off cooldown to avoid dying of old age. Dodging attacks is not special for her, every character has to do that to not die. Not to mention that infinite revival watch and that weapon. Why doesn't it break at 0% durability? Why can you keep using it at 0% durability? AND WHY DOES IT (apparently) DEAL A MINIMUM OF 60 DMG IN THE WORST CASE SCENARIO?! 

Imo the Backstep Watch will suffer 1 of 3 fates: Used to avoid kiting after you master the timing. Used for extremely minor things such as going to pick up a seed and teleporting back. Nerfed and useless.

I dislike that Rift Watch of her's. A character can be useful to the rest of the team if a player decides to, I dunno, collect some resources and bring them back to base. That's also useful input, Klei.

This is how I'd like Wanda's teleporting ability's team input to look like: her frieds give her resources, she teleports to the ruins and crafts what she needs to craft and teleports back. Mid-game Wanda is depended upon to craft ruins/lunar items. After getting Lazy Deserters up and running Wanda teleports to a target location and brings all her friends via L.Ds. Late-game Wanda saves time as she doesn't have to run to L.Ds. The fact that she can just craft a wormhole is really... silly. Willow cannot grant other survivors fire immunity, Woodie doesn't give them any canadian benefits. And Wormwood cannot share his blooming movement speed.

What I do like about Wanda is her design. It reminds me of old ds days. A watchmaker that can manipulate time? Yeah that sounds about right in a game where a pyromaniac is fire-immune and a librarian is basically a witch. She feels much more of a dst character than Walter. Her constant allusions to death via time almost make me think that Klei wants to bring back some of that precious atmosphere we lost somewhere along the way.

Her gameplay is somewhat unique and I'll definitely give her a try. But come on Klei... some of those items are way too op.

This!   :wilson_love:

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1 minute ago, ALCRD said:

Why would i do that when i have a instant reverse death button that costs nothing to reuse except waiting 2 mins if i happen to die too quickly in same spot (which can happen with life giving amulet too.)

And just go about my caving like nothing happened and save my gems and gold for other things or if multiplayer for characters who would need them more.

Idk why would someone do that. You are the one saying that is op reviving every 2 minutes when is something we already had for years. How many minutes do you need to craft a new amulet to consider this perk op?

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19 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Idk why would someone do that. You are the one saying that is op reviving every 2 minutes when is something we already had for years. How many minutes do you need to craft a new amulet to consider this perk op?

Wow its like you completely ignored everything i said in previous posts in favor of your poorly made strawman.

What part of "free of cost" , " revival on the spot" , "no need to carry additional mats or recraft to be able to revive" aspect of her watch you don't understand? 

No we clearly didn't have that for years.

Or maybe you do understand this but willfuly ignore it to continue arguing. Cause yea you do sound like you are trying to troll me and argue for the sake of arguing.

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10 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

No thanks, we dont need more gems stockpilling in our chests

Im already tired of cleaning the ruins ignoring all yellow gems and soon orange ones

Which is the same for me since i don't want to go every single time to the ruins because i need to re-craft the same items for poor balance and so i tend to leave all of them in the chests? I don't see any problem in that since it was suggested many many many times in the past.

If you don't want more gems stockpilling you can use wraps or just trash them to the lureplants, no? Like all those hounds teeth?

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13 minutes ago, ALCRD said:

Wow its like you completely ignored everything i said in previous posts in favor of your poorly made strawman.

Or maybe you really are ignoring reality or failing to understand the "free of cost" , " revival on the spot" , "no need to carry additional mats or recraft to be able to revive" aspect of her watch.

No we clearly didn't have that for years. You sound like you are trying to troll me and argue for the sake of arguing.

Im ignoring the cost because being free o needing gold and red gems are mostly the same. You even get more life giving amulets from klaus that you would waste

What extra material? You bring to the caves NF, gold and the watch = you die you wait 2 min for the next mistake

With other characters you bring NF, gold and life giving amulet and when you die you just look for a red gem (which there is plenty because of hounds in surface and ruins loot/earthquakes) to craft a new one

I just dont understand how that silly perk looks op in your eyes. I dont even think i will the watch when i can use life giving amulets from day 10

I only see it useful for multiplayer but not op, just useful

What is op is her 0% weapon but reviving? Im the one who is starting to think that you are trolling me

18 minutes ago, Milordo said:

Which is the same for me since i don't want to go every single time to the ruins because i need to re-craft the same items for poor balance and so i tend to leave all of them in the chests? I don't see any problem in that since it was suggested many many many times in the past.

Good point

 

18 minutes ago, Milordo said:

If you don't want more gems stockpilling you can use wraps or just trash them to the lureplants, no? Like all those hounds teeth?

I want uses for gems not more useless materials making the ruins useless too. If they add more recipes for gems i wont care if they make the old stuff refuelable but right now is just making the ruins and df useless. Also isnt fun that everything can waste NF to keep working

Also, if they make orange stuff refuelable people will start asking to add the same mechanic to green amulets

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42 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

I just dont understand how that silly perk looks op in your eyes.

That's the point. Despite me explaining it several times. You just pull up those nonsensical examples that in average DST scenario cost more mats, time and effort than just using her watch instead for unlimited cost free revives and try to say they are somehow better? Wanda doesn't need lifegiving amulets or effigies cause they are redundant for her compared to her revival watch.

I am not even going to bother anymore. Have fun fighting that strawman i guess.:???:

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2 hours ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Imagine calling op a character that needa to be almost death to do damage

Did you not watch the video? She does 82 damage above 110 health, 98 under 110 health, and 142 damage under 38 health. 38 health is up to 760 EHP if you're wearing armor, not hard to manage and in exchange you're dealing more damage than Wolfgang with a dark sword despite barely using any resources. Even if you aren't staying near death you're still dealing 98 damage for only a small amount of nightmare fuel and no living logs. More damage than a dark sword despite also being cheaper and also having more range and also not needing to be recrafted and also not draining your sanity and also can just be an infinite durability thulecite club for literally free.

Imagine calling a character that has everything Wanda does not overpowered because they "needa be almost death to do [the most, although at all other health levels they still have a lot of] damage".

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7 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

Did you not watch the video? She does 82 damage above 110 health, 98 under 110 health, and 142 damage under 38 health. 38 health is up to 760 EHP if you're wearing armor, not hard to manage and in exchange you're dealing more damage than Wolfgang with a dark sword despite barely using any resources. Even if you aren't staying near death you're still dealing 98 damage for only a small amount of nightmare fuel and no living logs. More damage than a dark sword despite also being cheaper and also having more range and also not needing to be recrafted and also not draining your sanity and also can just be an infinite durability thulecite club for literally free.

Imagine calling a character that has everything Wanda does not overpowered because they "needa be almost death to do [the most, although at all other health levels they still have a lot of] damage".

I already said that the weapon is op. Is the only thing i would change (not the stupid reviving clock for newplayers lel)

Is a non sense that weapon and more when you dont even need to refill it to do a lot of damage 

 

Edit. Dont compare her to wolf. Wolfg have x2 damage since he joins a server with 300hp and speed for just eating a little

9 minutes ago, ALCRD said:

 

That's the point. Despite me explaining it several times. You just pull up those nonsensical examples that in average DST scenario cost more time and effort than just using her watch instead for unlimited cost free revives and try to say they are somehow better?

I am not even going to bother anymore. Have fun fighting that strawman.:???:

Ok, enjoy thinking that her revival item is imba when we already got inmortality with meat effigie and free amulets.

What a bone farm you will do

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The only balance changes I think Wanda needs are the following, based off what I've seen, tbh I wouldn't be suprised if some last minute tweaking was done anyway, so I guess take this post with a grain of salt.

1. Reduce the damage of her alarming clock when it's out of charge(to like 34 or so?) As for the charged up clock(When it has nightmare fuel), keep its damage as is.

2. The reviving clock needs to either not drop on death(requiring the player to pay attention and drop it quickly before they die) or have an increased cooldown, since why bother actually playing the game and surviving when you have a literal free revive with no real downside?

Everything else in Wanda's arsenal I think is fine as is.

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These are early access stats, she’s still being worked on, wait until final release for the real numbers.

Early access is only meant to showcase how she’s gonna play, and for that we all agree she’s a super interesting, fun and well designed character.
 

As for the problematic numbers, I’m sure her uncharged weapon damage will be lowered (34 damage sounds more reasonable, still useful but not great) and her resurrection clock will have a longer cooldown and maybe another con (perhaps reviving you with much less hunger and health than an amulet, so if you don’t do something about your hunger and health you’ll die immediately again)

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1 minute ago, ShadowDuelist said:

These are early access stats, she’s still being worked on, wait until final release for the real numbers.

Early access is only meant to showcase how she’s gonna play, and for that we all agree she’s a super interesting, fun and well designed character.
 

As for the problematic numbers, I’m sure her uncharged weapon damage will be lowered (34 damage sounds more reasonable, still useful but not great) and her resurrection clock will have a longer cooldown and maybe another con (perhaps reviving you with much less hunger and health than an amulet, so if you don’t do something about your hunger and health you’ll die immediately again)

I think it would be very interesting if the revive clock were reworked to have a longer cooldown but be a lot stronger. If it had a very long cooldown but actually brought you back to the point you died, picking up the items around your corpse and placing them back into your inventory where they used to be, I think that would be a lot of fun. Then to players who already know how to revive it would be useful as more than just a "Don't have to go get another red gem from the base" revive, but to players who have trouble reviving they wouldn't be able to just be immortal and neglect all their everything.

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18 minutes ago, Cheggf said:

I think it would be very interesting if the revive clock were reworked to have a longer cooldown but be a lot stronger. If it had a very long cooldown but actually brought you back to the point you died, picking up the items around your corpse and placing them back into your inventory where they used to be, I think that would be a lot of fun. Then to players who already know how to revive it would be useful as more than just a "Don't have to go get another red gem from the base" revive, but to players who have trouble reviving they wouldn't be able to just be immortal and neglect all their everything.

The problem about that amulet is that, if the numbers described on the videos are right and it stayed that way (which as I mentioned in my post above I doubt it will) it would allow you to bypass eating entirely.
And even if you give it a 2 days or 4 days or whatever cooldown, you can just lay around more of them, still bypassing the need of eating since by the time you’ll die of starvation again there’s always at least one clock that will be off cooldown to revive you.

So the only way I believe there is to balance it out and prevent stupid cheesing strategies is to make it give you really low stats when you revive, like 10 hp (or wanda’s year equivalent) and 10 hunger.

The game shouldn’t reward you for doing the only thing that you are not meant to do, as stated in the game’s name. With low revival stats, trying to stay alive just reviving would make it terribly impractical. One day cooldown and really low stats after reviving for an infinite life giving amulet sounds a lot more fair.
 

If upon being revived by it you would pick up your lost stuff around your corpse automatically it’s fine too, that’s a cool idea as well.

 

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45 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

What a bone farm you will do

That's another thing i thought about. Somewhat decent cost free bone farm.. but from the looks of it in the video she doesn't seem to leave a Skeleton when she dies and instead just gets pulled into the ground and pop out as a ghost.

So jokes on you.

No bones for you.

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7 hours ago, sinisterrkid said:

The Alarming Clock weapon does need tuning for sure, but what people (who haven't played yet) need to keep in mind is that the massive damage not only is only slightly higher than a mighty Wolfgang, but only comes in when Wanda is:

  • At the equivalent of 35 health or lower
  • With her health still trickling down every 40 seconds
  • With only one means of healing

That weapon also has longer range and can stun lock some enemies, but attacks slightly slower (I saw someone unable to attack Deerclops three times before kiting with it.) Again, I agree it needs nerfing, but do keep all of that in mind before asking for it to be nerfed into oblivion.

So to say she is a Wolfgang + whatever is to ignore that Wolfgang's strength comes in for way cheaper, way safer, and with a speed boost. Gotta change that argument, please.

Till you remember magic doesn't drain her sanity in old age so she'll be using night armor as her default armor which means she'll have 95 percent damage reduction so that low hp is very deceptive and even if it doesn't hold out she's got free revives. Also Wolfgang's speed boost is worthless in the face of a infinite use lazy explorer actually speed in generally is meaningless in the face of warping.

That being said I feel like the best way to handle the adjustments would be to lower the weapon's base output to 20 or 25 while it has no fuel and boosting it up to 35 with no fuel in old age while still keeping it's cap stats.

As for the second chance watch a 2-3 day cool down should be fine it still would require no upkeep and people could have multiples to cut down on the CD in exchange for inventory space while not trivializing death.

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14 minutes ago, ALCRD said:

That's another thing i thought about. Somewhat decent cost free bone farm.. but from the looks of it in the video she doesn't seem to leave a Skeleton when she dies and instead just gets pulled into the ground and pop out as a ghost.

So jokes on you.

No bones for you.

I forgot that isnt even useful for that

 

10 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

That being said I feel like the best way to handle the adjustments would be to lower the weapon's base output to 20 or 25 while it has no fuel and boosting it up to 35 with no fuel in old age while still keeping it's cap stats.

I think the empty weapon should deal more damage when young than in old stage but yeah, her weapon needs some nerfs and some bosses arent prepared for medium range weapons

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2 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

I think the empty weapon should deal more damage when young than in old stage but yeah, her weapon needs some nerfs and some bosses arent prepared for medium range weapons

I feel like she should be encouraged to use normal weapons when young rather than a omni tool weapon.

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1 hour ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Good point

 

I want uses for gems not more useless materials making the ruins useless too. If they add more recipes for gems i wont care if they make the old stuff refuelable but right now is just making the ruins and df useless. Also isnt fun that everything can waste NF to keep working

Also, if they make orange stuff refuelable people will start asking to add the same mechanic to green amulets

Touche, I'm happy we agree on this. We must find a solution in between so we can help everyone in this issue because i'm honestly tired of how poor love the ruins receveid in atmosphere, loot, usufulness, balance, ecc...

My suggestion for the nightmare fuel was due not only for a videogame style but for lore too. Magiluminesce amulet already is refuelable through nightmare fuel, a decision made by klei itself so i don't see any problem in keeping that design idea to all the others items. Infact why the other items didn't received the same treatment i would ask?  

After that yes, more new items or usage for gems in general and other methods to farm more nightmare fuel. There, we can be all happy without keeping a Maxwell's face. I must confess too, after i mastered the end-game five years ago the feeling of gems being not too special and useful always grew in me. 

An alternative would be able to refuel the items with their corresponding gems, eg. Lazy explorer --> orange gem, Construction amulet --> green gem, ecc.... would you like it more?

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5 minutes ago, Mysterious box said:

I feel like she should be encouraged to use normal weapons when young rather than a omni tool weapon.

Im not saying that an infinity weapon at 0% should deal a lot of damage but having spear damage when young and axe damage when old wont make people only use the empty weapon

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2 minutes ago, ArubaroBeefalo said:

Im not saying that an infinity weapon at 0% should deal a lot of damage but having spear damage when young and axe damage when old wont make people only use the empty weapon

While I get what your saying it doesn't really make sense for her to be able to use a shadow weapon better than her older self even if it's empty but I'm not against giving it spear damage.

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3 minutes ago, Milordo said:

Touche, I'm happy we agree on this. We must find a solution in between so we can help everyone in this issue because i'm honestly tired of how poor love the ruins receveid in atmosphere, loot, usufulness, balance, ecc...

My suggestion for the nightmare fuel was due not only for a videogame style but for lore too. Magiluminesce amulet already is refuelable through nightmare fuel, a decision made by klei itself so i don't see any problem in keeping that design idea to all the others items. Infact why the other items didn't received the same treatment i would ask?  

After that yes, more new items or usage for gems in general and other methods to farm more nightmare fuel. There, we can be all happy without keeping a Maxwell's face. I must confess too, after i mastered the end-game five years ago the feeling of gems being not too special and useful always grew in me. 

An alternative would be able to refuel the items with their corresponding gems, eg. Lazy explorer --> orange gem, Construction amulet --> green gem, ecc.... would you like it more?

I think if the ruins werent a garbage bin filled with gears, purple, red and blue amulets we wont have this conversation because we wont need to grind reseting the ruins (imagine having a ruins that only gives you few thulecite and 2 green gems at most...) because in your way or in the old one, we would have a lot of ruins gems to play with instead of grinding fw to have few green gems

Im with you but also im still feeling that refueling green amulet is too powerful,  maybe 0'5% per nightmere fuel? As i said, if we have better ruins loot we wont need to reset them that often so we wont care about crafting again instead of refueling and viceversa

Just now, Mysterious box said:

While I get what your saying it doesn't really make sense for her to be able to use a shadow weapon better than her older self even if it's empty but I'm not against giving it spear damage.

Because the clock empty isnt a shadow weapon, is just a clockwatch that you use to hit so the harder you hit the more damage you do and, since a young person has healthier muscles, she should deal more "physical damage" when young but less "magical damage" and the opposite when is old

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For those saying “omg OP nerf” let’s think about her in a more general way:

-She has no gathering, or food making perks.

-According to what was shown on streams her perks are incompatible with beefalos, so if you want to play the beefalo way she’s just a Wilson that constantly loses health.

-She has no AOE attacks, area denial, special minions or crowd control perks.

-She won’t heal outside of using her watches, this means no food, jellybeans, sleeping, Wortox souls, nothing helps you. And healing entirely is somewhat of a con.

-If you want to take full advantage of her super damage you’ll die in 2-3 hits even with armor, or simply by forgetting about time passage and dying of old age. So I highly doubt everyone will go this route.

She’s a combat oriented hyper-mobile single-Target glass cannon character. It would seem to me that if you only think of her pros you forget about everything else. Despite a few values with the uncharged weapon and the revive tool, she seems pretty balanced. The self long distance teleports and the possibility to chain moving across the map will make a great addition too.
 

After everyone tries her out and the hype is gone I’m sure she’ll be used mostly as much as Wormwood or Wortox or any other DLC character is used.

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7 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

For those saying “omg OP nerf” let’s think about her in a more general way:

-She has no gathering, or food making perks.

-According to what was shown on streams her perks are incompatible with beefalos, so if you want to play the beefalo way she’s just a Wilson that constantly loses health.

-She has no AOE attacks, area denial, special minions or crowd control perks.

Same for most characters?

7 minutes ago, ShadowDuelist said:

-If you want to take full advantage of her super damage you’ll die in 2-3 hits even with armor, or simply by forgetting about time passage and dying of old age. So I highly doubt everyone will go this route.

yeah but doesn't she effectively have a huge passive damage resistance? Puts wig's to shame.

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